coldmeat
Diamond Member
- Jul 10, 2007
- 9,231
- 139
- 106
Reading some of your posts, they way you emphasize the "searching", it sounds like the police are asking you to step out of your vehicle and searching your person for any alcohol. And do they make everybody breathe into the breathalyser?
In Canada it's nothing like that. Just like KT said, I drive up to them and they ask me if I've had anything to drink, I say "no", and then they ask me where I'm coming from or going to, and I tell them and then they let me drive off. It really adds only a few seconds to my drive. It's not enough to get me all worked up about my freedoms and rights.
In Canada it's nothing like that. Just like KT said, I drive up to them and they ask me if I've had anything to drink, I say "no", and then they ask me where I'm coming from or going to, and I tell them and then they let me drive off. It really adds only a few seconds to my drive. It's not enough to get me all worked up about my freedoms and rights.
BoomerD
No Lifer
- Feb 26, 2006
- 65,905
- 14,305
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First of all, exactly what freedom is being attacked here? The freedom to drink alcoholic beverages and drive? Since the USSC has determined that driving is a privilege NOT a right, and that driviing under the influence of alcohol and/or drugs is a violation of the law in most states, exactly what constitutional right is being violated? Stopping you at checkpoints is NOT unreasonable search, since all they do is ask a few questions...unless they have reason to suspect you may be in violation of some law.
Wanna drink? stay home, or get a designated driver.
In my 35+ years of driving, I've been in two accidents caused by drunk drivers...in BOTH cases, the other driver was well over the legal limit and crashed into my vehicle. FORTUNATELY, (in part because I've always believed in seat belts) no one in my vehicles was injured beyond the occasional bump &/or bruise.
My brother-in-law is a drunk, and has only been arrested once for DUI...and that time was because he was on his Harley and got hit by another drunk driver. (ain't life a bitch?)
HE got badly fucked up in the crash while the other driver was not, but BOTH were arrested and charged with DUI.(My B-I-L while he was in intensive care in the hospital)
Does this mean that was the only time he ever drove drunk? HELL NO!...it's the only time he got caught.
Like I said in one of the early posts in this thread, personally, I'd support the cops parking outside every liquor store and bar/tavern and checking the patrons of said establishments as they leave...No profiling there...you are leaving an establishment that serves/sells alcoholic beverages. Gotta make sure you haven't imbibed more than the amount that allows you to drive.
Evaluation of Checkpoint Tennessee: Tennessee's Statewide Sobriety Checkpoint Program, January 1999:
This is an old study, but I wasn't able to find a more recent relevant study on the NHTSA site.
7 of the first 10 links that Google returns for dui checkpoint roving "three times" NHTSA are by or directly cite the American Beverage Institute.
This is an example press release, the study and "three times" statistic are mentioned as early as 2005. I was not able to find the NHTSA study.
I do not support them.
Now, I don't go to bars and I rarely drink at home...so whether they are there are not really does nothing more than inconvenience me. But if I were driving impaired, all I would have to do is take a side street. 90% of the places they will have them are expected, so if it were a Friday or Saturday night, I would know to avoid that particular intersection, etc.
It might catch some people off guard, but that's about it.
Do what my doctor says...quit drinking and smoke pot...in moderation, of course.
Now, I don't go to bars and I rarely drink at home...so whether they are there are not really does nothing more than inconvenience me. But if I were driving impaired, all I would have to do is take a side street. 90% of the places they will have them are expected, so if it were a Friday or Saturday night, I would know to avoid that particular intersection, etc.
It might catch some people off guard, but that's about it.
Do what my doctor says...quit drinking and smoke pot...in moderation, of course.
alkemyst
No Lifer
- Feb 13, 2001
- 83,769
- 19
- 81
First being involved in two DUI related accidents is an oddity...not impossible though. Having a brother also involved in DUI makes it even more rare, but still possible.
Second, the freedom being attacked has nothing to do with drinking. The MAJORITY of people being stopped for these things did nothing wrong and are now being stopped and partially searched. This is why you'd fail at being selected for jury duty on things like this.
Not to mention if you are stopped and are en route to a flight, concert, show, etc; you just missed that. Fear shouldn't dictate the laws in America.
Third, I think you have issues with your brother.
Fourth, buying alcohol <> using alcohol...cops already do this though and convenience stores in many areas. Profiling isn't wrong. Racially profiling is.
alkemyst
No Lifer
- Feb 13, 2001
- 83,769
- 19
- 81
What you have defined is a single stop. In a roadblock on a busy street you will be about 50+ cars in the chain. It's about 2 mins a pop.
The way it goes down mostly is the cops will stop you. One will watch the cars coming up. Once you get to the front another cop will have you roll down your window, peer inside and ask exactly what you said. I don't know why as would anyone say 'Hell yeah, occifer...you just missed a case of PBR we threw out in this fcking line, where's the nearest liquor store...that's where we were and need to go back now.'
Depending on how he evaluates you depends on what happens next. You will see a lot of club dressed women usually parading to the cops demands. If the cop suspects you they will have you pull into another queue.
In this queue you are asked to get out of the car...and volunteer for a field side test. Most will look drunk as they film this. It's a sucker's bet. IMHO if you drank anything with COH in it in the past 24 hours your best bet is to simply ask the cop you'd rather have your blood tested if he thinks you are intoxicated.
I have a close friend that was pretty messed up from a drunk driver (she is one of the spokes people). I have been arrested for a bogus DUI. I am a regular drinker...I don't drive drunk. I was out from 6 to 10pm at a bar for a concert...I was broke at the time and had a total of 4 beers during that. I ended up leaving at 2am to drive home. On paper, I should have been fine...I'd have loved to have another 4 beers during this, but I was out of cash...
I drove home and the chick I broke up with that day I was living with had her fck-buddy the cop waiting in my parking space. I ended up arrested and blowing a .168 somehow. I learned that this process is SO UNCONSTITUTIONAL it's not funny. Fortunately the judge felt the same way and I was able to go to the bench and work out a bittersweet resolution. Basically pay out about $4-5k and do the MADD classes they have mandated and find a ride to work the first couple months until I was allowed to drive to work only on my own.
In my class there was an public defender that pissed off the wrong cops in NY. They arrested him while washing the new special corvette he bought that made the auto section in his town while he was in his own driveway. They impound there and the cop that had the beef with him bought it at auction at a firesale price. In all these things, MADD wants the instructor to ask "How much did your DUI cost you so far?" This guy was up to $150k as he was defending himself and while doing so you cannot drive. He even relocated to Florida because we don't impound at least and he had a few offices here already.
DUI law is a fuxored beast. In high school I believed it was a really big problem...20 years later I realize it's a big money / political winner.
SacrosanctFiend
Diamond Member
- Oct 2, 2004
- 4,269
- 0
- 0
You're a little late to the game with that statement. The Supreme Court ruled that line of reasoning invalid back in '79.
Yea you're right, generally the 4th has been held up even as a licensed driver on public roads. Not sure what I was thinking there, must have been drinking the kool-aid. Though the crux of the DUI checkpoint argument has been that it's a public safety concern. This has been argued and proven both ways by both sides.
The thing is that the constitution is always open for interpretation. It always has been and always will be. That's generally the whole idea, as touched on in the 9th and 10th amendment. There are amendments and laws that interpret the constitution as it applies to society. I'm not sure literal interpretations of the constitution are realistic in all situations.
A stupid simple example: You have the freedom of speech, but you can't slander or libel. Why can't I talk as much bs about you as I want? It's what I want to do, and it's a constitutional right.
I'm all for constitutional rights and privacy. If DUI checkpoints were made constitutionally illegal tomorrow, I would be happy with that. If they stay they way they are and the debate continues to go on in court, it really wouldn't make a big difference in my life. The reality is that they are they are legal in many states and there are guidelines that must be followed. The logic of these checkpoints has been upheld in countless instances. Now saying these guidelines are always followed corrected is a different matter. The constitutionality of these checkpoints is always up for debate but has also been proven in many instances. Applied properly the guidelines are minimally invasive and stay on the good side of the 4th amendment.
One interpretations of the constitution is that you should be able to do whatever you want until that action is challenged against the constitution and subsequent laws. I'm not sure that exactly jives with reality, but quite a few accept it as that as evidenced by the 9th amendment. I've always found that interesting, albeit anarchistic in nature.
When you feel your constitutional rights have been violated you have the right to challenge all parties involved in a court of law. That court has the power to interpret the constitution as it applies to your situation. You have the right to express grievances against any and all laws of the government. So go ahead and do it. If you get stopped at a DUI checkpoint, file a grievance and get a lawyer. I'm not exactly sure what you will accomplish, but you can. If it at least makes you feel better and puts another grievance on file, then all the better.
Most people won't do anything but bitch about DUI checkpoints, or anything else for that matter. Also, most people really don't care, no matter how much they argue differently. If they really cared they might inconvience themselves for a little bit and do something. Take this forum for example. The vast majority of people here will spend endless hours passionately arguing as if their life depended on it. But if you took a count of thoes who took even a fraction of the time to involve themselves in the issues they argue, the number would be infinitesimally and embarrassingly small. Fight for your rights, or you might end up losing them.
alkemyst
No Lifer
- Feb 13, 2001
- 83,769
- 19
- 81
I think you are painting a higher and mightier than you picture here...
libel and slander exist because of the damage they can cause when it's money backed. However, if your are just stating opinon it's more a gray area. Saying someone is a rapist vs thinking they are one are vast plains apart.
I would have thought by the player personality you portrayed in the past that DUI stops would have caused you some problem.
Going to court is on these kinds of things is really about what money and political lobby is behind it. Chances are a judge will vote for his own vote if he can bend the rules to suit it.
Spikesoldier
Diamond Member
- Oct 15, 2001
- 6,766
- 0
- 0
i bet half of you people who are adamently opposing this have never been to a checkpoint before.
a properly run DUI checkpoint should take less than 5 or 10 seconds of your time unless you make the breathalyzer go off.
doing a checkpoint on the interstate is fucking retarded, i bet this is what many of you were thinking, merging six lanes of speeding oncoming traffic into one and going through a freedom stealing interrogation process.
they are not going to search your car. sometimes they might not even make every car take the breathalyzer if there is a traffic jam. for example, they may do every other car or one in every three, or even randomly.
most checkpoints are held at the wee hours of the morning AFTER THE BARS CLOSE. who knows maybe your town is already doing this and you have no idea?
some places will place checkpoints near the end of certain holidays, the most obvious one that comes to mind is new years eve. quite possibly the single night of the year to have the highest chance of a checkpoint near you.
also someone who is familiar with the area probably knows where the checkpoints are and would know how to take evasive action, that is if ole drunky isnt toasted all to hell and plows through a crowd of people like an ancient old man driving through a fruit market.
a properly run DUI checkpoint should take less than 5 or 10 seconds of your time unless you make the breathalyzer go off.
doing a checkpoint on the interstate is fucking retarded, i bet this is what many of you were thinking, merging six lanes of speeding oncoming traffic into one and going through a freedom stealing interrogation process.
they are not going to search your car. sometimes they might not even make every car take the breathalyzer if there is a traffic jam. for example, they may do every other car or one in every three, or even randomly.
most checkpoints are held at the wee hours of the morning AFTER THE BARS CLOSE. who knows maybe your town is already doing this and you have no idea?
some places will place checkpoints near the end of certain holidays, the most obvious one that comes to mind is new years eve. quite possibly the single night of the year to have the highest chance of a checkpoint near you.
also someone who is familiar with the area probably knows where the checkpoints are and would know how to take evasive action, that is if ole drunky isnt toasted all to hell and plows through a crowd of people like an ancient old man driving through a fruit market.
alkemyst
No Lifer
- Feb 13, 2001
- 83,769
- 19
- 81
I have been through many checkpoints. It's not on an interstate usually, but out of a popular nite spot causes a big backup. Are you from a major metropolitan area or cow town? Do you go out much?
Most don't have to take a breathalyzer ever...I have never had to in the many stops I have been in. Many of the stops start during happy hour endings (about 7-8pm, hardly wee hours) and then again around 11pm or so. I have been stopped at around 8pm and missed a 9pm show due to one.
Most don't have to take a breathalyzer ever...I have never had to in the many stops I have been in. Many of the stops start during happy hour endings (about 7-8pm, hardly wee hours) and then again around 11pm or so. I have been stopped at around 8pm and missed a 9pm show due to one.
I remember your posts in numerous threads about your DUI. I can't get over the fact that you're still rationalizing it to yourself. Rationalization is a key indicator of substance abuse, in your case that is alcohol. I'm not condemning you, because I drink heavily, but you have to get real at some point. No offense, but when are you going to stop telling youself that it wasn't your fault, or everything about what you did was ok? The lenghts you go to in your posts, past and present, to rationalize your DUI are simply amazing.
In every thread that has to do with drinking and driving you go on rants about how ridiculous DUI laws are and how MADD/SADD are evil and taking over the world (for reference I don't like MADD/SADD). You condemn drinking and driving, but then say the dangers of it are exaggerated and the laws are harsh for "what's not really a problem". You say you're an avid drinker and careful about drinking and driving. But then you go out, have a few beers, drive home and get a DUI (The circumstances surrounding your ex and her cop lover have little bearing on this). Then you state that if you had more money you would have had an easy 4 more? So at that point you would have made the rational decision to not drive?
What is your deal? Your story changes whenever it's read in different threads.
First the cop pulled you over as you were pulling into your driveway, now the cop was waiting for you in your parking space.
Before you were at the bar and had your last drink about an hour before you left, in this post you were only out and drinking until 10pm but left at 2am?
You claimed initially that your guilty plea allowed you to drive to work right away and then anywhere you want after 3 months.
This thread says you had to find a ride for the first couple of months until you could drive to work?
Then there is the story about the guy in your class. He was memorable enough to post about countless times, but not enough to keep details straight. He was from Ny, then Nj, he's a lawyer then a public defender, then the cops have it out for him, then he spends $100K then $150K then $250K other times.
You were consistant on the cut lip detail though. Which has been proven to raise BAC levels. Mabey you should have utilized that. Or not.
I have no doubt you got a DUI, and from what it seems for good reason.
Beyond that your details are foggy and inconsistant and frankly you're just full of shit.
I'm not sure what you mean by a "higher and mightier than you picture". If you're implying him trying to ride a high horse, then you're looking at the wrong painting. I know you are picasso in your own right.
Libel and slander can cause damage and so can drinking and driving related circumstances. Libel and slander do not always have to relate to any money backed situation. Actually most cases of libel or slander have little directly to do with money. They can merely be inteded to ruin the reputation of the person the statements are about, which is the most common. I'm not exactly sure what you're trying to say, but it's not making much sense.
DUI checkpoints are a grey area, that's the whole point of the discussion in this thread.
Constitutional law is a bit more involved than a local circuit court judge making rulings with the next elections in mind. I was speaking more about higher courts, not specific cases where someone may have gotten a DUI. I was suggesting someone file a grievance just for the simple fact they were subjected to a DUI checkpoint and their 4th amendment rights broken. Since so many in this thread want to jump on the orwellian ideal of a police state, I figured Id take it to the top level.
What exactly is this "player personality" I'm portraying? I've never had a problem at a DUI checkpoint. I've never had a problem with anything DUI related. I know you are plenty experienced with DUI though.
Honestly I'm not trying to offend, but you sound borderline incoherent and drunk. You're really not making any sense, or well, less sense than you usually make, which isn't much at all.
That would be par for the course on Thanksgiving night. Hopefully you didn't drive. If you did I'm going to guess that you took the long way home, around all thoes pesky DUI checkpoints.
Fidel Castro is calling me, god bless Donnie Osmond, god bless ye merry genltemen, free Paris Hilton, free Willy, long live President Bush, fuck you fuck you fuck you, you're cool, fuck you I'm out!
alkemyst
No Lifer
- Feb 13, 2001
- 83,769
- 19
- 81
driveway and parking space is the same to me...I have always posted this as my drinks were between 6 and 10pm as that was the tab I had on me when arrested. I never posted I had my last drink 1 hour before arrested.
I don't know where you are getting the rest of this from...Florida DUI law is pretty straight forward.
The ny vs nj vs $150k vs $250k I wasn't part of this guys life other than him sharing it one day about 5 years ago. Thanks for remembering this better than me.
alkemyst
No Lifer
- Feb 13, 2001
- 83,769
- 19
- 81
DUDE, I was referring to YOU. Get sober please.
I am hardly drunk, my wife works BF so I am up and about. I don't know what was incoherent though. You obviously lied about your hot NYC lifestyle in the past since you know nothing about DUI law. GO PLAYAH GO!
Now that was incoherent. You doing PCP or Meth?
IGBT
Lifer
- Jul 16, 2001
- 17,967
- 140
- 106
..drunks and druggies are always full of chite and excuses to justify reckless behavior. In order to protect friends and family we need more frequent DUI shakedowns and jail time for first offenders and loss of "privileges" for life for the 2nd offenders. And get ready for .040 BH. Safety sensitive personal are held to that criteria and there's a federal push to move it to civilians. 47k die behind the wheel every year and many are DUI.
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