What's best AMD for general use?

[ShawnD1]

You'd want an aftermarket cooler on the AMD anyway, if you want to overclock it. So I don't see the problem.

AMD processors come with extremely good stock coolers.

http://www.frostytech.com/articleview.cfm?articleid=2533&page=4
AMD 4-core and 6-core phenoms (not athlons) come with the AM2 stock cooler. Frosty Tech says this cooler runs at 17C over ambient at 125W

http://www.frostytech.com/articleview.cfm?articleid=2419&page=5
Intel's BEST stock cooler runs at 33.8 over ambient. This is exactly why you need an aftermarket cooler if you overclock an i5 or i7.

 

[Rifter]

Holy this thread went to hell real fast.

OP try to ignore the fanboy's

Here is the short of it

Intel is better clock for clock(go compare a i5 750 to a AMD Phenom 2 925, both 2.8Ghz quads and see what happens, that should end the clock for clock debate)

So if you are more concerned about single threaded performance get a i5.

AMD is better in well programmed multithreaded applications as mark has pointed out folding is one of them and a few encoding and video editing programs as well are very well mutithreaded. So if you are going to be using programs such as those alot then go with the 1055T otherwise go intel. Also as pointed out above by shawn the 1055T comes with a good heatsink so you should be able to OC to 3.5GHz or so on the stock cooler and will only need to upgrade if going for 4Ghz. The intel cooler on the other hand is not even good for even stock speeds so right off the top that will add 30-40$ to the cost of the intel CPU if you want a good cooler so you can OC it, or even keep temps down at stock.

I just re read the first post and when i first read it i thought this was going to be more of a work comp, but upon a second look(maybe due to the edit, i dont know what you edited) it seems like its going to be more a gaming and web surfing general office box. So i am going to retract my previous suggestion and say go i5 if that is the case.

 

[busydude]

How much money would you like to spend for this system?

 

[DrMrLordX]

Summary: Even if it's just AMD vs AMD, I would recommend the 965 BE over the 1055T, for lots of practical reasons that meet the OP's needs, as explained above. Now, if it's an e-peen thing, then yes, maybe bragging "I've got a hexcore PC" is better than having a 965 BE, but aside from bragging rights, it just doesn't make sense much based on the OP's described needs.

If he's going to overclock, the 1055T should hit higher clock speeds unless he becomes board-limited or RAM-limited. He's also concerned about heat, and while there is a 95w version of the 1055T available from Tiger Direct for $190 shipped, the lowest TDP available for the 965BE is 125W.

More to the point, once overclocking is taken into account, I think the 1055T winds up being a better quad than the 965BE. The fact that it has two more cores is just a nice little bonus for those occasions when he can actually use them.

Based on his needs, I think the 1055T wins.

750 if your a gamer

the AMD if you want a general multi purpose machine.

True. Starcraft II, anyone? AMD machines will do okay, if not pretty well, in most games, but you can probably get better FPS with an Intel rig.

OK, with a decent air cooler, both can do about 4 ghz. I still say for your applications, that the 1055T is your best bet. You could even use your old DDR2 memory with it !

Agreed, he can save a lot of money recycling his old RAM.

AMD processors come with extremely good stock coolers.

Da, though the AVC 4-heatpipe cooler is noisy as hell at full tilt. I really wouldn't wish that on anyone unless they're prepared to deal with 60 dBA on a regular basis. With HSFs like the Mugen 2, 212+ (if you can find them), BARAM, etc. available in the $30-$40 range, it would be sensible to get an aftermarket cooler, even for the 965BE or 1055T.

Really I think the OP should get the 1055T and spend the money he's going to save keeping his RAM on a decent mobo + HSF. Make sure to get the 95w 1055T if you are concerned about heat (or even if you aren't!).

 

[ShawnD1]

Da, though the AVC 4-heatpipe cooler is noisy as hell at full tilt. I really wouldn't wish that on anyone unless they're prepared to deal with 60 dBA on a regular basis. With HSFs like the Mugen 2, 212+ (if you can find them), BARAM, etc. available in the $30-$40 range, it would be sensible to get an aftermarket cooler, even for the 965BE or 1055T.

If you're concerned about noise the you shouldn't be overclocking

 

[jvroig]

If you're concerned about noise the you shouldn't be overclocking

How is that? So all overclockers are automatically required to not mind any noise at all?

That may be true for some overclockers, but given that there are a lot of solutions that are cheap, practically silent, and provide good cooling (the venerable Hyper212+, for example) are available, there doesn't have to be the compromise that you suggest. I can enjoy a Phenom II X4 965 BE @ 3.8 core / 2.7 uncore running practically silently, thanks to a Hyper 212+, which barely cost me $30.

 

[DrMrLordX]

If you're concerned about noise the you shouldn't be overclocking

Wellll maybe, maybe not.

A Hyper 212+ with two Gentle Typhoon AP-1850s is going to put out, what, 36 dBA?

It's not like everyone needs an obscene chunk of metal like the nh-d14 with deltas and crap on it. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

(for point of reference, my obscene chunk of metal is probably putting out ~50 dBA right now, and I still subject myself to less noise than the AVC unit @ 100 percent fan speed).

I can enjoy a Phenom II X4 965 BE @ 3.8 core / 2.7 uncore running practically silently, thanks to a Hyper 212+, which barely cost me $30.

Yeah, what you said. Until I did a fan swap on my nh-d14, it was near-silent as well. The Mugen 2 is also a good one for silent (or near-silent) overclocking.

 

[Tsavo]

I have the H212+ with single stock fan. It does put out noise on full tilt but it's not an annoying noise...just a rush of air with a background of fan whine. Stock LGA 775 in my other PC makes me want to punch kittens when it ramps up.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Stock LGA 775 in my other PC makes me want to punch kittens when it ramps up.

The ASPCA does not endorse that HSF. At all.

OP, one other thing: if you DO want to go the Intel route, which is perfectly valid, then might I make the following recommendations:

CPU: http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?name=...69951db3eae73a

RAM: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820231321

Motherboard: no immediate recommendation, just get a relatively inexpensive P55 board with decent PWM cooling + whatever on-board features you need

HSF: http://www.directron.com/scmg2100.html?gsear=1

TIM: http://www.frys.com/product/6274400 <-- might find this at a better price elsewhere, but I paid more for mine back in the day . . .

Fans: http://www.jab-tech.com/Scythe-Gentle-Typhoon-D1225C12B5AP-15-1850rpm-pr-4501.html <-- get two of these

If you go the AMD route, I recommend:

CPU: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applicati...23-100968490-2 <-- this is actually the 95w chip, not the 125w chip that Tiger Direct seems to think that it is

RAM: whatever you have now

Motherboard: Find a good DDR2-capable board that can do at least 285 mhz HTT. Don't have any recommendations handy, but someone out there must know of one . . .

HSF, TIM, Fans . . . same recommendation as with the Intel rig.

Possible alternate HSF: http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/thbauncpucos.html

It comes with no fans, but with 2x Gentle Typhoons, that would not be a problem for you. It might outperform the Mugen 2, though probably not by a whole lot.

Also . . . what PSU do you have?

 

[Scali]

AMD processors come with extremely good stock coolers.

While I agree that AMD's recent stock coolers are considerably better than Intel's, I still think that a $50 aftermarket cooler is a considerable improvement over either (as your own links show, plenty of coolers stay well below that 17C, and the noise levels of AMD's cooler aren't exactly brilliant either).

I'm not sure how fair these benchmarks are towards Intel coolers though. It appears they only tested Pentium D and Core2 Duo coolers, not the newer Core i7 ones, which are quite different. Especially the Pentium D cooler is horribly old and in no way representative.
I think you missed one Intel cooler as well. The best one is the Intel FCLGA4-S Reference (P mode), at 24.5C. Still not great, but hey.

 

[ShawnD1]

I'm not sure how fair these benchmarks are towards Intel coolers though. It appears they only tested Pentium D and Core2 Duo coolers, not the newer Core i7 ones, which are quite different. Especially the Pentium D cooler is horribly old and in no way representative.
I think you missed one Intel cooler as well. The best one is the Intel FCLGA4-S Reference (P mode), at 24.5C. Still not great, but hey.

I think they still use the same coolers.

This is a Pentium D and Core 2 Duo stock cooler:

This is the i5 stock cooler.

This is the i7 stock cooler: (it's the same)

 

[Scali]

No it's not.
They're the same design, but there are differences in height... and the more high-end series (eg socket 1366) have one that is a size larger. There may also be differences with the copper insert at the bottom.
You cannot tell that from such pictures. They all look alike.

See these pictures from Anandtech:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/2832/3

As you see, there are at least three different sizes. The Core2 is the one closest to the Pentium D one (socket 775)... but it is a low-profile version, probably from a low-end Core2. I have a Pentium E5200 which has one of those, while my E6600 came with one that is twice as high.

Still, Anandtech managed an overclock to 3.5 GHz on the modest stock cooler... that's not bad, although not quite as good as the 4.2 GHz they got out of the aftermarket cooler.

Some more pictures...
Here's one with no copper on the bottom:

And here's the same model with copper:

And here you can see a low-profile and full-height one next to eachother:

So there are a lot more Intel stock coolers available than you'd think at first sight. They all look alike to the untrained eye... but differences in diameter, height, and use of copper can make quite a difference.

 

[heyheybooboo]

Gigabyte GA-890GPA-UD3H / Crucial 4GB (2 x 2GB) DDR3 1333: $218

Sapphire Radeon HD 5770 1GB: $135 after rebate

With Athlon II X4 630 Propus: $452

With Phenom II X4 945 Deneb: $493




--

 

[DrMrLordX]

Gigabyte GA-890GPA-UD3H / Crucial 4GB (2 x 2GB) DDR3 1333: $218

--

I get the impression that he's going to be re-using his DDR2 if he goes with an AMD system.

 

[Scali]

I guess his wishes of having a COM and LPT port are pretty much out of the question, regardless of whether he goes AMD or Intel...
So far I haven't found a board on either side that still supports them.

 

[Rifter]

you can buy a PCI card thats adds a LPT and COM port, or at least you used to be able to.

 

[Scali]

you can buy a PCI card thats adds a LPT and COM port, or at least you used to be able to.

Yea I know... there are also USB-based solutions... but those would add to the total cost of the system. Was just wondering if there were still some boards around that still support COM/LPT out of the box.
My current board is already 4 years old now (Asus P5B Deluxe), and already it didn't have an LPT anymore. Still one COM port though.
I've also seen some systems that don't have PS/2 keyboard/mouse anymore either. Virtually everything going to USB now.

 

[evolucion8]

My gf motherboard which is an AMD2+ and has a AMD 770 chipset has both, useless though...

 

[aigomorla]

I want a LGA1366 AM X6...

yeah i heard those were totally badass!

it a joint venture from intel / amd to make the most badass cpu one can get.

There gonna call it the nehalem PH! for PHAT!

Ok.. now comic relief is done...
Can we please leave the amd/ intel pissing contest out the door.

In all honesty op, the intel rig is a better game rig, because ur not limited to sli or xfire, thats IF multi gpu is your thing.

The AMD is a better general machine.

In office apps, and every day tasks outside of games, you wont be unhappy with either.

 

[Vette73]

I guess his wishes of having a COM and LPT port are pretty much out of the question, regardless of whether he goes AMD or Intel...
So far I haven't found a board on either side that still supports them.

Then you did nto even look at the AMD side. PLenty of them have the COM port and some have the LPT port as well.

Here is a new 8XX series board with a COM port
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813130290

Let alone a lot of the 770 boards from AMD also support the newwer chips and have legacy ports.

AMD has a lot of back support while Intel uses every chance they get for a new socket, chipsetset, etc...

 

[Scali]

Here is a new 8XX series board with a COM port

I think he said COM *and* LPT. I don't see LPT, do you?

AMD has a lot of back support while Intel uses every chance they get for a new socket, chipsetset, etc...

Ah yea, there comes the Intel-bashing again.
I think we could do without that. Why don't we concentrate on finding a board with COM and LPT first...

 

[extra]

Man so much FUD in this thread ^_^. No the AMD system won't be much (if any) slower in real world use. And yes, Intel does keep changing sockets, but in reality psh it's not a big deal--the "oh no, new socket every year" thing is FUD...how long has 1366 lasted and been top of the line? More than a year? A nice socket 775 system is still excellent (e8400, anyone?). That socket has been around forever. Buy based on what you can get a killer deal on now, not based on what might be.

Anyway, if you want AMD then buy AMD...there's no harm in doing so. It doesn't perform much if any differently in real world use anyway. If you had a 4ghz amd 6-core and a 4ghz i5 750, for example...the i5 would be faster in most things that weren't heavily multithreaded, and the amd would win at heavily multithreaded things. But here's the thing...it's not enough slower or faster that you'd notice much difference. Especially in games.

I had a 4ghz 1090t (my friend wanted it bad so I sold to him because another friend sold me an i7 870 for $100, couldn't pass that up!)...my i7 870 at 4.2ghz is *slightly* faster in some things, but I feel that the AMD system was slightly faster at some photo related things that I do. Meh.

I do strongly feel that if you go AMD, spend the money and get the hex-core. They made some process tweaks and they run cooler, clock higher, etc. They make a better "quad core" than the actual quad core chips do. And there's deals to be had. If you go Intel, then great, get a 530, 750, 875k, or 920...the rest are just fluff imho (most of the AMD line is fluff too imho when you take OC'ing into account!)

 

[Fern]

Stop with the "fanboy" and other remarks in the nature of personal attacks.

Please keep this thread On Topic out of respect for the OP.

I'm not a techie and don't care which company makes better CPU's etc, but I do care that this thread stays OT and respectful.

I'll be monitoring this thread.

Thanks for your cooperation

Fern
Super moderator

 

[DrMrLordX]

But here's the thing...it's not enough slower or faster that you'd notice much difference. Especially in games.

Yeah, prolly.

I do strongly feel that if you go AMD, spend the money and get the hex-core. They made some process tweaks and they run cooler, clock higher, etc. They make a better "quad core" than the actual quad core chips do.

Indeed they do! E0 stepping rox0rs. edit: but only after overclocking is taken into account. Quads like the 965BE have an advantage @ stock in sparsely-threaded apps over, say, the 1055T. But since the OP is going to overclock, I hardly see that as being a problem.

 

[Gikaseixas]

If Markfw900 hadn't beat me to your post below I probably would've wacked you with a ban stick. I said keep this thread OT. Comments about moderation and complaints about other members belong elsewhere (Moderator Discussion for example).

Fern
Super Moderator.

The topic clearly says "What's best AMD for general use?" but still the same guy i've been telling all along to back off when it comes to his bias, managed to come in here and post "Intel is better".

Mods please do something, don't just warn but ban this guy already, he needs a vacation. This is yet another thread that he derailed successfully. I uesd to come here and have civilized discussions but now both video and cpu forums are infested with this dude's crap.


There are things being done (see above for one).

Now lets try and get this thread back on track please.
Markfw900
Anandtech Moderator.