Originally posted by: CPA
Patiently waiting for the first "GWB!" post.
Originally posted by: yoda291
If I recall my sketchy rendition of history ( I was a cs major, what do you want from me?), I don't think either of them were really too awful.
Hitler pretty much dragged germany out of a ww1 induced economic depression and turned it into a military and industrial superpower. From the perspective of the German people, they went from mulling around the streets starving to prosperity in a matter of months IIRC.
Stalin pretty much rode on the coattails of Lenin and turned Russia from an agrarian society just starting to recover from a civil war into an industrial powerhouse in record time. Likely he was egged on by the political and economic climate all over europe at the time.
Now while it's unlikely that either of them deserve sole credit for anything, it tends to pan out that way. I think they only seem really evil just because they ended up losing. Makes you wonder. Would we consider Abe Lincoln an evil man if we lost the civil war? Oodles of americans died there. How would we regard Jefferson Davis?
-snip-.
Originally posted by: yoda291
If I recall my sketchy rendition of history ( I was a cs major, what do you want from me?), I don't think either of them were really too awful.
Hitler pretty much dragged germany out of a ww1 induced economic depression and turned it into a military and industrial superpower. From the perspective of the German people, they went from mulling around the streets starving to prosperity in a matter of months IIRC.
Stalin pretty much rode on the coattails of Lenin and turned Russia from an agrarian society just starting to recover from a civil war into an industrial powerhouse in record time. Likely he was egged on by the political and economic climate all over europe at the time.
Now while it's unlikely that either of them deserve sole credit for anything, it tends to pan out that way. I think they only seem really evil just because they ended up losing. Makes you wonder. Would we consider Abe Lincoln an evil man if we lost the civil war? Oodles of americans died there. How would we regard Jefferson Davis?
I don't really think it comes down to such a black and white situation here. If I learned anything in history, the answer is never that simple.
Originally posted by: yoda291
If I recall my sketchy rendition of history ( I was a cs major, what do you want from me?), I don't think either of them were really too awful.
Hitler pretty much dragged germany out of a ww1 induced economic depression and turned it into a military and industrial superpower. From the perspective of the German people, they went from mulling around the streets starving to prosperity in a matter of months IIRC.
Stalin pretty much rode on the coattails of Lenin and turned Russia from an agrarian society just starting to recover from a civil war into an industrial powerhouse in record time. Likely he was egged on by the political and economic climate all over europe at the time.
Now while it's unlikely that either of them deserve sole credit for anything, it tends to pan out that way. I think they only seem really evil just because they ended up losing. Makes you wonder. Would we consider Abe Lincoln an evil man if we lost the civil war? Oodles of americans died there. How would we regard Jefferson Davis?
I don't really think it comes down to such a black and white situation here. If I learned anything in history, the answer is never that simple.
Originally posted by: L3p3rM355i4h
to the op, your mom, for spawning someone as stupid to ask a question...
Originally posted by: K1052
Originally posted by: yoda291
If I recall my sketchy rendition of history ( I was a cs major, what do you want from me?), I don't think either of them were really too awful.
Hitler pretty much dragged germany out of a ww1 induced economic depression and turned it into a military and industrial superpower. From the perspective of the German people, they went from mulling around the streets starving to prosperity in a matter of months IIRC.
Stalin pretty much rode on the coattails of Lenin and turned Russia from an agrarian society just starting to recover from a civil war into an industrial powerhouse in record time. Likely he was egged on by the political and economic climate all over europe at the time.
Now while it's unlikely that either of them deserve sole credit for anything, it tends to pan out that way. I think they only seem really evil just because they ended up losing. Makes you wonder. Would we consider Abe Lincoln an evil man if we lost the civil war? Oodles of americans died there. How would we regard Jefferson Davis?
I don't really think it comes down to such a black and white situation here. If I learned anything in history, the answer is never that simple.
The sheer loss of life caused by Hitler and Stalin for equally ignorant and paranoid reasons is staggering.
Their actions are in no way comparable to the events of the US civil war and the actions of Lincoln or Davis.
Originally posted by: mzkhadir
Originally posted by: WinstonSmith
Originally posted by: GTaudiophile
Originally posted by: mzkhadir
George W. Bush is worse.
You are a moron!
I would say Adolf. Stalin was bad but was genocide on his mind? Stalin just liked to kill and didn't really care who he was killing.
I don't know if he means it, but I almost bit because CPA was begging someone to.![]()
you know why I think he is worse because of the 26000+ iraqis dead.
Originally posted by: yoda291
Originally posted by: K1052
Originally posted by: yoda291
If I recall my sketchy rendition of history ( I was a cs major, what do you want from me?), I don't think either of them were really too awful.
Hitler pretty much dragged germany out of a ww1 induced economic depression and turned it into a military and industrial superpower. From the perspective of the German people, they went from mulling around the streets starving to prosperity in a matter of months IIRC.
Stalin pretty much rode on the coattails of Lenin and turned Russia from an agrarian society just starting to recover from a civil war into an industrial powerhouse in record time. Likely he was egged on by the political and economic climate all over europe at the time.
Now while it's unlikely that either of them deserve sole credit for anything, it tends to pan out that way. I think they only seem really evil just because they ended up losing. Makes you wonder. Would we consider Abe Lincoln an evil man if we lost the civil war? Oodles of americans died there. How would we regard Jefferson Davis?
I don't really think it comes down to such a black and white situation here. If I learned anything in history, the answer is never that simple.
The sheer loss of life caused by Hitler and Stalin for equally ignorant and paranoid reasons is staggering.
Their actions are in no way comparable to the events of the US civil war and the actions of Lincoln or Davis.
Well my point was kind of asking whether or not we demonize the two of them a bit irrationally simply because their plans didn't really work out. Had they succeeded in their crack-brained schemes, how much differently would we hold them?
Personally, I think the both of them are small fry compared to the romans, the holy roman empire, and the mongols. That's just me.
Originally posted by: 91TTZ
Don't try to impose your morality on someone else's post. Just as Christians see nothing wrong with converting others to *their* religion, you seem to see nothing wrong with imposing your beliefs on someone else and thinking it's the only right way and the final word.Originally posted by: DragonMasterAlex
An answer of which one was worse *inherently* gives you a "which one was better", which I think is pretty damn obvious.
The answer is simple: Neither was better or worse. There is no such thing as a "better dictator" any more than there is such a thing as a "better murderer", "better child molester" or "better rapist". Dictators are ALL bad, period, end of story. There is NO room for compromise on this kind of an issue.
Jason
Nobody said that either of these guys were good. You seem to take offense at the very asking of the question, while others weren't offended by the question and gave an honest answer. You have no right or authority to tell someone that they can't ask that question.
I recommend you keep your whining to yourself.
Originally posted by: bernse
Oh bull. That blanket statement holds no water whatsoever.Originally posted by: DragonMasterAlex
An answer of which one was worse *inherently* gives you a "which one was better", which I think is pretty damn obvious.
The answer is simple: Neither was better or worse. There is no such thing as a "better dictator" any more than there is such a thing as a "better murderer", "better child molester" or "better rapist". Dictators are ALL bad, period, end of story. There is NO room for compromise on this kind of an issue.
Jason
You mean to say with a straight face that oh, Castro is on the same level as Hitler? Using your theory, they are.. theu're both dictators. Or someone who raped 1000 women is the same as someone who raped 1? Please. Both are horrible, but one will be out of jail in 5 years.. the other never will be.
History rates people. It might be ugly, but it's done. Live with it or plug your ears and cover your eyes.
Originally posted by: DragonMasterAlex
I'm sorry but you can't defend these kinds of people and hold ANY credibility whatsoever.
Jason
Originally posted by: 91TTZ
Originally posted by: DragonMasterAlex
I'm sorry but you can't defend these kinds of people and hold ANY credibility whatsoever.
Jason
Are you really this out of touch with reality or what? All of your posts are filled with way too much emotion and you come off as being frantic. You make it sound like your angst-filled opinions are the only valid ones and that anyone who disagrees has no credibility.
Get over yourself and your whining. Nobody likes a brat.
Originally posted by: PhasmatisNox
Hitler did what he did based on hate. Stalin was just nuts. I have to go with Hitler on this one.
You reading a different thread? Who's defending them?Originally posted by: DragonMasterAlex
Actually yes, I WOULD put Castro on the same level as Hitler and Stalin. True, he hasn't managed to impose nearly the death, destruction and carnage that those two have, but that hardly makes him a good guy, now does it? As for your other very, very poor example, a rapist is a rapist pure and simple. Whether he'll be out in 5 years is immaterial, he's still a guy who decided he had the right to FORCE his will onto another, and that's just wrong. I'm sorry but you can't defend these kinds of people and hold ANY credibility whatsoever.
Jason
Originally posted by: bernse
You reading a different thread? Who's defending them?Originally posted by: DragonMasterAlex
Actually yes, I WOULD put Castro on the same level as Hitler and Stalin. True, he hasn't managed to impose nearly the death, destruction and carnage that those two have, but that hardly makes him a good guy, now does it? As for your other very, very poor example, a rapist is a rapist pure and simple. Whether he'll be out in 5 years is immaterial, he's still a guy who decided he had the right to FORCE his will onto another, and that's just wrong. I'm sorry but you can't defend these kinds of people and hold ANY credibility whatsoever.
Jason
Yes. They're all bad and horrible, nobody says they aren't. But to not differentiate and recognize between orders of magnitude is just wrong. If you can't grasp that, I don't know what else to say.
Originally posted by: DragonMasterAlex
How can one look at the array of dictators and say, "Oh, well Dictator X has only murdered a hundred people, he's not so bad, at least not compared to Dictator Y who killed 1,000!". It just makes no damn sense at all.
Jason
Originally posted by: CPA
Patiently waiting for the first "GWB!" post.
Originally posted by: mzkhadir
George W. Bush is worse.
Originally posted by: Taejin
Originally posted by: CPA
Patiently waiting for the first "GWB!" post.
OMGWTF GWB IS WORSE:!?!?!?!?