What's wrong with my car this week?

[Savij]

It's a 93 626 with about 125k miles on it. Until yesterday it had been running great. It was due for an oil change (200 miles over what it should have been) but other than that was great. I noticed some tapping when I started. Then oil light came on when I went around a curve so I pulled over at a gas station and checked the oil (less than 1 mile of driving since startup). No oil registered on the dip stick, even after I added 2 quarts (4.5 quart capacity!!).

I took it to the mechanic next door and had them check for leaks and do an oil change. The guy said he couldn't find a leak and changed filter and added oil. He said the tapping is the lifters and didn't think it was that big a deal. I haven't noticed any oil spots under the car, but I park the car in a public lot so it's not that difficult to miss oil spots if there were any.

This morning the tapping is still there, and I noticed the car doesn't seem to have as much power as before. The tapping goes away if I can keep the car under 1.5k rpm, but that's pretty much impossible above 45mph. When I checked the slip on the oil change it shows 6 quarts added (too much for that car). I didn't notice any smoke or anything in the exhaust.

To add to the confusion, the car was inspected last month and passed emissions w/o any problems.

I plan on taking the car to my regular mechanic this weekend, but I would love to have an idea of what is going on and how bad it is before I get there.

Any ideas? Suggestions? Car buying tips?

*Update*
The mechanics words were, and this is is a direct quote, "you're fucked." He suggested I take the car to a dealer and try to get them to trade it in w/o hearing it or to sell it for parts. He didn't really open it up or anything, but he listened to where the noise was coming from and said that the lifter was probably hitting the cam (shaft?). When he tried to pull the spark plug wire out, one of them wasn't coming out properly and he said that's probably the cylinder that is messed up.

I spent all day today walking to car dealerships around boston

Bye bye, 626. It was a great 14 years *sniff*

*Update 2*

I've decided I'm not keeping the car, but just out of curisoty I took a video and some pics to see if it'll help decide more conclusively what's wrong with the car.

This is what the engine now sounds like: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6wFv62JG2U halfway into the video I give the engine a little gas and you can here the tapping go up with the rpms. Keep in mind that the video doesn't capture just how loud the tapping is, you can easily hear it from across the parking lot when the car is idling and it gets louder with more rpms.

This is what the engine looks like now: IMG_0040.JPG

That weird white stuff is new, it wasn't there a few weeks before the problems started: IMG_0042.JPG

This oil looking stuff over here is new also: IMG_0043.JPG. I don't know if it makes a difference, but that's the oil dipstick right there.

 

[exdeath]

Sounds like time for a compression and leak down test. With 125k miles and letting oil run low like that (which I can only assume is regular habit by now), you've probably got leaky piston rings or valve seals which is what would be consuming oil even though there are no external leaks.

Over filling can also reduce power as the crank has to cut through the higher oil level in the pan; the oil in the pan should never come into contact with the crank. Not only would it reduce power, but it's very stressful on the rotating assembly and bearings.

Lifters are probably caked with dried out crud or worn due to oil starvation and not as 'flexible' (for lack of better term) as they should be, hence the tapping, either from lifter operating noise or valve lash as a result of the lifters not taking up the slack like they should.

Neglecting oil is the worst thing you can do to an engine. It would be like you walking around with only a pint of blood in your entire body and then running a triathlon. Even dirty oil that hasn't been changed in years and has only been topped of is better than no oil at all.

I'd like to have seen the oil that came out of it, in the sunlight it looks like metallic nail polish.

At any rate, you're next oil change should be sooner than usual on this fresh batch, since the fresh oil just put in is going to pick up all the junk left behind and get dirty again rather quickly.

 

[Savij]

Originally posted by: exdeath
(which I can only assume is regular habit by now)

Not really. Almost oil changes have been by the book(plus minus 200 miles). The car never had low oil when doing any previous oil change (going on how much was I was tossing out).

 

[exdeath]

Originally posted by: Savij

Originally posted by: exdeath
(which I can only assume is regular habit by now)

Not really. Almost oil changes have been by the book(plus minus 200 miles). The car never had low oil when doing any previous oil change (going on how much was I was tossing out).

Ah, so it's been regular oil changes, and this time it happened to be several quarts low at the regular interval?

Most likely valve seals then. It won't show at idle so much, but have someone else observe for bluish smoke when you accelerate from a stop. This puts more of a load and vacuum and will suck the oil through the warn seals more than when you are just idling in the driveway and looking yourself.

A compression and leak down test is rather quick and easy and shouldn't cost much, and you can easily determine if it's the piston rings or the valves. It's one of those two things if you have no external leaks.

By the way, the oil light is basically a low pressure switch that comes on at like 5 psi or something. It doesn't come on until it's already past the danger threshold, which is why it's bad for those who don't change their oil until the light comes on.

 

[Savij]

Originally posted by: exdeath

Originally posted by: Savij

Originally posted by: exdeath
(which I can only assume is regular habit by now)

Not really. Almost oil changes have been by the book(plus minus 200 miles). The car never had low oil when doing any previous oil change (going on how much was I was tossing out).

Ah, so it's been regular oil changes, and this time it happened to be several quarts low at the regular interval?

Most likely valve seals then. It won't show at idle so much, but have someone else observe for bluish smoke when you accelerate from a stop. This puts more of a load and vacuum and will suck the oil through the warn seals more than when you are just idling in the driveway and looking yourself.

Should I still ask for a compression and leak down test? Should I avoid driving the car till I can get to the mechanic? Should I have the car towed to the mechanic?

edit: Is it likely that every mile is adding more damage to the engine? I want to keep this car running as long as possible. Until yesterday, everyone was surprised that the car is as old as it is because it ran well and the interior was so clean.

 

[exdeath]

<reposted below>

 

[Savij]

Originally posted by: exdeath

Originally posted by: Savij

Originally posted by: exdeath
(which I can only assume is regular habit by now)

Not really. Almost oil changes have been by the book(plus minus 200 miles). The car never had low oil when doing any previous oil change (going on how much was I was tossing out).

Ah, so it's been regular oil changes, and this time it happened to be several quarts low at the regular interval?

Most likely valve seals then. It won't show at idle so much, but have someone else observe for bluish smoke when you accelerate from a stop. This puts more of a load and vacuum and will suck the oil through the warn seals more than when you are just idling in the driveway and looking yourself.

A compression and leak down test is rather quick and easy and shouldn't cost much, and you can easily determine if it's the piston rings or the valves. It's one of those two things if you have no external leaks.

By the way, the oil light is basically a low pressure switch that comes on at like 5 psi or something. It doesn't come on until it's already past the danger threshold, which is why it's bad for those who don't change their oil until the light comes on.

Yeah, the only other time I've seen the oil light is when I accidently left the gasket/seal/o-ring/whatever it's called on from the old oil filter stuck on the car before I put the new filter in. That was an immediate start up the car, oil light comes on, turn off the car and find a ton of engine oil all over the ground.

 

[exdeath]

As long as there is oil in it, you are fine and you aren't going to hurt anything if you keep driving it. Just keep an eye on the oil.

Definitely get a compression and leak down test. You are losing too much oil, and if it's not a visible leak outside the engine, then it's being consumed through combustion, either through the piston rings or the valves. Rings generally last the life of the engine in the absence of abuse or neglect, while valve seals are a higher wearing maintenance item, so it's most likely valves.

Those tests can narrow it down to which one it is without having to take anything apart. They will squirt oil in through the spark plug opening which will seal the top of the piston, and perform the test again. No improvement points to valves.

You may want to check your coolant too and make sure it's bright and clear, just to rule out any oil seeping into the cooling system through bad gaskets, seals, or possible cracks.

Basically you just want to find out where the oil is going. Two or three quarts in the course of 3,000 miles is not normal.

 

[Savij]

Ok. Thanks for all the info.

 

[Thump553]

You should be checking the oil yourself at a lot more frequent intervals than when an oil change is due. In the good old days the pump jockey checked it every time you gassed up.

The best thing to do is to get into a regular routine-check all the fluids, tire pressure, etc. first thing every Saturday morning, for example, would be great-or the first and fifteenth of the month. Don't forget to check the auto transmission fluid periodically as well (look in your manual for the procedure).

 

[SpeedEng66]

I have a 626 in the shop for a rebuild

626 are known for blown head gaskets
it's pretty simple to check
buy a compression tester
buy a small set of 3/8 ratchet set from sears (usually on sale for less than $30)
take off plug boot (one at a time)
disconnect coil pack
insert compression gauge

crank car 4-5 seconds

write down how much psi (should be @ 125psi min for 626)
insert old spark plug back in (or put in a new set of plugs )
replace boot

repeat for the next one


but yes 6 qts is not way too much if you have excessive smoke coming out
take it back the shop if not it's ok

another question what grade oil did they use?

 

[Savij]

So I checked the coolant this afternoon and it looks dark. I'm thinking there may be oil in there. They used 10w30 synthetic. I've been using synthetic in the car for the life of the car, and I'm pretty sure that the 10w30 is ok for this temp range.

 

[SpeedEng66]

Originally posted by: Savij
So I checked the coolant this afternoon and it looks dark. I'm thinking there may be oil in there. They used 10w30 synthetic. I've been using synthetic in the car for the life of the car, and I'm pretty sure that the 10w30 is ok for this temp range.

eek!

is there light white smoke out the exhaust?
time to do that compression test
if the head gasket is blown = big $$

10-30 is fine but you can always try a heavy oil to try to stop the tapping (and maybe trade it in )

 

[exdeath]

Originally posted by: Savij
So I checked the coolant this afternoon and it looks dark. I'm thinking there may be oil in there. They used 10w30 synthetic. I've been using synthetic in the car for the life of the car, and I'm pretty sure that the 10w30 is ok for this temp range.

It can be dark and rusty looking, but it should be thin and fluid like water, not thick and sludgy.

 

[chucky2]

Too bad you changed the oil, else you could have done an oil analysis on it and looked to see if any Sodium and/or Potassium was in the oil. If there was, and to any meaningful degree, you'd know for absolute certain you had a coolant leak.

If you can put on another 500 miles or so on your current fill, then you can probably get away with sending in a sample with such little use on the oil...especially if something blew.

When my brothers car nuked a gasket, there was noticable white smoke coming out of the exhaust, however the coolant tank look just fine. The coolant getting dirty only happens in the most extreme or prolonged cases, in which case you can probably look at the exhaust and tell anyways...

As for the tapping lifters, if they're hydrolic, you may be able to solve that and help your engine out in general with an Auto-RX program, however, don't attempt that until you know for sure you aren't getting coolant in the oil, else the Auto-RX will just spend it's energy against the coolant instead of the sludge.

Good luck!

Chuck

 

[LTC8K6]

Well, when my car needed a head gasket, coolant was disappearing at an alarming rate, but there were no leaks I could find...

 

[Arkaign]

Mazda @ 125k miles with head problems Sounds familiar. Bleargh! Hopefully they've improved some, and at least they're not as bad as Dodge 4clys

 

[Savij]

Ok, so the coolant was on the low side, the color is way darker than it had been on previous occasions and didn't smell like antifreeze. There is a little smoke/water vapor coming from the tailpipe.

I'll update with what the mechanic says tomorrow.

Please, God, dont make this too expensive

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: Savij
Ok, so the coolant was on the low side, the color is way darker than it had been on previous occasions and didn't smell like antifreeze. There is a little smoke/water vapor coming from the tailpipe.

I'll update with what the mechanic says tomorrow.

Please, God, dont make this too expensive

schiese...that could well be a blown headgasket. Now if you're lucky the smoke/water vapor is just regular exhaust on a cold day plus some paranoia since the car hasn't been running well...but you might be shelling out some money soon.

On the other hand, doing it yourself could be a learning experience.

 

[SpeedEng66]

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: Savij
Ok, so the coolant was on the low side, the color is way darker than it had been on previous occasions and didn't smell like antifreeze. There is a little smoke/water vapor coming from the tailpipe.

I'll update with what the mechanic says tomorrow.

Please, God, dont make this too expensive

schiese...that could well be a blown headgasket. Now if you're lucky the smoke/water vapor is just regular exhaust on a cold day plus some paranoia since the car hasn't been running well...but you might be shelling out some money soon.

On the other hand, doing it yourself could be a learning experience.

I dont know about op doing it himself the plenium on those 626 are a pita!

 

[Savij]

double

 

[Savij]

Originally posted by: SpeedEng66

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: Savij
Ok, so the coolant was on the low side, the color is way darker than it had been on previous occasions and didn't smell like antifreeze. There is a little smoke/water vapor coming from the tailpipe.

I'll update with what the mechanic says tomorrow.

Please, God, dont make this too expensive

schiese...that could well be a blown headgasket. Now if you're lucky the smoke/water vapor is just regular exhaust on a cold day plus some paranoia since the car hasn't been running well...but you might be shelling out some money soon.

On the other hand, doing it yourself could be a learning experience.

I dont know about op doing it himself the plenium on those 626 are a pita!

The mechanics words were, and this is is a direct quote, "you're fucked!" He suggested I take the car to a dealer and try to get them to trade it in w/o hearing it or to sell it for parts. He didn't really open it up or anything, but he listened to where the noise was coming from and said that the lifter was probably hitting the cam (shaft?). When he tried to pull the spark plug wire out, one of them wasn't coming out properly and he said that's probably the cylinder that is messed up.

I spent all day today walking to car dealerships around boston

Bye bye, 626. It was a great 14 years *sniff*

 

[cardiac]

uh, the lifter is "supposed" to hit the camshaft. That's what a lifter does. The heal of the lifter rides on the camshaft and the other end opens and closes the valve.

And, the plug wire NOT coming out really has nothing to do with the lifter making noise.
(If the plug wire is broken or cracked, it could cause that cylinder to mis-fire).

I would find a different mechanic.

That doesn't make a lot of sense......

Bob

 

[Savij]

Originally posted by: cardiac
uh, the lifter is "supposed" to hit the camshaft. That's what a lifter does. The heal of the lifter rides on the camshaft and the other end opens and closes the valve.

And, the plug wire NOT coming out really has nothing to do with the lifter making noise.
(If the plug wire is broken or cracked, it could cause that cylinder to mis-fire).

I would find a different mechanic.

That doesn't make a lot of sense......

Bob

I think he meant that it was bent and striking the camshaft instead of whatever it does normally. I know the sound is not normal for that engine. Should I have another place check it out? He did mention that he wasn't set up to do major engine work and was pretty adament that the best option to fix the car was to replace the engine (which his garage didn't do). Just to be clear, he wasn't trying to get me to spend any money at his garage for any of this damage.

Is there a national chain or something that would be recommended in the boston area? Is it worth going after it on a 14 year old car (that was running great last weeek).

 

[Regs]

It could be hitting the cam from screwed up timming and ignition.

Though I don't know why you were down so much oil. Not unless it's spitting out into the cam shaft because the seals are warped.

Even if it's just the timming, could of all ready caused enough damage on the cylander heads and gaskets to total out your car.