Who would win the city of Madrid or the Roman Empire

[AccruedExpenditure]

Who would win the battle... lets assume anything in Madrid goes back in time along with the city. Would the limited modern technology in the city be enough to defeat the european hegemon of the time?

 

[FoBoT]

does madrid have any spanish military bases?
actually, that probably wouldn't matter

the city wouldn't have modern services, electricity, fuel, gas etc nor modern food and modern things like toilet paper, TV, etc

so they would degenerate into a mob within a week and the romans would enslave them easily

 

[Firsttime]

Rome would own them.

 

[Gamer X]

The firearms in Madrid would be more than enough to oblitirate the Roman Empire.

 

[GuitarDaddy]

Chuck Norris of course

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: Gamer X
The firearms in Madrid would be more than enough to oblitirate the Roman Empire.

other than some police stations, are there that many firearms in madrid? it's not like spain is the united states where there are 10 guns per person

 

[FoBoT]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: Gamer X
The firearms in Madrid would be more than enough to oblitirate the Roman Empire.

other than some police stations, are there that many firearms in madrid? it's not like spain is the united states where there are 10 guns per person

http://www.wfsa.net/Intl_Leg/Leg_Spain.htm

A Permit is required to possess any type of firearm, issued by the Police (Guardia Civil). Generally issued to Spaniards and Citizens over 18 years, who do not have a Police record. (For Air Rifles ? see below)

Handguns for self-protection ? (Permit Type ?B?)

Permit to possess one handgun for their self-defence, valid for 3 years. It is only granted when the applicant can demonstrate the necessity for it, and has been the subject of a psycho-physical examination.

Big Game ? (Type ?D?)

Permit for rifles for big game ? calibres 5.56 ? 20mm excluded. Similar psycho-physical examination required, plus a technical examination on knowledge and care of firearms, and on conservation. Permit covers up to 5 firearms, and is valid for 5 years.

Shotguns and Rifles .22 Cal.-(Type ?E?)

Permit allows possession of Shotguns (smooth bore) of any calibre or system (side-by-side, over/under, semi-automatic, pump) and .22 Rifles and ?assimilated arms?. Similar examinations as Type ?D?. Permit allows possession of 6 Shotguns and 6 x .22 Rifles, or a maximum of 12 guns between the three types.

Target Shooting ? Handguns ? (Type ?F?)

Allows handguns for competition by members of Sports Federation, of calibres, length and type specified by the Federation. Members are classified by the Federation ? ?Class 3? allowed one handgun for club competition; ?Class 2? allowed up to 5 firearms and may compete in Regional competitions; ?Class 1? allowed up to 10 firearms for participation in National events. Applicant must pass psycho-physical exam and aptitude test in his Club. Permit valid for 3 years, during which period he/she must participate in at least one competition before renewal.

Muzzle-loading firearms ? (Authorization Type ?AE?)

Special authorization required to possess original or replica muzzle-loading firearms, antique or historic where first original model was manufactured before 1st January 1870, and Flobert system. Authorization subject to psycho-physical exam, is valid for 5 years, and covers unlimited number of arms.

Young Persons (14-16 years and 16-18 years) ? Authorization Type ?AEM?

16-18 years - allows use (not ownership) of Shotguns and .22 Rifles when accompanied by an adult who will be responsible for the minor?s conduct. 16-18 years may also use long rifles for big game, under adult supervision. Psych-physical test and technical-practical exam are necessary. On arriving at 18 years must apply for Permit Type ?D? or ?E? (without necessity of retaking technical-practical exam).

Security Guards, National Forces and Security Corps ? Permit Type ?C?

Issued subject to psycho-physical exam and a course in Security. User must have periodical organised practice. Permit authorizes one handgun, the property of the Security company and may only be carried when on duty.

Air Rifles

Those below 24,2 Jules energy, of any calibre, may be possessed with an authorization issued by the Town Hall. If the owner is to use it only on his/her property, he Town Hall?s authorization in not needed but the seller of the air rifle must issue a Sales Declaration before the Guardia Civil and the Mayor?s office, stating details of the buyer and the make, number and calibre of the gun. Those in excess of 24,2 Jules are considered equivalent to a firearm, and a Gun Permit is required.

Ownership Cards (Guias de Pertenencia)

In addition to Gun Permits, each firearm is registered and has it?s own Ownership Card, issued by Gardia Civil corresponding to the place of residence of the owner, containing make, serial number and calibre of the gun and the personal data of the owner. Valid for 5 years, then is subject to review.

Storage of Firearms

Must be kept securely. Shotguns and .22 Rifles may be kept at home, not necessarily in a security cabinet with disassembled pieces stored separately. Big Game rifles and handguns must be stored in an approved security cabinet. In the case of theft or loss, the owner is fined ?150.- minimum.

Hunting Licences.

To participate, a licence is required for which, in some regions, the applicant must pass an examination initially. These are issued by the Regions, for which there are 17 Hunting Licences. Civil Responsibility Insurance is required also, but on a ?nationwide? basis.

Visitors to Spain

A visiting non-resident or foreigner who wishes to participate in hunting or a shooting competition must apply through the organization for a permit to enter Spain with his/her firearm(s). The possession of the European Firearms Pass alone is not sufficient.

European Firearms Pass

Spaniards who are authorized to possess firearms may apply for a European Firearms Pass to enable them to travel to other EU States with their firearms.

 

[Gamer X]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: Gamer X
The firearms in Madrid would be more than enough to oblitirate the Roman Empire.

other than some police stations, are there that many firearms in madrid? it's not like spain is the united states where there are 10 guns per person

You know what a single machine gun can do against an army only armed with swords and spears ? Let alone the fact that the Romans will flee thinking they are fighting "magicians"
that can kill them without having to come close to them.

 

[Doboji]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: Gamer X
The firearms in Madrid would be more than enough to oblitirate the Roman Empire.

other than some police stations, are there that many firearms in madrid? it's not like spain is the united states where there are 10 guns per person

Yeah but how many guns would it really take to kill a whole bunch of guys with spears...

Get a group of say 2-300 people together armed with M-16s and plenty of ammo....

No imagine an army of say 5000 Romans charging at the 300 M-16 armed people... The Romans might in fact make it... but by then how many would be left standing? Probably not enough to withstand the Madrid Mob....

Or better yet... what if there was 1 tank in Madrid? How about 2?

-Max

 

[JDrake]

rome rocks

 

[imported_bum]

Romans.

 

[imported_LoKe]

Originally posted by: FoBoT
does madrid have any spanish military bases?
actually, that probably wouldn't matter

the city wouldn't have modern services, electricity, fuel, gas etc nor modern food and modern things like toilet paper, TV, etc

so they would degenerate into a mob within a week and the romans would enslave them easily

 

[AccruedExpenditure]

Looks like the verdict is still out...

 

[DaveSimmons]

Nantucket could take them, just ask S.M. Stirling.

Grantsville could too, if you believe Eric Flint.

 

[Kadarin]

Originally posted by: Gamer X
The firearms in Madrid would be more than enough to oblitirate the Roman Empire.

Not if they couldn't be used effectively. Rome would wtfpwn Madrid once the initial shock wore off and the ammo gave out.

 

[Deleted member 4644]

Depends on how many soldiers Rome could actually field at once and how many police/military people Madrid has. If Madrid has 5000+ armed people with any sort of organization, I think it could hold off 50,000+ Romans.

I think if Rome had an army at the gates of the city the moment it was teleported, Rome might win. Or if Rome had 5 years to seige the city it might win.

But in a stand up fight of 5000 police vs 50,000 Romans, I don't think the Romans would win.

 

[K1052]

I'd find the biggest truck in the city, armor it A-team style, and run the Romans down en masse.

If that doesn't have them fleeing in sheer panic, start shooting.

 

[Doboji]

Originally posted by: K1052
I'd find the biggest truck in the city, armor it A-team style, and run the Romans down en masse.

If that doesn't have them fleeing in sheer panic, start shooting.

Yeah absolutely... when you think about it... I don't think Spain would even need guns... Cars would be enough... just run the fckers down...

 

[Kenazo]

What a ridiculous scenario.

 

[Iron Woode]

given the same Roman weapons, the entire Roman Legion would pwn the US Army in less than a year.

food for thought.

 

[sandorski]

Romans
A population of Approx 60 Million for the Roman Empire is all I could find with a quick Google. Their Military reached 350k, but they were only able to field an Army of 80k(at least that's the most they ever took into a battle).

Madrid
Population 3 million. Probably could field 80k in a crunch, perhaps more. If they can provide firearms for all those they'd win. Tried to find info on Military bases, seems there are some nearby(including possibly a US MIlitary base) bases, but i have no idea what the contingents are. Wouldn't be surprised if a good sized military force would be available from the get go.

Scenario
Madrid pops into the Roman Empire. Ignoring the shock factor of such an event, the local Roman Military commander sends an urgent message off to Rome seeking assistance in repelling an invasion.

Rome
Alarmed by the reports the Emperor orders a Standard sized Army of 40k to go investigate the strange Invaders. A few days later the force is gathered, then begins the 2-3 months march out to the Invader.

Madrid
Realizes it's in danger of of war from Rome, gets to work building Defenses, but also in acquiring necessary supplies. Immediately it goes to historical records, identifies Roman Outposts and other strategic centers, valuable Mineral deposits, Oil fields, etc. Begins by eadicating Roman presence in important areas and developing Mines, Wells, Farms to secure Resources.

Taking out local Roman forces proves ridiculously easy with little more than a couple sprained ankles from gopher holes. Realizing how big a military advantage they have, Madrid decides to not wait for the Roman Legions to show up for battle. They load up a couple hindred soldiers in Transport Helicopters and take a trip out to the 40k of Legions on the way. They find a strategic spot along the road where an ambush will work and wait. Time passes, Legions show up, call in Airstrike. Devastation. The few hundred men would mop up the Roman survivors.

The Mayor realizes the Empire is his, orders an Airstrike against Rome itself. The Roman Emperor and the Barracks in and around Rome are turned to rubble. Roman citizens flee in terror, the Empire collapses. Madrid wins.

 

[FoBoT]

except madrid runs out of oil/gas/fuel and the helicopters can't get back to madrid so the people are eaten by wolves

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: FoBoT
except madrid runs out of oil/gas/fuel and the helicopters can't get back to madrid so the people are eaten by wolves

They likely have a few weeks of supply with normal consumption, likely many months(possibly even years) by instituting emergency measures.

 

[JawaJedi]

wouldn't the romans simply set fire to Madrid if it came down to it? Madrid wouldn't have the necessary plumbing for firefighters.

 

[andylawcc]

depends who got more Trebuchets and Priest