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Why Do I Suck At Multiplayer FPS Games?

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CorCentral

Banned
Feb 11, 2001
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So cheating does'nt come into play with the newer FPS games? Don't tell me that they have this under control :laugh: No one mentioned it in this thread so far. Hell, I have'nt played an online FPS for a long time because of it.

Is there still cheating going on in these types of games?
 

T2k

Golden Member
Feb 24, 2004
1,664
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Originally posted by: Maleficus
Originally posted by: T2k
Try UT2k4 in Onslaught (a.k.a. ONS) mode.
I dare to say it's the best balanced online FPS gaming between retarded, mindless DM and TDM games which are utterly boring after 5-10 minutes and idiotically overblown teamwork-centered games like ETQW or BF2 where ad-hoc teams of people living normal life have no chance against group of acne-ridden teens w/o life (a.k.a. 'clans'). Besides this it's also nice that any vehicle or weapon has a match so with enough training you can take down Mantas or Raptors with handweapons. :D)
Watch out for UT3 as well - it's coming with Warfare which said to be an updated ONS mode...! :)
No. No no no no no no no no and no

ONS is not balanced at all and is a POS when it comes to competitive gaming.
Yes. It IS balanced, much better than anything else. OK, better than most - I didn't try everything. :)

Teamwork centered games require some practice, but you are perfectly capable of having a life, you just also need to have a working brain to be able to adapt to situations on the fly and a moderate amount of chemistry with your team so you can predict how they will react as well so as to form a cohesive unit and not x random people.
In other words you don't even know what I'm talking about when I said there's no chance in hell that... ehh, just read my post before you post another cliche like this, would'ya?
:(

btw I'm 22, have a job, and go to school, yes i'm in a 'clan'
Yeah, suuure. You know, wannabe clan members doesn't count...

PS: go to school != having a life :p
 

T2k

Golden Member
Feb 24, 2004
1,664
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Originally posted by: CorCentral
So cheating does'nt come into play with the newer FPS games? Don't tell me that they have this under control :laugh: No one mentioned it in this thread so far. Hell, I have'nt played an online FPS for a long time because of it.

Is there still cheating going on in these types of games?
When did you play FPS last time? :) Almost every game uses the buggy-as-hell-but-somehow-working PB.
AFAICT last time when cheating was a real issue was around Q3... :)
 

Zenoth

Diamond Member
Jan 29, 2005
5,081
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Originally posted by: Pez D Spencer
I've been pretty hardcore into FPS games for about 4 or 5 years now and I consider myself pretty good at them. Well, pretty good in singleplayer mode. FWIW, I never even really played on easy difficutly in singleplayer FPS games even when I was a novice. And these days I usually play on hard difficulty over normal because normal just doesn't seem to be much of a challenge most of the time.

The thing is that I've tried playing multiplayer FPS games online and honestly it's pretty lame IMO. Even though I might kick major ass in a game when in singleplayer, in multiplayer I usually get killed as soon as I'm spawned and I just don't see the fun in it. I've tried more times than I have fingers and toes and usually after about 10 minutes I get bored of the whole thing. Spawn, run around for a minute or two, get a kill if I'm lucky, get killed myself, respawn, do it all over...

I've tried deathmatches and team based ones like CTF, but in the end I still don't last more than a minute or two. When the Quake Wars demo came out a few weeks ago I gave that a shot as well but again I ended up as nothing more than the recipient of a major fragfest.

So why do you think I suck at MP so much? Whats a good MP FPS that a "noob" like me might actually be good at? (I've probably already tried most of them though).
You've been practicing with Artificial Intelligence opponents for that many years, which is why you "suck". Ask the same thing to someone who played for four or five years almost exclusively, or exclusively on-line, and that person will probably suck off-line (probably). The brain adapts to new situations. You've been away of human opponents for that much time ... so give you some time to adapt to the new challenge.
 
Oct 30, 2004
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What games are you playing? In my experience, there is a gigantic difference between playing single player and online multiplayer.

When I first played Unreal Tournament (1999) online, I was horrific and a total noob even though I'd logged hundreds of hours with the original Unreal single player game and even though I could play the single player UT game decently.

Unlike bots, human players don't run in straight lines and predictable routes and they'll try to outsmart you. They also have a great understanding of a map's choke points and open sniping areas, etc.

I think it must have taken me hundreds of hours merely to be able to just hold my own on the public servers and then a thousand more hours to become better than average and then perhaps more than that to become a good public server flag runner.

The first thing that I had to correct, and what helped me begin to make the jump, was to stop using arrow keys to look around and to start using my mouse. Then I bound "move forward" and "move backward" to the left and right mouse button keys, respectively. I also had to set my keyboard up so that I could easily use the strafe/dodge keys along with my fire buttons. (My setup is unusual, most people set the mouse buttons for primary fire and alternate fire and then use WASD for move forward, move backwards, and strafe left/right.)

Another thing--you can't run in straight lines and if there's a device available to you like the UT translocater in CTF, you have to become very proficient with it and learn to use it to travel across the map. (It's much easier than you think.)

Basically, there really isn't any substitute for hundreds of hours of online multiplayer experience. Heck, I'm still learning how to play the game better even today.

If you're playing CTF, I suggest starting with defense because you'll respawn closer to the action--closer to the area you want to play. Just try to make whatever little contribution you can. Perhaps you'll kill the opposition with suicide attacks first...then later maybe you'll kill the other players sometimes while surviving. Also, feel free to "flag camp". Hide behind a box or a corner and shoot at enemy players when they try to take the flag. Another thing you could try to do would be to get a spammy weapon and then go to a high-traffic or medium-traffic area of the map that has a narrow bottleneck. Camping the base's front doors might work.
 
Oct 30, 2004
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Originally posted by: kaioshade
This is pretty much the reason i stopped playing online. And i played for a hell of a lot longer than 10 minutes. I have logged over 100 hours into unreal 2k4 and well over 30 in the unreal 3 demo. i still get massacred like a pointless noob. training your ass of only to get raped is not fun.
I think one of your problems may be trying to play UT 2004. UT 2004 (unlike UT99 and UT3) is very heavily hitscan-based because of the floaty dodgy movement (know what the dodge jump is--you need to learn that) and the power and rate-of-fire of the shock rifle primary. Your best bet for UT 2004 is to play Onslaught (a little less hitscanny because of the vehicles) and Invasion Monster Hunt/Mash RPG (lots of fun). Two good North American Onslaught servers are the Omnip)o(tents and Death Warrant Spam Vikings servers. A good Invasion Monster Mash RPG server and the one I play on is the Death Warrant Monster Mash server.

BTW, did you notice that the UT 2004 CTF (at least the regular weapons, no vehicles) and Bombing Run servers are empty? That's because few people enjoyed those game types as a result of the heavy duty hitscan emphasis of the game play. In contrast, in UT99 (and, presumably, in UT3), regular weapons CTF was da bomb and public servers were packed 24/7 for a couple years after UT99's release.

I hope that you won't give up on UT3. Like I said in my other post, it can take hundreds of hours to become a decent online player. Also, with UT3 you'll soon have a unique opportunity to get in on the ground floor of the game once the final version is available in stores--expect to see lots of similarly situated "out-of-the-box noobs" on the public servers. Having played the Demo, you might be ahead of them skill wise. Aside from learning how to move, you also need to get a sense of which weapons are best for various situations. The Stinger Minigun is a powerful weapon if you can circle strafe and aim quickly. Also, the Shock Rifle should become one of your staple weapons--learn how to use the shock combo. For tight areas, break out the flak cannon or the rocket launcher (just don't shoot yourself in the foot).

 

clamum

Lifer
Feb 13, 2003
26,219
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I'd try something a little more team based, like Team Fortress 2 or Day of Defeat: Source. One thing that is very important is the learn the maps, know where everything is and how to get anywhere, and what paths people tend to take, camping spots, etc etc. It basically boils down to practice, practice, practice.

I realize it's frustrating to keep getting killed time after time, but if you don't stick with it and learn, you'll never be good. When I first started DoD: Source I was fricking terrible. Kept getting killed and didn't know wtf to do. I stuck with it and these days can usually kick a good amount of ass if I play.
 

PingSpike

Lifer
Feb 25, 2004
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Originally posted by: TehMac
Latency as well might be an issue for you.
Don't tell him that. There's already enough people that suck and blame every death on lag! (No offense pez)

Single and Multiplayer are two entirely different beasts, as you've probably noticed. You'll have learn to accept death as something that comes often, and sometimes early. AI usually uses one set of states and you can figure them all out quickly. You never really know what a human is going to do...there are endless possibilities. Strategies that work against AI are often less then useless against humans that are well practiced.

Sometimes, when I'm being stalked by a player I know I'm totally outclassed by I've had good luck making seemingly random decisions (about where to go at least). I know the player is thinking one step ahead of me, so thats one tactic that partially denies him that advantage. You laugh...but have you ever seen a crappy noob stumbling around a map get a clear shot on the top player (they screw up and miss, because...well they're noobs)?
 

QuantumPion

Diamond Member
Jun 27, 2005
6,010
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For a better example of the difference between AI and human opponents, look at various RTS games (e.g. starcraft). The AI is methodical, predictable, and dumb. People are smart, aggressive, adaptable, and have a will of their own. Being good at comp stomping on big game hunters is a completely different game from real competition.
 

kaioshade

Senior member
Jun 17, 2005
416
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You know, i dont know why, but your post has really encouraged me.

I wont give up on ut3 just yet, im going to keep practicing. I guess i dont suck as hard as i thought, as i was able to score a few kills on most games i play with. If i can see myself continuing to climb the ladder eventually, then i will be happy. I dont expect to get good overnight.

Thanks for the advice.
 

lxskllr

No Lifer
Nov 30, 2004
54,755
4,735
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Originally posted by: kaioshade
You know, i dont know why, but your post has really encouraged me.

I wont give up on ut3 just yet, im going to keep practicing. I guess i dont suck as hard as i thought, as i was able to score a few kills on most games i play with. If i can see myself continuing to climb the ladder eventually, then i will be happy. I dont expect to get good overnight.

Thanks for the advice.
It can take a good while before you start getting decent at UT. There's people that have been playing since 98. Don't worry about winning, just have fun and do your best. When I first started, I was happy to have people join in the middle of a match, that way I might not come in last :p I didn't really notice myself getting better, I just did. I slowly stopped coming in last, and have been getting very slowly better ever since. I've had complete newbs come on our server, and after a year they're pretty stiff competition. It takes time, but it's very rewarding progressing in this game.
 

Vidda

Senior member
Sep 29, 2004
614
0
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Originally posted by: T2k
Originally posted by: CorCentral
So cheating does'nt come into play with the newer FPS games? Don't tell me that they have this under control :laugh: No one mentioned it in this thread so far. Hell, I have'nt played an online FPS for a long time because of it.

Is there still cheating going on in these types of games?
When did you play FPS last time? :) Almost every game uses the buggy-as-hell-but-somehow-working PB.
AFAICT last time when cheating was a real issue was around Q3... :)
PB doesn't work very well simply because like all AC systems, it has to 'catch up' to the cheats, meaning there will always be cheaters...
 

omber

Member
Oct 17, 2007
126
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This is funny but I can give two tips from playing CSS for a while..

In general I was under impression that the higher the mouse sensitivity the better you get but it seems you're actually better of with low sensitivity (as low as you can handle) because it allows you to be more accurate and pull of head shots easier. The other suggestion is that if you are ever in situation when you are looking for targets in large area try to focus on center of the screen rather then trying to watch the whole of it...
 
Oct 18, 2007
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I'd like to know what FPSs you're playing. Keep in mind, that dying frequently is par-for-the-course in a lot of FPS games. If you're expecting to live more than a minute in games like Unreal Tournament (all incarnations), Team Fortress, etc, you're not playing them right. Hell, even in Battlefield 2142, if you're accomplishing anything remotely useful for your team, you're going to have a couple guys gunning for you.
 

wb182

Senior member
Nov 15, 2004
281
0
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I sympathize with this thread. I swear the only multi-player game I can recall being competitive in is Warcraft III mods DoTA & Tides of Blood.

Going to try to get better at UT3 & TF2 myself, but I'm not expecting any miracles. Then again, I never put the amount of time into FPSs that you seem to have, so I'm well aware of why I suck.
 

bpatters69

Senior member
Aug 25, 2004
314
1
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I play Call of Duty a Fair bit and I understand what you mean about being good at single player and bad at multiplayer. I have just got to the point where my kills equal my deaths. Sometimes I kill more than I die but usually it is 50/50. The strategy I use is to play the same map over and over again. I play on a server dedicated to a Mod-ed Carentten Map. It called PFB Carrenten or something like that. I have learned the map inside and out and I know where the good spots are to hide and...... camp when necessary.

I still think there are some cheaters out there and although they might not be using Aimbots, there are a lot of other cheats which can be un-detected. You might also want to check your ping to make sure you are playing on a server that has a low ping. This will come into play when you face off against another player by surprise and the first one to pull the trigger wins.

 

skillyho

Golden Member
Nov 6, 2005
1,337
0
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I'm kinda in the same boat....I love UT99 and UT2k4 put I get owned when I hop on servers just b/c I play recreationally when I can...and thats usually in a few hour spurts over a week or so and then I don't play for months. It's just something you have to be committed to if you want to play well online. Giving up after a few hours (or weeks for that matter) isn't going to put you in the top of the charts.
 

imported_Imp

Diamond Member
Dec 20, 2005
9,148
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Singleplayer is a million times easier cause the enemies are predictable. This makes it easy and fun once you have them figured out near the end. In multi, you can guess right what someone will do half the time, then once you think you have them, they run at you with a freakng bottle (TF2:)) or spam themselves, with you included, to death.

It's not just FPS games, same goes for RPGs. I rock at singleplayer cause I love turtling and turning every battle into one of attrition. Well, turns out 90% of players online like to rush me, which I'm never ready for... I try adapting, works once out of 20 so I just stopped playing them online. Quitting rocks.
 

m1ldslide1

Platinum Member
Feb 20, 2006
2,321
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Originally posted by: irishScott
Try America's Army. It takes a while to get used to the weapons (they're programmed to be realistic, so your aim will wobble with your simulated breathing and whatnot), and you WILL get owned initially, but you're guaranteed not to die the moment you spawn (it's team based, and the rounds are typically around 5 min. You spawn once with your team, and if you die, you're dead until the end of the round), and if you try to just run around and be the shitz even the noobs will kill you with ease. It takes a hell of a lot more thought/teamwork than most MP FPSs IMO.

http://www.americasarmy.com
(yes, I know it's a huge download)
I second this notion - AA was my first online FPS and it's a good one. You do spend some time sitting and waiting for the rounds to finish, but it's well worth it. You'll want to pick a map and commit to it, otherwise you'll never learn it. You won't do well at AA or games like it until you really know the maps.

Edit: By the way, I have around 500 hours in AA over the last 3 years and a FR of 1.7 or thereabouts. In other words, I'm not super good, but I know my maps and can hold my own, and it's taken a LOT more than 10 minutes to get there. Some of those guys are just SO insanely good...
 

bunnyfubbles

Lifer
Sep 3, 2001
12,248
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Human players know you're in the game and will hunt you down. AI in single player usually is set to stay in a specific area where you can attack them at your leisure.

Human players aren't restricted when it comes to tactics, AI will rarely ever employ true tactics. Some of the better AI will actually try and employ clever tricks such as trying to flank you, but if you adjust they usually can't compensate like a human could.
 

spunkz

Golden Member
Jul 16, 2003
1,467
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in counter-strike, when you die you are able to spectate and watch what other people are doing to stay alive and get kills. just learn from the better players and observe what makes them good. from there it's just aim and adapting to new situations.
 

bupkus

Diamond Member
Nov 25, 2000
3,816
0
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I'm surprised nobody suggested playing in spectator mode. There you can see what the best do. You'll probably notice a combination of good body movement and good tactical decisions. Just watch the ones with the highest scores and you'll see a lot that you can learn from.
 

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