What is ATI's next gen card they say will be coming in 2010?
- Thread starter nyker96
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Nemesis 1
Lifer
- Dec 30, 2006
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Ya probably on 28nm in sept. It should slap fermi around pretty good . Since I pretty much shut down my computer from spring to fall ,I won't even look at fermi. I would rather see AMD do it first on 32 with HK/Metal gates . It will likely be 28 nm Bulk. With a 50% increase in what makes great Video cards great. Good back to school refresh
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It's just going to be refresh cards. They will be the same thing just slightly higher clocked, possibly cooler running but not necessarily, same goes with power consumption. Will probably just be a 5890, 5790, and something else maybe.
The only refresh that was ever worth upgrading from in ATI's history that I know of would probably be going from an X1800 to an X1900. Going from a 9700 to a 9800 was pointless, going from an X800 to an X850 was pointless. I suppose one could call the 3800s a refresh of the 2900, but nobody should have bought a 2900 in the first place 
And then of course the 4890 which wasn't worth going to from the 4870.
On the Nvidia side, the 5900 was a good deal faster than the 5800, but it was still pretty bad. The 6800 didn't have a refresh. Going from a 7800 to a 7900 was a mild change at best. Going from an 8800 to a 9800 was a rather mild change. GTX 280 to 285 was similarly mild.
I don't think one should really expect something too game changing with a refresh. Just a part that puts out 5-10% more fps.
And then of course the 4890 which wasn't worth going to from the 4870.On the Nvidia side, the 5900 was a good deal faster than the 5800, but it was still pretty bad. The 6800 didn't have a refresh. Going from a 7800 to a 7900 was a mild change at best. Going from an 8800 to a 9800 was a rather mild change. GTX 280 to 285 was similarly mild.
I don't think one should really expect something too game changing with a refresh. Just a part that puts out 5-10% more fps.
I don't think it's a refresh. It should be a new generation if it's out in September. They've said 1 year between generations and 6 months for refreshes.
From that xbit article:
"can introduce a brand new family of ninth-generation Radeon chips code-named Northern Islands, which is widely believed to feature a new architecture."
They also mention the possibility of another generation with different codenames.
From that xbit article:
"can introduce a brand new family of ninth-generation Radeon chips code-named Northern Islands, which is widely believed to feature a new architecture."
They also mention the possibility of another generation with different codenames.
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It won't be on 28nm if it's a refresh. Also there changing architectures for there next generation of chips AFAIK.
My inference from the article was that there is going to be a refresh of evergreen and some new architecture. Maybe refresh in august, new architecture around december/january?
Nobody's buying my 4770's on ebay, maybe i should hold on to them. A 32/28 nm 5790 would be perfect for my htpc.
Nobody's buying my 4770's on ebay, maybe i should hold on to them. A 32/28 nm 5790 would be perfect for my htpc.
The 5x00 series is great price/performance part and currently the best high end cards available. But I have to ask: how many times can an architecture be updated/refreshed before it starts showing it's age, i.e. bottlenecks and design limitations. They've been on this current architecture for quite awhile now and even though Fermi's not out yet, Nvidia will likely bring Fermi's refresh to market sooner into Fermi's life cycle than in G80's and GT200's cycle.
If AMD can keep refreshing/updating their cards as opposed to bringing a completely new architecure to market and stay competitive then that's really good for them and us. But I just have a feeling that, by this fall, upper and high end must-have cards will be squarely back in Nvidia's corner. I guess if they are coming out with a completely new architecture in about a year, then it'll probably work out great for them. We'll see though.
If AMD can keep refreshing/updating their cards as opposed to bringing a completely new architecure to market and stay competitive then that's really good for them and us. But I just have a feeling that, by this fall, upper and high end must-have cards will be squarely back in Nvidia's corner. I guess if they are coming out with a completely new architecture in about a year, then it'll probably work out great for them. We'll see though.
It wouldn't exactly be unheard of though, we did see it before with the Radeon 2900s -> Radeon 3800s moving from 80nm to 55nm. Only that move was more oriented to bring price and watt under control more than it was about improving performance. In this case it would most likely be about improving performance.
If they didn't keep talking about "refreshes" in that article, that was the last I had heard as well, that there was supposed to be a new architecture after the R5000s...
tweakboy
Diamond Member
Just beware of the red PCB
Also note: ATI Catalyst drivers are buggy and slow.
After my x800 experience and catalyst Im proud to say I will never ever go ATIhell again in my life. nVidia 4 life fellaz. Soo Im gonna get Fermi , Does anyone wanna trade their Fermi when it comes out for a Furbi ,, that toy from 15 years ago it talks and what not... its collectors item.. lolol
Also note: ATI Catalyst drivers are buggy and slow.
After my x800 experience and catalyst Im proud to say I will never ever go ATIhell again in my life. nVidia 4 life fellaz. Soo Im gonna get Fermi , Does anyone wanna trade their Fermi when it comes out for a Furbi ,, that toy from 15 years ago it talks and what not... its collectors item.. lolol
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Right...I had a X800XL and a X800GTO2 and never had any driver issues with those cards, and in fact I remember one cool feature they added at that time was Adaptive AA (had to hack it into the X800 series but was standard on the X1800 series). I had a bunch of driver issues with the 8800GTS 640 I bought...guess I better stay away from nVidia. :\
If your post was sarcastic then
on me.
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Nvidia drivers were good for me, but not perfect. So far AMD's drivers have been perfect. Everyone has different experiences with different set ups, so I don't think it's fair that you claim that "ATI Catalyst driver are buggy" based on your single experience from years back.
This is going pretty off topic from what this thread was about...
Anyway, I am not waiting for Fermi or an AMD refresh, as soon as the 5850 price gets to where I'm satisfied, that'll be my card. It should be perfect for 1920x1200 for a while yet I'd think.
tweakboy
Diamond Member
So, if only one person has a single problem with a single product from a single company, everybody in the entire world should stop buying any product from that company?
It's amazing how stupid we can be sometimes
Arkaign
Lifer
- Oct 27, 2006
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The only refresh that was ever worth upgrading from in ATI's history that I know of would probably be going from an X1800 to an X1900. Going from a 9700 to a 9800 was pointless, going from an X800 to an X850 was pointless. I suppose one could call the 3800s a refresh of the 2900, but nobody should have bought a 2900 in the first place
On the Nvidia side, the 5900 was a good deal faster than the 5800, but it was still pretty bad. The 6800 didn't have a refresh. Going from a 7800 to a 7900 was a mild change at best. Going from an 8800 to a 9800 was a rather mild change. GTX 280 to 285 was similarly mild.
I don't think one should really expect something too game changing with a refresh. Just a part that puts out 5-10% more fps.
Yeah I agree, I think for consumers refresh doesn't mean jack shit most of the time if they already own the 1st run of the gen.
Refresh seems primarily to get costs down (more dies per wafer), and to get the new process tech fabs a good run through.
Arkaign
Lifer
- Oct 27, 2006
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The Catalyst drivers did suck the big one for a while, but I've got a 5770 and it's flawless so far, and the past few times I've run ATI cards, X1950, etc, have been good as well.
Red Storm
Lifer
- Oct 2, 2005
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A lot of people (like myself) wait for the refresh before upgrading. Better power consumption, operating temperatures, more overclocking capability (usually), and better driver stability. It's well worth the short wait IMHO.
akugami
Diamond Member
- Feb 14, 2005
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Ok, but you're assuming nVidia won't have updates to Fermi ready by the end of the year. Unlike you shutting your computer down in the spring to fall months, nVidia doesn't close down their operations for half of the year.
Keep in mind the issues with the Radeon X1800 didn't affect the X1900 by a huge amount. The X1900 was released right about when it should while the X1800 was massively late. In other words, don't count on the successor/refresh to Fermi to be very late. I'm not saying it'll be here early, just that it might not be held up as long as AMD (or the fanboys) hope.
The problem for AMD is that short term, they have nothing to worry about but it is also my feeling that AMD really needs to refresh their architecture. The new info on Fermi that was recently released pins some of the blame of why it was late on the massive changes between the GT200 cores and Fermi. That doesn't help us in the short term if we want something from nVidia but long term, it might provide huge performance benefits for nVidia GPU's. Similar to what we saw with the Geforce 8 series. And the size hit of Fermi will become less important as TSMC moves At this point, we simply can't say.
As much as I've said that currently, GPU computing is not that important yet, and as much as I've said that physics acceleration isn't important yet, it will become important after 2010. More and more programs will start to optimize for GPGPU and games will start seriously considering physics acceleration. While not having a cohesive physics acceleration package/strategy hasn't hurt AMD, it will if they still don't have their act together by the end of the year. And I'm talking not just announcements but actual development kits and support. Same with GPU computing as some companies like Adobe are already using CUDA in CS5 or other products.
Yes. Let's perpetuate falsehoods like ATI has crap drivers when, for the most part, their drivers are equal to nVidia. Just because you had a bad experience with them five years ago must mean they have kept on sucking since then right? Forget the many issues that nVidia have had with drivers since the release of ATI's X800 GPU. Not that ATI hasn't had their issues as well but dammit, only ATI has crap drivers!
Arkaign
Lifer
- Oct 27, 2006
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Red Storm
Lifer
- Oct 2, 2005
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My 5770 has low power consumption, low temps, lots of OC, and it's totally stable
I didn't say first gen releases were bad, just that refreshes give you even better power consumption, temps, and OCing, plus the added time to iron out any bugs that may have arisen from the first gen launch. Because of these reasons I time my upgrades around refresh releases, so they are important to consumers.
In my experience, forcing AA from the control panel works a million times better with Nvidia. Nothing worse than having 90% of my HD 5870 go to waste because AA will not work. With supersampling they have no excuse -- render the image at a super high resolution and shrink it down, it should work universally!
In terms of stability, the ATI drivers seem worse for locking up the entire system, but that's a rare occurance. Nvidia drivers barely ever lock the entire system, but are crashing all the time.
In terms of stability, the ATI drivers seem worse for locking up the entire system, but that's a rare occurance. Nvidia drivers barely ever lock the entire system, but are crashing all the time.
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