Why do liberals hate America?

[dmcowen674]

Congratulations Crimie, I believe you are finally starting to get it. I am neither Liberal or Conservative. I am American and Love my Country too. The things I have been writing about tend to labeled as Liberal by the hard core Conservative will die Republican groupies on here yet at the same time you can clearly see by many of my posts Conservative values as well.

With all this Conservative/Liberal crap, being American has been forgotten about and kicked to the curb. I firmly believe at some point (unfortunately when things get excessively bad in the U.S.) that the people waging the dumb Conservative/Liberal War will give up that battle and fight to be an American again. I only hope that will take place with Votes and not guns but at this point it is still looking like a Revolutionary War would have to occur for it to happen.

So Crimie I firmly believe that the people being labled as Liberals in here including myself do not "Hate" America but LOVE America and what is HATED is HATE to see what is being done to to the Country both Morally and Financially.

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Originally posted by: Crimson[/i]
Ok, can someone PLEASE explain to me why liberals hate America? If the COUNTLESS posts from you guys here, we can conclude:

America is the root of all problems in the world.
America causes terrorism.
America causes third world countries to be poor.
America ruines the environment, and is killing mother earth.
America is trying to conquer the world.
Etc.. Etc.. Etc.. Fill in the appropriate line from the democratic playbook.

Lets think about this for a moment... it seems like America is involved in SOLVING many of the world's problems, rather than the cause. WWI? Our fault? No, but we help finished it. WWII? Our fault? Nope, but we helped FINISH it. Gulf War I, Bosnia, Kosovo, Panama, etc.. Did we start any of those problems? NO.. But damnit, nobody else would deal with it, so we did! Seems like an aweful lot of problems originating from these European countries which claim we are causing all the problems.

We cause terrorism? Yeah.. right. Muslims have been either killing eachother or other people for thousands of years. They are a barbaric society and are hellbent on exterminating anyone who doesn't agree with them. How can they blame all their problems on America when we have only been around for 200+ years, when they have been around for 2000+? Wait, maybe THEY are the problem and not us..

"But Christians have killed people too!".. Yeah, they DID.. several hundred years ago, for the most part we have gotten over the idea of forcibly converting people and killing anyone who doesn't agree. Unfortunately Islam is still stuck in the dark ages.

We are ruining the environment! Global warming, whales, oceans, etc.. I know, we have been being told the Earth is dying for 30 years now.. can we come up with something else? The earth is not dying, we are not killing it, can we move on to something a little more interesting please?

America is an imperialist country. PLEASE provide proof. Japan? Nope. Germany? Nope. France? Nope.. Yugoslavia? Nope. Kuwait? Nope. We seem to have a history of NOT being imperialist if you ask me. Most of the world can't seem to keep to stop starting wars. We need to go in and solve their problems for them. If we wanted to take over the world, we would have already of done it.

"But, the world hates us!" Of course they do.. We are the best god damn country in the world. We invented the car, the airplane, the internet, the lightbulb, the telegraph, the telephone, electricity.. What other country has had a greater impact on changing the world than us? People are jealous..

I love my country.. we are the best country in the world without a doubt.. I am not guilty for being successful, I am not guilty for trying to protect my success, I am not guilty for trying to bring freedom to the rest of the world, I am not guilty for intervening in world problems when they can't be resolved by the countries involved. I think the America haters have it backwards.. if the rest of the world would LEAVE US THE HELL ALONE, the world would be perfect. I am f-ing tired of having to fix the problems of other people.

God Bless America. Thank you to every serviceman who has died to protect me and my family. Without you we would be living under the rule of some brutal dictator. We are not the problem, we are simply the easiest place to point to.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mark it down, 2nd post I agree totaly with Crimie. Excellent post sir.

So what does all that have to do with a Democratic playbook or Republican???

"I am not guilty for trying to protect my success." This is the key line in your entire post other than honoring our Servicemen and Country.
Funny how this line is considered LIBERAL, should we label you as a Liberal too now?

That is all people are trying so hard to do and it is getting harder everyday. Until you are directly affected (which obviously you are not yet) negatively by what is happening in the U.S. today you will label everyone as something, whether it is Liberal or whatever else. It is about time that people drop the nutty labels and call each other Americans.

Oh and don't forget, you can't say "GOD Bless America"

 

[DoubleL]

Liberals suffer from a number of maladies and delusions, but several are painfully obvious. First, not only are they incapable of taking care of themselves, they cannot comprehend why they should be FORCED to take care of themselves. They are terrified of everything that is not pre-processed, homogenized and approved by an official governmental entity. "Governmental Entity," by the way, is defined as Martin Sheen, a guy who's not the President but plays one on TV.

That the recycling truck might be an hour late propels liberals into a state of near hysteria. That someone might actually own a gun sends them running to the therapist for Prozac, grief-counseling and Deepak Chopra seminars. They seek order, safety and security at any cost, rather than individuality, liberty and freedom.

The goals of a totalitarian, Fascist state are reflected in the ramblings of liberal politicians and Hollywood idiots. They say they want peace, but the sort of peace they seek is more akin to slavery then it is the ideals upon which America was founded.

Following the "Glory Days" scenario, liberals are bitter, angry and dogmatic. They cannot believe they lost the 2000 and 2002 elections. They feel the conservative ascendancy is an anomaly, and wax nostalgic over the administration of a lecherous sociopath who offered soothing words but never a vestige of reality, substance or results. They yearn for a choreographed fantasy world which disputes human nature. They swoon at the idea of standing on the side of the hill while reciting poetry with talking raccoons and drinking decaffeinated Coke.

Liberals want to play happily in a field of daisies, unable to accept that we live in a time of daisy cutters. True, if their desires were the rule of the land they would get their wish. Our enemies would gladly provide that field of daisies, and make certain every single American - liberal or conservative - was pushing them up.

The garden variety leftist attacks our country with every breath, oblivious to the fact that their ability to speak out, to acquire their toys, to travel and protest and whine, are provided by the very system they despise. They know only hate for those who disagree with their Utopian vision of unchecked liberalism. They immediately label as racists any who counter their nonsensical ramblings with the logic of protecting our sovereignty and future. They want but one thing...for their fellow travelers to control Congress and the White House.

The personification of this ideology is Tom Daschle. Shortly after the President gave Saddam Hussein his ultimatum, the diminutive Daschle donned his elevator shoes, climbed a tall stepladder and stood on his soapbox. "I am saddened that this president failed so miserably at diplomacy that we're now forced to war," said Senator Shortcake. "I'm saddened that we have to give up one life because this president couldn't create the kind of diplomatic effort that was so critical for our country."

South Dakota should be embarrassed. Daschle, still in shock over his loss of the undeserved power and prestige he once held, never misses an opportunity to engage in character assassination. He doesn't ask questions. He blubbers. He is an angry little man who cares far more about his party than he does his country.

Diplomacy? The President worked for months to try and bring a speck of rationality to those who openly despise the US. Diplomacy failed due to the irrelevant UN weasels who refused to enforce 12 years worth of their own mandates. They were led by France, a country that sold Iraq nuclear materials and stands to risk billions of dollars in oil contracts if their friendly neighborhood butcher is deposed.

But the second half of Daschle's quote is far worse than the first. As a government "leader," Daschle should know that Saddam will portray his moronic words as a sign that the American government is in disarray at the highest level. He should know the Butcher will use those words for propaganda purposes, hoping to fire up troops that, perhaps, were losing their morale.

Tom is saddened? Well boo hoo. I'll be saddened if we lose one American life because Daschle's self-serving attempt to stain George Bush might convince a single Iraqi soldier that we are not united, might lead him to think there's a chance of winning. I'm saddened that giving such comfort to the enemy might convince one of Saddam's minions to shoot a brave American soldier in the back, rather than laying down his rifle in fear. I'm saddened that Daschle's words, all over CNN and heard in Baghdad, might lead an Iraqi Republican Guardsman to pull the trigger rather than waving the white flag.

I couldn't have said it better

 

[Gaard]

Originally posted by: Crimson
Ok, can someone PLEASE explain to me why liberals hate America? If the COUNTLESS posts from you guys here, we can conclude:

America is the root of all problems in the world.
America causes terrorism.
America causes third world countries to be poor.
America ruines the environment, and is killing mother earth.
America is trying to conquer the world.
Etc.. Etc.. Etc.. Fill in the appropriate line from the democratic playbook.

Lets think about this for a moment... it seems like America is involved in SOLVING many of the world's problems, rather than the cause. WWI? Our fault? No, but we help finished it. WWII? Our fault? Nope, but we helped FINISH it. Gulf War I, Bosnia, Kosovo, Panama, etc.. Did we start any of those problems? NO.. But damnit, nobody else would deal with it, so we did! Seems like an aweful lot of problems originating from these European countries which claim we are causing all the problems.

We cause terrorism? Yeah.. right. Muslims have been either killing eachother or other people for thousands of years. They are a barbaric society and are hellbent on exterminating anyone who doesn't agree with them. How can they blame all their problems on America when we have only been around for 200+ years, when they have been around for 2000+? Wait, maybe THEY are the problem and not us..

"But Christians have killed people too!".. Yeah, they DID.. several hundred years ago, for the most part we have gotten over the idea of forcibly converting people and killing anyone who doesn't agree. Unfortunately Islam is still stuck in the dark ages.

We are ruining the environment! Global warming, whales, oceans, etc.. I know, we have been being told the Earth is dying for 30 years now.. can we come up with something else? The earth is not dying, we are not killing it, can we move on to something a little more interesting please?

America is an imperialist country. PLEASE provide proof. Japan? Nope. Germany? Nope. France? Nope.. Yugoslavia? Nope. Kuwait? Nope. We seem to have a history of NOT being imperialist if you ask me. Most of the world can't seem to keep to stop starting wars. We need to go in and solve their problems for them. If we wanted to take over the world, we would have already of done it.

"But, the world hates us!" Of course they do.. We are the best god damn country in the world. We invented the car, the airplane, the internet, the lightbulb, the telegraph, the telephone, electricity.. What other country has had a greater impact on changing the world than us? People are jealous..

I love my country.. we are the best country in the world without a doubt.. I am not guilty for being successful, I am not guilty for trying to protect my success, I am not guilty for trying to bring freedom to the rest of the world, I am not guilty for intervening in world problems when they can't be resolved by the countries involved. I think the America haters have it backwards.. if the rest of the world would LEAVE US THE HELL ALONE, the world would be perfect. I am f-ing tired of having to fix the problems of other people.

God Bless America. Thank you to every serviceman who has died to protect me and my family. Without you we would be living under the rule of some brutal dictator. We are not the problem, we are simply the easiest place to point to.

Ann? Is that you?

 

[chess9]

No, it's bill, and not bill the cat.

I gotta' give credit to the Fox Cartoon Network. They have tricked a whole generation of guys into believing they are actually watching news that is "Fair and Balanced" and accurate. I think CBS has the right approach with their Reagan docu-drama. Fight fire with fire.

I'm going to do my part right now and let you guys in on a little known secret: Bush uses a Macintosh! Which means he's really a liberal of course....

You heard it here first, not from The Sludge, not from Bill The Wily, or Ann Colt 45. <beams>

-Robert

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: DoubleL
Liberals suffer from a number of maladies and delusions, but several are painfully obvious. First, not only are they incapable of taking care of themselves, they cannot comprehend why they should be FORCED to take care of themselves. They are terrified of everything that is not pre-processed, homogenized and approved by an official governmental entity. "Governmental Entity," by the way, is defined as Martin Sheen, a guy who's not the President but plays one on TV.

That the recycling truck might be an hour late propels liberals into a state of near hysteria. That someone might actually own a gun sends them running to the therapist for Prozac, grief-counseling and Deepak Chopra seminars. They seek order, safety and security at any cost, rather than individuality, liberty and freedom.

The goals of a totalitarian, Fascist state are reflected in the ramblings of liberal politicians and Hollywood idiots. They say they want peace, but the sort of peace they seek is more akin to slavery then it is the ideals upon which America was founded.

Following the "Glory Days" scenario, liberals are bitter, angry and dogmatic. They cannot believe they lost the 2000 and 2002 elections. They feel the conservative ascendancy is an anomaly, and wax nostalgic over the administration of a lecherous sociopath who offered soothing words but never a vestige of reality, substance or results. They yearn for a choreographed fantasy world which disputes human nature. They swoon at the idea of standing on the side of the hill while reciting poetry with talking raccoons and drinking decaffeinated Coke.

Liberals want to play happily in a field of daisies, unable to accept that we live in a time of daisy cutters. True, if their desires were the rule of the land they would get their wish. Our enemies would gladly provide that field of daisies, and make certain every single American - liberal or conservative - was pushing them up.

The garden variety leftist attacks our country with every breath, oblivious to the fact that their ability to speak out, to acquire their toys, to travel and protest and whine, are provided by the very system they despise. They know only hate for those who disagree with their Utopian vision of unchecked liberalism. They immediately label as racists any who counter their nonsensical ramblings with the logic of protecting our sovereignty and future. They want but one thing...for their fellow travelers to control Congress and the White House.

The personification of this ideology is Tom Daschle. Shortly after the President gave Saddam Hussein his ultimatum, the diminutive Daschle donned his elevator shoes, climbed a tall stepladder and stood on his soapbox. "I am saddened that this president failed so miserably at diplomacy that we're now forced to war," said Senator Shortcake. "I'm saddened that we have to give up one life because this president couldn't create the kind of diplomatic effort that was so critical for our country."

South Dakota should be embarrassed. Daschle, still in shock over his loss of the undeserved power and prestige he once held, never misses an opportunity to engage in character assassination. He doesn't ask questions. He blubbers. He is an angry little man who cares far more about his party than he does his country.

Diplomacy? The President worked for months to try and bring a speck of rationality to those who openly despise the US. Diplomacy failed due to the irrelevant UN weasels who refused to enforce 12 years worth of their own mandates. They were led by France, a country that sold Iraq nuclear materials and stands to risk billions of dollars in oil contracts if their friendly neighborhood butcher is deposed.

But the second half of Daschle's quote is far worse than the first. As a government "leader," Daschle should know that Saddam will portray his moronic words as a sign that the American government is in disarray at the highest level. He should know the Butcher will use those words for propaganda purposes, hoping to fire up troops that, perhaps, were losing their morale.

Tom is saddened? Well boo hoo. I'll be saddened if we lose one American life because Daschle's self-serving attempt to stain George Bush might convince a single Iraqi soldier that we are not united, might lead him to think there's a chance of winning. I'm saddened that giving such comfort to the enemy might convince one of Saddam's minions to shoot a brave American soldier in the back, rather than laying down his rifle in fear. I'm saddened that Daschle's words, all over CNN and heard in Baghdad, might lead an Iraqi Republican Guardsman to pull the trigger rather than waving the white flag.

I couldn't have said it better

Nice. Paranoid, but nice. Wrong, but nice.

By your definition, I don't think there are any liberals outside a dozen or so.

I think I will stop here, before I dwell on your illogic for too long. Let's say the Liberals I know (BTW I do not identify myself with a particular ideology) have jobs, and don't wander the streets aimless as your first paragraph clearly implies.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: DoubleL
Liberals suffer from a number of maladies and delusions, but several are painfully obvious. First, not only are they incapable of taking care of themselves, they cannot comprehend why they should be FORCED to take care of themselves. They are terrified of everything that is not pre-processed, homogenized and approved by an official governmental entity. "Governmental Entity," by the way, is defined as Martin Sheen, a guy who's not the President but plays one on TV.

That the recycling truck might be an hour late propels liberals into a state of near hysteria. That someone might actually own a gun sends them running to the therapist for Prozac, grief-counseling and Deepak Chopra seminars. They seek order, safety and security at any cost, rather than individuality, liberty and freedom.

The goals of a totalitarian, Fascist state are reflected in the ramblings of liberal politicians and Hollywood idiots. They say they want peace, but the sort of peace they seek is more akin to slavery then it is the ideals upon which America was founded.

Following the "Glory Days" scenario, liberals are bitter, angry and dogmatic. They cannot believe they lost the 2000 and 2002 elections. They feel the conservative ascendancy is an anomaly, and wax nostalgic over the administration of a lecherous sociopath who offered soothing words but never a vestige of reality, substance or results. They yearn for a choreographed fantasy world which disputes human nature. They swoon at the idea of standing on the side of the hill while reciting poetry with talking raccoons and drinking decaffeinated Coke.

Liberals want to play happily in a field of daisies, unable to accept that we live in a time of daisy cutters. True, if their desires were the rule of the land they would get their wish. Our enemies would gladly provide that field of daisies, and make certain every single American - liberal or conservative - was pushing them up.

The garden variety leftist attacks our country with every breath, oblivious to the fact that their ability to speak out, to acquire their toys, to travel and protest and whine, are provided by the very system they despise. They know only hate for those who disagree with their Utopian vision of unchecked liberalism. They immediately label as racists any who counter their nonsensical ramblings with the logic of protecting our sovereignty and future. They want but one thing...for their fellow travelers to control Congress and the White House.

The personification of this ideology is Tom Daschle. Shortly after the President gave Saddam Hussein his ultimatum, the diminutive Daschle donned his elevator shoes, climbed a tall stepladder and stood on his soapbox. "I am saddened that this president failed so miserably at diplomacy that we're now forced to war," said Senator Shortcake. "I'm saddened that we have to give up one life because this president couldn't create the kind of diplomatic effort that was so critical for our country."

South Dakota should be embarrassed. Daschle, still in shock over his loss of the undeserved power and prestige he once held, never misses an opportunity to engage in character assassination. He doesn't ask questions. He blubbers. He is an angry little man who cares far more about his party than he does his country.

Diplomacy? The President worked for months to try and bring a speck of rationality to those who openly despise the US. Diplomacy failed due to the irrelevant UN weasels who refused to enforce 12 years worth of their own mandates. They were led by France, a country that sold Iraq nuclear materials and stands to risk billions of dollars in oil contracts if their friendly neighborhood butcher is deposed.

But the second half of Daschle's quote is far worse than the first. As a government "leader," Daschle should know that Saddam will portray his moronic words as a sign that the American government is in disarray at the highest level. He should know the Butcher will use those words for propaganda purposes, hoping to fire up troops that, perhaps, were losing their morale.

Tom is saddened? Well boo hoo. I'll be saddened if we lose one American life because Daschle's self-serving attempt to stain George Bush might convince a single Iraqi soldier that we are not united, might lead him to think there's a chance of winning. I'm saddened that giving such comfort to the enemy might convince one of Saddam's minions to shoot a brave American soldier in the back, rather than laying down his rifle in fear. I'm saddened that Daschle's words, all over CNN and heard in Baghdad, might lead an Iraqi Republican Guardsman to pull the trigger rather than waving the white flag.

I couldn't have said it better

Excellent Post DL

People like Daschel & even Ted kennedy are what have ruined the Democratic party and swayed so many people to swing over to the Republican party. It is a shame the regions of the Country that keep these idiots in Office can't see the Forrest through the Trees and replace these Dinosaurs that don't represent the people or their wishes and haven't for many many years.

DL, there are a lot of wusses out there and not all of them are Liberals, many of them hide behind a veil and call themselves Conservative Republicans too. It's really time to stop all the name calling, labeling and true Americans to start acting like Americans and get all of the wusses out of power and give the power back to the people!

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674


Excellent Post DL

People like Daschel & even Ted kennedy are what have ruined the Democratic party and swayed so many people to swing over to the Republican party. It is a shame the regions of the Country that keep these idiots in Office can't see the Forrest through the Trees and replace these Dinosaurs that don't represent the people or their wishes and haven't for many many years.

DL, there are a lot of wusses out there and not all of them are Liberals, many of them hide behind a veil and call themselves Conservative Republicans too. It's really time to stop all the name calling, labeling and true Americans to start acting like Americans and get all of the wusses out of power and give the power back to the people!

The problem is the Extremist Minorities of both parties have control of them.

 

[bigdog1218]

Crimson, You remind me of the Tories from the revolutionary war, you'll blindly follow your king no matter what, leaving your fellow American to fight for your freedom.

 

[VioletAura]

Conservatives are screwing the US for years to come and you have to nerve to claim that liberals hate america.

 

[Witling]

Crimson, I'll come back for a second bite after I've read the whole thread but to start:

First of all, you say "we can conclude." Crimson, it's you that concludes that, not the mysterious "we." The limitations and preconceived ideas are yours.

"America is the root of all problems in the world." No, not all of the problems, but we are responsible for many and we should chang our ways where necessary. Two of my personal favorites are overthrowing the legitimately elected governments of Iran and Chile to get out way.

"America causes terrorism." This is indisputable if you examine the facts. Many, many of the people trained in our School for the Americas" have gone on to torture, rape and kill. Who do you think killed the nuns in Nicauragua? The army junta that came into power in chile killed hundreds.

"America causes third world countries to be poor." Guilty as charged to a certain extent, but this area is not my main concern.

"America ruins the environment, and is killing mother earth." Any guesses at which major industrialized country refused to join the Kyoto Treaty.

"America is trying to conquer the world." No doubt about it if you mean economically dominate. That's what this Iraq thing is about. Up until the Bush administration or military efforts to control countries had been limited largely to the western hemisphere.

Crimson, I see the U.S. as a country that does both good things and bad things. Why should I support the bad things. As a liberal, I think "We could and should do better."

 

[busmaster11]

Originally posted by: Crimson
Ok, can someone PLEASE explain to me why liberals hate America? If the COUNTLESS posts from you guys here, we can conclude:

America is the root of all problems in the world.
America causes terrorism.
America causes third world countries to be poor.
America ruines the environment, and is killing mother earth.
America is trying to conquer the world.
Etc.. Etc.. Etc.. Fill in the appropriate line from the democratic playbook.

Lets think about this for a moment... it seems like America is involved in SOLVING many of the world's problems, rather than the cause. WWI? Our fault? No, but we help finished it. WWII? Our fault? Nope, but we helped FINISH it. Gulf War I, Bosnia, Kosovo, Panama, etc.. Did we start any of those problems? NO.. But damnit, nobody else would deal with it, so we did! Seems like an aweful lot of problems originating from these European countries which claim we are causing all the problems.

We cause terrorism? Yeah.. right. Muslims have been either killing eachother or other people for thousands of years. They are a barbaric society and are hellbent on exterminating anyone who doesn't agree with them. How can they blame all their problems on America when we have only been around for 200+ years, when they have been around for 2000+? Wait, maybe THEY are the problem and not us..

"But Christians have killed people too!".. Yeah, they DID.. several hundred years ago, for the most part we have gotten over the idea of forcibly converting people and killing anyone who doesn't agree. Unfortunately Islam is still stuck in the dark ages.

We are ruining the environment! Global warming, whales, oceans, etc.. I know, we have been being told the Earth is dying for 30 years now.. can we come up with something else? The earth is not dying, we are not killing it, can we move on to something a little more interesting please?

America is an imperialist country. PLEASE provide proof. Japan? Nope. Germany? Nope. France? Nope.. Yugoslavia? Nope. Kuwait? Nope. We seem to have a history of NOT being imperialist if you ask me. Most of the world can't seem to keep to stop starting wars. We need to go in and solve their problems for them. If we wanted to take over the world, we would have already of done it.

"But, the world hates us!" Of course they do.. We are the best god damn country in the world. We invented the car, the airplane, the internet, the lightbulb, the telegraph, the telephone, electricity.. What other country has had a greater impact on changing the world than us? People are jealous..

I love my country.. we are the best country in the world without a doubt.. I am not guilty for being successful, I am not guilty for trying to protect my success, I am not guilty for trying to bring freedom to the rest of the world, I am not guilty for intervening in world problems when they can't be resolved by the countries involved. I think the America haters have it backwards.. if the rest of the world would LEAVE US THE HELL ALONE, the world would be perfect. I am f-ing tired of having to fix the problems of other people.

God Bless America. Thank you to every serviceman who has died to protect me and my family. Without you we would be living under the rule of some brutal dictator. We are not the problem, we are simply the easiest place to point to.

You are a fool. You take things out of context and distort them to your liking. How convenient. Show me a single post where someone said that America alone has committed what you said was said.

I'd like to present you an itemized rebuttal to your whining, but it will only embarass you and make you go away. Either way, you will not learn anything because your mind is set, and you will not respond when cornered. You have proven this. You are a troll.

 

[Bleep]

Crimson
And those that think like you are not fit to judge anyone, you are part of the radical ones on here that are trying to destroy america
by causing hate and discontent. What have you done for your country other than run off at the mouth?
Are you saying that no liberal is now in the service fighting for our country? That there are no liberals have the right to live in this country?
You and some others here are like mushrooms that sit in the dark and let others feed you crap and have no thoughts of your own , you can only parrot the most radical in our society. You see no fault in yourself and blame others for all your failures. You are among the tree haters
and the ones that cannot cope with any opinion other than ones that you have gathered from The radical right wing money lovers.
and as always I will not return to this thread because you do not deserve to be heard.
Bleep

 

[oreagan]

Okay....this thread has made me sad, profoundly disappointed, and at times laugh disbelievingly. I try to keep a good opinion of people (in general), but it really makes it hard when not one, but several people post such hateful things.

(Crimson): "We cause terrorism? Yeah.. right. Muslims have been either killing eachother or other people for thousands of years. They are a barbaric society and are hellbent on exterminating anyone who doesn't agree with them. How can they blame all their problems on America when we have only been around for 200+ years, when they have been around for 2000+? Wait, maybe THEY are the problem and not us..

'But Christians have killed people too!'.. Yeah, they DID.. several hundred years ago, for the most part we have gotten over the idea of forcibly converting people and killing anyone who doesn't agree. Unfortunately Islam is still stuck in the dark ages." (/end Crimson)

First, peace/disarmament talks just broke down, again, in Northern Ireland, an area where Christians have been butchering Christians for decades now because of minor dogmatic differences. Second, Islam was founded in the 600s AD (I want to say 668 or so, but not sure). It's 2003. That's not 2000+ years. Third, the basic tenants of Islam are charity to the poor, submission to God, prayer, fasting, and pilgrimmage to Mecca. Christianity teaches love and peace, Islam teaches love and peace. War has been around since the beginning of man; these religions have not. Maybe the problem is not in either religion, maybe it's mankind itself.

As for America causing terrorism, well, that's difficult. We done some stuff that would really make us hate someone if they did it to us...for example, overthrowing the government of Iran and replacing it with an oppressive ruler so the West could keep them from nationalizing their oil industry. Also, doing the same in Nicaragua. Also, trying to do the same in Cuba. Also, we back Israel, which I personally agree with but Israel does do some sh^tty stuff with the tanks and helicopters they buy from us.

Terrorism is the unfortunate side-effect of an overpowering traditional military. When you fight an enemy, you don't play to his strengths, you play to yours. You can't expect people who hate America to try to match us "fairly" on the battlefield. In my opinion, suicide bombings and hostage-taking are disgusting and cowardly, but you really can't expect any more from any oppressed (in their eyes) people anywhere in the world, of any religion. Please, take a comparative religions class at a local community college or something, and maybe some history courses as well.

"America causes third world countries to be poor."

Well, yeah, but not just America. See, when American farms produce more food than the economy can really support or need, the government buys up the surplus (subsidies) and gives it away as humanitarian aid to third-world countries. Nice thing to do, but it makes it extremely difficult for farmers in those countries to make a living. That's actually one of the causes of the recent WTO talks breaking down.


DoubleL's post is just rediculous. We can all make wild generlizations and demonize each other, or we can try to figure out why the other side believes the way they do. Zealots are a terrible thing no matter which side they're on; conservatives have their fascist, racist bigots, while liberals have their lazy, smelly hippies while libertarians have their paranoid gun-nut and every other group has its own version of stupid. None of our opinions are perfect...to steal an idea from John Stuart Mill, they're probably partly true, but the only way we're going to move closer to the whole truth is by listening and trying to understand the good parts of both sides of every arguement.


Edited for slight grammatical errors.

 

[busmaster11]

Originally posted by: oreagan
Okay....this thread has made me sad, profoundly disappointed, and at times laugh disbelievingly. I try to keep a good opinion of people (in general), but it really makes it hard when not one, but several people posting things so hateful makes it difficult.

"We cause terrorism? Yeah.. right. Muslims have been either killing eachother or other people for thousands of years. They are a barbaric society and are hellbent on exterminating anyone who doesn't agree with them. How can they blame all their problems on America when we have only been around for 200+ years, when they have been around for 2000+? Wait, maybe THEY are the problem and not us..

'But Christians have killed people too!'.. Yeah, they DID.. several hundred years ago, for the most part we have gotten over the idea of forcibly converting people and killing anyone who doesn't agree. Unfortunately Islam is still stuck in the dark ages."

First, peace/disarmament talks just broke down, again, in Northern Ireland, an area where Christians have been butchering Christians for decades now because of minor dogmatic differences. Second, Islam was founded in the 600s AD (I was to say 668 or so, but not sure). It's 2003. That's not 2000+ years. Third, the basic tenants of Islam are charity to the poor, submission to God, prayer, fasting, and pilgrimmage to Mecca. Christianity teaches love and peace, Islam teaches love and peace. War has been since the beginning of man; these religions have not. Maybe it's neither religion, maybe it's mankind itself.

As for America causing terrorism itself, well, that's difficult. We done some stuff that would really make us hate someone if they did it to us...for example, overthrowing the government of Iran and replacing it with an oppressive ruler so the West could keep them from nationalizing their oil industry. Also, doing the same in Nicaragua. Also, trying to do the same in Cuba. Also, we back Israel, which I personally agree with but Israel does do some sh^tty stuff with the tanks and helicopters they buy from us.

Terrorism is the unfortunate side-effect of an overpowering traditional military. When you fight an enemy, you don't play to his strengths, you play to yours. You can't expect people who hate America to try to match us "fairly" on the battlefield. In my opinion, suicide bombings and hostage-taking are disgusting and cowardly, but you really can't expect any more from any oppressed (in their eyes) people anywhere in the world, of any religion. Please, take a comparative religions class at a local community college or something, and maybe some history courses as well.

"America causes third world countries to be poor."

Well, yeah, but not just America. See, when American farms produce more food than the economy can really support or need, the government buys up the surplus (subsidies) and gives it away as humanitarian aid to third-world countries. Nice thing to do, but it makes it extremely difficult for farmers in those countries to make a living. That's actually one of the causes of the recent WTO talks breaking down.


DoubleL's post is just rediculous. We can all make wild generlizations and demonize each other, or we can try to figure out why the other side believes the way they do. Zealots are a terrible thing no matter which side they're on; conservatives have their fascist, racist bigots, while liberals have their lazy, smelly hippies while libertarians have their paranoid gun-nut and every other group has its own version of stupid. None of our opinions are perfect...to steal an idea from John Stuart Mill, they're probably partly true, but the only way we're going to move closer to the whole truth is by listening and trying to understand the good parts of both sides of every arguement.

You make some very good, intelligent, and *gasp!!!* - objective points. But you're wrong about muslims. Only a tiny minority such as the fundie cave-dwelling goat-sucking sects like Bin Ladens' really fit that category. Most Muslims I feel are good peace-loving people. They kind of try to ignore or excuse the part about waging jihad against the infidel and becoming martyrs, which is really a more central part of their beliefs than I originally thought. The fundie sects are growing however because they feel that America is here to enforce our will and Christian and political philosophies on them.

 

[CaptnKirk]

Q: Why do liberals hate America. ?

A: Because they are free to hate anything they like.

 

[oreagan]

Originally posted by: busmaster11

Originally posted by: oreagan
Okay....this thread has made me sad, profoundly disappointed, and at times laugh disbelievingly. I try to keep a good opinion of people (in general), but it really makes it hard when not one, but several people posting things so hateful makes it difficult.

"We cause terrorism? Yeah.. right. Muslims have been either killing eachother or other people for thousands of years. They are a barbaric society and are hellbent on exterminating anyone who doesn't agree with them. How can they blame all their problems on America when we have only been around for 200+ years, when they have been around for 2000+? Wait, maybe THEY are the problem and not us..

'But Christians have killed people too!'.. Yeah, they DID.. several hundred years ago, for the most part we have gotten over the idea of forcibly converting people and killing anyone who doesn't agree. Unfortunately Islam is still stuck in the dark ages."

First, peace/disarmament talks just broke down, again, in Northern Ireland, an area where Christians have been butchering Christians for decades now because of minor dogmatic differences. Second, Islam was founded in the 600s AD (I was to say 668 or so, but not sure). It's 2003. That's not 2000+ years. Third, the basic tenants of Islam are charity to the poor, submission to God, prayer, fasting, and pilgrimmage to Mecca. Christianity teaches love and peace, Islam teaches love and peace. War has been since the beginning of man; these religions have not. Maybe it's neither religion, maybe it's mankind itself.

You make some very good, intelligent, and *gasp!!!* - objective points. But you're wrong about muslims. Only a tiny minority such as the fundie cave-dwelling goat-sucking sects like Bin Ladens' really fit that category. Most Muslims I feel are good peace-loving people. They kind of try to ignore or excuse the part about waging jihad against the infidel and becoming martyrs, which is really a more central part of their beliefs than I originally thought. The fundie sects are growing however because they feel that America is here to enforce our will and Christian and political philosophies on them.

If you were replying to my post, I absolutely agree with you, and I think if you re-read my post you'll see that I was making the same point. I had the original poster's comments in there in quotation marks, I hope no one mistook those views as mine. Islam is fundamentally a peaceful religion, just as fundamentally Christianity is a peaceful religion.

 

[SuperTool]

Why do conservatives bait America?

 

[Ferocious]

Why do liberals hate America?

Stare at that question for a minute or so.

It's quite scary when you soon realize how effective conservative talk radio and other mediums can be in brainwashing so many people.

 

[Bowfinger]

Originally posted by: Ferocious
Why do liberals hate America?

Stare at that question for a minute or so.

It's quite scary when you soon realize how effective conservative talk radio and other mediums can be in brainwashing so many people.

Amen.

There's a good article related to this in this thread: Framing the Dems - How conservatives control political debate and how progressives can take it back

 

[LilBlinbBlahIce]

We cause terrorism? Yeah.. right. Muslims have been either killing eachother or other people for thousands of years. They are a barbaric society and are hellbent on exterminating anyone who doesn't agree with them. How can they blame all their problems on America when we have only been around for 200+ years, when they have been around for 2000+? Wait, maybe THEY are the problem and not us..

It is at this brilliant statement by the ever wise Crimson that I stopped reading. Pure ignorance.

 

[ReiAyanami]

We are ruining the environment! Global warming, whales, oceans, etc.. I know, we have been being told the Earth is dying for 30 years now.. can we come up with something else? The earth is not dying, we are not killing it, can we move on to something a little more interesting please?

i guess that ozone hole does not exist. oh wait, it only doesn't exist to you because your life is not directly affected by it. don't mind that australia faced a 25% increase in skin cancer rates in just 10 years. or that certain regions of antarctica the penguin population was decimated by 90% where the hole is most prevalent (not a consipracy theory by bill gates to kill linux...)

it'd take well over 30 years for the earth to simply end, but once put in motion, it will be too late and maybe impossible to stop. humans have been the most destructive species on earth, that is certain.



perhaps asbestos is good for you, keeps you healthy the darwin way!

 

[chazzheatherly]

Drag - you want apersonal attack?
OK, you suck, Republican. Die, die, die.
there is your personal attack, Drag

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: chazzheatherly
Drag - you want apersonal attack?
OK, you suck, Republican. Die, die, die.
there is your personal attack, Drag

STOP POSTING!!!

 

[Sunner]

Originally posted by: Crimson
Ok, can someone PLEASE explain to me why liberals hate America? If the COUNTLESS posts from you guys here, we can conclude:

America is the root of all problems in the world.
America causes terrorism.
America causes third world countries to be poor.
America ruines the environment, and is killing mother earth.
America is trying to conquer the world.
Etc.. Etc.. Etc.. Fill in the appropriate line from the democratic playbook.

Lets think about this for a moment... it seems like America is involved in SOLVING many of the world's problems, rather than the cause. WWI? Our fault? No, but we help finished it. WWII? Our fault? Nope, but we helped FINISH it. Gulf War I, Bosnia, Kosovo, Panama, etc.. Did we start any of those problems? NO.. But damnit, nobody else would deal with it, so we did! Seems like an aweful lot of problems originating from these European countries which claim we are causing all the problems.

We cause terrorism? Yeah.. right. Muslims have been either killing eachother or other people for thousands of years. They are a barbaric society and are hellbent on exterminating anyone who doesn't agree with them. How can they blame all their problems on America when we have only been around for 200+ years, when they have been around for 2000+? Wait, maybe THEY are the problem and not us..

"But Christians have killed people too!".. Yeah, they DID.. several hundred years ago, for the most part we have gotten over the idea of forcibly converting people and killing anyone who doesn't agree. Unfortunately Islam is still stuck in the dark ages.

We are ruining the environment! Global warming, whales, oceans, etc.. I know, we have been being told the Earth is dying for 30 years now.. can we come up with something else? The earth is not dying, we are not killing it, can we move on to something a little more interesting please?

America is an imperialist country. PLEASE provide proof. Japan? Nope. Germany? Nope. France? Nope.. Yugoslavia? Nope. Kuwait? Nope. We seem to have a history of NOT being imperialist if you ask me. Most of the world can't seem to keep to stop starting wars. We need to go in and solve their problems for them. If we wanted to take over the world, we would have already of done it.

"But, the world hates us!" Of course they do.. We are the best god damn country in the world. We invented the car, the airplane, the internet, the lightbulb, the telegraph, the telephone, electricity.. What other country has had a greater impact on changing the world than us? People are jealous..

I love my country.. we are the best country in the world without a doubt.. I am not guilty for being successful, I am not guilty for trying to protect my success, I am not guilty for trying to bring freedom to the rest of the world, I am not guilty for intervening in world problems when they can't be resolved by the countries involved. I think the America haters have it backwards.. if the rest of the world would LEAVE US THE HELL ALONE, the world would be perfect. I am f-ing tired of having to fix the problems of other people.

God Bless America. Thank you to every serviceman who has died to protect me and my family. Without you we would be living under the rule of some brutal dictator. We are not the problem, we are simply the easiest place to point to.

Normally, I'd stay out of this, but here goes...

For one thing, I don't "hate America", I think there is a great abundance of arrogance among the US population though, but there are many great people whose company I enjoy.
I don't care much for the Bush administration though, I think Bush&co is a hazard to this planet and it's population, and no, this doesn't come from Dem vs Rep, I couldn't care less about that, I just don't like what the Bush administration has been doing.

As for that arrogance thing, stuff like this:

I love my country.. we are the best country in the world without a doubt..

How do you define best?
Did it actually occur to you that to me, my country is the best in the world, to a French fella, France is, etc etc?
There are many reasons why I wouldn't wanna live in the US, and Im sure there are many reasons why you'd never wanna live in Sweden, but judging by your comment that I quoted, you seem unable to fathom the concept which Im trying to describe.

And that arrogance is, IMO, the reaon why so many people have a general(as in, not directly related to Iraq, or something like that) dislike for the US, there are too many arrogant people who are stuck in that line of thinking, much like religious zealots are extremely annoying with their holier than thou attitudes.

 

[Lonyo]

Originally posted by: Crimson

I love my country.. we are the best country in the world without a doubt..

Best country...
in the world...?