Why can't I solder correctly?

[brxndxn]

Don't be dumb and buy an expensive soldering iron unless you plan to spend a ton of time soldering. With my $5.99 15W soldering iron from Radio Shack, I've soldered two different 29-wire modchips on Playstation 2s, soldered quite a few Playsation 1s, audio out pins on a SB Live value, and I've even done soldering for plumbing (though, that uses a blowtorch).

BUT.. USE FLUX. People that don't 'use flux' are either soldering wrong or using flux without even knowing it. (There is usually a small amount of flux left on soldering locations or in the soldering wire itself.) The flux is the adhesive. Think of it like primer..

You can tell you've soldered correctly when where you've soldered looks just like the existing soldered items on a board. Anything you solder should be fairly strong - will hold up if you bend the wire.


1. Apply flux to end A and end B (assuming you're soldering A to B)
2. Melt a small amount (not a big ball) of solder to the end of the soldering iron
3. Brush soldering iron on end A and end B. Make sure the wires are heated - so give it some time. Dropping a bunch of solder on cold metal does nothing. The flux should sizzle and smoke.
4. Put A to B and touch with iron. Again, the flux should sizzle and smoke. When it does, quickly remove the tip of the iron.
5. Tug lightly on the connection to test its' strength.

 

[SuperPickle]

Many tips here are helpful, but the key is the solder. Many rosin core solders are 40/60 (tin to lead). Get ahold of some 60/40 or even 70/30 rosin core solder if you can find it. It has a lower melting point and is easier to work. It surely will give you better results.

 

[BullsOnParade]

Flux takes the oxidation layer off the metal surfaces and lets the solder properly adhere to the
surfaces. A lot of times when you glob solder over a surface you have a dry/cold joint, meaning
there's a poor thermal/electrical connection as a result of poor bonding of the solder. Avoid this by
making sure you're applying solder to the heated contacts not the iron. Patience and practice are
the best soldering tools, however a proper iron with a suitable sided tip helps.

good luck.

 

[Colt45]

use 63/37 (60/40 if you're ghetto or something), flux/rosin core, or use seperate flux. i don't really care.
use the right size tip for proper heat transfer
use the right power for the amount of stuff you are heating
form a solder bridge at the start, to help transfer heat

that said.. I like hakko irons. but.. i can solder fine with a $6 ratshack one too.. just not very good for some applications
I think most people learn on a radioshack deluxe. piss around, you'll get it.

 

[Dulanic]

It's a skill, few people are good at soldering, many can do it ok, but few are good. My friends always ask me to do any of their soldering, after a couple years of being a electronics tech working on components ranging from large, or tiny surface mount, you learn to do it well. Everyone has given helpful hints, so I don't have much to add on that. Just takes practice, when I started working on boards it was tough, I was decent but not good, within a month I was able to solder 100 pin surface mount chips. They were too cheap to get the right equipment, we had to do thoose by hand, luckily not very often.

 

[Slickone]

OK, my solder is Nippon 60% Rosin Core, .8mm. So this is 60/40, right?

Colt45, you're metioning stuff that I'm basically asking to explain.

OK, where should I buy flux?

I like the iron style of the Metcal (you can hold it closer to tip), but way too expensive for me.

Thanks to Technokid for the link to the Wellers at AE. There's a $13 MIR for the WLC100. Still wondering if the iron is any better than the $5-$10 ones. Is it constructed in the same way & can the tip still become unable to tighten down?

Originally posted by: brxndxn
Don't be dumb and buy an expensive soldering iron unless you plan to spend a ton of time soldering. With my $5.99 15W soldering iron from Radio Shack, I've soldered two different 29-wire modchips on Playstation 2s, soldered quite a few Playsation 1s, audio out pins on a SB Live value, and I've even done soldering for plumbing (though, that uses a blowtorch).

BUT.. USE FLUX. People that don't 'use flux' are either soldering wrong or using flux without even knowing it. (There is usually a small amount of flux left on soldering locations or in the soldering wire itself.) The flux is the adhesive. Think of it like primer..

You can tell you've soldered correctly when where you've soldered looks just like the existing soldered items on a board. Anything you solder should be fairly strong - will hold up if you bend the wire.


1. Apply flux to end A and end B (assuming you're soldering A to B)
2. Melt a small amount (not a big ball) of solder to the end of the soldering iron
3. Brush soldering iron on end A and end B. Make sure the wires are heated - so give it some time. Dropping a bunch of solder on cold metal does nothing. The flux should sizzle and smoke.
4. Put A to B and touch with iron. Again, the flux should sizzle and smoke. When it does, quickly remove the tip of the iron.
5. Tug lightly on the connection to test its' strength.

So your $5.99 Radio Shack doesn't have the loose tip problem mine does, or that the other $5 one I had before did?

The solder you say to apply in step 3...is that the solder you're saying to use to join? I thought that was not the correct way.

 

[DOSfan]

I will throw my two cents in here, just to try and make it more clear. Everyone has given you pretty good tips so far.

1) I would recomend the 15 watt setting. When you get the nack for slodering, you will enjoy the higher setting, but for now stick to 15 watt.
2) Flux isn't required. I do highly recomend it - at least until you get good at soldering. When you find the skill (no offense intended) you can do just as well, if not better without flux.
3) Make sure you iron is hot. Yes, the tip should be tight... But it really depends on what you mean by loose. I can't make it more clear than that. Do what you can to tighten it. You might want to look for bigger diameter tips.
4) Yes, you should dab a little solder on the tip of your iron. When you get the hang of it, you will know just by looking at it if it is good. But until then, just touch the solder to the tip of the iron, and let some melt. Unless you go crazy, do not worry if you get too much on there right now. Then after you have the solder on the tip, just shake the iron a little, to let inertia take off the excess solder. To help you understand the "shake," imagine you have drinking straw with a little beverage in the end that for some reason you wish to not be there. You just flick the straw real quick, and the beverage comes out, right? Same effect. Just hold the iron a couple of inches over a "scrap work surface" and flick the end slightly. Not too much, you do not want to throw solder all over the place. This should give the tip a nice silvery shine to it.
5) Now for the real tricky part. You have to heat the component lead, and the face of the board. You need to hold the soldering iron against both parts - at the same time if you can swing it, but moving from one to the other works too. You need to be careful, because you can melt the board and/or the component. (As you are aware.) As you get more comfortable with soldering you will know about how long this takes, but when starting out try touching the solder to the opposite side of the lead as where your iron is. (If the tip of the iron is on the right side of the lead, touch the solder to the left side. Idealy, you will melt the solder in this fashion.) If you find that this is not working, you can start the solder against the iron and let the bead flow to the soldering point - BUT, this will make it more likely to get a cold joint. This is not good.
6) If all goes well, you have a nice bead of solder on the lead that forms seamlessly to the board face. When it cools, if it is still silvery and shiny, you have a good joint. If it is dull and gray, something went wrong. (Most likely you have a cold joint. This means that you did not get the items to be soldered hot enough for the solder to flow right.)

I hope this helps clear some things up. And I appologize if I made it worse. But this is about the best I can do without actually being able to show you in person.

Do be patient, and take your time. As others have said, it is an art.

EDIT:: Nearly forgot. For what you are doing, smaller tips and solder are best. You do not want a boat ore for a tip, and a 2" hemp rope for solder.

 

[CrazyDe1]

Get a METCAL

I won't solder anything without one of these....

 

[Slappy00]

copper desoldering braids are your friend.

oh and

I've soldered two different 29-wire modchips on Playstation 2s...

those are hardcore I tried it on a V4 and well bad things happened ... those points (esp on the IC's) are soo small you have to be super nearsighted to see if you soldered em right. Of course this was before i said "screw it" and went to digicom and got a third hand, paste flux and a decient soldering iron.

 

[edfcmc]

My .02 as a former milsec solder certified tech,

Your rat shack model is sufficient for what you are intending to use it for. In fact, you really shouldnt spend any more money on a new soldering iron until you *mastered* the one you are using. Think of it as a bike with training wheels. With that being saidl most of the tips here are very helpful. But, i will like to reiterate the following:

1) Tin the tip/clean the tip

tools needed: Wet sponge, metal file (I will explain below)

Plug your soldering in and let it heat up to its full temperature. If the tip is oxidized, (not shiny silver) you need to scrape the crud off by using a metal file (like the kind attached to a nail clipper) or a small screwdriver/razor blade to lightly scrape the old crud off. (hopefully you get the picture).

Once you get the crud off, apply (feed) some rosin core solder to the tip to get good coverage on the tip and then wipe the tip with the excess melted solder on the wet sponge. (repeat)... until you get at least the bottom quarter nice and shiny (you know, the part that touches the parts you are going to solder). Some people, bypass the wet sponge and fling the excess solder on the floor making solder splats everywhere (not recommended b/c its dangerous)

Thats called tinning the tip.

Once you have a shiny clean tip with a very thin layer of melted solder (no globs on the tip!! thats what the sponge is for..) you are now ready to solder. Please note, that if a suffcient amount of time has passed between soldering parts, you may need to feed some fresh solder and wipe with the sponge again to get it nice and shiny.

Soldering---
Make sure the parts you are going to solder (leads actually) are clean (free of sticky residue and not oxidized). If they are not clean, you may need to rub them with some fine sand paper.

The parts also must have a mechanical connection made before you solder them together. In other words, the leads must be bent on a pc board, so the part doenst fall, and are not going to rely on the solder as the sole source to keep it in place. Or, the leads or wires are twisted together so the they stay in place. etc.

Heat the mechanical connection with the *tinned* and *cleaned* soldering tip, and when it has reached appropriate soldering temperature the solder will melt and capillary action will cause it to flow, so you are going to have to feed solder to the connection to appropriate cover. Sometimes, to get the action going, you need to apply the solder briefly to the tip...and watch the flux..solder capilalry take over... Of course it takes practice.... which you need to do to get the hang of it....

try soldering wires together to get the hang of it.

ANyway, thats all I have to say.

 

[cucumber]

Originally posted by: Slickone
OK, my solder is Nippon 60% Rosin Core, .8mm. So this is 60/40, right?

Colt45, you're metioning stuff that I'm basically asking to explain.

OK, where should I buy flux?

I like the iron style of the Metcal (you can hold it closer to tip), but way too expensive for me.

Thanks to Technokid for the link to the Wellers at AE. There's a $13 MIR for the WLC100. Still wondering if the iron is any better than the $5-$10 ones. Is it constructed in the same way & can the tip still become unable to tighten down?

Originally posted by: brxndxn
Don't be dumb and buy an expensive soldering iron unless you plan to spend a ton of time soldering. With my $5.99 15W soldering iron from Radio Shack, I've soldered two different 29-wire modchips on Playstation 2s, soldered quite a few Playsation 1s, audio out pins on a SB Live value, and I've even done soldering for plumbing (though, that uses a blowtorch).

BUT.. USE FLUX. People that don't 'use flux' are either soldering wrong or using flux without even knowing it. (There is usually a small amount of flux left on soldering locations or in the soldering wire itself.) The flux is the adhesive. Think of it like primer..

You can tell you've soldered correctly when where you've soldered looks just like the existing soldered items on a board. Anything you solder should be fairly strong - will hold up if you bend the wire.


1. Apply flux to end A and end B (assuming you're soldering A to B)
2. Melt a small amount (not a big ball) of solder to the end of the soldering iron
3. Brush soldering iron on end A and end B. Make sure the wires are heated - so give it some time. Dropping a bunch of solder on cold metal does nothing. The flux should sizzle and smoke.
4. Put A to B and touch with iron. Again, the flux should sizzle and smoke. When it does, quickly remove the tip of the iron.
5. Tug lightly on the connection to test its' strength.

So your $5.99 Radio Shack doesn't have the loose tip problem mine does, or that the other $5 one I had before did?

The solder you say to apply in step 3...is that the solder you're saying to use to join? I thought that was not the correct way.

I know I'm no help, but the radio shack iron I've used also had a loose tip. I've tried to move it around to find a good fit, tighten the screw as much as possible....nothing seems to work. The damned thing just keeps on flopping around no matter what I do.

I also suck at soldering, but this thread seems pretty helpfull. I've usually been able to make a solder joint work, but I really don't know what I'm doing. I just fvcked with it untill it stuck and was secure.

Edit: Hell, even though I didn't post the question, this thread really helped me out. Thanks

 

[jtusa]

First thing I ever soldered was a modchip for my Playstation. Those were some tiny contact points too. It worked though so I was happy.

 

[erikiksaz]

Last time i had to solder (i'm no pro ), i had trouble getting the iron to warm the wires enough to melt the solder. This is what i did:

Assuming you have 2 pieces of wire that you want to solder. You would twist them together first of all. Now, instead of holding the iron at the bottom of the twisted portion and the solder at the top, waiting for the heat to transfer upwards (after "wetting" the iron of course), do this:

"wet" the iron while it's touching the top of the twisted portion of the wires. That way, you instantly melt some solder onto the tip (in other words, "wetting" it), which also melts onto the wire. Now you've got a slight connection between the twisted portion of the cable and the soldering iron. Here's your cue:

Once you've wet the iron and the twisted portion, that whole section should be enough to melt the rest of your solder. You may or may not have to apply pressure, but if you do, it will be very slight. The solder should just run through the threads effortlessly.

So far this has worked for me. The connection is pretty shiny, but not having seen an awesome wire-weld job, it may or may not be right. Either way, it works :thumbsup:

 

[klah]

Originally posted by: ElFenix
more watts, smaller tip, thinner solder.

and get this

$4.99 at Fry's!

 

[Slickone]

DOSfan, thanks.
Still not sure how solder on the iron tip helps heat xfer.
BTW, you seemd to wonder what I'm using. I've listed my solder specs, and linked to my iron.


edfcmc, thanks.
I do clean the tip with sandpaper before every use (sometimes while using), and use the wet sponge between every solder. But I've never coated the tip with solder. I thought that was the wrong way to solder, and also the reason I was cleaning it off.


I tried desoldering braid once but couldn't get it to do anything.

Thanks everyone for the tips (any more welcome). They do seem like they'll help.


cucumber, yep that's me too. I usually get what I'm trying to solder work, but it always looks horrible and occasionally I've damaged parts. I know some solder points have been dull looking or barely had solder end up in the right place, but I just couldn't get it to look and do right, so I'm sure they'll fail sometime. I think one problem is I only do maybe one solder job a year, so I forget the little things I picked up from the previous job. I think I'm gonna use some junk parts to practice soldering on.

 

[Eli]

You are not supposed to clean your tip with sandpaper unless it has become corroded and nasty.

Buy a small can of tip tinner at Radio Shack. Sand your tip, and dip it in. A silver substance should adhere to the tip.

I am betting that this is your problem. You aren't getting adequate heat transfer because your tip is not tinned.

You will notice that if you touch the solder to a dull part of the tip, it will take a split second for it to start melting, and it will just ball up on the end of the solder wire.

If you touch the solder to a tinned part of the tip, it will melt into the tin instantly.

Again, You do not need to use flux if you are using rosin core solder.

 

[Slickone]

Whats wrong with using sandpaper?

Yep, when I try to tin the tip, it either balls up on the solder wire, or else just mainly forms a few balls on the iron tip, rather than coating it.

So is my solder good?