Originally posted by: BeauJangles
We built this country on the idea that the free market would reign. We certainly don't live in a completely free market economy, but we're probably about as close as it gets. I don't quite know what to say to your points. [/quote]
When the country was founded, the economy was very simple - the sort of 'basic capitalism' Moore is in favor of, an agricultural economy where George Washington got 'rich' with a very modest farming operation, Franklin published, Jefferson went broke, most sold food or other products like furniture. It had nothing to do with the problematic economic structure we have today with 40% of the economy being the finance sector that has effective economic blackmail power over the economy.
Even in that small and simple economy, there was a struggle over whether to have 'centralized banking' because of the corrupting effects. That has now been settled.
We're far from a 'free economy'. One reason I said you are a right-wing ideologue on these issues is because of how you mouth their ideology and appear unimformed on the contradictory facts. Look over the last 25 years at the government bailouts of big buginess with taxpayer dollars - not only for the larger good of the country, but their not regulating big business as the public interest needs.
In the late 80's, we deregulated Savings and Loans, for example, and promptly had them make vast profits with reckless behavior - and get $250 billion in bailouts (with such fine figures as the President's son Neil intimately involved in triggering the crisis, and Sen. John McCain helping the most visible criminal). But at least then the government also convicted over 700 people of crimes. Number convicted in the current crisis: zero. And experts say it's not for lack of crimes.
What sort of protection do you want from people who are willing to do the same work for less money? You want the government to come in and put tariffs on goods coming into this country? Ultimately, that's going to hurt our economy (and the global economy) more than it's going to help. Yes, people get left behind (steel workers in this country) and that sucks, but that's also reality. Things change. The less we try to cling to the past and embrace the future, the more secure our economy is.
Yes, it's more complex than you describe, but I'm fine with some tarriffs for a balance between 'free trade' and protecting our people.
Consider this scenario: Old situation: US factory has 1,000 workers making $50K and an owner making $5 million. New situation: outsourced to China, 1,000 workers out of work zero income (unemployment), owner cut his labor costs 95% and now makes $25 million. How does that scenario, repeated over and over, affect our society?
I'm all for gradual and planned globalization, not destroying our economy in a sudden shift that's dominated by the benefits of the rich.
What's wrong with this country? Plenty! If we're going to talk strict economics, I'd say that the structure of corporations is disturbing. It seems to me like we have relatively few people on many different boards, all of whom are basically overcompensating themselves at the CEO level.
Finally a point of agreement. The only practical solution is government regulation of the process IMO. Right-wing ideology about stocholders doing it doesn't work in the real world.
I also think that, globally, there needs to be a push for companies to accept responsibility for their environmental impact. Right now, the cost of their actions is simply dumped on the government and I think it would be better for everyone if that burden was at least shared, if not passed almost completely to the company itself. I doubt that's going to happen any time soon.
Do you understand the only way for that push to happen is governmental regulation - the very sort of power the corporatocracy is trying to gut from government?
But again a point of agreement. 'Internalize profits, externalize costs.'
I'm increasingly worried about those who are left behind. With the closing of state-run mental health institutions we've let some of the neediest and least self-reliant people out into the cold. In general, I feel that our government concentrates too much on providing higher level goods and services, while it should be concerned with the basics.
Not bad.
With the increasingly global structure of the economy, I'd like to see this country more forcible export our health standards. I'd like to see better regulation of the food and goods that are imported into this country via an expansion of our regulatory agencies. Not only would this improve the quality of goods coming into this country, but it would help boost standards in the exporting countries.
Well I certainly have to acknowledge you leaving the realm of right-wing economic ideology on these later points.
Understand that the things you want tend to follow two things: the increase of wealth and political power among the general population of a country.
With out of control globalization, neither is a strong trend.
I dunno, there's a hell of a lot that needs to be fixed from gerrymandering to the FDA to lobbyists to public schools to prisons to tort law to ... to ... I guess enumerating every single point isn't really going to get us anywhere.
Gerrymandering: no apparent solution around; each state who changes it is unilaterally surrendering their party's interests while the other party can keep theirs.
Only federal regulation could seem to do much, and that would be a big change on states' rights, only the Supreme Court has done that in one state in 2000.
FDA, lobbyists: restrice corporate money in the system, close the revolving door.
Public schools: reducing the concentration of wealth frees up funds.
Prisons: restrict the private industry's role in lobbying for their own profits, e.g.,longer sentences. Consider legalizaing marijuana.
Tort reform: mostly a red herring, a political goal of the right to gut their opposition and help their corporate donors at the expense of the victims, a step in the wrong direction.
Isolated reform not driven by the Republican agenda is ok.
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