UberNeuman
Lifer
- Nov 4, 1999
- 16,937
- 3,087
- 126
I'm only asking what makes Mr. McCain so seasoned - is it because he's just been around a long time?
Because that's a pretty low threshold to make a standard.....
I'm only asking what makes Mr. McCain so seasoned - is it because he's just been around a long time?
Because that's a pretty low threshold to make a standard.....
Not just "being around", he's been around and been actively involved enough to have real experience not just "being around a long time" experience.
UberNeuman
Lifer
- Nov 4, 1999
- 16,937
- 3,087
- 126
Uhmmm, government or communal control of the means of production is the defining aspect of socialism. It's what makes socialism socialism. You appear to think that leftist = socialist, and it's simply not true. You are using the word incorrectly.
Not only that, but Obama isn't even really a leftist economically. He's still a free market capitalist. Our perceptions in America are extremely skewed when it comes to determining what is left/right. We have a center right party (Democrats) and an ultra right party (Republicans).
OrByte
Diamond Member
- Jul 21, 2000
- 9,303
- 144
- 106
hehehe so now I'm supposed to consider McCain as the better candidate because he is "seasoned?"
no thanks.
here is another definition of "seasoned"
seasoned - aged or processed. :laugh:
we all know McCain is "aged." And since 2000 his "processing" has been coming along just fine to the delight of the radical right fringe.
no thanks.
here is another definition of "seasoned"
seasoned - aged or processed. :laugh:
we all know McCain is "aged." And since 2000 his "processing" has been coming along just fine to the delight of the radical right fringe.
KlokWyze
Diamond Member
Wouldn't be surprised if McCain "won" even if 1st time voters came out in droves & Obama had 80% majority.
lupi
Lifer
- Apr 8, 2001
- 32,539
- 260
- 126
yawn
Obama often makes references to his distinctions as a candidate, such as saying there are doubts among some voters because he has "a funny name." At times he refers to his race as well, saying he looks different from any previous candidate but then adding that the differences are not just about race. Addressing supporters Tuesday night at a fundraiser in Springfield, he said, "It's a leap, electing a 46-year-old black guy named Barack Obama."
Vic
Elite Member
- Jun 12, 2001
- 50,422
- 14,337
- 136
And how is this race-baiting? Oh, it's not.
:roll:
edit: yaknow, this nest of quotes here makes for nice study of the paranoid process. A candidate says, hey, I'm black, get over it. And that gets followed by accusations of race-baiting and Orwellian delusions that he is Hitler or the KKK.
Look, vote for McCain if you want. That doesn't make you a racist and no one ever said so, except you. But what I will say is that your arguments (both of you) represent a profound level of self-dishonesty. And all I'd prefer is if I didn't have to read your constant lies and whining.
trenchfoot
Lifer
- Aug 5, 2000
- 15,890
- 8,480
- 136
A majority of Americans are willing to vote for eight more years of the last eight years?
I'm to believe that the majority of the nation will have forgotten what the repubs have done to this nation for the last eight years?
I'm to believe that the mood of the nation that gave the majority of both houses of Congress back to the Dems has now changed just because McCain - (you know, the guy that lost to Bush *of all people*:disgust: back in 2k, fer crying out loud) is now a very attractive and desirable repub heir apparent, devout keeper of the neocon agenda that ran this country for the last 7+ years and the better qualified candidate of the two?
Well, Bush got re-elected so I guess anything -ANYTHING- is possible.
I'm to believe that the majority of the nation will have forgotten what the repubs have done to this nation for the last eight years?
I'm to believe that the mood of the nation that gave the majority of both houses of Congress back to the Dems has now changed just because McCain - (you know, the guy that lost to Bush *of all people*:disgust: back in 2k, fer crying out loud) is now a very attractive and desirable repub heir apparent, devout keeper of the neocon agenda that ran this country for the last 7+ years and the better qualified candidate of the two?
Well, Bush got re-elected so I guess anything -ANYTHING- is possible.
rpanic
Golden Member
- Dec 1, 2006
- 1,896
- 7
- 81
Not voting for either one, just because you feel compelled to vote or if you are lucky actually like who you are voting for doesn?t mean I have to make the same choice. McCain lost my vote when he when he started supporting Bush and his war. Obama looked good until he started actually talking about things outside of his speeches.
I think Obama was the ?vision of perfection? for a lot of other people and still is too many. Now every time he opens his mouth and changes his position just to pander its even more obvious because of the pedestal he has been put on. Obama was a lot better at the beginning when there was at least an illusion of being someone that was different and for change. If he looses it will be the fault of all the democrats that nominated him without even knowing anything more than a bunch of meaningless speeches that sounded nice.
pretty much, that's why I'm so dispassionate about the vote I'll be casting for Obama in November.
- Oct 30, 2000
- 42,589
- 5
- 0
I think the campaign itself has gone negative damn quick. Personally I've lost a lot of interest in following the day to day stuff. I still read op-eds and such but at this point I'm more waiting to see some debates and actual discussion of policy. I think McCains series of ads featuring Britney and Paris Hilton were about as much as I could take. I don't really want to watch anymore of his campaign, I like the guy to much to see him dishonor himself any further.
It seems to me that the media is giving John McCain the image of 'scrappy underdog' which is working to his advantage. By failing to offer equal coverage of him they are placing extreme pressure on Dems. Rather than discuss ideas we are now discussing nonsense.
They don't seem to be covering the gaffes he has made or his own policy flips (which have been just as large as Obamas) while also hounding Obama on every single issue. I find the idea of McCain belittling the media particularly humorous given that he was the medias love child for the past 8 years.
That being said, I think one of the reason the polls are so tight is that it is looking at 'likely voters'. There are a lot of youth my age, both republican and democrat, who are not factored into these polls. Looking at the accuracy of polling during the primary I think it's safe to say that we can't trust them at all for this election.
It seems to me that the media is giving John McCain the image of 'scrappy underdog' which is working to his advantage. By failing to offer equal coverage of him they are placing extreme pressure on Dems. Rather than discuss ideas we are now discussing nonsense.
They don't seem to be covering the gaffes he has made or his own policy flips (which have been just as large as Obamas) while also hounding Obama on every single issue. I find the idea of McCain belittling the media particularly humorous given that he was the medias love child for the past 8 years.
That being said, I think one of the reason the polls are so tight is that it is looking at 'likely voters'. There are a lot of youth my age, both republican and democrat, who are not factored into these polls. Looking at the accuracy of polling during the primary I think it's safe to say that we can't trust them at all for this election.
OrByte
Diamond Member
- Jul 21, 2000
- 9,303
- 144
- 106
Thank you, I try really I do...
actually I've laid out my reasons for supporting BHO and those reasons are tied directly to policy expectations of both candidates. My reasons have nothing to do with who is "seasoned." That is simply stupid and meaningless.
as for the rest of this fringe wingbat stuff I will do my best to make light of all the stupid ways people are trying to tear the candidates down.
cheezy321
Diamond Member
- Dec 31, 2003
- 6,218
- 2
- 0
Holy crap. are you kidding me?
Lets break down the definitions....
A free market is a market in which prices of goods and services are arranged completely by the mutual consent of sellers and buyers. By definition, in a free market environment buyers and sellers do not coerce or mislead each other nor are they coerced by a third party. Source
Socialism refers to any of various economic and political concepts of state or collective (i.e. public) ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods and services, some of which have been developed into more or less highly articulated theories and/or praxis. Source
Source
Soooo, Obama wants to TAKE AWAY profits from the oil companies, and GIVE THEM to the poor.
In theory he wants to take away the extra money the oil companies made and give them to someone else. So collectively the poor have an "ownership" of some of the oil companies profits.
How is this not some form of socialism?
Free market capitalist????? WHATTTTTT????
ProfJohn
Lifer
- Jul 28, 2006
- 18,161
- 7
- 0
The following are Obama quotes from articles placed in one of two Chicago newspapers. source
For a guy who claims to be color blind he sure talked a lot about blacks and their need to work together as a group.
the black caucus "is broken and needs to unite for the common good of the African-American community."
"The problem right now is that we don't have a unified agenda that's enforced back in the community and is clearly articulated. Everybody tends to be lone agents in these situations."
"while everyone agrees that the Hispanic population has grown, they cannot expand by taking African-American seats."
"An incumbent African-American legislator with a 90 percent district may feel good about his reelection chances, but we as a community would probably be better off if we had two African-American legislators with 60 percent each."
"[A]s you combine a strong African-American base with progressive white and Latino voters, I think it is a recipe for success in the primary and in the general election."
"When you combine??.??.??.an energized African-American voter base and effective coalition-building with other progressive sectors of the population, we think we have a recipe for victory."
For a guy who claims to be color blind he sure talked a lot about blacks and their need to work together as a group.
the black caucus "is broken and needs to unite for the common good of the African-American community."
"The problem right now is that we don't have a unified agenda that's enforced back in the community and is clearly articulated. Everybody tends to be lone agents in these situations."
"while everyone agrees that the Hispanic population has grown, they cannot expand by taking African-American seats."
"An incumbent African-American legislator with a 90 percent district may feel good about his reelection chances, but we as a community would probably be better off if we had two African-American legislators with 60 percent each."
"[A]s you combine a strong African-American base with progressive white and Latino voters, I think it is a recipe for success in the primary and in the general election."
"When you combine??.??.??.an energized African-American voter base and effective coalition-building with other progressive sectors of the population, we think we have a recipe for victory."
StageLeft
No Lifer
- Sep 29, 2000
- 70,150
- 5
- 0
Not really, most Americans are far too ignorant to actually speak on Obama vs McCain intelligently. Many will support either candidate because "I am a democrat" or "I am a republican". Brainless. The remaining ones are the battleground individuals. Those may indeed be seeing Obama's fall from grace. I've seen it. I'd still, if I was eligible to vote, support him over McCain, but not with the glee I would have months ago. He is, as you said, inexperienced, too little when we need a lot, and like any other politician, now reversing stances on issues he spoke to confidently about before.
Hell, can't the US do any better? Obama or McCane? Brutal.
Well, experience or age doesn't always mean something. Bush had a lot of experience for his second term, didn't he? But, before Obama ran for this, he had no accolades at all of real consequence, not for a guy hoping to run the country, so it certainly is a bit of an acute issue for him. I was certainly willing to overlook, but he is overly pandering and lacks the backbone and resolve I had hoped for before.
Also, he will increase the size of government terribly.
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