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Which is better for OC P4 1.6 or XP?
- Thread starter Tbirdkid
- Start date
Mavrick007
Diamond Member
You will be able to overclock a P4 to more than an Athlon XP. It's not a guaranteed overclock to get 2.1 or 2.4 or more from the 1.6a but you will have better luck, plus it's easier to do, than with the XP.
The thing to keep in mind is that the XP is faster at stock than the P41.6 and unless you can get the P4 to overclock well, then it is not worth it IMHO. I don't think you will get 2.5 out of the P4 unless you get better cooling than the retail hsf either.
The thing to keep in mind is that the XP is faster at stock than the P41.6 and unless you can get the P4 to overclock well, then it is not worth it IMHO. I don't think you will get 2.5 out of the P4 unless you get better cooling than the retail hsf either.
Overclocking always involves some risk, so 2.4GHz is never guaranteed.
In fact, I would say that most overclockers should be able to get their 1.6A up to 2.1GHz. The probability of reaching 2.4GHz is much smaller.
Athlon XPs don't seem to overclock the huge sorts of jumps that you see with the Northwood Pentium 4s, so I would say go with the Pentium 4.
In fact, I would say that most overclockers should be able to get their 1.6A up to 2.1GHz. The probability of reaching 2.4GHz is much smaller.
Athlon XPs don't seem to overclock the huge sorts of jumps that you see with the Northwood Pentium 4s, so I would say go with the Pentium 4.
Yes indeed, I'm very happy with it!
I was only hoping to get 2.1 because I'm on an Asus P4s533 mobo with the SiS 645DX and typically those mobos tend to have problems reaching higher than 150fsb and I wanted to be conservative. I can post at 2.6 but my HDD don't like it very much.... lack of PCI/AGP lock....
I ran for a day and a half at 2.54 but I had to get the voltage up to 1.7volts to get this thing stable and I don't wan't to up the voltage more than 10% over stock (call me a wuss if you wish but I want this thing to last a bit...)
Btw, I have Samsung PC 2700 (unfortunately, on a 3rd party FSB so it won't do DDR400....)
I was only hoping to get 2.1 because I'm on an Asus P4s533 mobo with the SiS 645DX and typically those mobos tend to have problems reaching higher than 150fsb and I wanted to be conservative. I can post at 2.6 but my HDD don't like it very much.... lack of PCI/AGP lock....
I ran for a day and a half at 2.54 but I had to get the voltage up to 1.7volts to get this thing stable and I don't wan't to up the voltage more than 10% over stock (call me a wuss if you wish but I want this thing to last a bit...)
Btw, I have Samsung PC 2700 (unfortunately, on a 3rd party FSB so it won't do DDR400....)
Rectalfier
Golden Member
Plain and simple, P4 is better for OC. I would say you have an %80 chance at 2.4, and basically %100 for 2.1-2.2. Before you buy, take a look around and see what components people use to overclock high. If you get lucky the retail heatsink/compund will take you up to 2.7Ghz. Try and get a later packing date. Mine was 04/10/02.
CrazySaint
Platinum Member
Originally posted by: Zukatah
The best overclocking combo right now seems to be
P4 1.6a
True Samsung PC2700
Asus P4b533
couple the 1.6a to an Alpha or even watercooling and you're set for some major overclocking action. By the way, my packing date is may 15!
Any other good OC boards? The price on that Asus P4B333 is a bit out of my range (I'd like to keep mobo cost at <= $120 US).
If you want an Intel chipset and a stripped down version of a good board, there's the Asus P4B266-C that runs for pretty cheap. If you have problems with that board, there will be lots of people that will help you because it's a popular choice... If you want to have a good balance of goodies/price, the P4S533 is a great choice. You get C-Media audio (SB Live quality), LAN, Asus brand name and great support too. The P4B266 seems to go a bit higher though, so it's a sacrifice between features and raw speed. Just to let you know, there are some folks that encounter problems with their P4B266 when they overclock: they have problems with their USB so think twice before buying it. I don't know if that problem is corrected witht he P4B533... For the P4S533, the complaints I see are people that are not able to push their CPU as far as with an Intel chipset, because it lacks an AGP/PCI lock. At 40mhzPCI, my HDD start to corrupt data....
I heard, EPoX are good too, but I wanted an Asus for the peace of mind!
I heard, EPoX are good too, but I wanted an Asus for the peace of mind!
littlegohan
Senior member
You get C-Media audio (SB Live quality),
Are you sure about that? What kind of performance hit would u get for using the onboard sound?
TheLizardMan
Senior member
You have to be a total idiot not to get at least 2.4ghz out of a p4 chip. ppl with cheap ass ram and no idea how to work the bios get like 1.8ghz out of the 1.6a.
The only bad is that you will have to disable all onboard devices for the exception of ps/2 in order to get 2.4ghz and above with 100% stability. But if you went with a 1900+ you would have about the same performance "give or take in a few areas" and you wouldn't have to disable anything.
So think of it like this.... can you live with just ps/2? Also for some reason it has been hard getting usb 1.1/2.0 cards to work with the 1.6a, I guess they hate higher then normal bus speeds.
The only bad is that you will have to disable all onboard devices for the exception of ps/2 in order to get 2.4ghz and above with 100% stability. But if you went with a 1900+ you would have about the same performance "give or take in a few areas" and you wouldn't have to disable anything.
So think of it like this.... can you live with just ps/2? Also for some reason it has been hard getting usb 1.1/2.0 cards to work with the 1.6a, I guess they hate higher then normal bus speeds.
imported_zenwhen
Senior member
100% stable here without disabling a damn thing.
Lizardman,
Wrong about a couple of things, or least very general...It depends on the board you get whether or not you may have usb issues or other onboard chip issues....
PPl with asus p4b266-c's would have issues while ppl with p4b266's would not.
I had a sis645 by Asus and I ran my 1.8@2.52ghz with all my usb devices hooked up at startup and they ran...They even ran when I was running at 125fsb with pci clock speed of 42mhz. So I think you are being a little to wide range when you peg that on all p4 1.6 ocs....
Also a xp 1900+ at default well be just about par with a 2.0ghz default p4 northwood. However a 1.6 even at 2.0ghz will take 125fsb do get it making the fsb 500mhz and witha sis board potential for 400+mhz ddr....Then the 1900+ xp comparison stops being correct and a little more leaning to the p4 side....If he gets to 2.4ghz he will have a 600mhz fdb and running 375mhz ddr (4:5) and I think it will take a 2500+ to keep up....And I haven't seen any yet!!! T-bred overclocks may as well be a roll of the dice at the crap tables right now....
Now most new 1.a's are shipping with pack dates (newegg) of later the 4/2002 and they all seem to be great ocers. The reason ppl don't hit 2.4ghz is likely the lack of research in getting a board capable of it or insuffucient ram...I think it is very likely ifhe receives a newer packed 1.6a he will hit 2.4ghz, the questio will be whether he can attain it at default voltage. I bet he hits 2.4ghz with right around 1.65v...gets good pc2700 ddr and uses 4:5 rattio and pulls 375mhz ddr of just over pc3000 speeds....This is being conservative....
I had 2 chips and both were great ocers...I did my research and got the right boards...(pat myself onthe back)
TBIRDKID...go get a better HSF if you want to go above 2.4ghz...other many have gotten 2.4ghz with 1.6's and used retail hsf....
Wrong about a couple of things, or least very general...It depends on the board you get whether or not you may have usb issues or other onboard chip issues....
PPl with asus p4b266-c's would have issues while ppl with p4b266's would not.
I had a sis645 by Asus and I ran my 1.8@2.52ghz with all my usb devices hooked up at startup and they ran...They even ran when I was running at 125fsb with pci clock speed of 42mhz. So I think you are being a little to wide range when you peg that on all p4 1.6 ocs....
Also a xp 1900+ at default well be just about par with a 2.0ghz default p4 northwood. However a 1.6 even at 2.0ghz will take 125fsb do get it making the fsb 500mhz and witha sis board potential for 400+mhz ddr....Then the 1900+ xp comparison stops being correct and a little more leaning to the p4 side....If he gets to 2.4ghz he will have a 600mhz fdb and running 375mhz ddr (4:5) and I think it will take a 2500+ to keep up....And I haven't seen any yet!!! T-bred overclocks may as well be a roll of the dice at the crap tables right now....
Now most new 1.a's are shipping with pack dates (newegg) of later the 4/2002 and they all seem to be great ocers. The reason ppl don't hit 2.4ghz is likely the lack of research in getting a board capable of it or insuffucient ram...I think it is very likely ifhe receives a newer packed 1.6a he will hit 2.4ghz, the questio will be whether he can attain it at default voltage. I bet he hits 2.4ghz with right around 1.65v...gets good pc2700 ddr and uses 4:5 rattio and pulls 375mhz ddr of just over pc3000 speeds....This is being conservative....
I had 2 chips and both were great ocers...I did my research and got the right boards...(pat myself onthe back)
TBIRDKID...go get a better HSF if you want to go above 2.4ghz...other many have gotten 2.4ghz with 1.6's and used retail hsf....
TheLizardMan
Senior member
Yeah thats true Duvie, I had the p4b266-c and I had to disable the devices. I should have got the non c version of the sis board. But it all depends on your hardware, I wish I had the money to keep getting a mobo that worked great for me but i didnt :?
btw on a p4b266-c @2.4ghz with 512mb of samsung original ram i scored higher in some tests, but in other areas i didnt do as well. So the 1900+ will beat the 2,4ghz p4 in some areas, while the 2.4ghz p4 will beat the 1900+ in others. Now can you really tell the diffrence between the two cpus without benchmarks? I'd find it hard hard to do so.
p4 1.6a@2.4ghz is for ppl willing to take a risk
1900+ will get you goo speed with no risk
If i had to do it agian I might go with a p4 1.6z agian, but i would surly get a diffrent mobo.
btw on a p4b266-c @2.4ghz with 512mb of samsung original ram i scored higher in some tests, but in other areas i didnt do as well. So the 1900+ will beat the 2,4ghz p4 in some areas, while the 2.4ghz p4 will beat the 1900+ in others. Now can you really tell the diffrence between the two cpus without benchmarks? I'd find it hard hard to do so.
p4 1.6a@2.4ghz is for ppl willing to take a risk
1900+ will get you goo speed with no risk
If i had to do it agian I might go with a p4 1.6z agian, but i would surly get a diffrent mobo.
Lizardman,
I tell ppl this all the time....There is a big difference if you are into video editing, mpeg2 encoding, and divx encoding like myself....I took off over an hour and 15 minutes in time going from a 1.4tbird@1.5 to a 1.82@2.4 with 333mhz ddr....When I dropped down to 2.25ghz and used 410mhz ddr it was still a drop of about 40 minutes from tbird....This was usinh same program gknot and encoding same movie (2pass, 2 cd-rip)....
Now that above is by far noticeable. You will notice in the speed increase in any mp3 encoding, and 3d rendering time in cadd programs....
Again at default 1900+ xp the p4 2.4 (especially a 1.6 which has a 600mhz fsb at 2.4) will win in majority of all benchmarks. I am just restating what I saw in reviews. This is ofcourse even with the 400mhz p4's and not even the 533fsb chips that the reviewers often ran with pc1066. Those rdram systems will be slightly faster in memory hungry programs like quake3.😉
Find me the review showing an xp 1900+ beating a 2.4 in a good amount of the test....Now if one can get that xp 1900+ up to just over 2100+ levels then we are talking very tight with a p4 2.4, but the edge still goes to the p4. reviews speak for themselves....
I tell ppl this all the time....There is a big difference if you are into video editing, mpeg2 encoding, and divx encoding like myself....I took off over an hour and 15 minutes in time going from a 1.4tbird@1.5 to a 1.82@2.4 with 333mhz ddr....When I dropped down to 2.25ghz and used 410mhz ddr it was still a drop of about 40 minutes from tbird....This was usinh same program gknot and encoding same movie (2pass, 2 cd-rip)....
Now that above is by far noticeable. You will notice in the speed increase in any mp3 encoding, and 3d rendering time in cadd programs....
Again at default 1900+ xp the p4 2.4 (especially a 1.6 which has a 600mhz fsb at 2.4) will win in majority of all benchmarks. I am just restating what I saw in reviews. This is ofcourse even with the 400mhz p4's and not even the 533fsb chips that the reviewers often ran with pc1066. Those rdram systems will be slightly faster in memory hungry programs like quake3.😉
Find me the review showing an xp 1900+ beating a 2.4 in a good amount of the test....Now if one can get that xp 1900+ up to just over 2100+ levels then we are talking very tight with a p4 2.4, but the edge still goes to the p4. reviews speak for themselves....
Also where is the risk????
The p4 has thermal protection....
The p4 can do 400-600 mhz oc on 1.6 and 1.8's with stock retail hsf...
Get a board with locking agp/pci like mine and you can take away the potential in these high fsb's of damaging cards and harddrives....
Most xp of 1900+ and up have no room to oc without boosting vcore. No secret it has reached the edge of the .18 micron process. I have had athlons and they run hot out of the gate even with using a moderate aftermarket cooler. Boost vcore and you need something much more expensive, bigger and ofcourse louder. With no thermal protection heat will destroy this chip.
I think the risk comes when ppl oc over vcore of 1.8v...otherwise it is almost foolproof...
The p4 has thermal protection....
The p4 can do 400-600 mhz oc on 1.6 and 1.8's with stock retail hsf...
Get a board with locking agp/pci like mine and you can take away the potential in these high fsb's of damaging cards and harddrives....
Most xp of 1900+ and up have no room to oc without boosting vcore. No secret it has reached the edge of the .18 micron process. I have had athlons and they run hot out of the gate even with using a moderate aftermarket cooler. Boost vcore and you need something much more expensive, bigger and ofcourse louder. With no thermal protection heat will destroy this chip.
I think the risk comes when ppl oc over vcore of 1.8v...otherwise it is almost foolproof...
CrazySaint
Platinum Member
Here's what I would need in a Intel board:
Fast
Good OC'er (obviously)
Decent onboard sound - C-Media 8738 is fine (I may get a PCI sound card later, but right now budget constraints prevent it)
USB 2.0 is a plus, but I can do without it for now and get a USB 2.0 PCI card later, if I need to
PCI/AGP lock so I won't risk damaging my other components
I don't care about the integrated graphics in the i845g (I'll be pulling my old Radeon 32MB DDR from this machine until I get a new video card)
I'd really like to keep the price at $120 or below, but I might be willing to go higher if that's what it takes to get a decent board.
Obviously, I would love to hit 2.4 or higher (and it looks like buying a chip from newegg makes at least 2.4 a pretty high chance of occurance, but I wouldn't be upset if I got a "bad" chip that could only hit 2.1-2.2). I'll be using the stock HS/F (btw, anybody know the specs on the stock HS/F?) and I'll be pairing the CPU&mobo with a single 256MB stick of Samsung PC2700 from newegg. I chose Samsung because they're pretty cheap for PC2700 and VR-Zone said that they're the fastest PC2700 RAM, if anybody can suggest better RAM for about the same price, I'm open to suggestions.
Should I start a new thread for this?
Fast
Good OC'er (obviously)
Decent onboard sound - C-Media 8738 is fine (I may get a PCI sound card later, but right now budget constraints prevent it)
USB 2.0 is a plus, but I can do without it for now and get a USB 2.0 PCI card later, if I need to
PCI/AGP lock so I won't risk damaging my other components
I don't care about the integrated graphics in the i845g (I'll be pulling my old Radeon 32MB DDR from this machine until I get a new video card)
I'd really like to keep the price at $120 or below, but I might be willing to go higher if that's what it takes to get a decent board.
Obviously, I would love to hit 2.4 or higher (and it looks like buying a chip from newegg makes at least 2.4 a pretty high chance of occurance, but I wouldn't be upset if I got a "bad" chip that could only hit 2.1-2.2). I'll be using the stock HS/F (btw, anybody know the specs on the stock HS/F?) and I'll be pairing the CPU&mobo with a single 256MB stick of Samsung PC2700 from newegg. I chose Samsung because they're pretty cheap for PC2700 and VR-Zone said that they're the fastest PC2700 RAM, if anybody can suggest better RAM for about the same price, I'm open to suggestions.
Should I start a new thread for this?
This debate and conversation is very good. I just bought some PC 3000 ocz ddr off of here earlier. This came with a copper heatspreader and all. And with your board duvie I think I am on the right track right? Can anyone point me in the direction of a good hsf? I obviously know the alpha pal will do the trick without a doubt. I used to be a amd dude but I want to try something new and the 1.6 or 1.7 intel is the way I am going. I also have excellent case cooling with a nice sunon on each end of my case... the front and back. I am also thinking about getting a slot cooler for my video card. But I heard that negative pressure in a case is bad..... should I? It seems like I will be building a tight system with all the parts I am getting. Is there anywhere I can buy a 1.6 and ask for them to look at the stepping on it to tell me which one i want or do most vendors sell them without even looking?
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