Why did Trump win and what will be the response of the Democratic party?

[pcgeek11]

Oh quit fucking whining. The average democrat/liberal wants to help people. When those people do nothing but throw shit at them, then blame them when the room is full of feces, the average democrat/liberal will turn away from them. If the harassment continues, those shitheads will be turned on.

Just like everyone else, you seek perfection from democrats, and permit anything and everything from Republicans, because It's What's Expected.

Not whining.

I guess the facts bother you huh.

I don't seek perfection from anyone. I am a realist.

 

[MrSquished]

Not whining.

I guess the facts bother you huh.

I don't seek perfection from anyone. I am a realist.

I can't wait to see you suffer the consequences of your vote and support of evil.

 

[pcgeek11]

I can't wait to see you suffer the consequences of your vote and support of evil.

You do not know who I voted for obviously...

 

[MrSquished]

You do not know who I voted for obviously...

You are defending the worst of Trumpism, who cares if you wrote in some dumb name. You still support it.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Just curious, and it's ok if you don't have an answer for this, but what would have been a better message on inflation (if any)?

Do you think if she just took the "blame" for it (obviously more complicated than this), and made up a bunch of bullshit proposals to lower prices, would this have worked? It would be no different than anything Trump proposes.

I mean, if the economy/inflation is the #1 issue, then lean into it. Even if your proposals are garbage, because apparently the average voter doesn't care about your plans, just that you talk about it and acknowledge it, right?

Not sure just pointing out to people who are asking what went wrong it is plainly in our face.
To answer the question that’s what professional consultants need to address.
To answer me personally, I have said I want democrats to use more strong arm tactics as in last year I would have liked to see CEOs brought in to explain why they are showing record profits, and record bonus payouts while prices remain high.
Let them explain, beat them up over it.

 

[spacejamz]

No one here has mentioned that maybe they just didn't think she was a qualified candidate to begin with? Or are they not allowed to think that?

 

[dank69]

No one here has mentioned that maybe they just didn't think she was a qualified candidate to begin with? Or are they not allowed to think that?

You're allowed to think whatever stupid thing you want.

 

[spacejamz]

You're allowed to think whatever stupid thing you want.

so much for posting an honest and civil reply to the question of why Trump won...

 

[Greenman]

I think going forward, we just need to blame all bad things on Trump. Ride the wave of discontent.

I think you mean ride the wave of failed strategy.

 

[dank69]

so much for posting an honest and civil reply to the question of why Trump won...

an honest reply? If they voted for Trump in 2016, wouldn't that mean they don't give a fuck about qualifications? If they voted for Trump in 2024 wouldn't that mean they don't give a fuck about qualifications? I mean, if we're being honest.

 

[Greenman]

so much for posting an honest and civil reply to the question of why Trump won...

Does something make you think there is anything honest or civil about P&N?

 

[fskimospy]

Does something make you think there is anything honest or civil about P&N?

I think I am honest and civil, would you disagree?

That being said, I'm still interested in your reasons for voting for someone convicted of dozens of felonies, found to have raped someone, and who tried to overthrow the government. Did you ever imagine when you were younger that you would support something like that?

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

so much for posting an honest and civil reply to the question of why Trump won...

Trust us, this is civil.

No one here has mentioned that maybe they just didn't think she was a qualified candidate to begin with? Or are they not allowed to think that?

Assuming this is an honest question, yeah you're welcome to think that. Some may agree with you. Realistically? She was a fine candidate and a fairly normal politician. We collectively don't have a lot of experience with female politicians in general, but she's about as prototypical career beltway as you can get, and she would have made a very competent president for 4-8 years. That clearly isn't what the voters want though, so that's not what they're gonna get.

 

[fskimospy]

No one here has mentioned that maybe they just didn't think she was a qualified candidate to begin with? Or are they not allowed to think that?

People could obviously think she wasn't a qualified candidate if they wanted to but if you think voters made their choice based on qualifications it seems difficult to square that with choosing a rapist convicted of 34 felonies who attempted a coup last time he was in power.

I mean how much less qualified can someone be than that?

 

[spacejamz]

an honest reply? If they voted for Trump in 2016, wouldn't that mean they don't give a fuck about qualifications? If they voted for Trump in 2024 wouldn't that mean they don't give a fuck about qualifications? I mean, if we're being honest.

damn....God forbid anyone has a different opinion than yours...and if they do, apparently it makes them a dumb ass. And democrats are still scratching their heads at the results from Tuesday night.

 

[IronWing]

damn....God forbid anyone has a different opinion than yours...and if they do, apparently it makes them a dumb ass. And democrats are still scratching their heads at the results from Tuesday night.

A dumbass or willfully cruel. Trump's agenda is to attack the most vulnerable people. Voting for that agenda is to want to see people harmed.

 

[fskimospy]

damn....God forbid anyone has a different opinion than yours...and if they do, apparently it makes them a dumb ass. And democrats are still scratching their heads at the results from Tuesday night.

You claim to want a civil discussion and I gave you a civil response and a question. If you think this was about qualifications then why did Trump being a rapist felon who attempted to overthrow the government not lead to his defeat? Hard to think of many worse 'qualifications' than those.

What are your thoughts on this?

 

[Fenixgoon]

damn....God forbid anyone has a different opinion than yours...and if they do, apparently it makes them a dumb ass. And democrats are still scratching their heads at the results from Tuesday night.

Genuine discourse is welcome. Disingenuous discourse is not.

"Illegals come here, commit crimes, and take your jobs" is a lie. And it is an objectively provable one. Immigrants have a crime rate lower than "natural" US citizens. And they clearly don't take jobs if unemployment is near historic lows.

"Crime is out of control" is a lie, when data shows the crime rate is near its historic low.

"Schools turning kids gay/trans" is objectively false.

The list goes on and on. That is not a difference of opinion. That is a difference in operating in reality and believing a fabrication.

 

[fskimospy]

Genuine discourse is welcome. Disingenuous discourse is not.

"Illegals come here, commit crimes, and take your jobs" is a lie. And it is an objectively provable one. Immigrants have a crime rate lower than "natural" US citizens. And they clearly don't take jobs if unemployment is near historic lows.

"Crime is out of control" is a lie, when data shows the crime rate is near its historic low.

"Schools turning kids gay/trans" is objectively false.

The list goes on and on. That is not a difference of opinion. That is a difference in operating in reality and believing a fabrication.

'Immigrants are taking your jobs' was one of the biggest lies. They loved to point out that over 100% of new jobs went to the foreign born, which is true. What they didn't point out is the reason for that is the native born working age population is shrinking so while a greater proportion of them are working, it's fewer total people.

In a nation of sane and rational discourse we would look at our declining population and our labor shortage and decide we should make it easier for people to come here and work. In our timeline though apparently the answer to labor shortages is to deport laborers.

 

[Moonbeam]

'Immigrants are taking your jobs' was one of the biggest lies. They loved to point out that over 100% of new jobs went to the foreign born, which is true. What they didn't point out is the reason for that is the native born working age population is shrinking so while a greater proportion of them are working, it's fewer total people.

In a nation of sane and rational discourse we would look at our declining population and our labor shortage and decide we should make it easier for people to come here and work. In our timeline though apparently the answer to labor shortages is to deport laborers.

I believe the obstacle to seeing the world as you do, in my opinion, objectively and rationally, one needs a lack of personal motivation to see otherwise, in short an unbiased observer. My theory as to why, this does not happen is because millions and millions of people live in economic distress. I believe the biggest factor as to why economically stretched people are in that condition is because our economy produces an inequality of income where most of the wealth in the country belongs to way way too few people and that most of those who own most of the wealth want it to stay that way and pay others to keep it that way.

They are well aware that where economic stress exists people live in fear and that fear produced greediness and hatred of competitors. Thus the manufacture of notions that someone other than the haves are responsible for the stress felt by millions they use that hatred and fear and greed to keep control. They sell fear, hatred, and resentment to the stressed by creating the notions that others then themselves are to blame for their misery. They blame socialism and all notions of economic equality of income, by calling it theft from those already stressed, and the unemployed looking to work for less if it means a job. They blame immigrants especially for this, and while the rich will use immigrants as scapegoats for the stressed to blame, they will be the first to hire them and prevent unionization while pretending to want walls built.

Thus we live in a world where the stressed do everything in their power to fuck themselves because they have been convinced they are fucking somebody else. And if you were such a fool would you really want to know it?

It's the economy stupid means there is only one God and it is money because money is how our society papers over self hate. The rich are rich because they are deserving. Of course they are deserving because they sacrifices their life energies to achieve it as well as, for so many, any shreds of health self respect.

 

[fskimospy]

I believe the obstacle to seeing the world as you do, in my opinion, objectively and rationally, one needs a lack of personal motivation to see otherwise, in short an unbiased observer. My theory as to why, this does not happen is because millions and millions of people live in economic distress. I believe the biggest factor as to why economically stretched people are in that condition is because our economy produces an inequality of income where most of the wealth in the country belongs to way way too few people and that most of those who own most of the wealth want it to stay that way and pay others to keep it that way.

They are well aware that where economic stress exists people live in fear and that fear produced greediness and hatred of competitors. Thus the manufacture of notions that someone other than the haves are responsible for the stress felt by millions they use that hatred and fear and greed to keep control. They sell fear, hatred, and resentment to the stressed by creating the notions that others then themselves are to blame for their misery. They blame socialism and all notions of economic equality of income, by calling it theft from those already stressed, and the unemployed looking to work for less if it means a job. They blame immigrants especially for this, and while the rich will use immigrants as scapegoats for the stressed to blame, they will be the first to hire them and prevent unionization while pretending to want walls built.

Thus we live in a world where the stressed do everything in their power to fuck themselves because they have been convinced they are fucking somebody else. And if you were such a fool would you really want to know it?

It's the economy stupid means there is only one God and it is money because money is how our society papers over self hate. The rich are rich because they are deserving. Of course they are deserving because they sacrifices their life energies to achieve it as well as, for so many, any shreds of health self respect.

I do agree that people factor in inequality and that this can make people pissed off despite in objective material terms, their quality of life improving. As I said I think a lot of people would prefer to be the richest guy in a poor town than the poorest guy in a rich town, even if being in the rich town meant you had things better.

Sad.

 

[Sunburn74]

I am just today finding out who won. I blocked the news for 3 days after the election. Honestly I'm not surprised. I never really thought Kamala would win. I hoped she would but her campaign was so trash and no one really knew what she stood for, nor did she take any even borderline controversial positions that would have shown a fighting spirit. The democratic campaign was so bad and honestly I can't really think of any major thing the Biden/Harris administration did that really moved the needle during their time in office. They were fine as leadership but the polls make it pretty clear that they lost ground with pretty much everyone (blacks, latino's, young people, women, etc). At the end of the day, they got blamed for a lot of stuff that wasn't really in their control. Then in 4 years things will reverse, people will see the grass wasn't greener on the other side and things will go back to normal. The more things change, the more they stay the same. At the very least as a 1 percenter, I'll probably get a nice tax cut so whatever.

I really blame Biden for creating this situation and the democratic party for not having the balls to just redo the primaries and instead going with someone who's never won anything on the national stage and is seen as less interesting as paint drying.

 

[Moonbeam]

Again with the "massaging problem" get it through your thick fucking skull the Dems will never be able to message right because there is a firehose of misinformation poisoning the well. You said it yourself, whatever Kamala's message actually was, half of people thought it was too loberal and half thought it was to conservative. That should tell you Democrats can never win the messaging because no matter what they do it will be too liberal for half the country and too conservative for the rest. Pull your head out of your ass please.

I think the problem is that liberals don't understand what they are up against they don't know the enemy because they do not know themselves. I agree that ignorant people can't formulate a winning message and agree that any formulated will be effectively corrupted by conservative propaganda.

As an example of how to use knowledge of the nature of the enemy to defeat them, if I ran a large media corp like MSNBC I would be on every night praising the leadership tallent of Jack Vance the incumbent VP. He's the one that deserves all the attention he is just so much better, brighter, stronger, good looking and sexually attractive that that old has been he ran with.

 

[outriding]

Not whining.

I guess the facts bother you huh.

I don't seek perfection from anyone. I am a realist.

Hmmm waiting for the liberals attacking police at the capital like the Jan 6 crew did.

 

[MrSquished]

I despise your guts because in 8 years of hating him you couldn’t change him. Fuck you and all your worthless hatred. What a fucking idiot. Cough!

There were folks here that talked to him point by point for many of those years trying to convince him with logic, facts, and cogent arguments. He only got worse.

I prefer not to waste my time getting all nuanced and serious with very shitty unserious people that will just gaslight you, like him.

I knew what he was, and so did others, so I feel just fucking fine, thanks buddy! There are some people on my social and in real life I've spoken to trying to change their mind and give them a chance, if I see any potential. Not wasting my time with those I know are rotten to the core.