What should happen to this guy?

[FP]

A Salinas man was struck and killed at a gas station.

A transient who was washing car windows outside a gas station in Salinas died after on Friday being knocked down by a man buying gas, according to police.

Santa Clara resident Orion Moore, 29, and a female companion stopped at the Pilot Truck Stop, located at 951 Work St., to buy gas.

When Moore exited the car, a transient, who was about 60 years old, said he wanted to wash Moore's windshield for money. Moore declined the offer, according to police.

The transient loitered around the car and a while later began washing the window. The female passenger exited the car to tell the transient to leave.

Moore allegedly ran out of the Pilot and knocked the transient to the ground. The man struck his head on the pavement and was transported to a nearby hospital, where he died, according to police.

Officers arrested Moore at the gas station.

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I think he shouldn't charged. It was an unfortunate accident. It wasn't his intention to kill the guy and he might have sensed a threat to his wife/girlfriend.

 

[spaceman]

reverse?

 

[FP]

Originally posted by: spaceman
reverse?

Let a 60-year old man push him to the ground?

 

[ric1287]

transient, haha. Why can't they just say "a hobo"

 

[compuwiz1]

He should be charged. He made the choice to get physical with the guy, knocking him to the ground. It's unfortunate that the guy died but that is the potential consequence to that action.

 

[CRXican]

he chose to use physical violence to resolve the issue, he is responsible

 

[Whisper]

There will, and in my opinion should, likely be a minor charge, since the driver should not have physically shoved/pushed/knocked over the unwelcome windshield washer. Just ask him to leave, get in the car, and drive away.

 

[KeithTalent]

Originally posted by: compuwiz1
He should be charged. He made the choice to get physical with the guy, knocking him to the ground. It's unfortunate that the guy died but that is the potential consequence to that action.

This.

KT

 

[PepePeru]

wouldn't this be manslaughter?

 

[SonnyDaze]

Originally posted by: compuwiz1
He should be charged. He made the choice to get physical with the guy, knocking him to the ground. It's unfortunate that the guy died but that is the potential consequence to that action.

Agreed.

Originally posted by: G Wizard
wouldn't this be manslaughter?

He should be charged with involuntary manslaughter. Though he didn't intend to do it it happened on his account.

 

[FP]

Aren't you allowed to physically defend your personal property? If he started kicking the guy's car would he be allowed to touch the guy?

Also, I guess it depends on the situation, but if I was inside a store and saw my wife outside of our car yelling and the homeless dude I told to go away is seemingly harassing her I would have done the same. It looks like a threatening situation.

Maybe I am jaded because I have experienced some extremely physical homeless people in the Bay Area but things can go south quick.

 

[Descartes]

If the man wasn't a transient I doubt you'd be questioning what should happen.

Moore's actions led directly to the death of another human being. Unless you can claim self-defense (don't see how), that's involuntary manslaughter (isn't it?).

<-- not a lawyer obviously

 

[Descartes]

Originally posted by: FP
Aren't you allowed to physically defend your personal property? If he started kicking the guy's car would he be allowed to touch the guy?

Why speculate? The story says nothing of destruction to his property. All it says is that Moore ran out of the store and knocked the man over.

Also, I guess it depends on the situation, but if I was inside a store and saw my wife outside of our car yelling and the homeless dude I told to go away is seemingly harassing her I would have done the same. It looks like a threatening situation.

I would do the same, but clearly this wasn't the case. Anyone living in a large city has had encounters with the stubborn window washers.

Maybe I am jaded because I have experienced some extremely physical homeless people in the Bay Area but things can go south quick.

I'm willing to guess that there aren't many instances of a transient window washer going crazy on a pedestrian/driver/whomever because they didn't want their services.

 

[joesmoke]

what if it was the same situation, but it was YOU or YOUR SON selling candy bars and not a hobo asking to wash a window. would you think he should be unpunished then?

 

[FP]

Originally posted by: Descartes

Originally posted by: FP
Aren't you allowed to physically defend your personal property? If he started kicking the guy's car would he be allowed to touch the guy?

Why speculate? The story says nothing of destruction to his property. All it says is that Moore ran out of the store and knocked the man over.

Also, I guess it depends on the situation, but if I was inside a store and saw my wife outside of our car yelling and the homeless dude I told to go away is seemingly harassing her I would have done the same. It looks like a threatening situation.

I would do the same, but clearly this wasn't the case. Anyone living in a large city has had encounters with the stubborn window washers.

Maybe I am jaded because I have experienced some extremely physical homeless people in the Bay Area but things can go south quick.

I'm willing to guess that there aren't many instances of a transient window washer going crazy on a pedestrian/driver/whomever because they didn't want their services.

Well the description of the story doesn't have his side of it.

And yes, I have had homeless window washers mess with my car on more than 1 occasion after telling them I didn't want their services. Side mirrors bent inwards, spraying the car body with solution, slamming their hand on the glass, etc.

I've even seen a group of 3 homeless guys kick in my friend's car door after he refused to pay them to "watch" his vehicle while he was gone.

 

[CRXican]

Originally posted by: FP
Aren't you allowed to physically defend your personal property? If he started kicking the guy's car would he be allowed to touch the guy?

Also, I guess it depends on the situation, but if I was inside a store and saw my wife outside of our car yelling and the homeless dude I told to go away is seemingly harassing her I would have done the same. It looks like a threatening situation.

Maybe I am jaded because I have experienced some extremely physical homeless people in the Bay Area but things can go south quick.

silly ho should have stayed in the car

 

[Ns1]

Originally posted by: FP

Originally posted by: Descartes

Originally posted by: FP
Aren't you allowed to physically defend your personal property? If he started kicking the guy's car would he be allowed to touch the guy?

Why speculate? The story says nothing of destruction to his property. All it says is that Moore ran out of the store and knocked the man over.

Also, I guess it depends on the situation, but if I was inside a store and saw my wife outside of our car yelling and the homeless dude I told to go away is seemingly harassing her I would have done the same. It looks like a threatening situation.

I would do the same, but clearly this wasn't the case. Anyone living in a large city has had encounters with the stubborn window washers.

Maybe I am jaded because I have experienced some extremely physical homeless people in the Bay Area but things can go south quick.

I'm willing to guess that there aren't many instances of a transient window washer going crazy on a pedestrian/driver/whomever because they didn't want their services.

Well the description of the story doesn't have his side of it.

And yes, I have had homeless window washers mess with my car on more than 1 occasion after telling them I didn't want their services. Side mirrors bent inwards, spraying the car body with solution, slamming their hand on the glass, etc.

I've even seen a group of 3 homeless guys kick in my friend's car door after he refused to pay them to "watch" his vehicle while he was gone.

this.

need to know full story and/or see tapes.

 

[judasmachine]

Originally posted by: KeithTalent

Originally posted by: compuwiz1
He should be charged. He made the choice to get physical with the guy, knocking him to the ground. It's unfortunate that the guy died but that is the potential consequence to that action.

This.

KT

^

 

[UnixFreak]

I am no lawyer, but it sounds like involuntary manslaughter, and yes I think he should be charged, and they need to figure out an appropriate punishment in court. Any time you assault someone something like this can happen, and you know it. Sure, the odds are against it, and it might the furthest thing from your thoughts, but as an adult you know hitting someone can cause something like this. He does need to be punished appropriately. I dont think he deserves life in prison, but he certainly needs to pay for a crime like this.

 

[Iron Woode]

kick his ass seabass!

 

[episodic]

Sometimes, I think mistakes happen that don't require vengeance - if he acted in such a way as to defend his girlfriend from an unknown stranger - then I think that unknown strangers should stay the heck away when you tell them to. I don't advocate 'killing' just to kill, but a physical removal in which an accident occurred doesn't mean someone should spend their life in prison and be ruined. This attitude is why we lock up a higher percentage of our population than any other country. Soon we'll be a country where you can't defend yourself or property at all if this reasoning continues. . .

Slippery slope disbelievers - I minored in philosophy - so please, save me your arguments. In the real world one thing does seem to cause another . . .

 

[PepePeru]

Originally posted by: episodic
Sometimes, I think mistakes happen that don't require vengeance - if he acted in such a way as to defend his girlfriend from an unknown stranger - then I think that unknown strangers should stay the heck away when you tell them to. I don't advocate 'killing' just to kill, but a physical removal in which an accident occurred doesn't mean someone should spend their life in prison and be ruined. This attitude is why we lock up a higher percentage of our population than any other country. Soon we'll be a country where you can't defend yourself or property at all if this reasoning continues. . .

Slippery slope disbelievers - I minored in philosophy - so please, save me your arguments. In the real world one thing does seem to cause another . . .

i don't think it has a thing to do with involuntary manslaughter cases...

oooooh, minored in philosophy.

i bow before your mental prowess.

 

[episodic]

Originally posted by: G Wizard

Originally posted by: episodic
Sometimes, I think mistakes happen that don't require vengeance - if he acted in such a way as to defend his girlfriend from an unknown stranger - then I think that unknown strangers should stay the heck away when you tell them to. I don't advocate 'killing' just to kill, but a physical removal in which an accident occurred doesn't mean someone should spend their life in prison and be ruined. This attitude is why we lock up a higher percentage of our population than any other country. Soon we'll be a country where you can't defend yourself or property at all if this reasoning continues. . .

Slippery slope disbelievers - I minored in philosophy - so please, save me your arguments. In the real world one thing does seem to cause another . . .

i don't think it has a thing to do with involuntary manslaughter cases...

oooooh, minored in philosophy.

i bow before your mental prowess.

Look, I've got an average IQ and my GPA was high, but in the real world that means jack.

I don't have much more mental prowess than the next, I just wanted to let those that may start all of the 'philosophical arguments' that are thrown around in forums - know that I have an opinion that isn't going to be influenced by that because of my own personal beliefs.

If you still want to bow - go for it, but I neither asked for it or deserve it.

 

[ggnl]

Originally posted by: episodic

Originally posted by: G Wizard

Originally posted by: episodic
Sometimes, I think mistakes happen that don't require vengeance - if he acted in such a way as to defend his girlfriend from an unknown stranger - then I think that unknown strangers should stay the heck away when you tell them to. I don't advocate 'killing' just to kill, but a physical removal in which an accident occurred doesn't mean someone should spend their life in prison and be ruined. This attitude is why we lock up a higher percentage of our population than any other country. Soon we'll be a country where you can't defend yourself or property at all if this reasoning continues. . .

Slippery slope disbelievers - I minored in philosophy - so please, save me your arguments. In the real world one thing does seem to cause another . . .

i don't think it has a thing to do with involuntary manslaughter cases...

oooooh, minored in philosophy.

i bow before your mental prowess.

Look, I've got an average IQ and my GPA was high, but in the real world that means jack.

I don't have much more mental prowess than the next, I just wanted to let those that may start all of the 'philosophical arguments' that are thrown around in forums - know that I have an opinion that isn't going to be influenced by that because of my own personal beliefs.

If you still want to bow - go for it, but I neither asked for it or deserve it.

You used an appeal to authority to try to circumvent a valid arguement. You were totally asking for it.

 

[episodic]

Originally posted by: ggnl

Originally posted by: episodic

Originally posted by: G Wizard

Originally posted by: episodic
Sometimes, I think mistakes happen that don't require vengeance - if he acted in such a way as to defend his girlfriend from an unknown stranger - then I think that unknown strangers should stay the heck away when you tell them to. I don't advocate 'killing' just to kill, but a physical removal in which an accident occurred doesn't mean someone should spend their life in prison and be ruined. This attitude is why we lock up a higher percentage of our population than any other country. Soon we'll be a country where you can't defend yourself or property at all if this reasoning continues. . .

Slippery slope disbelievers - I minored in philosophy - so please, save me your arguments. In the real world one thing does seem to cause another . . .

i don't think it has a thing to do with involuntary manslaughter cases...

oooooh, minored in philosophy.

i bow before your mental prowess.

Look, I've got an average IQ and my GPA was high, but in the real world that means jack.

I don't have much more mental prowess than the next, I just wanted to let those that may start all of the 'philosophical arguments' that are thrown around in forums - know that I have an opinion that isn't going to be influenced by that because of my own personal beliefs.

If you still want to bow - go for it, but I neither asked for it or deserve it.

You used an appeal to authority to try to circumvent a valid arguement. You were totally asking for it.

Haha