What P4 Chipset would you use?

[Pabster]

DN wrote:

"People who REQUIRE nothing but stability do.. It's not all about frames per second to some people or a minute increase in price.."

Yep, that's exactly why I chose a Dual AMD rig for my frame-hungry applications. It's solid as a rock and destroys the Xeon (let alone P4) for a fraction of the cost. I still don't understand those who would even imply that an AMD solution is/will/would be any less stable than an Intel one. That logic has been disproven time and time again -- not only by the outspoken, but by those who rely on AMD-based machines on a daily basis.

Is it me or do the flame shooters always have the Grinch as their icon?

And why can't we just discuss the thread topic, instead of delving off in to (yet another) AMD vs Intel "debate"?

 

[JackBurton]

<< Yep, that's exactly why I chose a Dual AMD rig for my frame-hungry applications. It's solid as a rock and destroys the Xeon (let alone P4) for a fraction of the cost. I still don't understand those who would even imply that an AMD solution is/will/would be any less stable than an Intel one. >>


Uhh, there is still that little issue with your particular Tyan board that is still yet unresolved...Crucial memory being destroyed for some crazy reason. Tyan is saying they are aware of the problem and Crucial is saying there is no such problem. As it stands, Crucial memory isn't recommend for that board. I believe Corsair memory is one of Tyan's choices. If your rig is running great, that is awesome. But I wouldn't want that "little" issue hovering over my system.

 

[Pabster]

JackBurton wrote:

"Uhh, there is still that little issue with your particular Tyan board that is still yet unresolved...Crucial memory being destroyed for some crazy reason. Tyan is saying they are aware of the problem and Crucial is saying there is no such problem. As it stands, Crucial memory isn't recommend for that board. I believe Corsair memory is one of Tyan's choices. If your rig is running great, that is awesome. But I wouldn't want that "little" issue hovering over my system."

I've heard this rumor, but I don't buy it. I've used nothing but Crucial modules on several boards (including the S2460 and S2462 I'm using in rigs for personal use) and never had the slightest issue. A lot of people go to Corsair, of course, for the larger capacity modules (512+). And, both of my duallies are running great, Thanks

 

[NOS440]

Athlon4all I'm not sure why your so suprised with everyone choosing I850. I can't remember anyone saying that they had it and didn't love it. Also most all of us are already running at dam near PC 1000 with are easy overclocks. Most people are willing to pay a few bucks more for a sure thing

 

[GTaudiophile]

i845-B for me unless i850/Rambus combo is the same price when I purchase next month.

 

[Janus]

I was faced with the decision a few weeks ago between the P4 and an Athlon system - in the end, I went with a P4/1600 and Asus P4T-E (i850 chipset). Admittedly this system was idiot proof to build, thus far has been extremely stable, and certainly flies for the tasks I perform....office productivity software, watching DVDs, Internet surfing, web design, stat analysis, and playing a few games here and there. From what I've read on AT, the Intel chipset just felt like a safer bet because I wanted my system to be fast, stable, and not require much in the way of trouble-shooting, tweaking, or insufferable problem-solving or driver updates to make it stable. While a bit more speed for a less cost is certainly attractive, I also knew that having my system work without fail was far more important. After all, one doesn't want to deal with stability problems in the middle of writing one's doctoral dissertation! On the other hand, if I had time to play around and cost was more of an issue, I would have chosen the AMD Athlon system and never looked back.

As far as chipset, I decided upon the i850 and the Asus since I assumed those would be the best bets given everything I read and the fact that the i845 was not available just then. Perhaps today I might have considered an i845, but then again, now I have 512MB RDRAM, so as long as my Asus board will support some of the future Northwood P4's, I won't feel too cheated.

Just my .02.

 

[imgod2u]

I think that the only reason right now, for anyone to decide to buy a P4 is so that they can match it with an Intel chipset and have rock solid stability. To pair it with a third-party chipset would defeat the whole purpose of going for an Intel solution in the first place. You could easily just go for an AMD solution if you're going to use third party chipsets anyway. It'll outperform and be lower in price than similar Intel solutions. So basically, in my opinion at least, the only choices are Intel chipsets, and so far, the i850 is what performs the best.

 

[Janus]

<< I think that the only reason right now, for anyone to decide to buy a P4 is so that they can match it with an Intel chipset and have rock solid stability. To pair it with a third-party chipset would defeat the whole purpose of going for an Intel solution in the first place. You could easily just go for an AMD solution if you're going to use third party chipsets anyway. It'll outperform and be lower in price than similar Intel solutions. So basically, in my opinion at least, the only choices are Intel chipsets, and so far, the i850 is what performs the best. >>



I have to agree with you imgod2u....Of course I am very pleased with my P4 system and performance, but the stability and ease of ownership would be the largest factors for purchasing an i850 and P4 system. Truly, if it weren't for those two considerations, I would have gone with an Athon XP system in a heartbeat. Then again, I've historically always been an Intel customer, so it's probably what I'll stay with Intel in the future. (I also always buy Rockport dress shoes as an example - a pair of $50 Hush Puppies are probably just as comfortable and wear equally as well, but they aren't Rockports and I don't have the same amount of confidence in them. Does that mean they aren't as good as Rockports? Probably not....)

 

[rip22]

<< I think that the only reason right now, for anyone to decide to buy a P4 is so that they can match it with an Intel chipset and have rock solid stability. To pair it with a third-party chipset would defeat the whole purpose of going for an Intel solution in the first place. You could easily just go for an AMD solution if you're going to use third party chipsets anyway. It'll outperform and be lower in price than similar Intel solutions. So basically, in my opinion at least, the only choices are Intel chipsets, and so far, the i850 is what performs the best. >>

I disagree. People have been buying Pentium cpus in the past with non Intel chipsets so your argument falls right there, futhermore you dont have a upgrade path to Northwood with a socket a mobo and the performance crown will most likely go back to the P4 with Northwood..and as of today the SiS645 has the performance and price crown (cost less). Sure Intel is King of stability no argument there, but that dosent mean that other chipset manufactures cant make stable chipsets as well.

 

[oldfart]

I agree with imgod2u. People buy a P4 so they can use an Intel chipset mobo. If you are going with a VIA or SiS solution, might as well go AMD.

 

[thermite88]

I am an engineer in trade. I chose the P4 because it is a well enginerred product in term of packaging and thermal protection. AMD does not make the grade in these areas. In a recent Anandtech poll, even among the hobbyist here, 15% of AMD users have damaged beyond repair one of more Athlon CPU's.

I also believe that P4 will scale better than the older AMD architect and continue to pull away from AMD in the frequency race. The use of PR system by AMD is just the last straw.

I am using a Shuttle AV40 with VIA P4X266 because it is one of the first 478 socket board to the market. I am very pleasantly surprised by its stability compared to the P3 with Asus 815E (the CUSL2). But I am disappointed by its overclocking implementation. I cannot push the FSB beyond 118 MHz because there is no 1/4 PCI divider.

I did not switch to the i850 because Asus used 4-layer board for their P4T-E. My 4-layer AV40 is $60 cheaper and good enough for now.

I will definetely looking for SIS645 and I845-B boards if they have better OC capability than the Shuttle.

BTW, I am able to tweak the AV40 using the most agreesive memory timing with no sacrifice in stability. The Sandra memory scores are equal or better than most SIS645 reviews.

 

[Yoshi]

Until 845 officially is supporting DDR SDRAM, I have to say 850 with RDRAM. If you are going Intel, get an Intel chipset.

 

[imgod2u]

<< I disagree. People have been buying Pentium cpus in the past with non Intel chipsets so your argument falls right there, futhermore you dont have a upgrade path to Northwood with a socket a mobo and the performance crown will most likely go back to the P4 with Northwood..and as of today the SiS645 has the performance and price crown (cost less). Sure Intel is King of stability no argument there, but that dosent mean that other chipset manufactures cant make stable chipsets as well. >>



Well, as I said, currently, the only reason to get an Intel solution is if you want stability. Prior to the MP and XP solutions, Intel's chips still held the performance crown, so it was understandable back then for people to go Intel but not for the reason of stability. Also, some people just stick with Intel chips for reasons other than features, performance or stability, but we won't talk there. As for Northwood, it'll still cost a lot to get, and it really isn't a reason to go with a lower performing, more costly solution right now (shelling out $400 for a 2.0 GHz) just so you can replace it with a $600 CPU. So, as I've said, the only logical reason I can think of go to for an Intel solution right now is for the reason that Intel chipsets is guaranteed stability and compatibility. Going to a third-party chipset, you might as well use it with a higher performing, lower cost AMD chip.

 

[rip22]

<< Well, as I said, currently, the only reason to get an Intel solution is if you want stability. Prior to the MP and XP solutions, Intel's chips still held the performance crown, so it was understandable back then for people to go Intel but not for the reason of stability. >>

How about both performance and stability as reasons? Also prior to the MP and XP solutions there hasent been any chipset choices for the P4 until Via and SiS stept in. And people have been going with P3 and Celerons when the performmance crown has been with Athlons and Durons for whatever reasons...stability, reliability, performance, brand preference etc....

Bottomline is that people have been buying Intel Cpus and non intel chipset boards in the past. With the P4 there hasent been any choices until now.

Generally if people decide to go for a non Intel chipset board together with there cpu its lower cost, thats all there is to it.

<< As for Northwood, it'll still cost a lot to get, and it really isn't a reason to go with a lower performing, more costly solution right now (shelling out $400 for a 2.0 GHz) just so you can replace it with a $600 CPU. >>

I dont think so many people will buy a top of the line P4 (2 Ghz Willimette) right now today, just beacuse a month later upgrade to a Northwood.

IMHO, If you really need a P4 today and cant wait to end of January, getting a much lower priced Willamette today, say between 1.5-1.9Ghz makes more sense and then later upgrade to the Northwood after the initiall pricedrop.

<< So, as I've said, the only logical reason I can think of go to for an Intel solution right now is for the reason that Intel chipsets is guaranteed stability and compatibility. >>

Yes i agree, I have never had any problems with a Intel system, based on a Intel chipsets. Rock solid! Regarding the SiS645 chipset here is what TOM had to say about it SiS deserves to be greatly commended. The new SiS645 chipset was a pleasure to test, as it did not at all irritate with instabilities or incompatibilities.

Also i would like to add that the SiS board supports DDRAM and SDRAM how is that for compatibility?

<< Going to a third-party chipset, you might as well use it with a higher performing, lower cost AMD chip.>>

Like i said socket a boards dont support Northwoods


My 0.02$ cents.

 

[Mats]

An AMD platform is worth every cent. You get exactly what you pay for. Unlike a P4 solution which is overpriced with no benefits. Just b/c it costs more doesn't make it a better solution, on principle it makes it worse.

Quality to me matters more than performance, that's why AMD is my first choice.

Doesn't make you look very smart to believe there is a thermal issue period.

 

[Mingon]

I have 2 systems at the moment:
(uk prices)
1.13 athlon (£90), gigabyte kt266 mobo (£85) with 768mb ram (£75) total = £250
1.4 athlon@1867 (110), asus p4t-f (£150) with 256mb rdram (£90) total = £350

Both system are not exactly weedy, but both are rock solid. Since installing the Kt266 motherboard around 6 months ago I have only ever had 1 problem (sblive irq) which took me about 2 hours to fix, and thats it for problems no blue screens nothing. By comparison the asus motherboard also has had no problem except with a sound blaster 128 (creative :| ).
So which would I choose if I could keep only 1 ?
The AMD, stability in both these setups is not a problem so for me it comes down to pure grunt and despite being 700mhz slower it feels more musclebound. I know its probably the memory that helps it but at £90 for 256mb of rdram I am not buying anymore. I know the major argument against the amd is heat but to be honest look at the difference in cost £100 that will buy me a swiftech heatsink with a low rpm 80mm fan which will keep it more than cool enough and still give me change to buy more ram.
I use both machines for games, photoshop and cad so I push both through their paces.

 

[Priit]

If I should build P4-based system today, I would take VIA's P4X266A. SiS and ALi-based boards aren't avalible where I live, i845 performance is a joke and i850 is too expensive (RDRAM still costs 3-4 times more than DDR). And VIA chipsets have always served me well

 

[imgod2u]

See, that's the thing, if price was a factor, you wouldn't go for an Intel solution in the first place. Hence, why the only logical reason to even go Intel would be for the stability, currently. In the future (probably with Northwood), that may change and certainly in the past it has been different.

 

[rip22]

<< See, that's the thing, if price was a factor, you wouldn't go for an Intel solution in the first place. Hence, why the only logical reason to even go Intel would be for the stability, currently. In the future (probably with Northwood), that may change and certainly in the past it has been different. >>

I see your point, but then again its not a cut and dry thing....Performance crown have been going back and forward between the top of the line cpus from Intel and AMD....and many Athlon XP users would argue with you that AMD systems are as stable as there Intel counterpart.
So its not a black and white thing, there many factors involved in deciding which way to go. Price is one of them, preferance is another, reliability yet another etc....

Beside the release of Northwood is very close and i think that its fare to say that when we talk about "What P4 Chipset would you use?" in this thread, its with Northwood in mind that folks are thinking about it, since i think evryone would agree with me when i say that they have a socket 478 mobo in mind.

 

[Spook]

I can get a Grand Prix, or I can get An Acura TL-S... Both nice powerful cars... But on is obviously better than the other...

Sure the Grand Prix, might never break down for some... but if you look at the stats on Grand Prix's to TL-S's....

Anyway...

Or you can do what I did... bought into the AMD hype here on Anand, and I'm extremely disappointed with the stability of the system over all....

At least Intel has finally made it easy for me to use my DDR RAM in the 845D to upgrade to their platform.... I'm actually looking forward to the release of the 845D, and Northwood, so I can get that combo, and get rid of this AMD stuff... I want stability... I want today's BX chipset combo....

 

[AGodspeed]

Or you can do what I did... bought into the AMD hype here on Anand, and I'm extremely disappointed with the stability of the system over all...

Oh lord, another confused soul.

EDIT: If you really wanted stability, you'd get a Tyan Tiger MP board. I don't think I'd here you complaining about that.

 

[Diable]

Check out the 2CPU or the AMDMB fourms to see all the problems people are having with there Tiger Mp's, I wouldn't call that board the beacon of stability. My brother has a Thunder K7 and its rock sold it plus it has lovely onboard SCSI, if I were to get a Athlon motherboard it wound be the Thunder K7.

 

[AGodspeed]

Check out the 2CPU or the AMDMB fourms to see all the problems people are having with there Tiger Mp's, I wouldn't call that board the beacon of stability. My brother has a Thunder K7 and its rock sold it plus it has lovely onboard SCSI, if I were to get a Athlon motherboard it wound be the Thunder K7.

I think Anand would disagree with you:

During our weeks of testing we never encountered a single problem with the Tiger MP, even after testing it outside of AMD's and Tyan's specifications by using Dual Athlon (Thunderbird) CPUs and Dual Duron (Morgan) CPUs.

I'll check the AMDmb forums to see what you're talking about.

 

[Pabster]

Diable wrote:

"Check out the 2CPU or the AMDMB fourms to see all the problems people are having with there Tiger Mp's, I wouldn't call that board the beacon of stability. My brother has a Thunder K7 and its rock sold it plus it has lovely onboard SCSI, if I were to get a Athlon motherboard it wound be the Thunder K7."

Oh, bah-loney. Perhaps those people "having problems" has something to do with them using inadequate power supplies ("I hooked it up with my generic 250w unit"), trying to use regular unbuffered DIMMs (instead of Registered, as required), etc. Overall, both the Tiger MP and Thunder K7 are the two most stable AMD platforms. AMD 762+766 are rock solid.

 

[Athlon4all]

<< Oh, bah-loney. Perhaps those people "having problems" has something to do with them using inadequate power supplies ("I hooked it up with my generic 250w unit"), trying to use regular unbuffered DIMMs (instead of Registered, as required), etc. Overall, both the Tiger MP and Thunder K7 are the two most stable AMD platforms. AMD 762+766 are rock solid. >>

I have to agree. AMD 760 was first and foremost the most stable platform ever created for the Athlon and the 760MP tops even 760's stability. I doubt highly especially from a company such as Tyan, would release a board that had problems.

Btw Pabster, are you ever gonna change your sig to Athlon XP rather than Athlon 4? jw