When do you think we'll see transparent aluminum products at the consumer level?

[JEDI]

Star Trek is reality:

waiting for Transparent soda cans

 

[Greenman]

Looks like plastic to me.

 

[MrPickins]

It's not really aluminum, though. It's a ceramic that is something like 30% Al.

 

[Charmonium]

Star Trek is reality:
waiting for Transparent soda cans

They'll never do that. Then you'd be able to see all of the rat parts in your soda.

 

[lxskllr]

It's not really aluminum, though. It's a ceramic that is something like 30% Al.

So it's a cut rate lead crystal?

 

[zerocool84]

Depends what you consider consumer level. On cars, that type of stuff would only be on super cars that none of us regular people could afford.

 

[destrekor]

It's not really aluminum, though. It's a ceramic that is something like 30% Al.

Depends which type it is: is it ALON, or heat-pressed spinel? Spinel, or MgAl2O4, is about 37% Al by mass.

But ALON (or AlON when not using the trademarked variant), Aluminum Oxynitride... well I can't find the specs.

Both are ultimately taking advantage of a similar method, creating a ceramic composed of a spinel crystal formation. I believe the heat-pressed variety is taking straight MgAl2O4 as a powder and heat-pressing it... but AlON is more of a generic description that can describe a few different molecular compositions.

 

[twinrider1]

Depends what you consider consumer level. On cars, that type of stuff would only be on super cars that none of us regular people could afford.

Maybe in very limited amounts, such as the A pillar.

 

[CZroe]

Pics in the OP are wishful thinking. Aluminum isn't being used to eliminate seams in other car body panels so why would transparent aluminum that replaces the windshield be used for that? It's a bad thing anyway. Most people think individually replaceable parts make more sense. Those people are right. Also, you can't smash the window to get out if the aluminum bends.

The reasons we don't use plastic to make that same concept car today are the same reasons we wouldn't use aluminum even if it were transparent (it scratches, it bends/isn't rigid, it doesn't shatter where you might need it to, etc). They aren't thinking this through.

 

[Greenman]

Depends which type it is: is it ALON, or heat-pressed spinel? Spinel, or MgAl2O4, is about 37% Al by mass.

But ALON (or AlON when not using the trademarked variant), Aluminum Oxynitride... well I can't find the specs.

Both are ultimately taking advantage of a similar method, creating a ceramic composed of a spinel crystal formation. I believe the heat-pressed variety is taking straight MgAl2O4 as a powder and heat-pressing it... but AlON is more of a generic description that can describe a few different molecular compositions.

Isn't "heat pressed" sintering?

 

[MrPickins]

Depends which type it is: is it ALON, or heat-pressed spinel? Spinel, or MgAl2O4, is about 37% Al by mass.

But ALON (or AlON when not using the trademarked variant), Aluminum Oxynitride... well I can't find the specs.

Both are ultimately taking advantage of a similar method, creating a ceramic composed of a spinel crystal formation. I believe the heat-pressed variety is taking straight MgAl2O4 as a powder and heat-pressing it... but AlON is more of a generic description that can describe a few different molecular compositions.

That's what I was getting at, though. You can't call this aluminum any more than you can call a ruby or a sapphire aluminum.

Pics in the OP are wishful thinking. Aluminum isn't being used to eliminate seams in other car body panels so why would transparent aluminum that replaces the windshield be used for that? It's a bad thing anyway. Most people think individually replaceable parts make more sense. Those people are right. Also, you can't smash the window to get out if the aluminum bends.

The reasons we don't use plastic to make that same concept car today are the same reasons we wouldn't use aluminum even if it were transparent (it scratches, it bends/isn't rigid, it doesn't shatter where you might need it to, etc). They aren't thinking this through.

It's not aluminum and it doesn't have the properties of aluminum.

 

[sandorski]

Any day now. It was estimated to take 20 years to understand the matrix(IIRC), but computers have improved a lot since then and there are always complications along the way that muck about with estimates. At any rate, there have been plenty of delays already.

 

[CZroe]

That's what I was getting at, though. You can't call this aluminum any more than you can call a ruby or a sapphire aluminum.



It's not aluminum and it doesn't have the properties of aluminum.

...and if it had the properties of glass or plastic we'd be using those. The fantasy is in what properties of aluminum we can retain in a transparent form.

The OP did not say what kind of transparent aluminum the pictures were depicting... a fantasy one or the one you are talking about. There is no link so I don't know why you're so sure he isn't talking about Star Trek transparent aluminum.

 

[destrekor]

Isn't "heat pressed" sintering?

Yes - I forgot that word and just rolled with it.

 

[destrekor]

...and if it had the properties of glass or plastic we'd be using those. The fantasy is in what properties of aluminum we can retain in a transparent form.

The OP did not say what kind of transparent aluminum the pictures were depicting... a fantasy one or the one you are talking about. There is no link so I don't know why you're so sure he isn't talking about Star Trek transparent aluminum.

I imagine all of that COULD be done... but would it be practical? For the car? Nope to the nope.

But for the kayak? Hell yes please. That would be awesome.

 

[MrPickins]

...and if it had the properties of glass or plastic we'd be using those. The fantasy is in what properties of aluminum we can retain in a transparent form.

The OP did not say what kind of transparent aluminum the pictures were depicting... a fantasy one or the one you are talking about. There is no link so I don't know why you're so sure he isn't talking about Star Trek transparent aluminum.

Really I'm just venting because all the headlines I see in articles about Aluminium oxynitride describe this as a transparent form of aluminum, and people take it at face value.

 

[CZroe]

I imagine all of that COULD be done... but would it be practical? For the car? Nope to the nope.



But for the kayak? Hell yes please. That would be awesome.

Why can't you do that with plastic? Is there any reason to think that aluminum would be better or more scratch-resistant or more able to flex?

What I'm saying is that there is no sense in imagining things that are already perfectly possible with other materials that do not require any special properties of transparent aluminum.

 

[destrekor]

Why can't you do that with plastic? Is there any reason to think that aluminum would be better or more scratch-resistant or more able to flex?

What I'm saying is that there is no sense in imagining things that are already perfectly possible with other materials that do not require any special properties of transparent aluminum.

Because.

 

[Rakehellion]

You mean sapphire? Apple tried to do that with the last iPhone but their partner wasn't able to keep up with demand.

 

[khon]

Sapphire glass has been used in consumer products for years, and that's transparent aluminum by your definition.

 

[DigDog]

It's not really aluminum, though. It's a ceramic that is something like 30% Al.

that's still pretty darn impressive.

 

[Midwayman]

Not until the whales go extinct.

 

[MrPickins]

that's still pretty darn impressive.

I don't disagree with you.

 

[werepossum]

I imagine all of that COULD be done... but would it be practical? For the car? Nope to the nope.

But for the kayak? Hell yes please. That would be awesome.

Given that aluminum oxynitride is more dense than water it would only be awesome once, until submerged. Then it would be drifting along the bottom and damned hard to find.

 

[CZroe]

Given that aluminum oxynitride is more dense than water it would only be awesome once, until submerged. Then it would be drifting along the bottom and damned hard to find.

Metal ships float when most any shipbuilding metal is more dense than water. The entire volume of the submerged portion must be less dense, which is easy in a boat-shaped design that displaces most of that volume with air. You can make a glass boat too!