When did giving TIP become a requirement?

[Hossenfeffer]

<< The tiny tip is MEANT to send a message. It says - this is what your service is worth. >>

No, it says: "My impression of your service was not a good one and I'm going to be an ass and leave a penny."



<< If it pisses them off, then good. I tell the manager that the service was poor so there's at least a chance of follow-up. >>

Tell the manager if anything. There are so many things that you may not be aware of in the situation, including the days where you are being as ass. I've seen people go to a restaurant, have a waitress bending over backward for them and then leave a penny tip. That's just a damn slap in the face and yes, it makes you look like an ass. Like I said, it doesn't give the desired results you're looking for.



<< I was on the road 100% and still eat out very often. I leave 15% for normal service, more for excelent service. Maybe once a year at most do I have service so terrible that it needs a poor tip. >>

You sound very generous by all accounts. I'm sure the servers (except the slack-jawed morons) thank you and people like you.

 

[Jzero]

<< On many accounts, it's a misunderstood system by both sides, consumers as well as the servers. There's been no "rulebook" written that levels the playing field.

jzero, I gotta say that I can understand most all of what you're trying to say and it's a bit short-sighted.

Since servers are expected (and taxed) on tips, regardless of whether they get them or not, the risk of getting no tip increases with a larger party. >>


I don't really see why that would be...


<< On the contrary, he/she gets the satisfaction of a job well done, the possibility for advancement, a raise, a higher tip. There's plenty in it for a server who goes above and beyond. >>


Are we on the same page? When I said compulsory tip, I was referring strictly to "Parties of 6 or more will be charged an 18% gratuity..." type policies. I'ver never seen anyone I know add anything if there's a forced gratuity. You're going to force them to tip, you're getting what you forced and not a penny more.
Bearing that in mind, the server is getting that 15-18% and since he/she knows she's probably not going to get an extra $20 for going out of the way...they're just not going to bother.



<< You'd be surprised how many large groups just disperse without leaving a tip. >>


Pooh on them! Sucks to punish both the consumer and the server because people are incosiderate but I guess you do what you have to do.


<< With a group of 10, you're almost always using 2 or more tables where they could be serving other parties. They want a guarantee that they didn't serve you in these places. >>


Well...if the large party could be reasonably assumed to tip properly as a small party, it should make no difference. If you're waiting 4 tables and each rings up $40 and leaves $8 tip ($32 total) it should be roughly the same as one party of 16 taking up all 4 tables, ringing up a bill of $160 and leaving a $32 tip.


<< You "could" get off your butt and find someone to take your money. Heh. >>


I dunno if you're kidding or not but if you aren't, then you're full of it.
If I wanted to do my own legwork I wouldn't have bothered going out....it's one thing to get backed up or bring the wrong thing or almost anything in my book...but disappearing for 45 min after he already brought the check and walked right by me with my CC and the bill sitting right at the edge of the table...that's flat out shirk. I'd get fired if I ignored a client. He's lucky that's all he got!


<< Maybe he was hit by a Frito Lay truck and nobody had discovered the body. How dare you not go find that body! >>


Hah! A) It was Friday's...they don't do Frito Lay, do they? B)What was he doing outside when he was supposed to be inside helping the guests? Case closed

 

[golfreak]

You have to include the gratuities on large parties.
The reason is it takes a lot longer to turn a large party....close to 2 hrs as oppose to around 1 hr.
If you were to work a couple of large parties and get nothing out of it, you're screwed for the night.

I work for Disney and we get alot of foreign big parties....if we didn't inlcude gradtuities on those parties....chances are we would get nothing.
And yes, we get around $2.50 at Disney.

For anyone who doesn't agree with the tipping system....all I have to say is there is plenty of places to eat where you don't have to tip.
Fast foods, take-outs......if you want other people to wait on their hands and knees to insure that you have a pleasant dinner....TIP them.
Its that simple.

If you're jealous of how much servers make, become one....its an exhausting job.
Do you even know what its like to put on a happy face everyday to insure that you make some money even though you might be having a bad day.
This is an equivalent of kissing @ss everyday.....the serving profession is not that great.

And lets say I make $150 a day...by the time I'm done sharing it with the busser and bartenter, I walk out with $100.

God, I hate people who whine about tipping or servers making too much money.
Like I said, theres plenty of places to eat where tipping is not require.

 

[DannyLove]

Mwilding: WRONG! your script is f*cked. its Mr. PINK who doesnt want to tip not Mr. White.

danny~!

 

[Lithium381]

<< tightwad doesn't even begin to describe it.

Your bill is for your food. Period.

You want it served to you too? Then damnit, pay the person who does.

RD is funny, but it is also wrong - waiters/waitresses do not make minimum wage - their empoyers are required to "ensure" that their wages + their tips = an ave. hourly take home above the minimum wage. Guess what: it often doesn't and the restaurants don't have to do anything about it.

You don't like the way the system works? Don't sit and eat in restaurants. If you don't like the rules of the game, don't play. >>



Yeah, thats why you pay more for better service, the more they get the happier they are to do a good job

 

[Sugadaddy]

<< In my sociology class the teacher asked everyone "why do you bus your tray after eating at mcdonalds if you aren't being paid to do so?" He says the society makes us think that it's something normal to do.

Then I was thinking, everytime we walk in a restaurant, even if they have bad service, I feel guilty not to leave a (tax * 2) tip. There's always a line that says TIP on your check and.. some restaurants just charge you tip without asking. I mean waiters get paid for doing their job. I would tip them if I felt good about their service. Since when did giving a tip become a social norm? Anyone feeling this way? >>




It's something normal to do because I know I'd hate it to try to find a table and they were all full of garbage...


And waiters are usually paid very cheap because tip is supposed to complete their salary. It also makes them do a better job since they know they'll get more tip in the end... If they were paid a high salary, but without tip, they wouldn't be as motivated. And I don't feel guilty not to leave any tip if service is horrible. (I rarely do that, but I sometimes leave less if service wasn't too good)


What drives me nuts is tips in bars, not when a waitress comes to your table, but when you go get it at the bar yourself... They expect 4$ for filling up a damn pitcher, screw them!

 

[Jzero]

<< You have to include the gratuities on large parties.
The reason is it takes a lot longer to turn a large party....close to 2 hrs as oppose to around 1 hr. >>


Anyone in a large party should be courteous enough to tip extra if they stay any longer than it takes to finish eating...I guess I was raised with some exceptional sense of courtesy, but I can't wholeheartedly believe that.
Anyway, if I'm in a group of 8 and we sit around for 45 chatting after we finish eating and the restaurant tags on their 18% gratuity, they just screwed you the server out of the extra money I would have thrown down for monopolizing half your station for an hour. You can thank the management for being stupid. The system is clearly flawed. I'd rather see prices go up 18%.
How'bout the other night when we went to a crap diner in PA with 6 people and got hit an 18% dick for sh!t service? Yah right....at midnite we were monopolozing the girl's station? She's lucky she had someone to serve at all. We would have left a better tip, but they stiffed us for 18% so we told the manager the service sucked and they were idiots for tacking on 18%. She was just like "oh well."
I'm glad both sides are willing to work to a good conclusion.
Those foreigners don't tip b/c they do it right where they come from and the restaurant pays their service staff.
As someone already said, a tip was originally given BEFORE service. We've screwed up along the way.



<< If you're jealous of how much servers make, become one....its an exhausting job.
Do you even know what its like to put on a happy face everyday to insure that you make some money even though you might be having a bad day.
This is an equivalent of kissing @ss everyday.....the serving profession is not that great. >>



Being a server is an exhausting job, but you got to get over yourself. Just about every job is exhausting in some way or another. I feel for you about the tipping, but "kissing @ss everyday..." Oh dear, cry me a river. If you ever had a job where you were not the head honcho and you still didn't have to kiss @ss every day, you made a huge mistake in leaving that job. Kissing butt is just the way the business world works. I'm a sys admin in a cushy office, and I have to kiss client butt day in and day out. That doesn't make anyone special, sorry.

 

[Jhill]

I work in a hotel with a bar and a restaurant. Some of the servers and bartenders I've seen at work make me sick. If they add on an automatic large party GRAT of 18% the servers throw a fit if their not double tipped on top of the 18%. If a bartender hands someone a bottle of beer and doesnt get tipped he calls them cheap bast&#ds. If servers totally neglect a table then gets stiffed they throw a fit and calls them cheap.

The reason some service is bad these days is because some servers know that even if they give bad service that a lot of people will still tip anyway. Some servers feel it should be automatic. Thats why I don't tip if the service is bad. Don't get me wrong if the service is good I have no problem leaving a generous tip. I feel if more people stiffed servers when they got bad service that service would be better.

I don't want to offend anyone I'm sure that there are many great servers as well as not so great ones.

 

[Kenji4861]

Wow! This has become a big thread.

 

[golfreak]

Like I said man, if you like the include gratuities for large parties, bring your party to McDonalds next time.
And if you think serving is so great, become one.

I must admit that serving is a great job for me while I'm going through school but doing it as a proffession is another story.
I see too many people get caught in making "easy" money while going through school and they tend to put school off and it becomes too late.

I see these 40, 50 yr old servers that come to work all lag out to h3ll.
They wish they can turn back the clock and finish school instead of settling.

At least I speak from experience.
Most of you people in here whinning and bitching about tips probably haven't worked as a server before.

 

[KK]

I think it's safe to say that most people will leave 10-15 percent based on decent service. sure you will get a few that are cheap, and I'm sure you'll get some that pay more. To the waiters here that say you should give atleast 10-15 on every level of service, you need to wake up. Get another job and quit your whining. You knew what basically goes on when you took the job. As far as bad service goes, I'll usually frequent the place twice to give the place a chance to redeem itself before I boycott it. I take in account how many customers per how many waiters. If it's not that high of customer to waiter ratio then I would expect decent service. If it sucks, I'll leave less than 5%. Why should I pay for something I'm not getting. If you want to make money, do atleast what's expected. If you suck at your job, don't expect to get paid. Don't like this philosophy, get a job that pays miminum wage at McDonalds, nobodys forcing you to work for less.

KK

 

[FreeAgent]

Here is a TIP: Get a haircut and take a bath!

 

[Bluga]

i tip 10-20%, that's it.

 

[Jzero]

<< Like I said man, if you like the include gratuities for large parties, bring your party to McDonalds next time. >>


No, I'll just bring my party to a restaurant that has enough class to trust that its patrons will tip regardless of the size of the party, which evidently is not the one you work for.


<< And if you think serving is so great, become one. >>

I WAS one, tough guy. It's no worse than most any other job, and a heck of a lot better than a lot of jobs. Sorry to burst your bubble.


<< Most of you people in here whinning and bitching about tips probably haven't worked as a server before. >>

See above. In fact see ALL my posts--I believe in tipping and tipping well. I've only once in my life left a scum tip. My only complaint is that large-party tips short the server and screw the customer.

 

[Michael]

Hossenfeffer - I have no control over people who leave a penny tip when the service was good. In the unusual case where service is poor, I leave a very low tip (I usually leave a dime). It is my right to pay for what the service is worth and I know the difference between poor service by the wait staff and kitchen problems or staffing problems. You have given me no reason to change the way I express my displeasure with poor service to the wait staff giving that service. If they don't like getting a very low tip then they should improve their service. I don't care if they're having a bad day and usually are good and I'm happy to hear they get pissed at the low tip. I pay for the service I receive. If it is worth a dime they get paid a dime.

Since I spend thousands on meals outside my home every year (my wife and I still try and eat out a decent place once a week and I still travel on business), and since I've been doing that for over a decade, I think I'm a decent judge of when and how much to tip. Please note that I travel internationally and even know the differences in the countries I visit. If I go to a new country, I find out before I leave.

Michael

 

[DietDrThunder]

What is also rediculous is that tipping is now moving into the fast food sector. This is what I read in the newspaper: While at a Sonic Drive In, if you order your food and take it with you, you are not required to leave a tip. If however, you order your food and eat it in your car while at the Sonic, you are supposed to leave a 10% tip. I'm sorry but I refuse to leave a tip at a fast food restaurant. I also refuse to leave a tip at the to-go counters in restaurants.

 

[Schadenfreude]

Y'all are cheap ass bastards, y'know that? I worked as a waiter, and what people say is true - on my paycheck, I used to make an average of about ~ $2.15 an hour - we make most of our money on the tip, and we always try our goddamn hardest - now you tell me, what the f*ck am I supposed to do when there's 7 tables I have to wait for, which is usually in the range of 28 people, and the food is ready/customers want a refill/other customers want to order, all at the same time?

I'd say if you don't want to pay tip, go eat fast food for the rest of you life.

 

[isasir]

On average, if the service is good, and it's a large party, we'll double the tax, ($8.25*2) then round up to a number easily divideable by the # of ppl. in the party. On quite a number of occasions, this has resulted in the waiter coming back and pretty much thanking us for leaving that tip. However, at the same time, I will admit that I am not fond of my friends who will tip "more" than what should've been deserved. The last occasion of this, I think our tip bordered on 30%. The service was nothing extraordinary, and our order was simplistic. (1-2 drinks/person, 1 meal/person, no complaints/odd requests) I also have started to not feel obligated to tip if a bartender literally just hands me a beer, and that's my order. There's just something not right about him/her making a quick buck for doing that, when a waitress who really did more work, albeit lousy work, may make about the same in some cases.

 

[Blundar]

Date a waitress, waiter or bartender - anyone who lives off tips - and you will start tipping. Trust me.

 

[WaTaGuMp]

The one bad thing about tipping is this. How do the servers or any other service know your a good tipper when you tip AFTER you have gotten your service? A good tip can get you better service but the person getting the tip wont know your a good tipper till after the fact, which to me puts all the demand on the person serving you. So to those in the service area please give great service to all you serve cause you never know who will be a big tipper and who wont.

 

[badluck]

I subscribe to the belief that if the waiter/waitress sucks, they get squat. A few years ago I never tipped, but only do so now because I frequent the same restaurants and KNOW they will spit in your food if you do not tip and are a repeat customer. Hmmm. tasty...

For the most part, I could care less what kind of money they make. That is their problem, not mine. They are doing a job that takes very little skill. In this world, you get pay based on your skill. In my opinon, these workers don't deserve more than $5-$6 a hour for the work they do. It's just like my job, if I am not happy with the pay, I can quit. I hate hearing excuses that they are college kids and what not. The bottom line is, if they don't like the job, quit. All I hear is excuses from people who work in the restaurant business. Someone said that your $6 for the food pays for the food alone. Bulls**t. It pays for everything involved with making a restaurant "run". Yes, that even means paying the $2.30 or whatever the waiter/waitress gets.

Their job is exhaustive? Haha. More excuses. Try working out in the summer heat in construction. Not only is it exhaustive, but it's dirty.....Any job can be exhaustive. Mentally or physically......

Obviously the problem starts with the employer. They know they can get away without paying much so they are guaranteed their profit. At many restaurants, turnover is so bad that if someone quits after a week, the owner doesn't even flinch. So to the people who have a problem with people not tipping, call the restaurant owner a cheap bastard. I'm simply paying for the price of the food on the menu..

 

[Jzero]

<< The one bad thing about tipping is this. How do the servers or any other service know your a good tipper when you tip AFTER you have gotten your service? A good tip can get you better service but the person getting the tip wont know your a good tipper till after the fact, which to me puts all the demand on the person serving you. So to those in the service area please give great service to all you serve cause you never know who will be a big tipper and who wont. >>


True, OTOH, there's no law outside of social more which prevents you from slipping a server a little cash in-advance to get the ball rolling. For instance at clubs with open bar going on, I've found that if you really want to get great service, chat with one of the bar tenders and offer him a bit of cash in advance to keep your glass filled. Sometimes I even tell the guy I'll give him some extra before I leave if I'm really happy. That way he knows he's not wasting his time serving me b/c I already gave him some money, and he'll even consider going an extra mile to earn another tip on top of that.
There's not really any reason why one couldn't do the same in a restaurant....
Like if you go in with 4 people and are figuring the bill to be $50, you could give the server $8 which is a little over 15% right off and tell the server if you're satisfied you'll give them even more at the end of the deal.
So now the server knows they aren't going to get screwed out of a tip and they aren't losing money working with you, but they still have an incentive to provide good service....
Of course, that's how tipping got started anyway, as we've discussed.

 

[GasX]

<< I subscribe to the belief that if the waiter/waitress sucks, they get squat. A few years ago I never tipped, but only do so now because I frequent the same restaurants and KNOW they will spit in your food if you do not tip and are a repeat customer. Hmmm. tasty...

For the most part, I could care less what kind of money they make. That is their problem, not mine. They are doing a job that takes very little skill. In this world, you get pay based on your skill. In my opinon, these workers don't deserve more than $5-$6 a hour for the work they do. It's just like my job, if I am not happy with the pay, I can quit. I hate hearing excuses that they are college kids and what not. The bottom line is, if they don't like the job, quit. All I hear is excuses from people who work in the restaurant business. Someone said that your $6 for the food pays for the food alone. Bulls**t. It pays for everything involved with making a restaurant "run". Yes, that even means paying the $2.30 or whatever the waiter/waitress gets.

Their job is exhaustive? Haha. More excuses. Try working out in the summer heat in construction. Not only is it exhaustive, but it's dirty.....Any job can be exhaustive. Mentally or physically......

Obviously the problem starts with the employer. They know they can get away without paying much so they are guaranteed their profit. At many restaurants, turnover is so bad that if someone quits after a week, the owner doesn't even flinch. So to the people who have a problem with people not tipping, call the restaurant owner a cheap bastard. I'm simply paying for the price of the food on the menu.. >>

If you have any balls, you will be honest with your server and tell him you don't plan on tipping. I'll bet anything you are too much of a pussy to do so.

cheap bastard...

 

[starwarsdad]

They are doing a job that takes very little skill. In this world, you get pay based on your skill. In my opinon, these workers don't deserve more than $5-$6 a hour for the work they do.

Do the job for 2 nights and tell me how little skill it requires! Who the hell are you to determine what someone else's time is worth?

As for the other cheap f*cks here, go to McDonalds. I will not waste the time trying to type an explanation of what it takes to perform the job in question. Suffice it to say, very few people can do it well. Several factors outside fo your control work against you, and there are those that feel the only "acceptable" level of service is someone that blows them in the parking lot during the meal.

 

[badluck]

<< If you have any balls, you will be honest with your server and tell him you don't plan on tipping. I'll bet anything you are too much of a pussy to do so. >>




Heh. You are pretty funny. Why would I tell the server that I don't plan on tipping? Do you tell your server that you intend on leaving them a tip when you sit down to eat? I should be honest with them? haha Give me a break....

And you want to call me a cheap bastard? Ooooh....my feelings are so hurt. LOL


Who am I to determine how much skill is involved? I did work in the restaurant biz when I was a teenager, so I do have some idea, lame ass. Man, if you think there takes a lot of skill to be a waiter/waitress, I suggest you go to college and get a real job.....