what can be done to change our litigious society?

[BlahBlahYouToo]

is there anything the govt can do?
is it even in their place to do so?
is it on their to do list, or are they even interested in doing anything about it?
or are there too many lobbyist groups preventing them from doing anything?

 

[Ausm]

tort reform

 

[69Mach1]

As long as the legal system rewards people for doing this, it will continue to happen. As soon as it no longer pays to sue everyone who looks at you funny, it will stop. There are a lot of attorneys that make a lot of money off the current setup, they don't want it to change. They have lots of money to lobby, majority of congress are lawyers = No Change.

 

[Infohawk]

It depends on what you mean by litigious. And be careful what you wish for. The US has a robust legal system. It's important for business that people feel that they can correct wrongs through the courts. Otherwise, people are afraid to enter into deals and transact commerce.

Now if you mean bogus personal injury lawsuits I think the simplest thing is to cap pain and suffering damages.

 

[JS80]

What % of congressmen are lawyers?

 

[ElFenix]

who says our society is litigious? do they have any numbers to back up their claim? i'd be interested in what % of the country has been sued or has sued in the last, oh, decade, and how that compares with other countries, how that compares to the US over it's history, and how that compares to earlier common law legal traditions.

 

[Craig234]

One of the few equalizing powers the citizen has is the level playing field of court - except while we knw it's not really level, it's more level than not having it.

The legal system has many imperfections on both sides simply because of the nature of the issues it deals with, at least.

Tort Reform is mainly an agenda by the rich to deprive the average citizen of one of the few levelling powers they have - to increase their wealth by less accountability.

Small problems with the system are hyped on for propagandistic purposes to build support for far larger changes that break the system for the citizen.

If the citizens fall for this and give up their rights, it's hard to see how they'll ever get them back as injustices spread.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Infohawk
It depends on what you mean by litigious. And be careful what you wish for. The US has a robust legal system. It's important for business that people feel that they can correct wrongs through the courts. Otherwise, people are afraid to enter into deals and transact commerce.

/thread

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

Originally posted by: Craig234
One of the few equalizing powers the citizen has is the level playing field of court - except while we knw it's not really level, it's more level than not having it.

The legal system has many imperfections on both sides simply because of the nature of the issues it deals with, at least.

Tort Reform is mainly an agenda by the rich to deprive the average citizen of one of the few levelling powers they have - to increase their wealth by less accountability.

Small problems with the system are hyped on for propagandistic purposes to build support for far larger changes that break the system for the citizen.

If the citizens fall for this and give up their rights, it's hard to see how they'll ever get them back as injustices spread.

i'm far from rich and i'm for tort reform.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Originally posted by: BlahBlahYouToo
is there anything the govt can do?

Yes. Part of the problem is that we have a very large oversupply of attorneys, a great many of whom end up underemployed-and-involuntarily-out-of-field. Others open up solo practices and try to scratch out a living. As a result of this tremendous amount of attorney overproduction, it's difficult for attorneys to pick and choose only the meritorious cases and it's tempting to take cases that have questionable merit and that might only have small chances of success.

So--advocate for cutting the number of law school seats in half (at least) and the de-accreditation of at least 50% of the law schools. This will also end the massive amount of economic waste, human suffering, and suicides that result from law school graduates having $150,000 of student loans and no jobs or careers to show for it. It's not merely a way to reduce the number of non-meritorious lawsuits but is also more humane and makes economic and social sense.

is it even in their place to do so?

Since the government controls the courts and is the law, yes it is the government's place to deal with this issue or to not deal with it.

What specific changes would you like to see happen? If you eliminate torts all together and eliminate all liability for personal injuries and property injuries then you will also remove the incentive for people and businesses to act in a reasonably prudent manner, resulting in a skyrocketing amount of negligence and injuries to people and society which will be even more costly, both economically and in social terms, than the current torts system.

If the torts system operates properly, then it attains maximum efficiency by minimizing the total costs of accidents and prudence.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Originally posted by: InfohawkNow if you mean bogus personal injury lawsuits I think the simplest thing is to cap pain and suffering damages.

Are you saying that pain and suffering is fictitious and that people who have been legitimately wronged and injured shouldn't be able to receive compensation for their pain and suffering?

 

[Brainonska511]

Originally posted by: ElFenix
who says our society is litigious? do they have any numbers to back up their claim? i'd be interested in what % of the country has been sued or has sued in the last, oh, decade, and how that compares with other countries, how that compares to the US over it's history, and how that compares to earlier common law legal traditions.

I'd also like to know how many of the ridiculous lawsuits that are filed actually make it to trial instead of being dismissed outright.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Tort Reform is really a distraction and the torts system isn't nearly as broken as people think. (The real problem is that we need more courts and judges to deal with a large backlog of cases.) Attorneys who take cases on contingency (you don't pay unless you win) really do not want to lose money on non-meritorious loser cases--which means they probably won't take them. However, politicians like to demonize the legal profession because the sheeple are easily riled up and by doing this they can distract the sheeple from real problems such as our woefully inefficient and backwards health care system and our nation's massive economic, international trade, and immigration problems.

 

[Moonbeam]

I support a continuation of litigiousness as it is in our society, but with one change. Instead of the penalties for violations coming in the form of monetary remunerations, they come in the form of beatings.

 

[shiner]

I turn on the tube and what do I see
A whole lotta people cryin' "Don't blame me"
They point their crooked little fingers at everybody else
Spend all their time feelin' sorry for themselves
Victim of this, victim of that
Your momma's too thin; your daddy's too fat

Get over it
Get over it
All this whinin' and cryin' and pitchin' a fit
Get over it, get over it

You say you haven't been the same since you had your little crash
But you might feel better if I gave you some cash
The more I think about it, Old Billy was right
Let's kill all the lawyers, kill 'em tonight
You don't want to work, you want to live like a king
But the big, bad world doesn't owe you a thing

Get over it
Get over it
If you don't want to play, then you might as well split
Get over it, Get over it

It's like going to confession every time I hear you speak
You're makin' the most of your losin' streak
Some call it sick, but I call it weak

You drag it around like a ball and chain
You wallow in the guilt; you wallow in the pain
You wave it like a flag, you wear it like a crown
Got your mind in the gutter, bringin' everybody down
Complain about the present and blame it on the past
I'd like to find your inner child and kick its little ass

Get over it
Get over it
All this bitchin' and moanin' and pitchin' a fit
Get over it, get over it

Get over it
Get over it
It's gotta stop sometime, so why don't you quit
Get over it, get over it

 

[tk149]

I think you have to delineate among the different types of litigation.

1. Contract disputes

2. Personal Injury

3. Medical malpractice (yeah, maybe it's a subsection of Personal Injury)

4. Class Action Lawsuits

That's just for starters.

I think OP is talking about #2, #3, and #4. There is a public perception (possibly valid) that these are clogging courts needlessly, and certainly these are the ones that make the news headlines.

How would you do tort reform? Lots of approaches, each with problems.
Possibly:
1. Loser pays all court costs and attorneys fees - sounds good on the surface, because it will eliminate many lawsuits that have less than a 50% chance of succeeding...but that would favor big business who would spend $100K's on defense, and drag the litigation out for years.

2. Cap damages - How much is a lost limb worth? To an accountant? To an NBA player?

3. Eliminate or cap non-"physical" damages like Pain and Suffering, and Punitive damages (e.g. McDonald's hot coffee case).

4. Bench trials only (no jury) - might reduce the cost. Probably result in speedier trials. Needs Constitutional Amendment? Other countries have this.

5. Eliminate pro se (self representation) cases. I once read an article that claimed that 80% of all cases clogging up federal courts in New York were habeas corpus appeals from prisoners. The advantage would be that a lot of silly cases filed by stupid people would go away. Oh god, I do not want to give lawyers any more power than they already have...

6. Kill all the lawyers. (I can dream, can't I?)

The answer is to find a solution that eliminates ridiculous lawsuits quickly and cheaply (e.g. suing your school because you can't find a job), is fair to both big business and the little guy, and provides adequate compensation for successful meritorious lawsuits (a broken arm should not be the equivalent of winning the lottery), without chilling business activities. Good luck with that.

 

[Atreus21]

Originally posted by: Infohawk
It depends on what you mean by litigious. And be careful what you wish for. The US has a robust legal system. It's important for business that people feel that they can correct wrongs through the courts. Otherwise, people are afraid to enter into deals and transact commerce.

Now if you mean bogus personal injury lawsuits I think the simplest thing is to cap pain and suffering damages.

I seriously doubt legal regress will be done away with.

The entire economy comes crashing down without it.

 

[Atreus21]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper

Originally posted by: BlahBlahYouToo
is there anything the govt can do?

Yes. Part of the problem is that we have a very large oversupply of attorneys, a great many of whom end up underemployed-and-involuntarily-out-of-field. Others open up solo practices and try to scratch out a living. As a result of this tremendous amount of attorney overproduction, it's difficult for attorneys to pick and choose only the meritorious cases and it's tempting to take cases that have questionable merit and that might only have small chances of success.

So--advocate for cutting the number of law school seats in half (at least) and the de-accreditation of at least 50% of the law schools. This will also end the massive amount of economic waste, human suffering, and suicides that result from law school graduates having $150,000 of student loans and no jobs or careers to show for it. It's not merely a way to reduce the number of non-meritorious lawsuits but is also more humane and makes economic and social sense.

is it even in their place to do so?

Since the government controls the courts and is the law, yes it is the government's place to deal with this issue or to not deal with it.

What specific changes would you like to see happen? If you eliminate torts all together and eliminate all liability for personal injuries and property injuries then you will also remove the incentive for people and businesses to act in a reasonably prudent manner, resulting in a skyrocketing amount of negligence and injuries to people and society which will be even more costly, both economically and in social terms, than the current torts system.

If the torts system operates properly, then it attains maximum efficiency by minimizing the total costs of accidents and prudence.

I agree to some extent, but that's also a chicken-egg scenario. Why are there too many lawyers? Possible because lawsuits are common. Which one do you address first?

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: Infohawk
It depends on what you mean by litigious. And be careful what you wish for. The US has a robust legal system. It's important for business that people feel that they can correct wrongs through the courts. Otherwise, people are afraid to enter into deals and transact commerce.

Now if you mean bogus personal injury lawsuits I think the simplest thing is to cap pain and suffering damages.

Correct. And it's also guaranteed and protected by The Constitution.

We can discuss "tort reform" but we can never really tell somebody they can't have their grievances heard/ruled on before a judge.

 

[Infohawk]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper

Originally posted by: InfohawkNow if you mean bogus personal injury lawsuits I think the simplest thing is to cap pain and suffering damages.

Are you saying that pain and suffering is fictitious and that people who have been legitimately wronged and injured shouldn't be able to receive compensation for their pain and suffering?

There are definitely cases out there where it is falsified. There are also cases where it isn't. The problem is that it's extremely subjective and speculative and juries can get carried away, just like with punitive damages. In many cases this is what drives plaintiff tort lawyers which is what most people are upset by when they talk about tort reform. I'm not saying to do away with pain and suffering compensation, but to cap it or structure it in a way that is reasonable.

 

[IGBT]

true medical reform can't happen without tort reform.

 

[Pens1566]

Originally posted by: IGBT
true medical reform can't happen without tort reform.

You mean like in texas where it didn't help at all?

 

[Siddhartha]

A lawsuit is sometimes, (usually?) the only recourse a regular person has to redress an injury or a grievance cause by a richer, more power individual, company, or organization.

I am concerned about taking away or limiting this avenue for people to get their day in court.

 

[Ausm]

nvm

 

[alphatarget1]

Make the plantiff pay court costs + attorney fees (of the defendent) if they lose.