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What router can stand out against considerable usage?

W

WaiWai

Senior member
It's for a local/home network.
It should at least support 10M (download/upload), preferably 30M (download/upload).
It should be stable and no constant crashing/reboots.
No specific budget. Prefer getting the cheaper unless it's proved to be of great help.

All desktop computers will be connected by wire. It will do all sorts of things (instant messaging, voice/video chat, Internet Phone, receiving streaming data, gaming and FTP, P2P/BT).
The notebook computer will be connected wirelessly. It will do all sorts of things except FTP/P2P/BT since wireless network is less reliable and slow.

1) Does the above setup need a strong wireless router, like fast download & upload speed, support many simultaneous connections?
If so, how many number of simultaneous connections are enough for normal usage of P2P/BT?

2) What router can support many connection types?
For example support ASDL, ADSL2, ADSL2+, VSDL, and fiber connections.

3) Router has many features which make me confused. I'm unsure if such a local network needs those features.
What features would a local network like the above need, or shuld I pay attention to?
I prefer buying cheaper, especially if the feature means little for a typical local/home network.

Some features that I'm aware of:
- QoS
- Stateful packet inspection (SPI)
- NAT firewalls
- Intrusion detection
- MAC address filtering
- DHCP servers
- DDNS
- VPN
- VoIP
- UPnP
- ISDN

3) What kinds of security features/implementation do I need to secure the local network?
What kinds of encryption do I need? What is enough? WEP? WPA? WPA2?

4) What wireless networking access standard should I get?
802.11g or 802.11n or else?
 
Asus 500g premium with ddrwrt is probably the best you can get for cheap. There is an N version on newegg too and they are around $100. They have double the ram of the typical home router.
 
Routers per se do not support ASDL, ADSL2, ADSL2+, VSDL, and fiber connections.

They need an ethernet connection in the input, it is the role of a modem or other interfaces (dpending on the type of connection) to convert the external feed ibto Etherent.
Click to expand...

Well, the modem will be provided by the ISP. We want to make sure we can use the same router when we move to a new place with a new ISP, or when we change services. We don't want to buy a new router simply because we can't use the old one to share the connection.

Does router generally support all sorts of broadband technology the ISP is offering?
 
Technologically 802.11n improves the transfer speed between Local computers (It does not improve Internet Speed).

Therefore, if someone really uses the Wireless for serious Wireless LAN work it might be a consideration to get a Draft-N, otherwise saving few seconds on casual transfer does not worth the investment.
Click to expand...

Most are connected via wired. Different computers will share data among one another. The desktop will also be used to share our free resources to the rest of the world.

The notebook is mainly used to get Internet connection. It won't do heavy data transfer or FTP/BT/P2P. Otherwise we can always connect it by wired and get better speed (?). I believe every cheap wired router can deliver 12.5MB/s, isn't it?

We want our router able to accept higher speed Internet connection so we don't need to change router when ISP offers faster connection. Since we don't use the wireless part of connection to do heavy data transfer (it will still receive streaming data, phone/video chat, Internet phone etc.), does it mean we don't need to get a powerful wireless router? It seems all wired can offer fast connection(?).

I don't know if we need 802.11n in our case where we can have faster Internet connection.
 
Originally posted by: WaiWai
Routers per se do not support ASDL, ADSL2, ADSL2+, VSDL, and fiber connections.

They need an ethernet connection in the input, it is the role of a modem or other interfaces (dpending on the type of connection) to convert the external feed ibto Etherent.
Click to expand...

Well, the modem will be provided by the ISP. We want to make sure we can use the same router when we move to a new place with a new ISP, or when we change services. We don't want to buy a new router simply because we can't use the old one to share the connection.

Does router generally support all sorts of broadband technology the ISP is offering?
Click to expand...

The input on the routers to the modem will be a standard Ethernet connection, so you'll be able to bring a router to another ISP, no problem. You don't need to worry about the technology, the modem will take care of that part.
 
Originally posted by: SpunkyJones
Originally posted by: WaiWai
Routers per se do not support ASDL, ADSL2, ADSL2+, VSDL, and fiber connections.

They need an ethernet connection in the input, it is the role of a modem or other interfaces (dpending on the type of connection) to convert the external feed ibto Etherent.
Click to expand...

Well, the modem will be provided by the ISP. We want to make sure we can use the same router when we move to a new place with a new ISP, or when we change services. We don't want to buy a new router simply because we can't use the old one to share the connection.

Does router generally support all sorts of broadband technology the ISP is offering?
Click to expand...

The input on the routers to the modem will be a standard Ethernet connection, so you'll be able to bring a router to another ISP, no problem. You don't need to worry about the technology, the modem will take care of that part.
Click to expand...

Hmm... I see different routers are listing slightly different network protocols in the specifications. The terms that I see: "PPPoE, PPPoA, Dynamic IP, CSMA/CA, CSMA/CD, TCP/IP, DHCP, ICMP, NAT". What do they mean? I think it is related to the broadband technology that are supported. But which is which? If I miss some that are not list, I may not be able to share some types of connections. It's what I know (it could be wrong though. I'm pretty confused at all those stuff).

Is it really *ALL* router support any type of connection sharing?

Another question, do all router support Windows Vista and Windows XP?


 
Unless there is something unusual about your Internet needs then state clearly what it is.

Otherwise these type of specs are uniform across Entry Level Router and do not differentiate between them.

If you really want to know what they are buy a book and do some studying. Real explanation of all of this is beyond a scope of a forum post.

******************
Inexpensive Flashable with DD-WRT*.
Asus WL-520GU

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16833320023

--------------------
Very Solid with DD-WRT (Mediocre Wireless).

Linksys WRT54GL

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16833124190

--------------------

Not compatible with DD-WRT but as is features rich and Good Wireless.

Zyxel 550 -

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...181218&Tpk=zyxel%2b550

---------------------
*What is DD-WRT?

http://www.dd-wrt.com/wiki/ind...hat_is_%22DD-WRT%22%3F

===========

OK, but why Not 802.11n?

Because there is No 802.11n standard, there is only Draft-N pre/maybe hardware.

Almost all the manufacturers claim on the front page of the Data Sheets that it would be compatible with the 802.11n standard when it comes out.

Then put in small letters on the last page a Disclaimer that basically voids what was stated on the first page.

Quote from a top manufacturer Data Sheet (I Bolded few words).

"This product is based on IEEE draft 802.11n specifications and is not guaranteed to be
forward compatible with future versions of IEEE 802.11n specifications. Compatibility
with draft 802.11n devices from other manufacturers is not guaranteed. All references
to speed and range are for comparison purposes only. Product specifications, size and
shape are subject to change without notice, and actual product appearance may differ
from that depicted herein".
End of Quote.

The standard is Not out because the concerned parties are fighting over it. Therefore, it is implicit that at the end the Draft-N devices of the losers will not be compatible or upgradable.

To benefit from Draft-N the Router and the Wireless card have to be Draft-N.

The Hardware is currently about $80 +$80 for Router and a card for the first computer. and $80 for each additional one.

What you get for this money?

Technologically 802.11n improves the transfer speed between Local computers (It does not improve Internet Speed).

Therefore, if someone really uses the Wireless for serious Wireless LAN work it might be a consideration to get a Draft-N, otherwise saving few seconds on casual transfer does not worth the investment.

Second advantage of N might be coverage. However, the expectations are really exaggerated. In most cases if the environment is highly unfriendly to Wireless, switching from g to N is Not going to yield dramatic improvement. The RF output of the N is the same as the g (about 33mW) the bandwidth gains are achieve by the additional MIMO arrangement of the Antennae.

Some Routers have a Giga switch. However, in most of them the switch is mediocre and bellow.

I find that if One uses a separate Giga switch for the Giga capable computers, and uses the Router's port for the 100Mb/sec. devices, the Giga part of the network works better.

In sum, buy a Draft-N if there is a real technological advantage for your specific Network, otherwise leave Trendy waste of money to others.
 
Unless there is something unusual about your Internet needs then research it.
state clearly what it is.
Click to expand...

Here's what we want to do with our computers:
- browsing Internet
- instant messaging
- voice and video chatting
- receiving streaming data, videos etc.
- Internet phone (to mobile phones and telephone)
- host/join games on game servers, or play in LAN network
- send or receive files
- share our resources by mainly P2P/BT to the rest of the world (wired connection only)
- may do light FTP (wired connection only)

We know wireless network is slow, so we switch all heavy data transfer task to wired.

I do not need to know the details of the technology alone. I just want to know if I can benefit from those technology/features, or whether our network needs it.

PS: About the post above, I have read it already from the link you posted initially. You said "buy a Draft-N if there is a real technological advantage for your specific Network". Well our case seems to fit what you mean by specific network. The case is described in Post #5:
Most are connected via wired. Different computers will share data among one another. The desktop will also be used to share our free resources to the rest of the world.

The notebook is mainly used to get Internet connection. It won't do heavy data transfer or FTP/BT/P2P. Otherwise we can always connect it by wired and get better speed (?). I believe every cheap wired router can deliver 12.5MB/s, isn't it?

We want our router able to accept higher speed Internet connection so we don't need to change router when ISP offers faster connection. Since we don't use the wireless part of connection to do heavy data transfer (it will still receive streaming data, phone/video chat, Internet phone etc.), does it mean we don't need to get a powerful wireless router? It seems all wired can offer fast connection(?).

I don't know if we need 802.11n in our case where we can have faster Internet connection.
Click to expand...
 
These are the questions that are left unanswered, and I'm still puzzling over:
1) Do I need to buy a fast wireless router in our case?
2) Is it true that *ALL* routers can let us share connections of *ANY* technology provided by *ANY* ISP (this would be ADSL, ADSL2+, VDSL, fibre)? The ISP will provide a modem. We only buy a gateway router.
3) Specifically what sorts of features do we need for such kinds of network and usage?
4) How can we know if my router can *actually* support 100Mb speed (wired LAN) and 30Mb (wired Internet), and some moderate speed (wireless Internet)? I realise the specifications stated by the manufacturer can be very different from the advertised?
5) How can we know how many number of PC connections, and linkups to the sources on Internet?
For example, 3 PCs connected by wire, and each PC will distribute our own resources to 100 peers by BT. There are also 2 PCs connected wirelessly.
 
Draft-N cam help if your Internet connection is above 15Mb/sec.

Draft-N does not do any thing for wire transfer.

If you want faster wire transfer you better of buying an independent good Giga switch and plug Giga capable computers into it.

Draft-N might help if there is a real need for fast LAN (Local Not Internet) transfer.

Do not ask me to recommend Drat-N.

I do not want you to cast a bad omen on my name ( 😉 ) later on when you find out that your expensive Dratf-N plastic box is among the devices that are Not compatible with the final standard when it comes out.
 
Well if draft-n can only help to boost "wireless part" of the wireless router and it's expensive to get, we will probably not consider it whether or not the future compatibility issues.

I believe our network card can only support up to 100Mb/s (=12.5MB/s). It really depends on the cost of the upgrade to Gigabit [Gigabit network card + Gigabit switch + gigabit router(?)] which can only help in LAN network. How high is the cost? Seemingly quite high.

I think our focus should be to improve the speed of the wire connection to the Internet. It seems many routers claim to support 100Mb theoreticially, but how many can *actually* support up to 100Mb?
 
Questions:
1) do I need to buy a gateway router which has gigabit port?
AFAIK, I believe the setup is:
Modem <--> Router <--> Switch <--> NIC
2) Can it really do what it claims? Although it says it can run up to 1000Mb (assuming we can really use that much), it doesn't mean it actually can.
 
Giga switch can be connected to regular Router (No need for any special accommodation on the Router).

The Giga would run only between the Computers with Giga cards that are connected to it.

Average End-user get transfer of 25 to 35 when doing Giga (100Mb/sec produces 8 to 10B/sec.)

Good optimized Entry Level Giga with Windows Client OS can get up to about 48MB/sec.
 
Originally posted by: WaiWai
Originally posted by: Madwand1
Originally posted by: WaiWai
It seems many routers claim to support 100Mb theoreticially, but how many can *actually* support up to 100Mb?
Click to expand...

http://www.smallnetbuilder.com...,com_chart/Itemid,189/
Click to expand...

It's the test of the "wireless part" of speed, not the wired part.
Click to expand...

This is one of the most useless table concerning End-Users systems.

It is a WAN to LAN transfer in the Router.

It has nothing to do with wire or wireless

 
Originally posted by: WaiWai
It's the test of the "wireless part" of speed, not the wired part.
Click to expand...

"WAN" in this context meant Wide Area Network, i.e. the port intended to connect to the Internet service. "WLAN" is more typically used to describe the wireless LAN.

If that link didn't answer your question, then perhaps you could clarify it to get a more appropriate answer.
 
Having a gigabit wan port is a good way to future proof your investment. When isp's begin exceeding the 10/100 rate of a standard wan port a gigabit port will be ready to handle the flow. I personally use a d-link dgl-4500 router so my network looks like this: linksys befcmu10 v4 cable modem - d-link dgl-4500 router - hp procurve 1400-8g gigabit switch that populates the lan jacks in my home. I'm salivating over the prospect of having docsis 3 service with multichannel downstreams. Come on comcast roll it out in Jax.😀
 
Originally posted by: Puffnstuff
Having a gigabit wan port is a good way to future proof your investment. When isp's begin exceeding the 10/100 rate of a standard wan port a gigabit port will be ready to handle the flow. I personally use a d-link dgl-4500 router so my network looks like this: linksys befcmu10 v4 cable modem - d-link dgl-4500 router - hp procurve 1400-8g gigabit switch that populates the lan jacks in my home. I'm salivating over the prospect of having docsis 3 service with multichannel downstreams. Come on comcast roll it out in Jax.😀
Click to expand...

Why would you need a Gb WAN port?? When is 100Mb+ broadband going to be standard? Hell, when is 10 Mb broadband going to be standard? And how much cheaper is a Gb router going to cost when it is? Are they even available now? Silly.
 
Originally posted by: WaiWai
These are the questions that are left unanswered, and I'm still puzzling over:
1) Do I need to buy a fast wireless router in our case?
2) Is it true that *ALL* routers can let us share connections of *ANY* technology provided by *ANY* ISP (this would be ADSL, ADSL2+, VDSL, fibre)? The ISP will provide a modem. We only buy a gateway router.
3) Specifically what sorts of features do we need for such kinds of network and usage?
4) How can we know if my router can *actually* support 100Mb speed (wired LAN) and 30Mb (wired Internet), and some moderate speed (wireless Internet)? I realise the specifications stated by the manufacturer can be very different from the advertised?
5) How can we know how many number of PC connections, and linkups to the sources on Internet?
For example, 3 PCs connected by wire, and each PC will distribute our own resources to 100 peers by BT. There are also 2 PCs connected wirelessly.
Click to expand...


1) It depends on how fast your internal file transfers need to be over wireless. 802.11g = 54 MBps, 802.11n = 74 MBps. Range for n is ~ 70 m vs. ~38 m for g though, so that's something to consider if you have a big house. However, you need to make sure your laptop is 802.11n capable. And in the past there were serious compatibility issues between different manufacturers' N-band products as the standards weren't really "standardized" -- don't know if this is still true today. Personally I'd say if you move big chunks of data to/from your laptop, just plug it into a gigabit switch.

2) Essentially yes. I haven't seen an ISP that doesn't put data on your PC through anything other than standard ethernet.

3) All you need is a lot of bandwidth, inside and outside. Outside is all ISP - AFAIK routers nowadays all have 10/100 WAN ports, and you are NOT getting 100+ Mbps internet to your home for a long while. Internally, it would be best to get yourself an 8-port gigabit switch. Connect one port to the router and all other ports to your PCs. Not only will this provide much better transfer rates between your computers at a low cost, all that traffic won't pass through your router and thus won't tax its resources.

4) Unless it's an old POS, it will have all ports at at least 100 Mbps. I'm not sure if they offer gigabit LAN ports now, but as I mentioned before, it would be better (and probably much cheaper) to have a separate gigabit switch.

5) Don't worry about that. There aren't any router restrictions on how many other computers you can be connected too. Bandwidth, however, WILL be a bottleneck. If you're uploading to 300 clients (if you even can) you better have some serious bandwidth.

Hope this helps.
 
kimchee, 100+ Mbs internet service is just around the corner. Comcast is rolling out DOCSIS 3.0 THIS YEAR.

In order to take advantage of these speeds you're going to need a router that will do the job. Not just the physical 1000 Base-T aspect but actually be able to forward packets at a high packet per second rate to actually use it.

Not too long ago routers that could do this cost 50,000 dollars and up. Amazing how fast technology moves.
 
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