Whats Wrong With Diesel in USA?

[thescreensavers]

How come in the USA we don't have more Diesel cars like in Europe!

MPG problem would be solved.

VW Polo $13,000-$16,000 70mpg

0-60: 8.2 sec
Top Speed 134mph

Toyota Prius $22,000-29,000 46mpg

0-60: 10.5-11sec
Top Seed: 115mph

Honda Insight $19,800-26,300 41.5 mpg

0-60: 11-12sec
Top Speed: 112mph


So why do we need all these complex battery, drive train, electric engine systems when you can get better gas mileage on a pure Diesel engine!

And on a side note you can actually hear the polo at slow speeds so blind people are not endanger!

 

[Vette73]

They have a differnet gallon then us so you can;t use their gallon rating to ours.

Also Diesel cost more in the US.

So once you convert to our gallon, take into account price differance, and then the extra cost. Its not worth it.

1 US Gallon = .83 Imperial gallon
So its more in line with 58MPG not 70. The Polo is also a subcompact and the price would be much higher to meet the US standards.

 

[Strk]

ULSD wasn't available for a long time, so diesels couldn't pass emissions in five states (including CA). Diesel also suffers from a pretty bad reputation of being dirty and slow.

 

[thescreensavers]

Originally posted by: Marlin1975
They have a differnet gallon then us so you can;t use their gallon rating to ours.

Also Diesel cost more in the US.

So once you convert to our gallon, take into account price differance, and then the extra cost. Its not worth it.

1 US Gallon = .83 Imperial gallon
So its more in line with 58MPG not 70. The Polo is also a subcompact and the price would be much higher to meet the US standards.

ah, I did not know that so when Top Gear tested the Prius 45mpg he got is US Gallons not the Imperial Gallon. So to him it got 54.0 mpg not 45 he stated. 4 mpg off the Polo, not to bad but the price difference is also there, and Diesel is 15-30 cents more per gallon then regular depending were you go here in the USA,

If you take the low end prius vs low end polo its 30,000 gallons of Diesel for the polo and the Prius with regular before the prius starts saving you money. And thats at 30 cents over regular.

11.89 Gallon tank the Polo has thats 2,523 tanks of Gas, and once a week fill up lets say thats 48.5 years of gas

so ultimately Polo > Prius for mpg and price and performance

 

[angry hampster]

Originally posted by: thescreensavers

so ultimately Polo > Prius for mpg and price and performance

Yea but they're F'n tiny.

 

[Arkaign]

Originally posted by: angry hampster

Originally posted by: thescreensavers

so ultimately Polo > Prius for mpg and price and performance

Yea but they're F'n tiny.

Yep, not even remotely comparable vehicles. The Prius is a usable vehicle for an average 2-child family, for moderate road trips, etc. The Polo is an urban runabout, and a great deal smaller.

I'm not a particularly big Prius fan, but this is apples to oranges. The Prius is more of a Passat-sized vehicle when you look at interior room and so on.

 

[sandorski]

I wonder why the North American Price of Diesel is higher? It could be simply lack of Supply, due to the lack of Vehicles using it, but I suppose there could be an issue with the predominate type of Oil available as well.

 

[Arkaign]

Originally posted by: sandorski
I wonder why the North American Price of Diesel is higher? It could be simply lack of Supply, due to the lack of Vehicles using it, but I suppose there could be an issue with the predominate type of Oil available as well.

Gov't.

 

[ViviTheMage]

emissions

/thread

 

[SparkyJJO]

Diesel has a bad reputation here generally. Mention diesel and people immediately think of black smoke pouring out of a tailpipe. Sad really, I'd like to see more diesel vehicles.

And concerning the prius...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qP-tyvBGla4

 

[Fenixgoon]

diesel doesnt cost more than premium anymore (at least in some places)

 

[LTC8K6]

Diesel was a lot more, now it's much closer. It was out of the question for quite a while, given the price of the fuel and the extra cost of the vehicle.

Diesel is probably break even for me now, so still no real reason to buy one.

 

[angry hampster]

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
diesel doesnt cost more than premium anymore (at least in some places)

Depends largely on location. Here in Iowa, diesel is consistently ~20 cents more than premium gas, but an hour south in Missouri they're about equal.


Diesels got bad rep in the US because of the 1970s and early 1980s. Go read up on GM's 5.7L diesel.

 

[franksta]

Have you ever tried to fill up a tank with diesel? First you have to find a station that has it, as not everyone does. Then there's only a pump or two that actually dispense the stuff. Sometimes it's out behind the back of the building. Then surprise surprise you have to wait in line behind 4 trucks filling 30+ gallon tanks and maybe auxiliary tanks for the tractor, generator, and who knows what else.

I drove around for half an hour one time in my dad's F-350 and that's almost the story from it. Good ol' 87 octane is just fine for me thanks. At least until the distribution of diesel is better.

 

[Possessed Freak]

Amazingly, diesel used to be cheaper then gasoline. It is only in the past few years that it increased in price over gas.

 

[EightySix Four]

Originally posted by: franksta
Have you ever tried to fill up a tank with diesel? First you have to find a station that has it, as not everyone does. Then there's only a pump or two that actually dispense the stuff. Sometimes it's out behind the back of the building. Then surprise surprise you have to wait in line behind 4 trucks filling 30+ gallon tanks and maybe auxiliary tanks for the tractor, generator, and who knows what else.

I drove around for half an hour one time in my dad's F-350 and that's almost the story from it. Good ol' 87 octane is just fine for me thanks. At least until the distribution of diesel is better.

Move to Texas.

 

[Arkaign]

Originally posted by: crazySOB297

Originally posted by: franksta
Have you ever tried to fill up a tank with diesel? First you have to find a station that has it, as not everyone does. Then there's only a pump or two that actually dispense the stuff. Sometimes it's out behind the back of the building. Then surprise surprise you have to wait in line behind 4 trucks filling 30+ gallon tanks and maybe auxiliary tanks for the tractor, generator, and who knows what else.

I drove around for half an hour one time in my dad's F-350 and that's almost the story from it. Good ol' 87 octane is just fine for me thanks. At least until the distribution of diesel is better.

Move to Texas.

I live in Texas, in the northern suburbs of Plano/Frisco, where every vehicle seems to be a Mercedes, BMW, or Cadillac SUV, and Diesel is not all that easy to find, and it's usually only at one pump when it is available. It also tends to be drastically more expensive.

 

[Knavish]

Originally posted by: sandorski
I wonder why the North American Price of Diesel is higher? It could be simply lack of Supply, due to the lack of Vehicles using it, but I suppose there could be an issue with the predominate type of Oil available as well.

When you refine a barrel of oil into diesel, you get fewer gallons then when you refine it into gasoline. This is reflected in how diesel has more energy per volume than gasoline, and is part of why diesel cars get better MPG! I'd imagine this makes diesel more expensive than gas.
...
You can't really compare prices of any fuel type in Europe to the US because there are *HUGE* fuel taxes in Europe. In my state (North Carolina) our gas tax is $0.4855 per gallon. According to an article I found at thesun.co.uk, Britain taxes "petrol" at 67.8p/litre. If I did the math right, this works out to a tax of $3.67 per gallon!!!

i.e. Britain's gas tax is ~7.6x what I pay in NC.

 

[npoe1]

Originally posted by: Marlin1975
They have a differnet gallon then us so you can;t use their gallon rating to ours.

USA should start to use the metric system for good of the world.

 

[rh71]

Originally posted by: ViviTheMage
emissions

/thread

That. To meet emissions, companies like MB & BMW have had to compromise with their new diesel engines (compared to the diesels that live overseas) as well as add some piss into the mix. Still better than the gas engines overall - I'd wait a bit before jumping on them though.

 

[Beanie46]

Originally posted by: Knavish


i.e. Britain's gas tax is ~7.6x what I pay in NC.

But that's the way it's always been in the EU countries....they social engineer car buying choices through various means, including high fuel taxes.

Another way is to tax engines by size. Take Italy, for instance. The Italian gov't begins to excise (?) tax engines when they crest 1L in size, and it gets higher as the engines increase in displacement.

And we, in the U.S., think we have it bad with taxes.

 

[Beanie46]

Originally posted by: Knavish


When you refine a barrel of oil into diesel, you get fewer gallons then when you refine it into gasoline. This is reflected in how diesel has more energy per volume than gasoline, and is part of why diesel cars get better MPG! I'd imagine this makes diesel more expensive than gas.
...

Well, it's a rare happening, probably never actually, that a barrel of oil is refined into one single product. Instead, a barrel of oil typically yields this when refined:

19.5 gal gasoline
9.2 gal diesel
1.75 gal other distillates, typically heating oil
1.76 gal heavy fuel oil (residual)
3.82 gal jet fuel
1.72 gal liquefied petroleum gases (LPG)
7.27 gal other products (road tar, asphalt, coke, lubricants, kerosene, etc.)

All of which adds up to a greater volume than the 42 gal in a barrel of oil, > 2.2 gal more in fact. This is called the "processing gain."

Another factor in diesel is that the federal tax on diesel is, as of now, .06 (six cents) higher per gallon than on gas.

 

[ZickZJ]

Originally posted by: Possessed Freak
Amazingly, diesel used to be cheaper then gasoline. It is only in the past few years that it increased in price over gas.

x2

 

[ballmode]

they charge too much for jeans

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

Originally posted by: angry hampster

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
diesel doesnt cost more than premium anymore (at least in some places)

Depends largely on location. Here in Iowa, diesel is consistently ~20 cents more than premium gas, but an hour south in Missouri they're about equal.


Diesels got bad rep in the US because of the 1970s and early 1980s. Go read up on GM's 5.7L diesel.

You mean GM turning the 350 block into a desiel and failing horrbily at it.
Now, GM has a 4.5L that is due out this year that looks promising.