Who's buying Skylake-X? (You may now change your vote)

[Zucker2k]

See bellow.

Yes, as a placeholder for coffeelake. I said so right after. In any case, there's an intersection between top tier mainstream and entry level HEDT. It's always been the case, but for some reason, the popular chips in HEDT seem to be the halo products. That surely looks to change with x299 though.

 

[Nebor]

Just so we're clear, all these crazy power use situations and VRM temperatures are from overclocking, right? I shouldn't have a problem with an Asus x299 deluxe, 7900x, 2x1080 FTWs on a 1000w power supply and a corsair h110i with no overclocking at all, correct? Mainly will be used to play Killing Floor 2, Stardew Valley,& Civ 5. Maybe a little bit of web browsing but I usually use my ipad for that.

 

[DooKey]

Just so we're clear, all these crazy power use situations and VRM temperatures are from overclocking, right? I shouldn't have a problem with an Asus x299 deluxe, 7900x, 2x1080 FTWs on a 1000w power supply and a corsair h110i with no overclocking at all, correct? Mainly will be used to play Killing Floor 2, Stardew Valley,& Civ 5. Maybe a little bit of web browsing but I usually use my ipad for that.

Yep, you won't have any problems at all. Enjoy the new rig!

 

[Arachnotronic]

Just so we're clear, all these crazy power use situations and VRM temperatures are from overclocking, right? I shouldn't have a problem with an Asus x299 deluxe, 7900x, 2x1080 FTWs on a 1000w power supply and a corsair h110i with no overclocking at all, correct? Mainly will be used to play Killing Floor 2, Stardew Valley,& Civ 5. Maybe a little bit of web browsing but I usually use my ipad for that.

Correct. You will be more than fine -- that is going to be one heck of a system!

 

[Nebor]

Correct. You will be more than fine -- that is going to be one heck of a system!

I only sit down to game for 4-6 hours a week, so I like to make it count!

 

[IndyColtsFan]

So let's say I get a 7900 and happen to play a game that stresses 8 cores. What speed would the various cores run at (assuming no overclocking on my part)? I know there are various turbo modes but I want to make sure I understand what happens if I leave the CPU at stock and rely on the turbo modes.

 

[Arachnotronic]

So let's say I get a 7900 and happen to play a game that stresses 8 cores. What speed would the various cores run at (assuming no overclocking on my part)? I know there are various turbo modes but I want to make sure I understand what happens if I leave the CPU at stock and rely on the turbo modes.

All core turbo is 4GHz. I don't know what the 8 core turbo is, but I'll try to test and find out...

 

[imported_ats]

It's HEDT! High End Desk Top! Premium platform with premium performance and premium tax. Please stop comparing mainstream and HEDT. HEDT is not meant for all. For some, the premium cost is worth it, otherwise, there are other choices. Smh.

oh cut the BS. HEDT is literally snake oil to for ignorant people with too much money and not enough sense. The fraction of the market that can actually derive any actual benefit from HEDT is astonishingly small. Esp considering for the same cost you can get a Xeon-D and a 7700k or equiv system. HEDT is primarily the same market that sells overpriced body kits and rims to the ignorant masses.

 

[dlerious]

In fact, I would like to know what wonderful features I get out of the C6H that I can't get from the ASRock B350 Pro4. Here's what I can tell so far:

- a third PCI-e slot which is virtually impossible to use with a video card that has a dual-slot cooler.
- some RGB lighting yay
- Crossfire support
- USB 3.1
- some fluff for "xtreme OC"/watercooling crowd which you would probably not use with a 1700 anyway
- a CMOS clear button
- bclk OC, good luck with that if you use NVMe
- the onboard audio might be better. Maybe?

Comparing it to my Taichi (which has built-in wireless, something the C6H technically does not have; you must buy an extra module for that), the only things I would really miss are the built-in wireless and the CMOS clear button. Though I do love me some low VRM temps. Ask Mark, he's got a Pro4. It'll get you to DDR4-3200 and has for awhile. Just pop in a 1700, clock it up to about 3.9 GHz or so, and let er rip. It just works.

Well for me, Crosshair 6 vs Asrock pro4 it would be; ALC1220 audio over ALC892, Intel lan (not real important), more SATA ports, more USB and USB 3.1 gen2, more PCIe lanes, better VRM. I was looking at the Taichi, but it was always out of stock .

 

[dlerious]

I don't know what to tell you, you ignored where I said "with the feature set I wanted" and "for my usage". I did a ton of research and was going to buy the CH6, that is a fact. Therefore I compare with other $350 boards on the X299 side. If a cheaper or different board works for you personally, that's great. Between the two systems I was going to build, the X299 one is less than $500 CAD more expensive - that isn't going to change, and that is a price difference I am happy with for the advantages of the X299 platform and 7820X.

You're comparing by price. I checked Newegg and there were only 3 X299 boards cheaper then than Crosshair and 1 X370 that was more expensive (entry-level X299 vs top end X370). I think if you wanted a better picture of the price premium, you would compare motherboards in the same family, for example X370 Taichi, Z270 Taichi, X299 Taichi.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Well for me, Crosshair 6 vs Asrock pro4 it would be; ALC1220 audio over ALC892, Intel lan (not real important), more SATA ports, more USB and USB 3.1 gen2, more PCIe lanes, better VRM. I was looking at the Taichi, but it was always out of stock .

See, those are legit concerns. If I had a lot of USB devices and I cared a great deal about USB performance, I would have to look at something other than the Pro4 'cuz no USB 3.1 and a shortage of ports. The C6H is riddled with USB ports of various types. Just be careful about trying to use them all at once, or so is said by some of the old ROG hands.

I only got a Taichi by buying a marked-up one on eBay. I paid too much, but at least I got one.

I'm not sure that the PCIe lanes would be a big deal either, unless you try crossfire AND use an NVMe drive at the same time. Am I wrong there? Not 100% sure about it since I am not currently running Crossfire aaaaand I have X370 so whatever. Also the VRM issue gives you peace of mind, but unless you are a hardcore LN2 overclocker, you will probably never need the VRMs on something like the Taichi. chew* has warned some of us that the VRM quality on some B350 boards is subpar, yet I haven't see anyone burn out a B350 yet doing plebian 3.6-4.0 GHz OCs.

So back to Intel.

You can basically make the same comparisons between Z270 and x299. Personally I do not feel that the extra $$$$ paid for baseline x299 boards is warranted over something like the Z270 version of the Pro4. It's a competent enough on its own. There are some "extreme" cases such as quad GPU rigs - barely supported - and other such madness where x299 makes sense. But most of what a gamer/overclocker really needs out of a system can already be had from a client-level board. With x299 (and x99 before it) Intel made the choice for you. Plus if you get a board with a single 8-pin power connector and funky VRM heatsinks then . . . oops.

 

[lobz]

It's HEDT! High End Desk Top! Premium platform with premium performance and premium tax. Please stop comparing mainstream and HEDT. HEDT is not meant for all. For some, the premium cost is worth it, otherwise, there are other choices. Smh.

Yet you've said that the 7800 renders thenentire ryzen lineup obsolete. Come again?

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

 

[lobz]

Yes, as a placeholder for coffeelake. I said so right after. In any case, there's an intersection between top tier mainstream and entry level HEDT. It's always been the case, but for some reason, the popular chips in HEDT seem to be the halo products. That surely looks to change with x299 though.

Goalposts, goalposts.... but then at least do the math please. A CPU+mobo will start @ $550 or more. That's the cost of a 1600 + mobo + case + PSU and some very nice RAM, and you have an a tually usable cooler. But go ahead, defend your nonsense if you must.

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

 

[Archer27]

How are you liking your TUF 1? There is so little info available for it, not many people seem to have bought it (yet). I haven't been able to find any VRM details on it either other than it's a 8+2 phase.

The VRMs on the TUF Mark 1 are superior to all the current boards except for the Prime Deluxe which is equivalent.
I am liking it so far and will have benchmarks and such when I return from vacation in 2 weeks.

Ah, der8auer's test results (graphed by extremetech) which have already been debunked due to a variety of errors.
Please link the article next time. Terrible click-bait article here -> https://www.extremetech.com/computi...mperatures-disaster-limit-skylake-x-potential
OFN!

Ah yes I should have stated my source.
Indeed those temps have been debunked.
It is a clickbait article. Simply calling it a "disaster" is a very poor choice of word alone.

 

[beginner99]

Even an entry level X299 board typically has higher quality audio

Most realtek stuff is pretty good these days. if you think you need a better one and a DAC, you will also need to shell out $1000+ on speakers or headphones to actually hear a difference. A DAC is useless with $100 gamer headset.

In fact, I would like to know what wonderful features I get out of the C6H that I can't get from the ASRock B350 Pro4. Here's what I can tell so far:

- USB 3.1

That actually is a pretty big feature to miss especially nowadays when you will keep your CPU for 5+ years. In case of ryzen you might even be able to upgrade the CPU and keep the mobo. So lack of USB 3.1 is pretty big. its 2x times faster than usb 3.0 so it can matter when transferring lots of data.

 

[DrMrLordX]

That actually is a pretty big feature to miss especially nowadays when you will keep your CPU for 5+ years. In case of ryzen you might even be able to upgrade the CPU and keep the mobo. So lack of USB 3.1 is pretty big. its 2x times faster than usb 3.0 so it can matter when transferring lots of data.

It actually is, if that's an issue for you. Some people have two USB devices they use on a regular basis: mouse and keyboard. Then some folks use USB mass storage devices out the yin-yang. So I made sure to point out that one.

I'm a little surprised USB 3.1 wasn't on that board. A little weird really.

 

[jmelgaard]

So he basically shut everyone up who "debunked" his initial testing. Very well worth the watch.

Those CPUs are power hogs and will throttle if not tweaked for them to specifically not to. When not throttling power consumption is up at the 300-400w range as already known, depending on the load. OC3D can now replicate his results. ASUS boards throttle the VRM at 105°C, Gigabyte does it at 115°C.

P95 27.1 is pre Haswell... I wonder what those numbers would be using 28.3 with FMA+AVX2 or 29.2 with AVX512 support.

VRM cooling on current boards just isn't enough for the worst case scenario and the 10 core part, if not the 8 core model pushed hard enough. Again, those upcoming 12-18c models when overclocked, will result in some pretty interesting posts across enthusiast boards

Great and needed followup... and just to be complete in this thread, OC3D's response as wel... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3h2p5383ubw&t=1s

Hopefully they keep at it and others join in also, because right now it's only when using Prime95 (and with specific settings?) that they can actually reproduce this (as far as I understood it)... It would be interesting if they can reproduce it in actual applications (not sure which would be candidates)...

Because if it can't be reproduced in an actual real-world usage scenario, but only under this very specific synthetic benchmark, then the relevance of it is negligible, interesting but negligible, but if they do manage to find a real-world scenario, then it is sort of another story...

Enough with all the RYZEN please!

Would people please stop talking so much abour Ryzen in this thread, for us that are choosing Skylake-X there can be very specific reasons... For some of those reasons, Ryzen doesn't even enter the radar, the only viable AMD alternative would be Threadripper, and since that is not out yet that would be pure speculation at this time. (I think there is good odds that it will be)

Ryzen is (as far as I can tell, not owning one) a great CPU for the mainstream market... And that is just fine, but this Thread is not about that...

 

[Nebor]

It actually is, if that's an issue for you. Some people have two USB devices they use on a regular basis: mouse and keyboard. Then some folks use USB mass storage devices out the yin-yang. So I made sure to point out that one.

I'm a little surprised USB 3.1 wasn't on that board. A little weird really.

What exactly can I use USB 3.1 for? Are there 3.1 flash drives? Or is it more for external GPUs?

 

[LTC8K6]

What exactly can I use USB 3.1 for? Are there 3.1 flash drives? Or is it more for external GPUs?

https://www.sandisk.com/home/usb-flash/extreme-go-usb

https://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Description=usb 3.1 flash drive&Submit=ENE

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB_3.0#USB_3.1

Only Gen2 3.1 has any advantage over 3.0, though. So there are USB 3.1 drives, but they are the same as USB 3.0 drives.

So I would say that right now there isn't much difference overall.

 

[MarkPost]

Hopefully they keep at it and others join in also, because right now it's only when using Prime95 (and with specific settings?) that they can actually reproduce this (as far as I understood it)... It would be interesting if they can reproduce it in actual applications (not sure which would be candidates)...

The issue is that Prime95 is the tool massively used to check CPU OC stability. Probably we will see this same SKY-X issue with other tools with the same goal than P95, such as OCCT or whatever. So, how do we know if a SKY-X OC is stable? just if it doesnt crash with common use? do we have to wait and see if anytime it crashes or not? how is this?

 

[LTC8K6]

The issue is that Prime95 is the tool massively used to check CPU OC stability. Probably we will see this same SKY-X issue with other tools with the same goal than P95, such as OCCT or whatever. So, how do we know if a SKY-X OC is stable? just if it doesnt crash with common use? do we have to wait and see if anytime it crashes or not? how is this?

If you are trying to run the chip well above it's normal clocks, it's all on you. That's always been the case. It's your job to get your overclock stable.

I used to torture my 4790K to try to eek out the last 50-100mhz, but I soon realized it was not really necessary to do that to the chip, it gains you very little and risks everything.

Those who are seeking records know what they are doing and know what they are risking and choose to accept it.

For normal CPU users, the SL-X "issues" probably don't exist.

 

[evrae]

Because if it can't be reproduced in an actual real-world usage scenario, but only under this very specific synthetic benchmark, then the relevance of it is negligible, interesting but negligible, but if they do manage to find a real-world scenario, then it is sort of another story...

The damage is already done, because instead of clarifying that the issue has no real world relevance and no impact on end-users, he instead labels his first video 'x299 DISASTER.'

 

[fleshconsumed]

Enough with all the RYZEN please!

Would people please stop talking so much abour Ryzen in this thread, for us that are choosing Skylake-X there can be very specific reasons... For some of those reasons, Ryzen doesn't even enter the radar, the only viable AMD alternative would be Threadripper, and since that is not out yet that would be pure speculation at this time. (I think there is good odds that it will be)

Ryzen is (as far as I can tell, not owning one) a great CPU for the mainstream market... And that is just fine, but this Thread is not about that...

This thread is about who's buying skylake x or not and why. Ryzen/Threadripper are totally appropriate topics of conversation in this thread as they're direct competitors to SkylakeX and could be the primary reason why people may not want to buy skylake-x.

It's HEDT! High End Desk Top! Premium platform with premium performance and premium tax. Please stop comparing mainstream and HEDT. HEDT is not meant for all. For some, the premium cost is worth it, otherwise, there are other choices. Smh.

Strip out HEDT moniker and look at the actual features.

What does HEDT actually provide over so called mainstream platform?
- More PCIe lanes for multiGPU's and M.2 drives
- More cores than mainstream

If we're being honest current videocards are not bottlenecked by the PCIe bandwidth, the actual performance hit of running SLI/Crossfire in PCIe 8x/8x mode over 16x/16x is at most around 5%. It is not a night and day difference. There are also 8 cores available on AMD mainstream platform now. The only reasons to buy HEDT anymore are if you want 3/4 multiGPU rig or of you need more than 8 cores.

I'm not going to tell people what to do with their money, if they have the means and want to pay extra for intel HEDT, it's their choice. However, I think it would server everyone well if they looked at their actual needs. If all one need is an 8 core PC with high end GPU, they're much better served by AMD mainstream than Intel HEDT. A ~$1000 budget can buy you either x299/7820x/nVidia 1060 6GB or it can get you x370/1700x/1080ti. I don't care for the HEDT label, I care about my needs and what I get for my money, and what I get with AMD mainstream is a lot more than Intel HEDT.

 

[IEC]

Anyone pushed the limits with BOINC usage yet? Curious to see how it holds up to 24/7 (ab)use.

 

[MarkPost]

If you are trying to run the chip well above it's normal clocks, it's all on you. That's always been the case. It's your job to get your overclock stable.

I used to torture my 4790K to try to eek out the last 50-100mhz, but I soon realized it was not really necessary to do that to the chip, it gains you very little and risks everything.

Those who are seeking records know what they are doing and know what they are risking and choose to accept it.

For normal CPU users, the SL-X "issues" probably don't exist.

and how do I know if my OC is stable? I mean, lets say I try a 4.6 OC, but if SKY-X throttles to 4.2 using the common tools to check OC stability, how do I know it will be stable at 4.6?

This is the issue. I am in this "business" since 486 days, and this is the first time this issue happens as far as I can remember