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Wheres the Enthusiasm for Windows 10?
- Thread starter Executioner
- Start date
lxskllr
No Lifer
Pretty much. O/Ss aren't offering groundbreaking innovation anymore. They're mature products, With "innovation" consisting of dicking up the interface everyone knows and likes. Add the new overt spyware, and there isn't much reason to upgrade.
Maximilian
Lifer
You said it :thumbsup:
postmortemIA
Diamond Member
People go nuts if their Android phone stops getting upgrades. About half of iPhone owners update to latest OS in a few weeks of time.
Yet most avoid Windows upgrades like plague.
I think that Microsoft dropped the ball with every upgrade for a long time being a mess. And that Windows 8 bad legacy has carried over to Windows 10. So people don't want to risk it.
Yet most avoid Windows upgrades like plague.
I think that Microsoft dropped the ball with every upgrade for a long time being a mess. And that Windows 8 bad legacy has carried over to Windows 10. So people don't want to risk it.
Ham n' Eggs
Member
this isn't good marketing:
vs.
vs.
mikeymikec
Lifer
Continuing on lxskllr said, the two platforms are at radically different milestones of development, as are the typical usage scenarios. Furthermore, I'd say that the percentage of business-critical systems running on a desktop-type OS is considerably higher than on a mobile platform.
Windows has one or two serious issues that need fixing (the first that springs to mind is to fix the hole whereby users can and are typically required to download executables and run them in order to install programs, alternatives were demonstrated and deployed a long time ago and they don't require "stores" - in short, it's time to make it difficult to run downloaded executables), but it basically "just works" for millions of people. If it's not a hardware issue then the vast majority of the time any users are brought on by the user, not the OS. The (non touch) hardware that Windows typically runs on is evolving but not at the 'leaps and bounds' rate that mobile platforms have in say the last decade.
Windows was first released thirty years ago. Android on the other hand was first released in 2008. By Windows standards, Android should be at a level of maturity matching Windows NT 3.x 🙂
I'm confused, what's new in this respect? NTFS file system compression has been around since before I started using NT...
<smirk> Really? I think you're grossly overestimating the general level of concern in Western societies in this respect.
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ShintaiDK
Lifer
http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/
The numbers may change further the following days.
But from the looks of it, Windows 10 only grew 2.77% combined for 32 and 64bit in October. That's very bad considering more people may be willing to go Windows 10 due to DX12.
The numbers may change further the following days.
But from the looks of it, Windows 10 only grew 2.77% combined for 32 and 64bit in October. That's very bad considering more people may be willing to go Windows 10 due to DX12.
mikeymikec
Lifer
On the other hand, I'm surprised that they already have it at ~25%. I would almost be inclined to use the word "impressed", except that how much of that figure was due to them giving it away for free?
---
IMO MS should stop trying to coerce people into upgrading to Win10 and instead concentrate on things like not short-changing Windows users by avoiding making improvements on certain versions depending on which way the wind blows. Is there really a good technical reason why Win8x won't get DX12 capabilities? Was there any technical reason why Win7 didn't even get native USB 3.0 support? How about serving up some DX12 goodness to Win7 users (as well as Win8x but that's beside my point), after all, they are the largest crowd of Windows users by a long shot.
The main thing I don't understand about the development of Windows in recent years is that surely before one starts trumpeting "this is the final version of Windows", that development for it would have settled down to under-the-hood improvements and very slight UI adjustments, as opposed to (wrt the UI) "let's throw out half the kitchen sink with Win8, then bring back some of the sink with Win10 because everyone knows we screwed up big time... you know what, I think it's good for the foreseeable future now". In hindsight I can see why things have gone like that (to be brief, "Microsoft Surface" and touchscreen), but now seems like the least appropriate time to start implying that this is the way that Windows is going to be for the foreseeable future, partly because MS could really do with renewed confidence in their platform, which usually doesn't come for some time after a serious mistake. Hell, even the blatant poor timing that plagued Vista's release isn't ancient history yet as far as most people are concerned. Rules of thumb like "every other version of Windows is OK" and "I'll wait until SP1" aren't ancient history either, even if MS wants to avoid wording like "service pack".
Windows Update in the last 12-24 months hasn't exactly been a smooth ride for everyone either (through my line of work I'd say I've seen WU problems go up by about 500% in that time), yet now Win10 Home users are being forced to accept all updates immediately.
A few years ago I was starting to think that MS was starting to tone down its arrogance (becoming more standards compliant, for example, or not engaging in "embrace, extend, extinguish"), but their recent cock-ups are evidence to the contrary.
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Magic Carpet
Diamond Member
Do we have killer apps in DirectX12? About the only interesting feature in W_X in my humble opinion. Win 8.1 is just as good or even better (depends how you look at the update policy).
Realistically, for the most people "don't fix, what ain't broken", pretty much. If Microsoft is smart enough, they should start breaking basic things for Windows XP/Vista/7/8/8.1 users, making Windows 10 the only viable alternative. They sort of started it with Windows XP... but "gosh some people are still using it", lmao. They will need to try harder.
Look what Apple been doing with their older iOS devices, they introduce new software which is sort of a "must-update" or so they say. Devices become slow and unusable, you cannot downgrade anymore, people run to the store to buy a newer device in order just to check their e-mail or some other basic activity. Works like a charm!
Microsoft has become the victim of its own Windows business model.
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mikeymikec
Lifer
That really wouldn't be smart; if you get caught sabotaging your own products, it doesn't make your users want to trust you, and any incident in future that involves anything not working in Windows stands a much higher chance of being chalked up as 'sabotage' (ie. people defaulting to a stance that involves not trusting your products). Furthermore, your products won't get to be on the list of "no-one ever got fired for buying ..." at any point in the foreseeable future.
ShintaiDK
Lifer
Completely agree. Windows 10 looks like another Windows that just gets its share, but nothing else. Its a huge problem legacy wise.
I dont think we ever get one. For DX12 really to shine, we need a DX12 only game. DX12 got its pros and cons. And while initially giving a bit more. Later on the 7/8 crowd will point fingers and say "we told you so" when the DX11 compatibility must used. Managers sit with all the telemetric from MS, Steam etc. And its very unlikely they want to bet on DX12 only. Specially not with these results. MS also knew this would happen. DX11.3 is the answer.
And its a shame, because a new Windows is so much more than DX12, also for gaming.
Magic Carpet
Diamond Member
But that's exactly how some users perceive Microsoft now after all these scandals and the inclusion of telemetry "for the greater good". You also get the new Microsoft Edge browser that just barely works... but was supposed to be the next big thing. And guess what? You get all of that, for freeeeeeeeeeeeee. People should instantly feel very ecstatic? You are speaking of the trust?
Windows 10 has heavily under-delivered, imo. Why they pushed it so fast, I don't know. Probably scared of Google/Apple. I've asked my friends who upgraded to Windows 10, they were saying: I expected more, or I didn't like blocky user interface, etc. Nobody is super happy (even though they got it for free). But if you give them a super DirectX 12 killer app, they might just forgive you. But none is available at the moment. Why release a new OS with no "current" benefits to the consumer? Is Microsoft trying to mimic the AMD strategy? But why... Has Gates gone maad or something.
Just proves another point, free is not always good. And certainly not good for a business. That is so, anti-Microsoft. Not even funny. Oh I forgot, Gates is no longer at the helm. Times have changed.
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On the local radio talk show "All about computers - DATEL Systems", the explanation is that it was driven by marketing to get WIN 10 out in time for start of school fall semester.
Hi-Fi Man
Senior member
I'm referring to this feature specifically (my bad, compactOS is the name): http://www.anandtech.com/show/9676/windows-10-feature-focus-compactos
The privacy issues are understandable and annoying but ultimately defeatable, just disable some options in pc settings then disable some services and most of it goes away.
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quikah
Diamond Member
Resources are finite. They could backport DX12 to WinNT if they wanted, but why spend the $$ there when they could spend it on the latest OS instead?
Things cascade, you need to add feature X, but it is not compatible with Y, so you change that, but then that breaks Z, etc. Adding new features to legacy code is very expensive.
mikeymikec
Lifer
Maybe it is, neither of us AFAIK have any way to know. As for the reasons why it might be a good idea, I've already been through those.
I personally haven't heard anything about Windows 10 that makes it radically different to Win8x or even Win7 for that matter in terms of what DirectX does, all the driver models have been the same since Vista (except video, but those changes were even backported to Vista to make it easier for developers to maintain and improve drivers).
- edit - My mistake, Win10 has a new display driver model, WDDM 2.0.
My first Win7 build was about 6 months after Win7 was released, the board had USB 3.0 yet there wasn't any native support for it, so I'm really not buying "maybe technical reasons but no specifics" arguments at this point. MS simply couldn't be arsed and were getting on with Win8 development. Also, Win7's chkdsk program includes a blatant memory hogging bug which MS claimed was "a feature, not a bug" then fixed said bug in Win8.
I guess they had the time to backport the telemetry stuff though! Funny that.
IMO Win10 has been pushed only for reasons that suit MS's interests, not its users.
PS - Win10 is WinNT. Perhaps you meant NT 4.0?
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Magic Carpet
Diamond Member
Yeah, it's money.
Magic Carpet
Diamond Member
Pretty sure, nothing is impossible. It just means complex which just means more expensive. Why bother, when we can release Windows 11 and call it a day 😎
Can I get a 10% off my Windows subscription plan for next year? Heh.
ShintaiDK
Lifer
Its impossible in the case that you break everything legacy that needs to be retested and recertified. New drivers and what not.
Its something people easily forget, since they only need to make sure their own home PC works.
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