Whats your guys take on this thread?

[Nemesis 1]

I was reading the forums and this caught my eye.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/f...howthread.php?t=186366

Ya the guy is a little forward. But he speaks the trueth.Looks like someone called in the army to help out @XS water cooling. Who was the first to water cool a cpu?

These water blocks everyone and their bothers are making does 2c really matter at all ?
Between differant efficient brands.

Why is marketing water products at XSF so spam like. Who are these water cooling gods? I good plumber is their =. I agree with what the qoute was in that thread . The OP is just beside himself. is he a good water clocker you bet. Is he great ? No way.

If people would take the time to google. you will find that all the designs for water blocks / hydralic . Were done ages ago befor the PC.

I agree with that quote. Why because you have marketers entering threads giving advice a good thing maybe maybe not . Point is to many marketers in water cooling forums @XS.

This thread is getting a bit "messy".

Fern
AnandTech P&N Moderator

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: Nemesis 1
I was reading the forums and this caught my eye.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/f...howthread.php?t=186366

Ya the guy is a little forward. But he speaks the trueth.Looks like someone called in the army to help out @XS water cooling. Who was the first to water cool a cpu?

These water blocks everyone and their bothers are making does 2c really matter at all ?
Between differant efficient brands.

Why is marketing water products at XSF so spam like. Who are these water cooling gods? I good plumber is their =. I agree with what the qoute was in that thread . The OP is just beside himself. is he a good water clocker you bet. Is he great ? No way.

If people would take the time to google. you will find that all the designs for water blocks / hydralic . Were done ages ago befor the PC.

I agree with that quote. Why because you have marketers entering threads giving advice a good thing maybe maybe not . Point is to many marketers in water cooling forums @XS.

Iany is on this forum a friend of mine.

And i am Naekuh on that forum.

And you dont understand the whole story. It started somewhere else not the radiator cleaning. If you know me, you'll see why iany and everyone got pissed.

The real problem happened because he recomended mixing metals, and i exploded because people started thinking it was good. Then it progressed and more people started coming out trying to resurect the idea on mixing metals.

The thing is mixing metals is bad. Its not smart, and its totally avoidable. Why risk it even with additives when it can be avoided all together?

Also giving bad advice is worse then not giving advice. Giving bad advice like mixing metals without the proper concentration of additives in your loop will lead to galvanic corrosion. The alu will then get eatten, and slowly disolve. Pressure will build up in your system and cause havok.

But what wose can happen is a pin hole leak. A small drop starts, and since the water is no longer non conductive, if it leaks, POOF there goes your 2000? 3000? 4000? dollar machine.


to me the gods would be:

Cathar
Marci
Bill Adams.

These are the people who shaped watercooling to be what it is today.


Also i only recomend great parts. I dont have any loyalty to any company. If they have crap products, i'll rant in front of them even. I dont care if they hate me, if they have crap products, there a crap company. Thats how i see it.



Nemisis i hope you get it now that i told you i am naekuh. And how it started.


Anyhow im being serious about talking mad crap to the company:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/f...ad.php?t=180749&page=5

Post 109, you guys can see me bitching evga out.

Thankfully eVGA expected this, and suprised us with that. BTW its out of testing and its awesome, eVGA says it will be on sale soon.

 

[Tim]

0/10

 

[IanY]

Speak of the devil and here I am !! lol

I told that guy to be gentle with his comments, but he wouldn't tone down. He got punished harder than I expected. All I asked was for him to have some simple decorum, and to agree to disagree. Even that was fluffed off with profanity. In the end, the hand of justice usually is harsh.

Am I a good water cooler? I don't know. Does it matter?

What does matter is that people treat each other with courtesy and respect.

Aigomorla here is Naekuh over there, and we cover each other's six o'clock.

 

[Billb2]

The whole WCing community has been going downhill since ProCooling blew up.
By the way, Joe, jaydee, pHaestus, and ben333 are trying to get started again...stop by!

 

[Nemesis 1]

Well he may have been rude true but his points were valid. The only one who showed anysense in the thread your talking about was movie man. I have mixed aluminium and copper many times not one problem . Not 1 ever. Why is that? Why do some guys get corrision in a copper brass only system and don't say it doesn't happen . But the real true point is copper is a better conductor. Thats enough said on that. Point I was trying to make is there are to many marketeers in watercooling @ XS. Your guys little rant was interesting. Giving advice is great . But when you hype a product at the same time than its something differant all together. Is 2c going to get a more stable system higher O/C ? Not likely.

He is more pissed about the hype than anything as I read it. I know a lot of so called experts that were pushing ddc1 ddc2 pumps. I got to say it these pumps are not real reliable. But peeps still recommend them . Poor little pumps get worked harder than their tiny little motors can handle. The price for these pumps is a retail joke. Whats a bottle of coke cost? $1.25 I buy them by the cases for 57cents per 16oz. What do you suppose these little pumps really sell for . $25 thats one hell of a mark up. It was you guys that called him into your forum with all the hype about this vs that. Flat bottom Vs bow. Flat tops only please. Cathar is actually a water PC guru . Whats he think about bowed blocks.
I can tell you what any good engineer will tell ya. Bowed what base . NOWAY.

 

[IanY]

I'm just one guy. I am connected to that forum, but I don't represent that forum. I don't operate with the same agenda as the mass populace. Never have. At times, I'm equally opinionated and despised there as well. Most people have gotten used to me being a PITA, but there are some who still can't handle it.

I still have a rather high end mixed loop computer with an Apogee GTX and two Stealth gpu blocks, butit isn't my principal machine. Yes, I have a history of mixed loop machines. Back in the old days, there wasn't even a choice. The blocks were aluminum, period.

I'll stay out of the discussion regarding Laing DDCs and bowed blocks. I have a couple of both. I also have a bunch of D5s. I haven't bought an Iwaki RD30 yet, unlike aigomorla, who has been persuading me to go that route.

Different people water cool for different reasons. Whether or not a lower temp leads to a higher overclock or a more stable system, beyond a certain point, that is debatable. Some people see gaining lower temps as being silly when the machine works well as it is. For me, I would kill for 0.5C, never mind 2C.

I tend not to take an interest in the equipment choices of other because its not my business. Similarly, I keep my equipment choices to myself for the same reason. What works for me and keeps me happy is goode nough for me.

Cheers,
Ian

 

[Davegod]

Hai.

I'm not a moderator here nor represent the community but please don't bring your arguments over here. Try contacting the moderators there instead. Different sites take different approaches to moderating flaming, and different folks have varying degrees of flame tolerance. If you're not happy with theirs then consider leaving the site.

At best this thread is Off Topic, it has nothing to do with Cases & Cooling.

 

[Tim]

Originally posted by: Davegod
Hai.

I'm not a moderator here nor represent the community but please don't bring your arguments over here. Try contacting the moderators there instead. Different sites take different approaches to moderating flaming, and different folks have varying degrees of flame tolerance. If you're not happy with theirs then consider leaving the site.

At best this thread is Off Topic, it has nothing to do with Cases & Cooling.

9/10. I second that (the bringing the argument to this forum part)

 

[Nemesis 1]

Originally posted by: IanY
I'm just one guy. I am connected to that forum, but I don't represent that forum. I don't operate with the same agenda as the mass populace. Never have. At times, I'm equally opinionated and despised there as well. Most people have gotten used to me being a PITA, but there are some who still can't handle it.

I still have a rather high end mixed loop computer with an Apogee GTX and two Stealth gpu blocks, butit isn't my principal machine. Yes, I have a history of mixed loop machines. Back in the old days, there wasn't even a choice. The blocks were aluminum, period.

I'll stay out of the discussion regarding Laing DDCs and bowed blocks. I have a couple of both. I also have a bunch of D5s. I haven't bought an Iwaki RD30 yet, unlike aigomorla, who has been persuading me to go that route.

Different people water cool for different reasons. Whether or not a lower temp leads to a higher overclock or a more stable system, beyond a certain point, that is debatable. Some people see gaining lower temps as being silly when the machine works well as it is. For me, I would kill for 0.5C, never mind 2C.

I tend not to take an interest in the equipment choices of other because its not my business. Similarly, I keep my equipment choices to myself for the same reason. What works for me and keeps me happy is goode nough for me.

Cheers,
Ian

I have read most all your post . I wasn't attacking you. Fluid dynamics is a bit easier and complacated at the same time than most people realize. I remember when pressure Vs. Flow first came up. I just put my head in hands a shock it.
Your right tho . You do know water cooling pc's. You do give good advice. Like you I am indifferant to what people think they know and the facts. Remember when fusion first came out . How everyone loved the free flow threw the block. With good results. Now its come down to restrictors. restrictors???? You call them noozels . But orfice is good enough name. as it does the same thing . raising the pressure at the orfice is common when A system isn't balanced so you need to balance it.
By the way I loved your stepping ya did to those cpu blocks. If I were you I would start working on a Nehalem block and make some $$$$.

 

[Nemesis 1]

Originally posted by: Davegod
Hai.

I'm not a moderator here nor represent the community but please don't bring your arguments over here. Try contacting the moderators there instead. Different sites take different approaches to moderating flaming, and different folks have varying degrees of flame tolerance. If you're not happy with theirs then consider leaving the site.

At best this thread is Off Topic, it has nothing to do with Cases & Cooling.

No no no this topic IanY put forth at xs is not off topic it is the topic .It is important to all forum members in the water cooling community. There are guys that give good advice . Than there are the guys trying to sell us things with hype. Its important to know the differance. It just so happened IanY made a thread I found A bit strange.

KOOLANCE is perfect example. What happens the minute KOOLANCE water blocks are mentioned? Corrision mixed metals the world is ending . and its pure BS. Show me the proof . Not 1 example but many to show the true facts. This is important to us all . Koolance builds a fairly decent system . Would I buy for self . No . Thats not the issue.

Its like me bashing on AMD . Is it fair ? No . But the shoe is now on oher foot.

 

[aigomorla]

ask and ye shall recieve:

http://www.xtremesystems.org/f...01&highlight=Corrosion

http://www.xtremesystems.org/f...63&highlight=Corrosion

Heres just 2 examples, i have more if you want.

 

[surfsatwerk]

So does Swiftech have aluminum tops on all their blocks or just the GTX?

 

[Nemesis 1]

Thanks I read 1 those along time ago. Could you tellus more about those blocks. What treatment did they recieve and how deep was the treatment? Anodizing: I was aware of this top already. I was really looking for Koolance mixed metal that showed corrision .

I guess I was to vague. The aluminium parts need to be treated properly. Given the time it took those parts to corrode its likely they were bad parts from the factory. Now that first block that shows the green corrision . Thats interesting. What would cause that type of corrision? THATS ACIDIC reaction. But they were good links and just goes to show how not to use aluminium in mixed metals. But a properly treated part will last for years.

My daughter is cleaning a mixed system tomorrow or sunday that uses koolance and Storm . Its been running 2 1/2 years without a cleaning . I will have here take the Storm apart and take pic. I bet there is zero corrision .

 

[aigomorla]

its only on the gtx and the MCW6002 TEC block, and the OLD S479 MCW6000.

The GTX was also military spec plated, which was praised because we thought it would work.

Well, thats the result of even military spec platting. Sorry Nature vs Human Inginuity, most of the time nature always wins. :T

This is why i dont recomend the GTX anymore, and its just 2 instances. The first case, Jedda i thought just got unlucky. The second Case my good friend phelan, which i cant seem to find the article.

Its funny, because its avoidable. The GTX has a copper top option, given its expensive, its available,

The D-tek Fusion, which is one of the TOP contending blocks, is pure copper. The EK Supreme is pure copper.

You dont need to mix alu. This is the point in getting across. Why bother mixing it when its not required, and all the top parts in this field are made of copper?

 

[IanY]

Since I am the devil of the month, I will now respond.

I don't hold back my punches but I will nevertheless be polite and observe standard decorum. I mean what I say and say what I mean.

Davegod, theplaidfad, I'm not here to bring *junk* from another forum here. Honestly, I detest that insinuation. That, in my view, is highly unwarranted. It gets my goat, but I will let it go. You don't know me from Adam. Vice Versa.

Apparently, a topic about *me* was posted in this forum. That was without my prompting. Its incumbent on me to protect my turf and clear up any issues or questions.

YOUR MODERATOR INVITED ME HERE. OTHERWISE, I WOULDN'T HAVE BOTHERED. IF YOU WANT TO SHOOT ARROWS, THEN I INVITE YOU TO CRITICIZE AIGOMORLA.

Now, if you want me gone, then speak to Aigomorla.

As for Nemesis1, I respect all your opinions and applaud you for laying it all out in the open.

As I said so myself, my son has my Apogee GTX and my Stealth V2 video blocks, all of which have aluminum tops. I use Swiftech's own Hydrx in the mixture amount prescribed. If there are any problems, I'll take the blocks and shove them back in Gabe Rouchon's face. Gabe is Chairman of Swiftech and he has personally guaranteed the safety of his all-Swiftech loop. I use only Swiftech stuff in that machine on purpose. No excuses there.

I have never had corrosion issues. I have followed every manufacturer's specifications to the letter.

Would I recommend aluminum blocks ? No. Its not worth the hassle, and it certainly does not performa any better. Its debatable whether spceific brands of blocks perform any better than the others. A lot of it depends on what I call system integration. The comprehensive unit is more important than the sum of its parts. For example, you wouldn't want an EK Supreme cpu block in a complicated loop because the block is highly restrictive. Place it in a loop by itself an it will shine.

Aigomorla and myself have a high level of mutual respect for each other. He's a hell lot more active with the newer stuff than I am. I'm more of an old schooler.

BTW, I wasn't the guy who did the stepping on the cpu block. I have no access to such machine shop equipment and I have no such talents. It was a guy named Nikhsub1 who did that. I just know how to buy blocks and use them. And I'm rather extreme in everything I do. I do not believe in the concept of overkill. I go way beyond that.

No matter. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

 

[aigomorla]

Okey guys, speaking very objectively.

I try very hard to not give out a bad recomendation. Why? because i know the cost value of the dollar. Every time i look at my usless parts box, it reminds me of all the junk i spent while experimenting for the "best".

I like giving out recomendations which are in that "best" catigory. Its not my fault if only a hand few of manufactors do produce the best. So like a broken record im always recomending that same company because of there past and present quality.

I will never talk bad about a product unless i have seen it perform aweful, or i have had it and it was just a disaspointment.

My views on mixing metals maybe a bit strong, however its because ive ran into corrosion. Its like a kid who touches fire, will never touch fire again. The same goes with corrosion. Once you get it, you never want to mix metals ever again. But i have told you guys b4, if you do it, i will give you a stern lecture and end it with a keep a watchful eye on it.


Once again, i am Naekuh on XS, and please read how clueless and sirheck would bash my post at ever response.

Anyhow with nemisis's permission unless he has more he wishes to talk about, i would like to lock this thread as it will just confuse people because its only 1/3rd of the whole story.

And you guys are right this doesnt belong here, yet it poped up here. Problem is i cant do anything to it without a conflict of interest.