Whats the highest framerate that the human eye can detect?

[BFG10K]

A 75hz monitor is gonna look exactly the same whether your game is running at 75fps, 100fps, 5000fps.

If vsync is disabled then that isn't the case.

 

[Krynis]

i didint read much of this thread sorry if i repeat but im lazy you will notice the difference bettween 30 and anything higher do to the fact that ur eye can see changes in the FPS even if it doesint register all the frames i believe but reason says it wouldint notice as much in the higher FPS area due to loss of perception or something like that and if ur only minor amounts above 30fps its bound to drop below now and again which is bad but some games and or monitors tear at some high FPS areas so it can be a bit of a lose lose deal at times

 

[JonnyBlaze]

Originally posted by: VIAN
Why would VSYNC be unnecissary? There are monitors that can scan up to 160Hz. And plus, if you read, 85fps is perfect, as long as you can keep that to a minimum.

trust me 160fsp @ 160hz with vsync on looks much better than a "perfefct" 85

JB

 

[1ManArmY]

60 FPS.

 

[VIAN]

dear rbv5,

85fps with vsync on of course and a refresh rate of 85Hz. Looks incredibly smooth and you do not see any frame blur or nothing, just smoothness as I've told you, And it doesn't matter on the situation and it is not variable. Smoothness is consistancy in framerate. Agreed, be you at 24fps or 60fps, you can still see the frame blur. But at 85Hz, Everything looks smooth, and its gonna look smooth nomatter what you play as long as you can keep that constant.

And duh you didnt understand, at 75Hz you will be shown 75fps nomatter how many frames your video card pumps out. And at 160Hz you will be shown 160fps nomatter how many frames your video card pumps out.

"It's not rocket surgery"

 

[VIAN]

I dont see how much better it can look as with 85, we have eliminated the frame blur of moving side to side (you can notice this when moving side to side when looking at an ege of an object like a corner of a building), but I would love to test out the 160. If only I had a multiscan monitor. If only there was a video application that could allow frames that high. If only there was a video card that would push frames that high. Any suggestions.

 

[VIAN]

For BFG10K

What is the purpose of the refresh rate, it is to refresh what is seen on the screen, a sort of frame rate on its own. And no matter how many frames the graphics card pumps out, it will be too fast for the refresh rate to show, so, at 60Hz, you will only be seeing 60 out of those 120 frames, if the timing is right - you might see a half a frame, tearing. So your either gonna see a frame or a tearing when the refresh comes. The computer can show you how many frames your graphics processer is processing - 120, but your monitor can only show you as many frames as it refeshes. It like when you move your mouse in a fps game, it will not show till the next frame that you did because it needs to refresh and make the changes. VSYNC or not it is true and makes a lot of sense. So to have vsync off all those times to get that higher frame rate was foolish and is foolish, unless you want to see how high it can go for bragging, but to enjoy a game vsync is on.

 

[CraigRT]

with Quake 3, I never liked going below 60-80 range.. at 30 it's choppy.

 

[VIAN]

I think quake 3 would allow me to go up to 160, I would still need the multscan monitor and a powerful video card. Maybe one of you guys can try it out. First try out the 85 vs 60. keeping the refresh rate at 85Hz with vsync enabled, see the difference between a cap of 85fps and 60fps. Then set it at 160Hz with vsync on and see the difference between the cap of 160fps and 85fps. Don't bother if you didnt see the first difference though.

 

[jdurg]

You could probably determine the maximum framerate noticeable to a human being if you had the data on how much time it takes for the rods and cones in your retina to "refresh" themselves after being stimulated by light. Technically speaking, any refresh rate which is faster than the refresh rate of your retina will be unnoticeable to a human being. At that point, it does become a psychological factor.

 

[JonnyBlaze]

Originally posted by: VIAN
I think quake 3 would allow me to go up to 160, I would still need the multscan monitor and a powerful video card. Maybe one of you guys can try it out. First try out the 85 vs 60. keeping the refresh rate at 85Hz with vsync enabled, see the difference between a cap of 85fps and 60fps. Then set it at 160Hz with vsync on and see the difference between the cap of 160fps and 85fps. Don't bother if you didnt see the first difference though.

ok i did just this. ill post my cfg file so other people can try this too.

i started at 800x600@60 and went thru 85 then 160.

its really a much bigger difference from 85 to 160 and from 60 to 85. one thing i noticed was that the refreshrate i was getting directly affected the quickness of the mouse. its much faster to spin around at the higher rates and is alot smoother overall.

heres how to do it


driver settings: vsync on, put your other settings to where you think your card can handle the fps.

then make a cfg file in the baseq3 folder called rr.cfg or something similar

put this in that file:

set 60 "Exec 800; seta r_mode -1; seta r_customwidth 800; seta r_customheight 600; seta r_displayrefresh 60; seta maxfps 60; seta com_maxfps 60; vid_restart; echo 800x600@60hz; bind end vstr 85"
set 85 "Exec 800; seta r_mode -1; seta r_customwidth 800; seta r_customheight 600; seta r_displayrefresh 85; seta maxfps 85; seta com_maxfps 85; vid_restart; echo 800x600@85hz; bind end vstr 160"
set 160 "Exec 800; seta r_mode -1; seta r_customwidth 800; seta r_customheight 600; seta r_displayrefresh 160; seta maxfps 160; seta com_maxfps 160; vid_restart; echo 800x600@160hz; bind end vstr 60"

bind end vstr 60



then once you start quake type in the console 'exec rr' and start a game

now the 'end' key will toggle you thru the refreshrates and you can just switch between them all and see the difference.

remember to change the numbers in the cfg file if your monitor cant handle 160hz!!!!!!!!!!!! just change all the 160 to the max your monitor can handle. make sure to double check it!!!


later

JB

 

[VIAN]

jdurg, I think you have something there but its not entirely correct.

I wish I was able to see that 160fps.

 

[kamaboko]

i think the bionic man could see something like 20 million fps. i could be off just a few though.

 

[Mingon]

You could probably determine the maximum framerate noticeable to a human being if you had the data on how much time it takes for the rods and cones in your retina to "refresh" themselves after being stimulated by light. Technically speaking, any refresh rate which is faster than the refresh rate of your retina will be unnoticeable to a human being. At that point, it does become a psychological factor.

Wow a considered response :Q The problem is that the cons and rods respond to different light levels, so the response time is then decreased as they wont be working in sync. Furthermore each con or rod would be stimulated at different times depending on how the light (wavelengths) is received via the lens to each grouping.
So your sensitivity(to refresh/change) to a black / white flashing screen is probably lower than to a multi-coloured screen. So whilst black / white would be say 600 fps, black / white / green / yellow would likely be higher 9. Hope that isnt to confusing.

 

[BFG10K]

if the timing is right - you might see a half a frame, tearing.

Exactly - you can see the effects of partially drawn frames. But if you read the quote I took, it was incorrectly saying that there was no difference between the different framerates.

So to have vsync off all those times to get that higher frame rate was foolish and is foolish, unless you want to see how high it can go for bragging, but to enjoy a game vsync is on.

That is incorrect. 120 FPS @ 60 Hz is always better than 60 FPS @ 60 Hz because you're getting extra information from the partially drawn frames; you're seeing 120 FPS rolled into 60 Hz instead of just seeing 60 FPS to begin with.

Also vsync causes a lot of problems such as increased mouse lag and framerate drops that are divisions of your monitor's refresh rate. For example, because of timing issues an 85 Hz vsynced system can often drop to 42.5 FPS or even 28.3 FPS, even if the system is normally capable of pumping out more than 85 FPS when vsync is off.

Vsync is not just a simple framerate cap.

 

[VIAN]

I agree, but vsync looks a lot better. Tearing is sort of annoying because its almost like a flickering, however, I checked it out and I lost half my frame rate with VSYNC on, very interesting. VSYNC isn't worth half of my frame rate, and the better response time helps. Thanks.