Which SSD for Mid 2010 White MacBook

[xreyuk]

Hey guys

I want a 120GB SSD for my MacBook.

I have tried a Corsair Force 3 (I know my MacBook is only SATA II), and have had the same problem as a lot of MacBook Pro users, in that the SSD will only work at SATA I speeds (negotiates at 1.5Gbps). I returned that SSD and am after another one. MacBook Pro users were treated to a fix by Apple, however my MacBook is unlikely to get a fix from Corsair or Apple.

I have been told that I need a Sandforce drive, because OS X doesn't support TRIM, and sandforce does garbage collection, does anyone know which drives are sandforce?

I've been recommended the Kingston V+100 (because it has 'always-on garbage collection', and it's not badly priced) and the OCZ Agility 3 (it has SATA III capability, and according to the Anandtech Benchmarks here, the Agility 3 is much faster than the Kingston on SATA II) (I assumed where it said Agility 3 (6gbps) was the SATA III test, and without the (6gbps) was SATA II). However, I've been unable to confirm if the Kingston will work in my MacBook, or whether it is Sandforce.

Also, the Kingston SSD was in the MacBook Air, so I may be able to get TRIM support for it, and I shouldn't have the 1.5Gbps problem. The OCZ SSDs have had problems only negotiating 1.5Gbps, however, OCZ appear to have issued a fix.

Can anyone recommend which of the above, or any other SSD I should consider. The two above cost around £130GBP for 120GB model.

Thanks

*EDIT*
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/201?vs=372 - Direct link to the 2 benchmarks I was comparing.

 

[Coup27]

Anand said this in the latest SSD review on the last page:

I still wouldn't recommend the Octane for Mac OS X use without TRIM. SandForce is still best suited for the TRIM-less environments, although I've been quite pleased with the Samsung SSD 830 under OS X for the past few months as well.

 

[xreyuk]

Hmm, the Samsung SSD is about £30 more expensive than the other two. Ideally, because of the age and spec of the MacBook, it might be a bit overkill. If I had MacBook Pro, then maybe, but I don't really use my MacBook for anything other than general home computing.

I believe the Agility 3 is SandForce, but don't know about the V+100, maybe someone could clarify?

Thanks for your input.

 

[Coup27]

The Kingston V+100 is not a Sandforce drive and uses a Toshiba controller. The Agility3 is Sandforce.

 

[xreyuk]

The Kingston V+100 is not a Sandforce drive and uses a Toshiba controller. The Agility3 is Sandforce.

Ahh okay. Would the Kingston V+100 be okay to put in a MacBook? I've been told to get Sandforce, but I'm not sure if it's essential. Judging by the Anandtech review, it was used in the MacBook Air, and does have 'always-on' garbage collection.

Do you know if I installed it, if the TRIM support in Lion would work for it?

Out of the two, what would you suggest?

Thanks

 

[Coup27]

The only TRIM support you will get through Lion OSX is for the Apple branded SSDs.

There is an unofficialy hack for OSX to get TRIM support to work on any SSD but I can't help with because I don't use Apple.

The theory is there to use the Kingston because of its aggressive garbage collection, but Apple doesn't implement standards the same way non-Apple people do; they only implement the bits needed to ensure Apple products work. You should be able to go and buy any SSD you want and plonk it in but the reality is very different. I've read many threads here and there about users having issues with non-Apple SSDs and OSX.

Your best bet would be to research in some OSX forums what success people have had with what SSD. It would be a complete gamble to buy one until you've looked into it, and obviously Apple won't help you.

 

[paperwastage]

The theory is there to use the Kingston because of its aggressive garbage collection, but Apple doesn't implement standards the same way non-Apple people do; they only implement the bits needed to ensure Apple products work. You should be able to go and buy any SSD you want and plonk it in but the reality is very different. I've read many threads here and there about users having issues with non-Apple SSDs and OSX.

been using a kingston v+100 96GB on a 2011 MBP... no trim hacks, it seems to be working fine after a few months, because the aggressive garbage collection is OS-independent (i.e. done within the SSD firmware)

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4010/kingston-ssdnow-v-plus-100-review

This drive uses the T6UG1XBG controller but with updated firmware. The new firmware enables two things: very aggressive OS-independent garbage collection and higher overall performance. The former is very important as this is the same controller used in Apple's new MacBook Air. In fact, the performance of the Kingston V+100 drive mimics that of Apple's new SSDs:

 

[xreyuk]

Yeah, that's what's pointing me towards going to the Kingston, however, compared to the Agility 3 it seems to have very slow speeds on SATA II.

I'm not sure if this link is showing the Agility 3 running at SATA II or SATA III speeds. I've sent a couple of PMs out to see if anyone can clarify.

At the moment the plus points of getting the Kingston is the garbage collection (which will obviously help preserve the performance/life of SSD). However, the Agility 3 with it's apparently better SATA II speeds and the ability to move it into a SATA III system are pointing me at that.

Another quick question whilst we're on them, how does secure erasing help increase performance in the drive?

​

 

[Coup27]

On a hard disk when you delete data it doesn't actually delete it, it just marks the area as free. When you write new data, it overwrites this previous data with the new data.

This presents a problem for SSDs as NAND which has data on it cannot be overwritten. To write new data to NAND, you have to erase the block first. Imagine you have a 100GB SSD and you have wrote 100GB of data. Now everytime you write new data it will take longer because you will have to wait for the NAND to be erased first, before you can write the new data.

This is where TRIM and garbage collection comes in. Very simply put, TRIM tells the SSD which blocks can be erased and when the drive is idle, garbage collection will erase the block so next time you want to write some data the block is already "clean".

Secure erasing will erase every single block on the SSD so there is no data to erase first. This is what people do before setting their new system up with a used SSD. Obviously secure erasing is impractical once you have installed your system to it.

 

[xreyuk]

Ahh okay, thanks for the info.

Still unsure which SSD to go for, looks like I've got some thinking to do!

I'm assuming the fact that the Agility is a SATA III drive, it's read/write speeds at SATA II should be pretty high, similar to that of the Vertex 2E for example.

*EDIT*

After doing some research, the V+100 is around £50 more expensive than the Agility 3.

I'm going to ask Kingston if the V100 has always on garbage collection.

Would you guys still recommend the v100?

 

[Coup27]

Would you guys still recommend the v100?

I think choosing a drive which will work without issue in the MacBook is more of a priority than choosing a drive based on performance/preference and price. The fact it uses the same controller as what Apple use and at least one other user has reported a good experience with it puts it in a good position.

Personally I have only bought Intel or Samsung drives, but as I am a Windows user I have more choice. You will just have to read some reviews (Anandtech did one of the v100) and decide yourself.

 

[springnr]

1.5Gbps this, sata 3 that, sure 6Gbps is going to wow ya while running them thar benchmarks.

Functioning 1.5Gbps beats the heck out of a 6Gbps paperweight.

 

[Coup27]

How was that useful?

 

[xreyuk]

I think choosing a drive which will work without issue in the MacBook is more of a priority than choosing a drive based on performance/preference and price. The fact it uses the same controller as what Apple use and at least one other user has reported a good experience with it puts it in a good position.

Personally I have only bought Intel or Samsung drives, but as I am a Windows user I have more choice. You will just have to read some reviews (Anandtech did one of the v100) and decide yourself.

Cheers for the info, that's a good way of looking at it. The v100 doesn't have the advanced garbage collection however but I'll have a look.

Thanks for all your help.

 

[Coup27]

Kingston have a very confusing line up. Make sure you don't confuse the V100 with the V+100 as they are different drives. See thread for more info.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4010/kingston-ssdnow-v-plus-100-review

 

[xreyuk]

Kingston have a very confusing line up. Make sure you don't confuse the V100 with the V+100 as they are different drives. See thread for more info.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4010/kingston-ssdnow-v-plus-100-review

Yeah I was originally suggested the V+100, as it had the aggressive garbage collection. I think when I looked up the price the first time around, I looked up the V100 instead.

Now I've found the correct price, it's roughly £180 for the 120GB V+100, so that's out of the question, it's too expensive.

However, the V100, is around a similar price as the OCZ Agility 3, but doesn't have the aggressive garbage collection, but I believe they use the same controller, which is known to be compatible.

The V100 actually has better read/write speeds than the V+100, but I don't know how they compare to the Agility 3.

Maybe I'm overthinking it, and should just choose one!

 

[Coup27]

However, the V100, is around a similar price as the OCZ Agility 3, but doesn't have the aggressive garbage collection, but I believe they use the same controller, which is known to be compatible.

Thats obscene money for an old drive. The V100 uses a JMicron controller, and you don't want to get one of those.

 

[xreyuk]

Yeah, the V+100 is about £180, and the Agility 3/V100 are about £125-£135.

Looks like I'm getting the Agility 3 then!