Who here thinks the G8 will really call off all debts Africa owes to them?

[Feldenak]

Originally posted by: chrisms

Originally posted by: Feldenak
I would prefer that the G8 nations not write off the debt of African nations. It's not like Africa produces much of anything (outside of export of raw materials). I may be wrong but I don't believe I have anything in my household that says "Made in <insert African nation>".

That's the problem.. we need to give them something to produce. Or we can not write off their debts and let them stay the hellhole of the world, killing themselves with disease, poverty, and war that will eventually spread to sorrounding regions. Many believe AIDS will soon effect Asia in a similar way that it has Africa, and after that who knows where it could spread next.

You can leave the world's problems thousands of miles away but sooner or later they will catch up to all of us.

Let'em grow up or die....worked for the rest of the world.

 

[Aquaman]

I think they will forgive some......... although I don't know what that will accomplish? :Q 😕 🙁

Cheers,
Aquaman

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: chrisms

Originally posted by: Excelsior
This..in the whole scheme of things, won't really help Africa much. Africa needs more than just having their debt relieved and some money thrown at them.

The point of this concert wasn't to throw money at Africa, but to change policy to allow Africa to create wealth for itself. The main thing people like Geldof want is fair trade for poor nations, so their economies can actually have some sort of backbone.

I am sorry I wasn't clear in my post. I fully realize that the point of the concert wasn't to throw money at Africa. However, don't you realize that is almost the point of the G8 itself? They (the representatives) want to double the aid sent to africa. That is, in effect, throwing more money at Africa.

Africa needs to fix itself before the wealthy countries can help it.

 

[DAGTA]

Many people do not care because they see people in Africa as 'primitive' and somehow that makes them less than human. Just because their technology and infrastructure is behind much of the rest of the world doesn't make them any less human. If you were to take a baby born in Africa and raised him/her elsewhere, he/she would be just the 'same' as anyone else you knew in an 'advanced' society.

I know a woman that was born and raised until the age of 12 in Zimbabwe. Short of her telling you that, you'd probably never guess it.

 

[chrisms]

Originally posted by: Feldenak

Originally posted by: chrisms

Originally posted by: Feldenak
I would prefer that the G8 nations not write off the debt of African nations. It's not like Africa produces much of anything (outside of export of raw materials). I may be wrong but I don't believe I have anything in my household that says "Made in <insert African nation>".

That's the problem.. we need to give them something to produce. Or we can not write off their debts and let them stay the hellhole of the world, killing themselves with disease, poverty, and war that will eventually spread to sorrounding regions. Many believe AIDS will soon effect Asia in a similar way that it has Africa, and after that who knows where it could spread next.

You can leave the world's problems thousands of miles away but sooner or later they will catch up to all of us.

Let'em grow up or die....worked for the rest of the world.

If we went by this policy, we could probably assume the cause of death would be AIDS. With AIDS in Asia already becoming a serious problem, how much worse will this disease spread when the entire continent of Africa is infected? I don't want to go as far as to say that if we left Africa alone the world would end, but millions dead outide of Africa would not be unlikely.

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: Vertimus

Originally posted by: AmdEmAll
Africans really need to stop having so many damn kids... they can't even feed themselves!

Anyway, this live 8 thing is stupid. Its just for these artists to sell more cd's.

Where did this debt come from that Africa has?

I agree the Live8 thing is stupid, but helping Africa is not.

The debt is from previous loans from the World Bank and IMF etc.

The reason why Africans have so many kids is because they can't expect half of them to survive.

Are you that dense? It is because they don't use contraceptives. What kind of sense would it make to have MORE kids because half of them will die of starvation....think about that for just a second.

 

[Pocatello]

Originally posted by: Feldenak
I would prefer that the G8 nations not write off the debt of African nations. It's not like Africa produces much of anything (outside of export of raw materials). I may be wrong but I don't believe I have anything in my household that says "Made in <insert African nation>".

Not that I'm saying you don't understand the important of raw material. Think how many cars Japan can produce without raw materials. A lot of G8 countries need stuffs from African countries and other third world countries to keep their economy running.

 

[dudeman007]

All the ignorant people who keep shelling out this screw Africa crap should be forced to live there for a month. When and IF they come back, they can all then decide however they like.

 

[Feldenak]

Originally posted by: DAGTA
Many people do not care because they see people in Africa as 'primitive' and somehow that makes them less than human. Just because their technology and infrastructure is behind much of the rest of the world doesn't make them any less human. If you were to take a baby born in Africa and raised him/her elsewhere, he/she would be just the 'same' as anyone else you knew in an 'advanced' society.

I know a woman that was born and raised until the age of 12 in Zimbabwe. Short of her telling you that, you'd probably never guess it.

It's not that I'm apathetic....I just don't care. 😉

Seriously, they may have outstanding individuals but as a continent they seem rather dumb. African nations want help? They need to start first by moving away from tribal society.

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: dudeman007
All the ignorant people who keep shelling out this screw Africa crap should be forced to live there for a month. When and IF they come back, they can all then decide however they like.

If you care so much, move to Africa to help the poor bastards.

Fact is, we don't live there, we are blessed to live in decent countries.

 

[Feldenak]

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: dudeman007
All the ignorant people who keep shelling out this screw Africa crap should be forced to live there for a month. When and IF they come back, they can all then decide however they like.

If you care so much, move to Africa to help the poor bastards.

Fact is, we don't live there, we are blessed to live in decent countries.

Exactly.

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: Feldenak

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: dudeman007
All the ignorant people who keep shelling out this screw Africa crap should be forced to live there for a month. When and IF they come back, they can all then decide however they like.

If you care so much, move to Africa to help the poor bastards.

Fact is, we don't live there, we are blessed to live in decent countries.

Exactly.

:heart:

 

[alexeikgb]

Russia forgave 2.2 billions of debt.... havent heard of anyone else tho

 

[gsaldivar]

The only thing that wholesale debt forgiveness will accomplish is to give each corrupt dictator in Africa a brand-new line of credit that they can spend as they please. Assistance without a link to political reform is simply good money thrown after bad, serving to enrich systems of government that have already proven to be incapable of providing for their people. If you want to help improverished Africans, you have to come up with something a little more creative than simply medicine & debt forgiveness. :thumbsdown:

One more thing... I'm all for helping out people in Africa, but all the me-too hippie anarchists standing around holding up signs that say "end capitalism", "end Bush" aren't helping "get the message out"... 😀

 

[Pocatello]

Originally posted by: gsaldivar
The only thing that wholesale debt forgiveness will accomplish is to give each corrupt dictator in Africa a brand-new line of credit that they can spend as they please. Assistance without a link to political reform is simply good money thrown after bad, serving to enrich systems of government that have already proven to be incapable of providing for their people. If you want to help improverished Africans, you have to come up with something a little more creative than simply medicine & debt forgiveness. :thumbsdown:

One more thing... I'm all for helping out people in Africa, but all the me-too hippie anarchists standing around holding up signs that say "end capitalism", "end Bush" aren't helping "get the message out"... 😀

:thumbsup:

 

[AntiEverything]

Originally posted by: gsaldivar
The only thing that wholesale debt forgiveness will accomplish is to give each corrupt dictator in Africa a brand-new line of credit that they can spend as they please. Assistance without a link to political reform is simply good money thrown after bad, serving to enrich systems of government that have already proven to be incapable of providing for their people. If you want to help improverished Africans, you have to come up with something a little more creative than simply medicine & debt forgiveness. :thumbsdown:

One more thing... I'm all for helping out people in Africa, but all the me-too hippie anarchists standing around holding up signs that say "end capitalism", "end Bush" aren't helping "get the message out"... 😀

That should pretty much end this thread. 🙂

Very well put.

 

[EyeMWing]

South Africa has done fairly well, as have the north African nations. The landscape and climate of the rest of the continent isn't conducive to supporting a permanent civilization. Think about it. The vast majority of successful nations sit in a temperate zone, or have their population densely compacted into areas closely resembling temperate climates. The middle east? It's got far higher than the acceptable number of per-capita genocidal maniacs. Africa? It's just like it was back in the beginning of humanity, except with AK-47's and RPG-7's. A bunch of warring clans. Central/South America? There are a few okay nations there, but the majority are politically unstable.

 

[isekii]

I think a sh!t load of condoms and food will go a longer way than wiping out their debt.

I really think we should take care of our own problems within the US before tacking other problems for different 3rd world countries especially if there are people that are hungry and starving within our own country.
How about solving the problems within out own country first before trying to tackle problems of other countries.

Live8 <~ may be a good cause but it still doesn't solve problems 😛. Something that probably helps those people feel they accomplished something, when in reality it just delayed the ongoing problems.

 

[Chaotic42]

Debt forgiveness will do nothing. They need social structure first.

I don't know if it's true or not, but I've always thought that unless a people are united and determined enough to overthrow oppression and create their own democracy, a forced democracy wouldn't be able to stand.

They just need time.

 

[isekii]

Originally posted by: Chaotic42
Debt forgiveness will do nothing. They need social structure first.

I don't know if it's true or not, but I've always thought that unless a people are united and determined enough to overthrow oppression and create their own democracy, a forced democracy wouldn't be able to stand.

They just need time.

All the time in the world isn't gonna help africa.
As the time goes on it'll get a lot worse.

 

[Chaotic42]

Originally posted by: isekii
All the time in the world isn't gonna help africa.
As the time goes on it'll get a lot worse.

If the people there can't rise up and do something with their society, what good will propping them up for a few years do? They'll just fall back under warlord rule.

 

[Brackis]

Originally posted by: Chompman
One would think that since Africa has one of the worlds richest collection of valuable gems and ore in their country they could do something with that.

Instead they fight over them and make them conflict diamonds and thus near worthless.

This is thanks to the devloped worlds demand for worthless rocks and the monopoply DeBeers holds in the diamond industry.

 

[Chompman]

Originally posted by: Brackis

Originally posted by: Chompman
One would think that since Africa has one of the worlds richest collection of valuable gems and ore in their country they could do something with that.

Instead they fight over them and make them conflict diamonds and thus near worthless.

This is thanks to the devloped worlds demand for worthless rocks and the monopoply DeBeers holds in the diamond industry.

Seeing how many of these gems do have uses, such as diamonds being the hardest thing and are used in many high quality tools, we would still want these.

Plus they are shiny...ohhhh shiny. 😀

 

[gsaldivar]

Originally posted by: Brackis
This is thanks to the devloped worlds demand for worthless rocks and the monopoply DeBeers holds in the diamond industry.

No, it's thanks to corrupt African governments which allow DeBeers to freely mine and export their most valuable natural resource with little or no wealth reinvested back into the country's local economy.

 

[Brackis]

Originally posted by: Chompman

Originally posted by: Brackis

Originally posted by: Chompman
One would think that since Africa has one of the worlds richest collection of valuable gems and ore in their country they could do something with that.

Instead they fight over them and make them conflict diamonds and thus near worthless.

This is thanks to the devloped worlds demand for worthless rocks and the monopoply DeBeers holds in the diamond industry.

Seeing how many of these gems do have uses, such as diamonds being the hardest thing and are used in many high quality tools, we would still want these.

Plus they are shiny...ohhhh shiny. 😀

DeBeers has horded diamonds in such a number that if they were all sent to the open market the value would be killed. Thus they keep them in massive storage amounts and artificially inflate the price. DeBeers could have some semblance of a heart and push for reform in countries, but they want to diamonds and nothing else, thus these countries are war zones that the world bank and the precious stone industries turn a blind eye to.
God bless imperialism.