Why Catholic Schools Spell Success For America's Inner-City Children

[cubeless]

go catholic schools go!!!

my oldest son just started teaching at a catholic school in grosse pointe, mi... he says the school is well funded and over 90% catholic kids... the majority of their staff isn't clergy or nuns, but most (like my son) are actively practicing catholics (he even went to madonna u in livonia to get his degree)...

he says that there's a very high level of parental involvement in both the school he's at and the schools he did his year of slave labor at last year (of course these are the 'good' areas of mi)... methinks, like others here, that that really is the deciding factor in what you get in the system...

i'm just happy that he's earning enough to start paying his own bills finally!!!

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: Marlin1975
1. This is from the heritage, a right wing republican group

2. Kids that go to private schools have parents that are more active with their kids. If soemone goes out of their way to send a kid to a certain school they are also more likly to make sure their kids do their homework, attend school each day, etc... Its not about the school but the parents.

3. So OP who were you before you were banned? Butterface? Loser111?

And for that I agree 100% with #2

 

[WashedInTheBloodOfTheLamb]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Marlin1975
1. This is from the heritage, a right wing republican group

2. Kids that go to private schools have parents that are more active with their kids. If soemone goes out of their way to send a kid to a certain school they are also more likly to make sure their kids do their homework, attend school each day, etc... Its not about the school but the parents.

3. So OP who were you before you were banned? Butterface? Loser111?

And for that I agree 100% with #2

The study by the Rand Corporation referenced in the article I linked compared results for Catholic and public schools drawing from the same demographapic.

Are you suggesting that all parents who sned their kids to public schools in the inner-city are disinterered in their childrens education?

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: WashedInTheBloodOfTheLamb
Why Catholic Schools Spell Success For America's Inner-City Children

Mean ass Nuns who don't take shit from snot nosed kids.

 

[PJABBER]

OP. don't worry about the wide range and type of commentary here. If you had taken the time to read some of the other threads you would see both extraordinary rudeness and extraordinary insight. Partisan hacks abound here! (Now, let's see how long it takes for me to be identified as such by the howling mobs!)

Catholic schools are great options to public education for all of the reasons stated by others - better discipline, more parents are likely to be engaged, there is some discussion of a moral code, though many schools don't require participation in the religious classes.

The downside is that they don't have money for special education needs and those students spend some time in the public education system.

I attended Catholic school in a working class neighborhood in an industrial city and took shop (metal and wood working) in public school. Summers I went to enrichment classes at the public HS. The Catholic school was much tougher on behavior, going to the public school was an eye opener for me. The neighborhood continued downhill as the original immigrant community moved up and out and that Catholic school eventually closed.

When I was a substitute teacher at the local "alternative" HS I saw the wide range of disruptive kids that originally started off in the public school system. I am glad I did not have a lot of exposure to the issues they had and brought into the classroom. I also subbed a bit in the public grammar and middle school - the young kids were great, the older kids had increased self control problems and kids that wanted to learn were having a hard time at it. I did not find the expertise of teaching was different between the two systems, but the learning environment definitely was.

I work overseas a lot and my comments apply equally in other countries. Private schools are better for establishing an environment where students can learn.

My wife and I initially put the kids in public schools but now have them in Catholic schools. From living overseas in non-English speaking countries and moving every one or two years, the kids standardize tested a year behind in English language skills and stayed like that while in one of the best U.S. public school systems when we relocated back. Last year, we put them into Catholic schools and they now standardize test a year ahead of the curve. So, in this particular case, they jumped two years in performance by not being distracted. And they actually look forward to going to school.

YMMV. I am sure there are exceptions, but having structure and an environment that encourages learning works. As does having parents engage in education.

There is another thread that explores this topic here - African Researcher Investigates Cause of African-American Poor Academic Peformance (in Affluent communities)

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: WashedInTheBloodOfTheLamb

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Marlin1975
1. This is from the heritage, a right wing republican group

2. Kids that go to private schools have parents that are more active with their kids. If soemone goes out of their way to send a kid to a certain school they are also more likly to make sure their kids do their homework, attend school each day, etc... Its not about the school but the parents.

3. So OP who were you before you were banned? Butterface? Loser111?

And for that I agree 100% with #2

The study by the Rand Corporation referenced in the article I linked compared results for Catholic and public schools drawing from the same demographapic.

Are you suggesting that all parents who sned their kids to public schools in the inner-city are disinterered in their childrens education?

Less so, yes. I never implied "all".

 

[WashedInTheBloodOfTheLamb]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: WashedInTheBloodOfTheLamb

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Marlin1975
1. This is from the heritage, a right wing republican group

2. Kids that go to private schools have parents that are more active with their kids. If soemone goes out of their way to send a kid to a certain school they are also more likly to make sure their kids do their homework, attend school each day, etc... Its not about the school but the parents.

3. So OP who were you before you were banned? Butterface? Loser111?

And for that I agree 100% with #2

The study by the Rand Corporation referenced in the article I linked compared results for Catholic and public schools drawing from the same demographapic.

Are you suggesting that all parents who sned their kids to public schools in the inner-city are disinterered in their childrens education?

Less so, yes. I never implied "all".

Converesly, would you say all parents who send their kids to Catholic school are interested and engaged?

What I'm suggesting is that there's more to the success of Catholic schools than parental involvement, although that is certainly very important.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: WashedInTheBloodOfTheLamb


Converesly, would you say all parents who send their kids to Catholic school are interested and engaged?

No.

Originally posted by: WashedInTheBloodOfTheLamb
What I'm suggesting is that there's more to the success of Catholic schools than parental involvement, although that is certainly very important.

Agree 100%.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: WashedInTheBloodOfTheLamb
Why Catholic Schools Spell Success For America's Inner-City Children

Mean ass Nuns who don't take shit from snot nosed kids.

Oh... heck... they loved me.

I don't know about now a days but when I attended a Catholic Academy we stayed in the same classroom and had the same Nun/Jesuit for all subjects (except stuff like music and art) AND we had three divisions of grade. 8.1, 8.2, and 8.3 as an example. IF you were really bright you'd be in 8.1 and less so you'd be in 8.2., etc. You were taught to the level of your ability to learn. IF you were beyond the grade level '.1' you'd be 'skipped' up a grade and if you were below a grade level '.3' you'd be 'relegated'. IF you were getting so old or would not put in the effort, and effort was required, your parents would have to take you and put you in Public School. I really enjoyed that environment because we were challenged to the extreme. Our little ego always wanted to be in the '.1' class so we could strut about but also cuz some of us wanted to know stuff and we also just loved Sr. Marcella

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Siddhartha

Originally posted by: WashedInTheBloodOfTheLamb
It's impressive that drawing from the same demographic, Catholic schools do a much better job of educating children at a much lower cost.

Perhaps public schools should model themselves after their poor cousins. Or better yet, maybe parents should be able to use some of their tax dollars going to failed public schools to send their children to the school of their choice.

Link

Where are you going to get the nuns to teach in these schools. What if the kids and their families are not Catholic?

When I was a kid my dad mentioned sending me to a catholic school. The big problem was I wasn't a Christian and it would have pissed me off more about school if I had been forced to listen to the dogma.

:disgust:

This isnt the 1950s. I went through Catholic school from K-10 and didnt see a single Nun in the classroom.

We had plenty of non catholics in the the two schools I attended. They had various options if they didnt want to participate in a religion class.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

Not all private schools are Catholic, but the vast majority are going to be preferable to public school. Not only do you have smaller class sizes with more individual attention, but if parents are shelling out tens of thousands of dollars to get their kids educated, they're going to be more committed to keeping their children on task and make sure they are actually learning. That's not Catholicism, that's capitalism; if you invest that money, you're going to make sure you get something out of it.

 

[umbrella39]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I'm for any school that teaches folk to have shorter names.

I am expecting good things from this new poster, especially if he is the resurrected voice of an ex banned zealot.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Siddhartha

Originally posted by: WashedInTheBloodOfTheLamb
It's impressive that drawing from the same demographic, Catholic schools do a much better job of educating children at a much lower cost.

Perhaps public schools should model themselves after their poor cousins. Or better yet, maybe parents should be able to use some of their tax dollars going to failed public schools to send their children to the school of their choice.

Link

Where are you going to get the nuns to teach in these schools. What if the kids and their families are not Catholic?

When I was a kid my dad mentioned sending me to a catholic school. The big problem was I wasn't a Christian and it would have pissed me off more about school if I had been forced to listen to the dogma.

Back when I went to St. John's about a third of the kids were not Catholic. They were the kids from UN delegates and lived on campus. They were rich and could pay the tuition. The local kids generally were Catholic, however. And, quite poor!

They, the school, wanted kids who wanted to learn stuff over the money they'd pay to attend. They, the non Catholic kids, were not required to participate in church activity. IF they wanted to Convert, and who wouldn't hehehehehe, they had alternate lesson to that end.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I'm for any school that teaches folk to have shorter names.

Would you prefer 'Smiles' with a mile between the 'Esses'... heheheheh

 

[piasabird]

Generally the reason why is that the people that are willing to pay to send their child to a catholic school care about their children. It is not because the Catholic school is that great; it is because the kids have good parents that love their children.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: piasabird
Generally the reason why is that the people that are willing to pay to send their child to a catholic school care about their children. It is not because the Catholic school is that great; it is because the kids have good parents that love their children.

I'm not going to outright disagree but, the teachers (in my 1950s and very early 1960s) were the highest educated elementary and high school instructors in the City. (NYC). Especially the Jesuits. The kids were sent to Catholic School not because their parents cared so much for them but that they could board them there or it was what you did with your kids if they were Catholic. The folks from the UN that sent their kids there were especially interested in the room and board aspect.
I've no idea today since I've not sought to know.

 

[WHAMPOM]

Cut the ALL, EVERYONE, and EVERYTHING, lamby. Parental support in education is 75% of the difference between a failing student and an excelling one. Besides comparing public to catholic is a case of cherry picking, compare your catholic schools to other private and see how your schools suck.

 

[PJABBER]

The Jesuit (Society of Jesus) universities are world class. One that comes to mind is the Gregorian University in Rome. I think that the Jesuits are the Catholic religious order with the highest number of Phds.

Some more from Wiki -

In the United States, 28 Jesuit tertiary education institutions are organized as the Association of Jesuit Colleges and Universities, the oldest one being Georgetown University in Washington, D.C., founded by Bishop John Carroll in 1789. One of its presidents, Father Patrick Francis Healy, was the first African American to head a major university. The largest institution is Fordham University in New York City. The 46 Jesuit high schools of America are organized under the Jesuit Secondary Education Association. The Jesuits have recently opened a number of middle schools in poor neighborhoods in New York, Boston, Baltimore, Washington, DC, Chicago and Omaha. There are also Jesuits serving on the faculties of other Catholic colleges and universities; additionally they serve on many secular faculties.

You would be lucky if you lived close by and could get your kid into one of these schools.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: WHAMPOM
Cut the ALL, EVERYONE, and EVERYTHING, lamby. Parental support in education is 75% of the difference between a failing student and an excelling one. Besides comparing public to catholic is a case of cherry picking, compare your catholic schools to other private and see how your schools suck.

Go ahead and link away. Feel free.

 

[alchemize]

Well run homeschooling pwns them all.

 

[evident]

Originally posted by: PJABBER
The Jesuit (Society of Jesus) universities are world class. One that comes to mind is the Gregorian University in Rome. I think that the Jesuits are the Catholic religious order with the highest number of Phds.

Some more from Wiki -

In the United States, 28 Jesuit tertiary education institutions are organized as the Association of Jesuit Colleges and Universities, the oldest one being Georgetown University in Washington, D.C., founded by Bishop John Carroll in 1789. One of its presidents, Father Patrick Francis Healy, was the first African American to head a major university. The largest institution is Fordham University in New York City. The 46 Jesuit high schools of America are organized under the Jesuit Secondary Education Association. The Jesuits have recently opened a number of middle schools in poor neighborhoods in New York, Boston, Baltimore, Washington, DC, Chicago and Omaha. There are also Jesuits serving on the faculties of other Catholic colleges and universities; additionally they serve on many secular faculties.

You would be lucky if you lived close by and could get your kid into one of these schools.

don't forget the augustinians, you know, gregor mendel and all...

 

[marincounty]

I think one of the problems with public schools is the fact that they are free. I think many parents don't seem to care about their children's education because the state is taking care of it. I think a small payment by the parents for each student, on a sliding scale based on family income, would do wonders for parental involvement. Parents would not be as likely to tolerate poor grades and cutting classes when it is their hard-earned money going to waste.

 

[evident]

Originally posted by: alchemize
Well run homeschooling pwns them all.

except that some crazy parents teach kids wacked out shit

 

[nick1985]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: WashedInTheBloodOfTheLamb
Why Catholic Schools Spell Success For America's Inner-City Children

Mean ass Nuns who don't take shit from snot nosed kids.

lol

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Atomic Playboy
Not all private schools are Catholic, but the vast majority are going to be preferable to public school. Not only do you have smaller class sizes with more individual attention, but if parents are shelling out tens of thousands of dollars to get their kids educated, they're going to be more committed to keeping their children on task and make sure they are actually learning. That's not Catholicism, that's capitalism; if you invest that money, you're going to make sure you get something out of it.

I think it also has to do with Peer Pressure issues. IF you've kids are surrounded by kids focused on learning Parents have not at all to do, really. The kids are self motivated. There are lots of private schools that offer the same benefits as Catholic schools vs the Public School System but right here in my little neck of the woods kids get the parents to move into the Public high school districts so they can avail themselves of the right school. I think the students and eventual alumni that give the schools the rep. The teachers are very important but they too are motivated by their students.