What is CPU Power Package?

[cheapwebhoster]

I need to understand the following please help me

1. What is CPU Power Package
2. Why CPU Power Package is measured in Watts? for example my Intel core i3 fluctuate within 1.25w (min) to 25w (max)
3. Why CPU Power Package always fluctuate from from Max to Min?
4. Can we keep the CPU power package always stay at Max or at least going down to reasonable value i.e. 10w but NOT to the lowest value like 1.25w
5. Is there any reason why it fluctuate?

If anyone can answer each of my questions above i would really appreciate it. Would you be so kind to answer based on each point asked not one or two answer for all. Thank you

For your reference this is what i am talking about

 

[Enigmoid]

1. Package power is the power that is consumed by the CPU cores, cache, and other uncore (memory controller and igp if you do not have a discrete card.
2. Power is almost always measured in watts. 1 W = 1 Joule per second.
3. Certain loads/programs are more or less demanding on the CPU and so the power consumed by the CPU will change accordingly. Playing a game or transcoding video will use much more power than browsing the internet.
4. Ideally you would want this as low as possible but sometimes power saving features can lower performance. If you want a higher idle clockspeed (and perhaps performance) go to the system power menu and change it to 'high performance'
5. Same as 3.

Welcome to the forums!

 

[cheapwebhoster]

1. Package power is the power that is consumed by the CPU cores, cache, and other uncore (memory controller and igp if you do not have a discrete card.
2. Power is almost always measured in watts. 1 W = 1 Joule per second.
3. Certain loads/programs are more or less demanding on the CPU and so the power consumed by the CPU will change accordingly. Playing a game or transcoding video will use much more power than browsing the internet.
4. Ideally you would want this as low as possible but sometimes power saving features can lower performance. If you want a higher idle clockspeed (and perhaps performance) go to the system power menu and change it to 'high performance'
5. Same as 3.

Welcome to the forums!

Thank you for the welcoming and most importantly your answers. Back to your answer no.1...if i increase the hardware specs i.e. adding better graphic cards and RAM will the CPU power package stay high at least consistently...not fluctuating too often especially at the lowest min.

Which of the following will keep the CPU power package at high level all the time. I meant at least not fluctuating to its minimum. Because i've test your answer 4 but there is always time that it will go down to the min.

1. Upgrade hardware i.e. higher spec graphics
2. Adding more RAM
3. Close unnecessary application software that is opened
4. Set the computer at high performance
5. Upgrade Processor from core from i3 to i5

 

[BSim500]

Thank you for the welcoming and most importantly your answers. Back to your answer no.1...if i increase the hardware specs i.e. adding better graphic cards and RAM will the CPU power package stay high at least consistently...not fluctuating too often especially at the lowest min.

Which of the following will keep the CPU power package at high level all the time. I meant at least not fluctuating to its minimum. Because i've test your answer 4 but there is always time that it will go down to the min.

1. Upgrade hardware i.e. higher spec graphics
2. Adding more RAM
3. Close unnecessary application software that is opened
4. Set the computer at high performance
5. Upgrade Processor from core from i3 to i5

None of them. Adding a discrete GPU will actually make CPU power fall since the iGPU inside the CPU will usually be disabled. More RAM will make zero difference. Closing applications, etc, won't make any difference if they're already mostly idle (and will make the CPU more idle if they aren't). i3 vs i5 makes little difference beyond 1-3w for the "uncore" aspect as they share a great deal in common (iGPU & memory controller are often identical, etc), often it's just the extra L3 cache.

All the stuff you seem to be trying to avoid is part of it's normal operation, ie, when some parts of the CPU aren't used, it gets "gated down" by design. When it's demanded again, it gets powered up so quickly you simply won't notice it. Your comment "sometimes power saving can lower performance" was true about 10 years ago on much older chips, but things have changed a lot since then, especially with the Core architecture. There's absolutely nothing wrong with it (or CPU / GPU speed) fluctuating these days - it's designed to do precisely that and doesn't affect performance (unless you have a faulty motherboard). In fact it would highly abnormal and inefficient to design a CPU that used as much power flat out as idle.

PS: Welcome to the forum too.

 

[Yuriman]

Thank you for the welcoming and most importantly your answers. Back to your answer no.1...if i increase the hardware specs i.e. adding better graphic cards and RAM will the CPU power package stay high at least consistently...not fluctuating too often especially at the lowest min.

Which of the following will keep the CPU power package at high level all the time. I meant at least not fluctuating to its minimum. Because i've test your answer 4 but there is always time that it will go down to the min.

1. Upgrade hardware i.e. higher spec graphics
2. Adding more RAM
3. Close unnecessary application software that is opened
4. Set the computer at high performance
5. Upgrade Processor from core from i3 to i5

I believe I'm seeing some confusion here. Power package is basically how much electricity it draws, and has nothing at all to do with performance, at least not directly. You want it to draw as little electricity as possible when it's doing nothing, so low package power is a good thing, and it will ramp up and draw more power when it needs to do stuff.

 

[Cerb]

Which of the following will keep the CPU power package at high level all the time. I meant at least not fluctuating to its minimum. Because i've test your answer 4 but there is always time that it will go down to the min.

1. Upgrade hardware i.e. higher spec graphics
2. Adding more RAM
3. Close unnecessary application software that is opened
4. Set the computer at high performance
5. Upgrade Processor from core from i3 to i5

None of them. Only running a CPU stress testing application that uses all logical threads all the time will get even close to what you're asking. However, I don't see what the point would be (if you're trying to power your PC with a shunt PSU, that would answer the obvious question, but just raise more ). Even if you disable the software-visible power saving features, the hardware still has baked-in features, like local clock gating, that I'm pretty sure can't be turned off, so there will always be variation. In fact, even before all these power saving features were in use, there was a fair bit of difference between idle and load power use, just due to transistors used for CPU work not switching when idle v. more of them switching under load.

 

[Techhog]

Thank you for the welcoming and most importantly your answers. Back to your answer no.1...if i increase the hardware specs i.e. adding better graphic cards and RAM will the CPU power package stay high at least consistently...not fluctuating too often especially at the lowest min.

Which of the following will keep the CPU power package at high level all the time. I meant at least not fluctuating to its minimum. Because i've test your answer 4 but there is always time that it will go down to the min.

1. Upgrade hardware i.e. higher spec graphics
2. Adding more RAM
3. Close unnecessary application software that is opened
4. Set the computer at high performance
5. Upgrade Processor from core from i3 to i5

I see what's going on here. It's a language barrier. You see the word "power", think of the word "powerful", and assume that the fluctuation means that your CPU is messed up and not as powerful as it should be, correct? Well, that's not exactly what it means. "Power" refers to the amount of energy it uses (electrical) and the energy it releases as waste (heat). Imagine if you were always running as fast as you could, even when there's no need to. You'd always be tired and you'd likely damage parts of your body. This is similar to what will happen if your CPU is always running at full power. It won't get "tired", but it will use more electricity (raising your electricity bill), and it'll always be hot. Heat damages computer parts over time. By keeping it at 100% power all of the time, your CPU will get hot, which will damage your CPU and motherboard faster than it would if it's using power saving features. Meanwhile, the only benefit you get is that some things might open 0.001 second faster. That doesn't really seem like a worthy trade-off, does it? The heat getting into the case will shorten the lifespan of your other components too, and if you're using a laptop, the laptop will feel hot to the touch, the fan will run more loudly, and your battery life will be short. Basically, it's supposed to power down when it's not doing much, just like how you sleep lying down instead of running. Do you understand?

 

[cheapwebhoster]

Thank you all your answers here, all of your contributions help me to understand...why it fluctuates

So the fluctuation is normal...

actually i am asking all these is because i am playing a game which the spike/lag happens quite often and this is caused by the processor trying to go idle when the game need it at most. For example during high actions game the CPU power package suddenly went down drastically from 25w max to 1.25 (lowest min).

From my observation at this point the game will also lag significantly. I tried to find ways how to keep at 25w max where it doesn't lag but it seems there is no way to do it.

I've tried all the thing i asked but none of them works....anyway thanks for all the understanding

 

[Dufus]

For your reference this is what i am talking about

I don't see anything there, was there supposed to be an attachment?

Yes, you can run the processor at high power by turning off the power saving features such as disabling C-States. There will still be speed step so setting minimum processor performance to 100% will get you nearer TDP. But as others have said this is only really useful for testing.

What System do you have?

 

[cheapwebhoster]

I don't see anything there, was there supposed to be an attachment?

Yes, you can run the processor at high power by turning off the power saving features such as disabling C-States. There will still be speed step so setting minimum processor performance to 100% will get you nearer TDP. But as others have said this is only really useful for testing.

What System do you have?

How to disable C-States?

My system

Intel Core i3
Intel HD graphics (Integrated)
2 GB RAM

This is the image i am trying to show

https://plus.google.com/photos/105355116038973014556/albums/6069901717626834209

 

[Yuriman]

Thank you all your answers here, all of your contributions help me to understand...why it fluctuates

So the fluctuation is normal...

actually i am asking all these is because i am playing a game which the spike/lag happens quite often and this is caused by the processor trying to go idle when the game need it at most. For example during high actions game the CPU power package suddenly went down drastically from 25w max to 1.25 (lowest min).

From my observation at this point the game will also lag significantly. I tried to find ways how to keep at 25w max where it doesn't lag but it seems there is no way to do it.

I've tried all the thing i asked but none of them works....anyway thanks for all the understanding

I very much doubt disabling power-saving features will help, it is almost certainly unrelated. It sounds more like your CPU is throttling due to excessive heat. Is this a desktop or a laptop? Do you have a utility to monitor temperatures? Also, what game is it that you're running?

 

[cheapwebhoster]

I very much doubt disabling power-saving features will help, it is almost certainly unrelated. It sounds more like your CPU is throttling due to excessive heat. Is this a desktop or a laptop? Do you have a utility to monitor temperatures? Also, what game is it that you're running?

I am using laptop the temperature max at 85 C...but i think at the heat level the system seems normal...and the game run smoothly at that temp level...when the power package drop from 25w to 1.25w the temperature also drop to around 75 C...at this dropping point the lag starts to happen and it happens quite frequently (within 1 to 3 minutes range) which make the lag is kind of annoying.

So if the CPU power package can stay or at least drop around 15w to 10w it still be okay...but its to the lowest min.

 

[BSim500]

I am using laptop the temperature max at 85 C...but i think at the heat level the system seems normal...and the game run smoothly at that temp level...when the power package drop from 25w to 1.25w the temperature also drop to around 75 C...at this dropping point the lag starts to happen and it happens quite frequently (within 1 to 3 minutes range) which make the lag is kind of annoying.

So if the CPU power package can stay or at least drop around 15w to 10w it still be okay...but its to the lowest min.

No, as Yuriman said, you actually have that back to front. The power suddenly drops because your CPU is throttling under high load temps not the other way around. Disabling power savings / C states won't fix anything - it'll just make your laptop run hotter when idle. The "1.25w power package" figure and sudden temp drop is the effect of a CPU throttle, not the cause of it. What you really need to do is find some way of increasing the fan speed to 100% under load (maybe use Speedfan). Or perhaps, your laptop simply needs the CPU cooler cleaned of dust to work better (ie, blast an air duster into the vent holes)? You certainly won't solve high load temps related throttling by disabling power saving features though.

 

[cheapwebhoster]

No, as Yuriman said, you actually have that back to front. The power suddenly drops because your CPU is throttling under high load temps not the other way around. Disabling power savings / C states won't fix anything - it'll just make your laptop run hotter when idle. The "1.25w power package" figure and sudden temp drop is the effect of a CPU throttle, not the cause of it. What you really need to do is find some way of increasing the fan speed to 100% under load (maybe use Speedfan). Or perhaps, your laptop simply needs the CPU cooler cleaned of dust to work better (ie, blast an air duster into the vent holes)? You certainly won't solve high load temps related throttling by disabling power saving features though.

I will test this when i make my ice pack cooler ...i need to buy few ice pack put in a box and have a fan to blow out the cold air to the laptop...

but in saying that actually i feel my laptop heat is normal. Even running at 85c it's not that hot at the back...i have tried it many times playing about 3 hours nonstop..the heat is still normal no feeling of overheating under the CPU

 

[Dufus]

Intel Core i3
Intel HD graphics (Integrated)
2 GB RAM

Thanks. It would be beneficial to know exactly which i3 processor, OS and laptop model.

I notice your core temp up to 89C, what about integrated graphics temp?

Lots of reasons for throttling but going from 25W to 1.25W seems super aggressive, more so than normal Intel throttling.