While we worry about the wolf in the hen house. The fox sneaks in and steals an egg.

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Craig234
Liberals who have long said the corporatocracy has far too much power: 1

Right-wingers who parroted the corporatocracy propaganda why not to spend on people: 0

Haven't liberals favored the growth of gov't over the years? Your type created a big club (gov't), and now you're upset corporations wield it? Wake up.

Ahhh.. go check your facts out not what Fox/Rush/etc... says. Under Bush the Gov has grown bigger then ever. Gov always gets bigger under republicans.

I don't watch Fox or listen to Rush, but don't let the facts stand in the way of your stupid assumptions. Gov't certainly got bigger under FDR, and he was no Republican. More importantly, I've yet to find a liberal calling for a smaller gov't. What programs or departments is Obama looking to eliminate?

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Craig234
Liberals who have long said the corporatocracy has far too much power: 1

Right-wingers who parroted the corporatocracy propaganda why not to spend on people: 0

Haven't liberals favored the growth of gov't over the years? Your type created a big club (gov't), and now you're upset corporations wield it? Wake up.

Ahhh.. go check your facts out not what Fox/Rush/etc... says. Under Bush the Gov has grown bigger then ever. Gov always gets bigger under republicans.

I don't watch Fox or listen to Rush, but don't let the facts stand in the way of your stupid assumptions. Gov't certainly got bigger under FDR, and he was no Republican. More importantly, I've yet to find a liberal calling for a smaller gov't. What programs or departments is Obama looking to eliminate?

Stop before you are unable to pull that foot from your mouth. For over 30 years the trend has been clearly that republicans spend more than democrats. Why are you still believing the myth of the fiscally conservative republican? They are dead like the dinosaur.

Linky dinky doo

 

[heyheybooboo]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Craig234
Liberals who have long said the corporatocracy has far too much power: 1

Right-wingers who parroted the corporatocracy propaganda why not to spend on people: 0

Haven't liberals favored the growth of gov't over the years? Your type created a big club (gov't), and now you're upset corporations wield it? Wake up.

Ahhh.. go check your facts out not what Fox/Rush/etc... says. Under Bush the Gov has grown bigger then ever. Gov always gets bigger under republicans.

I don't watch Fox or listen to Rush, but don't let the facts stand in the way of your stupid assumptions. Gov't certainly got bigger under FDR, and he was no Republican. More importantly, I've yet to find a liberal calling for a smaller gov't. What programs or departments is Obama looking to eliminate?

LOL - You just plain Fail

Bill Clinton was the best Republican president since Eisenhower. Not only did the Federal Gov't shrink he left us with a $230 billion annual surplus.

Fast forward to 2008. By the end on the month the annual Federal deficit will exceed $700 billion this fiscal year - NOT including Hank Paulson's $700 Billion Golden Bucket of Taxpayer Cash.

The biggest scam of the last 8 years (giving honorable mention to the Bush Tax cuts and Iraq War) was the Bush-Republican Part D Big Pharma Give-A-Way which will cost the American Taxpayer 40 Trillion Dollars over the next 70 years.

The only stupid rhetoric is yours

 

[Robor]

Originally posted by: winnar111
Yay for the new Democratic Congress.

What is the current makeup? Last I checked the (D)'s have 49 just like the (R)'s. Considering LIEberman is campaigning for McCain where do you count him?

 

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: heyheybooboo

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Craig234
Liberals who have long said the corporatocracy has far too much power: 1

Right-wingers who parroted the corporatocracy propaganda why not to spend on people: 0

Haven't liberals favored the growth of gov't over the years? Your type created a big club (gov't), and now you're upset corporations wield it? Wake up.

Ahhh.. go check your facts out not what Fox/Rush/etc... says. Under Bush the Gov has grown bigger then ever. Gov always gets bigger under republicans.

I don't watch Fox or listen to Rush, but don't let the facts stand in the way of your stupid assumptions. Gov't certainly got bigger under FDR, and he was no Republican. More importantly, I've yet to find a liberal calling for a smaller gov't. What programs or departments is Obama looking to eliminate?

LOL - You just plain Fail

Bill Clinton was the best Republican president since Eisenhower. Not only did the Federal Gov't shrink he left us with a $230 billion annual surplus.

Fast forward to 2008. By the end on the month the annual Federal deficit will exceed $700 billion this fiscal year - NOT including Hank Paulson's $700 Billion Golden Bucket of Taxpayer Cash.

The biggest scam of the last 8 years (giving honorable mention to the Bush Tax cuts and Iraq War) was the Bush-Republican Part D Big Pharma Give-A-Way which will cost the American Taxpayer 40 Trillion Dollars over the next 70 years.

The only stupid rhetoric is yours

Since you'll give the Republicans Clinton, I'll give the Democrats Bush. He's certainly no conservative (but then few Republicans are, which is why I've left that party).

 

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Craig234
Liberals who have long said the corporatocracy has far too much power: 1

Right-wingers who parroted the corporatocracy propaganda why not to spend on people: 0

Haven't liberals favored the growth of gov't over the years? Your type created a big club (gov't), and now you're upset corporations wield it? Wake up.

Ahhh.. go check your facts out not what Fox/Rush/etc... says. Under Bush the Gov has grown bigger then ever. Gov always gets bigger under republicans.

I don't watch Fox or listen to Rush, but don't let the facts stand in the way of your stupid assumptions. Gov't certainly got bigger under FDR, and he was no Republican. More importantly, I've yet to find a liberal calling for a smaller gov't. What programs or departments is Obama looking to eliminate?

Stop before you are unable to pull that foot from your mouth. For over 30 years the trend has been clearly that republicans spend more than democrats. Why are you still believing the myth of the fiscally conservative republican? They are dead like the dinosaur.

Linky dinky doo

Presidents don't appropriate, Congress does. A president can't spend what the Congress doesn't give him.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Craig234
Liberals who have long said the corporatocracy has far too much power: 1

Right-wingers who parroted the corporatocracy propaganda why not to spend on people: 0

Haven't liberals favored the growth of gov't over the years? Your type created a big club (gov't), and now you're upset corporations wield it? Wake up.

Ahhh.. go check your facts out not what Fox/Rush/etc... says. Under Bush the Gov has grown bigger then ever. Gov always gets bigger under republicans.

I don't watch Fox or listen to Rush, but don't let the facts stand in the way of your stupid assumptions. Gov't certainly got bigger under FDR, and he was no Republican. More importantly, I've yet to find a liberal calling for a smaller gov't. What programs or departments is Obama looking to eliminate?

Stop before you are unable to pull that foot from your mouth. For over 30 years the trend has been clearly that republicans spend more than democrats. Why are you still believing the myth of the fiscally conservative republican? They are dead like the dinosaur.

Linky dinky doo

Presidents don't appropriate, Congress does. A president can't spend what the Congress doesn't give him.

History shows he tends to do a pretty good job of encouraging them to vote along his lines.

 

[SP33Demon]

United States of France indeed. Renault, anyone?

 

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
History shows he tends to do a pretty good job of encouraging them to vote along his lines.

Assuming that's true (and I'm not saying it is), aren't Congressmembers adults? And if they are, aren't they responsible for their own actions, "encouragement" or not? Congress has ignored presidents plenty of times, even when they're of the same party. Clinton couldn't get his own party to pass universal healthcare, and the GOP Congress likewise let Bush's SS reform plan die on the vine.

I'm not suggesting the GOP is fiscally conservative; they like to claim they are, but that's only in theory, not practice. However, it's silly to pretend the Dems are any different - Democratic Congresses have been happy to pass deficit spending bill after deficit spending bill. Wasn't the Dem complaint about the Medicare Drug bill something about how it didn't go far enough?

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: DeathBUA
And you'd like to let a major part of the US economy fail? If any of the Big 3 failed it will help further the economic woes.

And lets compare, 25 billion vs 700 billion. I'll gladly let the Big 3 have their bailout.

Ummmm.......major ? Our failing banks are a bigger threat to our economy then the big 3 going under. The big 3 have ceased being a major player in the consumer auto market and if it were not for the huge fleets of government owned vehicles they would of sunk a long time ago. They can't and do not know how to adapt and have failed to change their mindset to meet the needs and demands of US consumers. In effect they are now corporate welfare whores who are being saved from their own failures.

Big 3 going under would be much, much, much smaller of an issue compared to our credit system going under.

 

[lupi]

But...but...but the dems have only been in control since 06, this can't possibly be becuase of them.

 

[boomerang]

100th post about this issue. Get happy with it.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Skoorb
History shows he tends to do a pretty good job of encouraging them to vote along his lines.

Assuming that's true (and I'm not saying it is), aren't Congressmembers adults? And if they are, aren't they responsible for their own actions, "encouragement" or not? Congress has ignored presidents plenty of times, even when they're of the same party. Clinton couldn't get his own party to pass universal healthcare, and the GOP Congress likewise let Bush's SS reform plan die on the vine.

I'm not suggesting the GOP is fiscally conservative; they like to claim they are, but that's only in theory, not practice. However, it's silly to pretend the Dems are any different - Democratic Congresses have been happy to pass deficit spending bill after deficit spending bill. Wasn't the Dem complaint about the Medicare Drug bill something about how it didn't go far enough?

Many of them are junk if not post, but all I can say with certainty is that over the past three decades, when a democratic president is in office the government grows slower and the deficit is in better shape. So, it's not like they are fiscally responsible, because they sure aren't, but they are not as bad.

 

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Skoorb
History shows he tends to do a pretty good job of encouraging them to vote along his lines.

Assuming that's true (and I'm not saying it is), aren't Congressmembers adults? And if they are, aren't they responsible for their own actions, "encouragement" or not? Congress has ignored presidents plenty of times, even when they're of the same party. Clinton couldn't get his own party to pass universal healthcare, and the GOP Congress likewise let Bush's SS reform plan die on the vine.

I'm not suggesting the GOP is fiscally conservative; they like to claim they are, but that's only in theory, not practice. However, it's silly to pretend the Dems are any different - Democratic Congresses have been happy to pass deficit spending bill after deficit spending bill. Wasn't the Dem complaint about the Medicare Drug bill something about how it didn't go far enough?

Many of them are junk if not post, but all I can say with certainty is that over the past three decades, when a democratic president is in office the government grows slower and the deficit is in better shape. So, it's not like they are fiscally responsible, because they sure aren't, but they are not as bad.

We could argue causation all day, but that would be a waste of time. But since it's looking like Obama's got this one in the bag, I just can't wait to see that deficit start shrinking come January. I'm sure he's not only going to enact all the spending he's been promising, but he's also going to balance the books. Should be quite a feat.

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: lupi
But...but...but the dems have only been in control since 06, this can't possibly be becuase of them.

They were duped! There's duping going on here!

 

[winnar111]

Originally posted by: Robor

Originally posted by: winnar111
Yay for the new Democratic Congress.

What is the current makeup? Last I checked the (D)'s have 49 just like the (R)'s. Considering LIEberman is campaigning for McCain where do you count him?

The Democrats have full control of the House and all Senate committees, last time I checked.

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: DisgruntledVirus

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: Young Grasshopper
this is such bullshit. these banks going bankrupt because people cant pay thier mortages is understandable. but these auto makers getting bailouts?

do you hear of toyota or honda getting bailouts? these fucking automakers arent hurting because people cant buy thier cars,

its because no one wants to buy their gas guzzling junk and here we are saving thier asses for not coming up with fuel efficient cars?

Enjoy paying for the giant gas sucking Escalade "Hybrid" SUV that they are pushing that commerical that we are now paying for too.

America deserves to go down in flames.

:| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :|

You deserve to go down in flames.

You have a problem with America than GTFO.

I nominate dmcowen to be deported....

Eh this is one of the few times that I actually agree with Dmcowen... (I can't believe I'm saying that)

 

[Aharami]

the year of the bailouts. It's the IN thing to do now

 

[winnar111]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Skoorb
History shows he tends to do a pretty good job of encouraging them to vote along his lines.

Assuming that's true (and I'm not saying it is), aren't Congressmembers adults? And if they are, aren't they responsible for their own actions, "encouragement" or not? Congress has ignored presidents plenty of times, even when they're of the same party. Clinton couldn't get his own party to pass universal healthcare, and the GOP Congress likewise let Bush's SS reform plan die on the vine.

I'm not suggesting the GOP is fiscally conservative; they like to claim they are, but that's only in theory, not practice. However, it's silly to pretend the Dems are any different - Democratic Congresses have been happy to pass deficit spending bill after deficit spending bill. Wasn't the Dem complaint about the Medicare Drug bill something about how it didn't go far enough?

Many of them are junk if not post, but all I can say with certainty is that over the past three decades, when a democratic president is in office the government grows slower and the deficit is in better shape. So, it's not like they are fiscally responsible, because they sure aren't, but they are not as bad.

Kind of curious to pick 3 decades....when we've only had 1 Democratic President in the last 28 years.

 

[Ktulu]

Originally posted by: Young Grasshopper
this is such bullshit. these banks going bankrupt because people cant pay thier mortages is understandable. but these auto makers getting bailouts? do you hear of toyota or honda getting bailouts? these fucking automakers arent hurting because people cant buy thier cars, its because no one wants to buy her gas guzzling junk and here we are saving thier asses for not coming up with fuel efficient cars?

Despite the fact that GM is having issues keeping the Cobalt supplied to dealerships? Also they do build more than gas guzzling SUV's you know? They actually produce a lot of gas thrifty cars, please go do some research and actually compare them to the other automakers, they are actually very good on gas mileage. Their problem is that their main money makers have largely been trucks and SUV's. That source of profit is now diminishing. With all the problems they're going through with legacy costs, bailouts, unions, etc. they can't be as nimble as the Japanese. Some of you people need to get real. In order for them to survive they really need some sort of help. The Japanese and Koreans get help from their government why can't the domestics?

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: winnar111

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Skoorb
History shows he tends to do a pretty good job of encouraging them to vote along his lines.

Assuming that's true (and I'm not saying it is), aren't Congressmembers adults? And if they are, aren't they responsible for their own actions, "encouragement" or not? Congress has ignored presidents plenty of times, even when they're of the same party. Clinton couldn't get his own party to pass universal healthcare, and the GOP Congress likewise let Bush's SS reform plan die on the vine.

I'm not suggesting the GOP is fiscally conservative; they like to claim they are, but that's only in theory, not practice. However, it's silly to pretend the Dems are any different - Democratic Congresses have been happy to pass deficit spending bill after deficit spending bill. Wasn't the Dem complaint about the Medicare Drug bill something about how it didn't go far enough?

Many of them are junk if not post, but all I can say with certainty is that over the past three decades, when a democratic president is in office the government grows slower and the deficit is in better shape. So, it's not like they are fiscally responsible, because they sure aren't, but they are not as bad.

Kind of curious to pick 3 decades....when we've only had 1 Democratic President in the last 28 years.

OK go back 32 years, then it's 1/3rd of the time 🙂

 

[nakedfrog]

Well, at least it's a loan with 4% interest, so they have to pay it back.

 

[Ktulu]

Originally posted by: nakedfrog
Well, at least it's a loan with 4% interest, so they have to pay it back.

People here just want to call it a bailout to keep them looking bad. Whatever.

 

[MetalMat]

Originally posted by: Young Grasshopper
this is such bullshit. these banks going bankrupt because people cant pay thier mortages is understandable. but these auto makers getting bailouts? do you hear of toyota or honda getting bailouts? these fucking automakers arent hurting because people cant buy thier cars, its because no one wants to buy her gas guzzling junk and here we are saving thier asses for not coming up with fuel efficient cars?

That and the unions

 

[Wreckem]

Originally posted by: heyheybooboo

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Craig234
Liberals who have long said the corporatocracy has far too much power: 1

Right-wingers who parroted the corporatocracy propaganda why not to spend on people: 0

Haven't liberals favored the growth of gov't over the years? Your type created a big club (gov't), and now you're upset corporations wield it? Wake up.

Ahhh.. go check your facts out not what Fox/Rush/etc... says. Under Bush the Gov has grown bigger then ever. Gov always gets bigger under republicans.

I don't watch Fox or listen to Rush, but don't let the facts stand in the way of your stupid assumptions. Gov't certainly got bigger under FDR, and he was no Republican. More importantly, I've yet to find a liberal calling for a smaller gov't. What programs or departments is Obama looking to eliminate?

LOL - You just plain Fail

Bill Clinton was the best Republican president since Eisenhower. Not only did the Federal Gov't shrink he left us with a $230 billion annual surplus.

Fast forward to 2008. By the end on the month the annual Federal deficit will exceed $700 billion this fiscal year - NOT including Hank Paulson's $700 Billion Golden Bucket of Taxpayer Cash.

The biggest scam of the last 8 years (giving honorable mention to the Bush Tax cuts and Iraq War) was the Bush-Republican Part D Big Pharma Give-A-Way which will cost the American Taxpayer 40 Trillion Dollars over the next 70 years.

The only stupid rhetoric is yours

Your numbers are extremely off on Part D.

The $53trillion in medicare libabilites, existed before Part D. Prior to this year they were always given a vague range of between $30-60trillion.