When will Quadcore Matter for PCGAMING?

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toyota

Lifer
Apr 15, 2001
12,957
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Originally posted by: minmaster
didn't someone say you pretty much need a quad-core to run the new GTA game? there's one then.

well it must be true then if "someone" said so...

yes the new gta game uses the quad core very well but even the most quad core optimized games pretty much even out with dual cores clock for clock at 1920 with max settings.
 
Dec 30, 2004
12,554
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Originally posted by: zerogear
Originally posted by: TidusZ
I played supcom more than most of the people here, so I'm gonna start out by pointing out that quadcore for gaming doesn't make a whole lot of difference at this point. Well, I am wondering, when do you think it actually will? Next summer? 2010? Anyone got any ideas?

I'm about to buy a dualcore E8400, and I haven't seen any good reason at this point why I should pay more for quad. I'm almost looking now to find that evidence.

Honestly SupCom's multithreading is not at all efficient, it is very rudimentary. And even other multithreaded games are not as good as they can be (read: they suck.)

I haven't seen the code so I can't say. But let me be the first to say intelligent pathing is very CPU intensive. It wasn't much a problem with Starcraft because everything was a sprite and could be treated as a moving point for most intents and purposes. When you throw 3d into the equation the algorithms all change as you iterate through 800 possible paths.the unit can travel through, each of which the CPU has to calculate where he can drive and where he can't, to find the most efficient path.
I'm looking forward to improvements made to the Warzone2100 AI/unit pathing (this game is open source now) and there is definitely a need for work in this area (of this game, specifically).
 
Dec 30, 2004
12,554
2
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Originally posted by: toyota
Originally posted by: minmaster
didn't someone say you pretty much need a quad-core to run the new GTA game? there's one then.

well it must be true then if "someone" said so...

yes the new gta game uses the quad core very well but even the most quad core optimized games pretty much even out with dual cores clock for clock at 1920 with max settings.

Ya people have said this, from what I've heard it's because it's possibly the worst console-PC port in the history of gaming; absolutely zero optimization. Just dump the Cell SPE work onto the FPU/ALUs on the cpu and ship! Although I submit UT3 (gosh that game was just a straight console port) and especially Halo PC as contenders. For all the hooplah Gearbox says they put into "specially optimizing for the PC" (I'm convinced they made sure to cover this in the developer vids because they knew they hadn't done any work and it sucked) it ran terrible on my 6800GT. Couldn't even get 1600x1200 on that game without some nasty slowdown. Nevermind that Doom3 and Farcry ran great at that same resolution. :/
 

AdamK47

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
15,169
2,830
126
Originally posted by: Azn

UT3 doesn't use quad cores either. What you are seeing is cache differences between quad and dual core.

The L2 cache on a Penryn Core 2 Quad isn't shared across all 4 cores. C2Q is two Core 2 Duos glued together. 2 cores share 6MB L2 and the other 2 cores share their own 6MB L2.

Edit: UT3 does take advantage of quad core. Hence the increase in performance.
 

ayabe

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2005
7,449
0
0
It all depends on what you are going to be doing with your machine. Right now, I don't feel that you're paying through the nose for a Quad, you can get a 6600 or 9550 pretty cheap nowadays, so what if it's only marginally faster than a dual, you aren't getting fleeced and if and when more games do start taking advantage, then you will be set. I know people have been saying this for a few years now and it's getting to be a tired argument, but it's up the user, you aren't making a "bad" choice either way.

For someone like me, who upgrades pretty infrequently, there's no reason not to go quad, in fact there's no reason not to go i7, which is what I did. I am all over Empire when it comes out and built this machine more or less for that game. I just don't think my Opteron 165/8800GT is up to the task at 1920.

Now if it turns out that Empire doesn't care whatsoever about my two extra cores or extra bandwidth, am I going to be disappointed? Not in the least, I'll find a use for the extra cycles, no doubt about it. I'm going to be running this machine for 3-4 years with some GPU upgrades in between, so it's completely worth it to me.
 

chizow

Diamond Member
Jun 26, 2001
9,537
2
0
Originally posted by: toyota
Originally posted by: minmaster
didn't someone say you pretty much need a quad-core to run the new GTA game? there's one then.

well it must be true then if "someone" said so...

yes the new gta game uses the quad core very well but even the most quad core optimized games pretty much even out with dual cores clock for clock at 1920 with max settings.

Linked this earlier but that someone is PCGH:

Various CPUs with a GTX 280 at 1280x1024

Various GPUs with a QX6850 @ 3.33GHz at 1280 and 1680

So what can you derive from this? Your GTA4 experience will be better with a fast Quad + 3870 vs a slower CPU with a GTX 280.
 

toyota

Lifer
Apr 15, 2001
12,957
1
0
Originally posted by: chizow
Originally posted by: toyota
Originally posted by: minmaster
didn't someone say you pretty much need a quad-core to run the new GTA game? there's one then.

well it must be true then if "someone" said so...

yes the new gta game uses the quad core very well but even the most quad core optimized games pretty much even out with dual cores clock for clock at 1920 with max settings.

Linked this earlier but that someone is PCGH:

Various CPUs with a GTX 280 at 1280x1024

Various GPUs with a QX6850 @ 3.33GHz at 1280 and 1680

So what can you derive from this? Your GTA4 experience will be better with a fast Quad + 3870 vs a slower CPU with a GTX 280.
there is no cpu comparison at 1680 much less at 1920 so my comments still stands.

 

chizow

Diamond Member
Jun 26, 2001
9,537
2
0
Originally posted by: toyota
there is no cpu comparison at 1680 much less at 1920 so my comments still stands.
No it doesn't. If your FPS at 1280 is 20, its not going to be any higher at 1680 or 1920, its only going to go down. So yes you may at some point reach a point of intersection as you become more GPU limited but with a given CPU you will never exceed the FPS you see at 1280.
 

AzN

Banned
Nov 26, 2001
4,112
2
0
Originally posted by: toyota
Originally posted by: chizow
Originally posted by: toyota
Originally posted by: minmaster
didn't someone say you pretty much need a quad-core to run the new GTA game? there's one then.

well it must be true then if "someone" said so...

yes the new gta game uses the quad core very well but even the most quad core optimized games pretty much even out with dual cores clock for clock at 1920 with max settings.

Linked this earlier but that someone is PCGH:

Various CPUs with a GTX 280 at 1280x1024

Various GPUs with a QX6850 @ 3.33GHz at 1280 and 1680

So what can you derive from this? Your GTA4 experience will be better with a fast Quad + 3870 vs a slower CPU with a GTX 280.
there is no cpu comparison at 1680 much less at 1920 so my comments still stands.

The benchmark show a 280gtx isn't much faster than 9800gt for this game even @ 1680x1050.

Why would you need a CPU comparison at 1680 to tell GTA4 is dictated by CPU performance?

Quoted from PCGH

As GPU power is concerned, we can give an all-clear. Even at 2,560 x 1,600 (but also at 800 x 600) a Geforce 9800 GT is only slightly slower than a GTX 280 - GTA 4 primarily requires CPU power, reducing the resolution doesn't result in much more fps. On two test systems we were able to get a Radeon HD 4870 running. The benchmark revealed that this card also delivered similar results.

 

toyota

Lifer
Apr 15, 2001
12,957
1
0
Originally posted by: Azn
Originally posted by: toyota
Originally posted by: chizow
Originally posted by: toyota
Originally posted by: minmaster
didn't someone say you pretty much need a quad-core to run the new GTA game? there's one then.

well it must be true then if "someone" said so...

yes the new gta game uses the quad core very well but even the most quad core optimized games pretty much even out with dual cores clock for clock at 1920 with max settings.

Linked this earlier but that someone is PCGH:

Various CPUs with a GTX 280 at 1280x1024

Various GPUs with a QX6850 @ 3.33GHz at 1280 and 1680

So what can you derive from this? Your GTA4 experience will be better with a fast Quad + 3870 vs a slower CPU with a GTX 280.
there is no cpu comparison at 1680 much less at 1920 so my comments still stands.

The benchmark show a 280gtx isn't much faster than 9800gt for this game even @ 1680x1050.

Why would you need a CPU comparison at 1680 to tell GTA4 is dictated by CPU performance?

Quoted from PCGH

As GPU power is concerned, we can give an all-clear. Even at 2,560 x 1,600 (but also at 800 x 600) a Geforce 9800 GT is only slightly slower than a GTX 280 - GTA 4 primarily requires CPU power, reducing the resolution doesn't result in much more fps. On two test systems we were able to get a Radeon HD 4870 running. The benchmark revealed that this card also delivered similar results.

you know I am an advocate for having a very good cpu but Im just saying the higher the settings and resolutions the less quad cores matter. if building a new system a quad core is probably the way to go but a higher clocked dual core will net you about the same results in most games at the settings most gamers use. obviously GTA 4 is one of the few games showing that the quad core is the way to go.
 

AzN

Banned
Nov 26, 2001
4,112
2
0
Not GTA4.

Reality is that quad core doesn't matter much other than 1 or 2 games. It should be interesting in the next year or two however.
 

mrblotto

Golden Member
Jul 7, 2007
1,647
117
106
I had no idea that some consoles were multi-cored. Then again, the last console I had was the Sega Genesis....lmao.
 

zerocool84

Lifer
Nov 11, 2004
36,041
472
126
Originally posted by: mrblotto
I had no idea that some consoles were multi-cored. Then again, the last console I had was the Sega Genesis....lmao.

Yep the tree-sidee and ps-tree are multicore.
 

Tempered81

Diamond Member
Jan 29, 2007
6,374
1
81
Originally posted by: zerocool84
Originally posted by: mrblotto
I had no idea that some consoles were multi-cored. Then again, the last console I had was the Sega Genesis....lmao.

Yep the tree-sidee and ps-tree are multicore.

X-Bizzie & PS-Triple?
 

Cuular

Senior member
Aug 2, 2001
804
18
81
So to throw a wrench is this whole discussion, check out CPU scaling with 4870X2 at Legion hardware Legion Hardwares CPU Scaling with 4870X2

basically while the game themselves may not be scaled for multi-core, the 2 GPU's in the X2 gained significant performance from the extra CPU's. So if you run Crossfire or CrossfireX or X2 from AMD/ATi the quad core will allow you to harness way more of the GPU's power.

Halfway back on topic, the games themselves may not require or fully use Quad cores now, but the multi-GPU solutions definitely use them, and so since I run a 4870X2, it was worth it to me to get the 9550.