Who is to blame? Eli Manning or Tom Coughlin?

[zinfamous]

a little from column A, a little from column B...

 

[Deeko]

I think both Eli and Coughlin have had issues, but I don't think either of them are really at fault for this loss.

Also, before the Giants fans jump off a bridge...the 3 losses come from the two teams in the NFC tied with an 8-1 record. Its not all bad.

 

[ThePresence]

Originally posted by: Gnrslash4life

Originally posted by: Argo

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: Argo

The Giants may be 6-3 but they have outstanding player personnel and should be in the top tier.

Who are these outstanding personnel you're talking about? Talent wise giants are decent, maybe borderline good but nothing spectacular.

They're thin at winde receiver, cornerback, linebacker and defensive tackle. O-line is good in run blocking but always give up pressure in passing downs. D-line puts good pressure one week, no pressure the next week.

Not really thin at WR. Plax, Amani, Smith, Moss.
O-line has been really good at protecting Eli. Up until this game it was one of the Giants strengths. D line got outplayed this week by one of the best O line's in the game.

Plax been a no show last few weeks, not sure if he's hurt or what. Amani been the consistent one until the last 2 weeks. Moss is a complete bust so far. I'm not sure if it's just Eli locking up on the primary receivers but the Giants haven't been spreading the ball too well lately.

Plax has been a no show cause Eli doesnt throw him the ball. Same with Moss. You say 2 boneheaded sentences and then follow it up with the correct answer. Eli is clearly the problem and he needs to go. I think we should get Derek Anderson who isnt going to resign with the Browns im sure.

Eli didnt throw to Plax during the London game because the receivers could not get downfield in that swamp. He didn't throw long to Plax last night because he didn't have time in the pocket to wait for him to get open downfield. I've never heard anyone say that Eli's issue is that he doesn't throw to Plax ENOUGH. Generally his problem has been that he's only looking to Plax.

 

[se7en]

A good coach knows his team is only as good as he/she can lead them. The players may struggle to make the plays but someone higher up asked them to run that play to start with. Being able to get people fired up, making roster changes, rotating people and adjusting to other team are all very subtle things that have a huge impact.

I have never liked Coughlin as a head coach. From what I hear he can be good at motivating but his football IQ doesn't shine in some of the plays I've seen this season. Not that hes "bad" but maybe head coach isn't the best role for him on a team.

 

[ThePresence]

Originally posted by: se7en
A good coach knows his team is only as good as he/she can lead them. The players may struggle to make the plays but someone higher up asked them to run that play to start with. Being able to get people fired up, making roster changes, rotating people and adjusting to other team are all very subtle things that have a huge impact.

I have never liked Coughlin as a head coach. From what I hear he can be good at motivating but his football IQ doesn't shine in some of the plays I've seen this season. Not that hes "bad" but maybe head coach isn't the best role for him on a team.

I disagree, I think Coughlin is a very good game coach. I think his issue has been dealing with the players off the field. He tended to treat them like children which they resented. He solved most of those issues this year and the players are very vocal in their support for him this season.

 

[jjones]

The Giants lost to a better team, but that's not to say they couldn't win against Dallas. Dallas has an off day or NY has a great day, who knows, the Giants are good enough of a team to pull out a win. They are not a better team than Dallas this year but, as they say, on any given Sunday...

That being said, I've never been a fan of Coughlin.

 

[Fingolfin269]

I'll bet Eli wishes he had a different last name. Then maybe the rabid NY fans would realize he's a decent QB. Not a superstar but decent enough to win. Give him a T.O. or Moss at receiver and then judge him.

For those of you saying 'Trade Eli for Romo' would you not also want to swap receiving corps and o-line or do you feel confident he would put up similar numbers if you just traded QBs?

 

[ThePresence]

Originally posted by: Fingolfin269
I'll bet Eli wishes he had a different last name. Then maybe the rabid NY fans would realize he's a decent QB. Not a superstar but decent enough to win. Give him a T.O. or Moss at receiver and then judge him.

For those of you saying 'Trade Eli for Romo' would you not also want to swap receiving corps and o-line or do you feel confident he would put up similar numbers if you just traded QBs?

Giants have good receivers.
Not as good as Dallas, but not many teams outside of New England do.
Eli is not what people thought he'd be, but he's a solid QB.

 

[techs]

I can't figure out who is to blame for the fact the Giants seem to have drafted too many defensive linemen.

 

[ThePresence]

Originally posted by: techs
I can't figure out who is to blame for the fact the Giants seem to have drafted too many defensive linemen.

That's Ernie Accorsi. When they drafted Kiwanuka people were suprised because they needed LB's and DB's. He said "you can never have too many people who can rush the passer". I don't fault him for it, I kinda agree with his philosophy.

 

[Fingolfin269]

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: Fingolfin269
I'll bet Eli wishes he had a different last name. Then maybe the rabid NY fans would realize he's a decent QB. Not a superstar but decent enough to win. Give him a T.O. or Moss at receiver and then judge him.

For those of you saying 'Trade Eli for Romo' would you not also want to swap receiving corps and o-line or do you feel confident he would put up similar numbers if you just traded QBs?

Giants have good receivers.
Not as good as Dallas, but not many teams outside of New England do.
Eli is not what people thought he'd be, but he's a solid QB.

But that is the point about switching QBs. They are not always a product of themselves as much as they are a product of a system and those around them. I personally feel Romo has much better tools around him than Eli and definitely thrives there. If you take T.O. away from him it definitely hurts him a lot more than Eli losing one of this receivers.

 

[Fingolfin269]

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: techs
I can't figure out who is to blame for the fact the Giants seem to have drafted too many defensive linemen.

That's Ernie Accorsi. When they drafted Kiwanuka people were suprised because they needed LB's and DB's. He said "you can never have too many people who can rush the passer". I don't fault him for it, I kinda agree with his philosophy.

That is definitely true. A great front 7 can make up an average group of DBs look much greater than they really are. Take a look at the Titans without Haynesworth this week vs. the Titans every week prior.

 

[sash1]

the holding penalties is to blame for their loss to Dallas. on the kickoff return that would have set them up at i think the 5, a holding penalty (which i thought was crap i didn't see anything) brought them back. and then when they scored a TD that would have tied the game at 24, there was another holding that reversed that.

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: Fingolfin269

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: techs
I can't figure out who is to blame for the fact the Giants seem to have drafted too many defensive linemen.

That's Ernie Accorsi. When they drafted Kiwanuka people were suprised because they needed LB's and DB's. He said "you can never have too many people who can rush the passer". I don't fault him for it, I kinda agree with his philosophy.

That is definitely true. A great front 7 can make up an average group of DBs look much greater than they really are. Take a look at the Titans without Haynesworth this week vs. the Titans every week prior.

But 4 defensive ends and one lame wide reciever can kill your offense.