What do you think of this letter I'm sending?

[torpid]

First thing you need to do is actually determine if you can sell the phone number, no?

You've got to think carefully here. A request too high and they will probably not give you anything. Too low and you'll not feel vindicated. I'm thinking maybe $1000-2000?

 

[James Bond]

Originally posted by: torpid
First thing you need to do is actually determine if you can sell the phone number, no?

You've got to think carefully here. A request too high and they will probably not give you anything. Too low and you'll not feel vindicated. I'm thinking maybe $1000-2000?

This is exactly what I have been thinking. How would I go about finding out if I can legally sell my number?

 

[meltdown75]

this is getting tougher.

now you have to choose between your random phone friends that have slowly but surely became your life obsession and livelihood and... video games.

i don't envy your position

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: Tizyler

Originally posted by: torpid
First thing you need to do is actually determine if you can sell the phone number, no?

You've got to think carefully here. A request too high and they will probably not give you anything. Too low and you'll not feel vindicated. I'm thinking maybe $1000-2000?

This is exactly what I have been thinking. How would I go about finding out if I can legally sell my number?

You have to find a consultant or lawyer who will help you find COMPARABLE market prices of phone numbers sold (and also willing to work for a % of the proceeds so you don't pay anything out of pocket).

 

[James Bond]

Originally posted by: meltdown75
this is getting tougher.

now you have to choose between your random phone friends that have slowly but surely became your life obsession and livelihood and... video games.

i don't envy your position

This is tough!

 

[IEC]

Wow. Just wow. I couldn't have put up with that for so many years!

 

[pnad]

You won't be 'Selling' your number.

They will be 'Paying' you for the service or act of YOU getting YOUR number changed like you should have done on your own several years ago.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: Tizyler

Originally posted by: torpid
First thing you need to do is actually determine if you can sell the phone number, no?

You've got to think carefully here. A request too high and they will probably not give you anything. Too low and you'll not feel vindicated. I'm thinking maybe $1000-2000?

This is exactly what I have been thinking. How would I go about finding out if I can legally sell my number?

You could, you know, call the phone company.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: pnad
You won't be 'Selling' your number.

They will be 'Paying' you for the service or act of YOU getting YOUR number changed like you should have done on your own several years ago.

lol that is in effect selling his number

 

[JS80]

wiki

Numeric trivia

One of the most expensive phone numbers in the world is 666-6666 which was sold for USD$2.75 million in Doha, Qatar as part of a charity event in 2006.

Another is 888-8888, which was sold for USD$270,723 in Chengdu, China. 8 is traditionally considered a lucky number in Chinese culture.

Computer industry pioneer Steve Wozniak, a collector of phone numbers, obtained the phone number 888-8888, but it proved unusable: Children playing with phones would dial it, resulting in more than a hundred wrong numbers a day.[1]

In Quebec, the Journal de Montréal newspaper has been using the 888-8888 phone number for a few years for its classifieds section. There is a word game in French between this number and "vite, vite, vite, vite, vite, vite, vite" for "fast, fast, fast, fast, fast, fast, fast". ("Vite" (fast) and "Huit" (eight) sound similar.) It is now mandatory to dial the area code first, so the number is now 514-888-8888.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: Tizyler

Originally posted by: torpid
First thing you need to do is actually determine if you can sell the phone number, no?

You've got to think carefully here. A request too high and they will probably not give you anything. Too low and you'll not feel vindicated. I'm thinking maybe $1000-2000?

This is exactly what I have been thinking. How would I go about finding out if I can legally sell my number?

Don't worry about that.

Let the company and their lawyers handle that matter.

I'd go for a little more $. I wouldn't get a lawyer either. Learn how to negotiate for yourself. Some of the worst negotiators I've ever seen were lawyers. Now in their opinion they were good, but not even close to some business people I've seen.

Imo, forget about the time you've spent on this the past 8 years. WTF does he care? For the CEO the point is how much business he may be missing out on. From his response I can see if he could just change the # on print advertising he would. He's worried about all the advertising that's already there, and the potential lost business.

Honestly, no one knows but him what he'll pay. Might not be a bad idea to aks the other agency.

BTW: Consider that if he makes a low ball offer and you refuse, he may come back in a little while. You have the bargaining power here. Every day he delays, he loses business. WTH is it to you?

Fern

 

[kranky]

Ask for $1,000.

 

[JS80]

from a law forum:

I am involved in the buying and selling of businesses. It is common for the
transaction to include transfer of telephone numbers (and Yellow Pages ads,
premises leases, equipment leases, employee contracts, and other rights
pertaining to assets that the seller doesn't actually own). The buyer
doesn't own the number just as the seller doesn't. But the seller transfers
to the buyer whatever rights to use the number that seller has. As part
performance of the contract, the seller cooperates with the buyer in getting
the account transferred. The telephone companies are very cooperative about
this. Happens every day. Some assets of this sort are sold subject to the
rights of others to approve the transfer. But in my experience, the company
having the right to approve or disapprove will almost always cooperate.

There should be no problem with transferring a personal account to a
business. (Transferring the other way around could be a problem, but that's
another discussion). In most cases the telephone company doesn't know what
use the customer will make of the phone number. People sign up for cell
phone accounts to use personally, or to use in their business, without the
telephone company knowing or caring. When someone buys a business,
including the phone numbers, everyone should understand that the number
might be lost in the future, just as the seller could have lost it.

There are limits to the value of the product you are selling. Since your
number is not an 800 number, the buyer company will have to advertise the
number with the area code included. Callers from outside the local calling
area will be paying higher rates and therefore won't call. So the company
doesn't get a nationwide benefit from buying your rights in the number.
Still, if you can find a buyer, go for it.

 

[TangoJuliet]

in an ironic twist....after you sell the number to Thrifty, they turn around and sue you back for the same amount when they get wrong numbers for people looking for tizyler.

 

[Dead3ye]

Originally posted by: pnad
You won't be 'Selling' your number.

They will be 'Paying' you for the service or act of YOU getting YOUR number changed like you should have done on your own several years ago.

I agree that you should have just changed your number 8 years ago. The only thing is now that since you waited this long you might actually profit from it. Here's why:

If they are missing all the calls that you say, it would be in Thrifty's best interest to acquire your number seeing how it is obviously on printed material that is readily available. In being this is their best option, I would definately choose this route of compensation.

BTW: you need legal advice somehow. Got any lawyer friends?

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: Tizyler

Originally posted by: torpid
First thing you need to do is actually determine if you can sell the phone number, no?

You've got to think carefully here. A request too high and they will probably not give you anything. Too low and you'll not feel vindicated. I'm thinking maybe $1000-2000?

This is exactly what I have been thinking. How would I go about finding out if I can legally sell my number?

Don't worry about that.

Let the company and their lawyers handle that matter.

I'd go for a little more $. I wouldn't get a lawyer either. Learn how to negotiate for yourself. Some of the worst negotiators I've ever seen were lawyers. Now in their opinion they were good, but not even close to some business people I've seen.

Imo, forget about the time you've spent on this the past 8 years. WTF does he care? For the CEO the point is how much business he may be missing out on. From his response I can see if he could just change the # on print advertising he would. He's worried about all the advertising that's already there, and the potential lost business.

Honestly, no one knows but him what he'll pay. Might not be a bad idea to aks the other agency.

BTW: Consider that if he makes a low ball offer and you refuse, he may come back in a little while. You have the bargaining power here. Every day he delays, he loses business. WTH is it to you?

Fern

I also emphasize that you CANNOT take into account all the time you wasted. This is in effect a business transaction. Also take into fact that all the print costs are SUNK COSTS (i.e. worthless for the valuation). You have two options:

1) Open and honest method+finance method.
Work with his finance team. Ask questions like how much revenue per call generates and what the typical commission/referral rate is and come up with a $ per call number, show proof of how many calls per day you get and multiply by FIVE years, do Present Value. Risk of rebuff is lower than method 2, but you will probably get less money.

2) Black box method.
Try to extract as much money as they are willing to pay by using negotiating tactics. Get comparable prices, etc.

 

[James Bond]

Originally posted by: Dead3ye

Originally posted by: pnad
You won't be 'Selling' your number.

They will be 'Paying' you for the service or act of YOU getting YOUR number changed like you should have done on your own several years ago.

I agree that you should have just changed your number 8 years ago. The only thing is now that since you waited this long you might actually profit from it. Here's why:

If they are missing all the calls that you say, it would be in Thrifty's best interest to acquire your number seeing how it is obviously on printed material that is readily available. In being this is their best option, I would definately choose this route of compensation.

BTW: you need legal advice somehow. Got any lawyer friends?

My dad has got a pretty good lawyer who he left a message with. He'll be getting back to me this afternoon most likely.

At the moment, the CEO is just waiting for my opening offer, so like others have pointed out, I need a good place to "start". Hopefully the lawyer has some insight into this.

 

[bonkers325]

Ask for your phone bills for the past 8 or so years to be paid for in full. It is a reasonable compensation, their business is getting routed to your phone. You shouldn't 'charge them for your time' because your time isn't really chargeable because you stated in a previous email that you re-routed calls back to the proper channel on your own accord. You didn't NEED to do anything, you could've just hung up.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: Tizyler

Originally posted by: Dead3ye

Originally posted by: pnad
You won't be 'Selling' your number.

They will be 'Paying' you for the service or act of YOU getting YOUR number changed like you should have done on your own several years ago.

I agree that you should have just changed your number 8 years ago. The only thing is now that since you waited this long you might actually profit from it. Here's why:

If they are missing all the calls that you say, it would be in Thrifty's best interest to acquire your number seeing how it is obviously on printed material that is readily available. In being this is their best option, I would definately choose this route of compensation.

BTW: you need legal advice somehow. Got any lawyer friends?

My dad has got a pretty good lawyer who he left a message with. He'll be getting back to me this afternoon most likely.

At the moment, the CEO is just waiting for my opening offer, so like others have pointed out, I need a good place to "start". Hopefully the lawyer has some insight into this.

I would recommend against retaining a lawyer, just use him for advice.

I would email back "can I work with your finance team to work out a reasonable price" or "can you have your people provide me with a fair market value of the phone number."

 

[James Bond]

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: Tizyler

Originally posted by: Dead3ye

Originally posted by: pnad
You won't be 'Selling' your number.

They will be 'Paying' you for the service or act of YOU getting YOUR number changed like you should have done on your own several years ago.

I agree that you should have just changed your number 8 years ago. The only thing is now that since you waited this long you might actually profit from it. Here's why:

If they are missing all the calls that you say, it would be in Thrifty's best interest to acquire your number seeing how it is obviously on printed material that is readily available. In being this is their best option, I would definately choose this route of compensation.

BTW: you need legal advice somehow. Got any lawyer friends?

My dad has got a pretty good lawyer who he left a message with. He'll be getting back to me this afternoon most likely.

At the moment, the CEO is just waiting for my opening offer, so like others have pointed out, I need a good place to "start". Hopefully the lawyer has some insight into this.

I would recommend against retaining a lawyer, just use him for advice.

I would email back "can I work with your finance team to work out a reasonable price" or "can you have your people provide me with a fair market value of the phone number."

If I reply with "can you have your people provide me with a fair market value of the phone number", would I be at high risk of being low balled and starting off at a disadvantage?

Edit: The lawyer will be for advice _only_

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: bonkers325
Ask for your phone bills for the past 8 or so years to be paid for in full. It is a reasonable compensation, their business is getting routed to your phone. You shouldn't 'charge them for your time' because your time isn't really chargeable because you stated in a previous email that you re-routed calls back to the proper channel on your own accord. You didn't NEED to do anything, you could've just hung up.

Whatever has happened in the past cannot be used for pricing. The price that is figured is what the number is WORTH to them (and there is monetary value of the referrals). He has to figure out: (Revenue per call) * (commission/referral rate%) * (5 years worth of calls) * (Present Value)
Obviously this is not an exact formula but you have to do a spreadsheet by year to do accurate PV.

 

[GTaudiophile]

Free rental cars for life?

Or how about assign a dollar value to each inconvenient call you've received and multiply that times the number of calls received.

So, let's assume $5 per call x 4 calls per day x 5 days/week x 52 weeks / year = $5,200.

Or

$5 per call x 8 calls per day x 7 days/week x 52 weeks/year = $14,560.

But remember, if the calls really cost you $5 of inconvenience each, you might want to charge them $7.50 or $10.00. Always aim high to give them room for a counter offer.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: Tizyler

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: Tizyler

Originally posted by: Dead3ye

Originally posted by: pnad
You won't be 'Selling' your number.

They will be 'Paying' you for the service or act of YOU getting YOUR number changed like you should have done on your own several years ago.

I agree that you should have just changed your number 8 years ago. The only thing is now that since you waited this long you might actually profit from it. Here's why:

If they are missing all the calls that you say, it would be in Thrifty's best interest to acquire your number seeing how it is obviously on printed material that is readily available. In being this is their best option, I would definately choose this route of compensation.

BTW: you need legal advice somehow. Got any lawyer friends?

My dad has got a pretty good lawyer who he left a message with. He'll be getting back to me this afternoon most likely.

At the moment, the CEO is just waiting for my opening offer, so like others have pointed out, I need a good place to "start". Hopefully the lawyer has some insight into this.

I would recommend against retaining a lawyer, just use him for advice.

I would email back "can I work with your finance team to work out a reasonable price" or "can you have your people provide me with a fair market value of the phone number."

If I reply with "can you have your people provide me with a fair market value of the phone number", would I be at high risk of being low balled and starting off at a disadvantage?

Edit: The lawyer will be for advice _only_

If he comes out with a number you're willing to accept I would just take it. If he comes back with an offer you deem lowball, I would suggest offering him my formula and asking his finance team to fill in the unknowns. I can help you build a simple model if you want (and it comes to that point).

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: GTaudiophile
Free rental cars for life?

Or how about assign a dollar value to each inconvenient call you've received and multiply that times the number of calls received.

So, let's assume $5 per call x 4 calls per day x 5 days/week x 52 weeks / year = $5,200.

Or

$5 per call x 8 calls per day x 7 days/week x 52 weeks/year = $14,560.

But remember, if the calls really cost you $5 of inconvenience each, you might want to charge them $7.50 or $10.00. Always aim high to give them room for a counter offer.

You can't price it based on his inconvenience, you have to price it based on what it's valued at to the company. Thrifty doesn't give a crap about his inconvenience, all they care about is the business value.

 

[James Bond]

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: Tizyler

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: Tizyler

Originally posted by: Dead3ye

Originally posted by: pnad
You won't be 'Selling' your number.

They will be 'Paying' you for the service or act of YOU getting YOUR number changed like you should have done on your own several years ago.

I agree that you should have just changed your number 8 years ago. The only thing is now that since you waited this long you might actually profit from it. Here's why:

If they are missing all the calls that you say, it would be in Thrifty's best interest to acquire your number seeing how it is obviously on printed material that is readily available. In being this is their best option, I would definately choose this route of compensation.

BTW: you need legal advice somehow. Got any lawyer friends?

My dad has got a pretty good lawyer who he left a message with. He'll be getting back to me this afternoon most likely.

At the moment, the CEO is just waiting for my opening offer, so like others have pointed out, I need a good place to "start". Hopefully the lawyer has some insight into this.

I would recommend against retaining a lawyer, just use him for advice.

I would email back "can I work with your finance team to work out a reasonable price" or "can you have your people provide me with a fair market value of the phone number."

If I reply with "can you have your people provide me with a fair market value of the phone number", would I be at high risk of being low balled and starting off at a disadvantage?

Edit: The lawyer will be for advice _only_

If he comes out with a number you're willing to accept I would just take it. If he comes back with an offer you deem lowball, I would suggest offering him my formula and asking his finance team to fill in the unknowns. I can help you build a simple model if you want (and it comes to that point).

Okay. In that case, I'm going to reply asking for a reasonable value. If he lowballs me, I'll begin dealing with the actual finances.