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What are the Dems plans for radical Islam?
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Well, not exactly. See, I am a network administrator that doesn't hold national public office. I don't question my elected officials on a daily basis for what their plan is to eliminate the radical islamic threat. As I am trusted to do my job, at this point in the cycle, I'm going to trust them to do their jobs until I have reason to think otherwise. Right now, they are holding Mr. Bush to task by withholding funds. Mr. Bush's administration is our failure, the Dems in Congress haven't failed anything yet. I'm sure they will, when that happens, I'll speak out.
How about questioning your commander in chief what his backup plan is before bashing those that have done nothing wrong? Sounds like desperation to me.
imported_Shivetya
Platinum Member
What they did when Clinton was in office, claim its a police matter, bomb a few camps and aspirin factories and call it a day?
Well, instead of actually going after the terrorists in Afghanistan, where they actually were trained and have a huge base, you've created a much larger amount of terrorists in Iraq, and aren't even coming close to securing that. And now Afghanistan is becmong into another Iraq. I suppose you'll want to attack Iran next and create more terrorists as well?
This WAS a worldwide effort to stamp out terrorism. Do you realize how many nations participated in Afghanistan? Instead of focusing on that, this administration has fvcked everything up beyond belief. Now the terrorists and even nations aren't afraid of the US. If they had focused on Afghanistan, not only would you have been able to contained it, but no other nation on earth would dare touch the US again, or even dare harbor terrorists in their own country... because if they did, and another attacked happened, that government would have been toppled just like Afghanistan did.
You guys have been so blind, and still so blind, as to the purpose of this war. It's been shown again and again that this administration selectively chosen what intelligence it wanted to present to the public to make their case for war, and it has all been lies. So if it wasn't for WMD, which none has been found, and not for nation building, like what they said initially, then what was the Iraq war for? It was for oil.
How about building a real united allegiance against terrorism? The UK, Spain, US, Canada, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Russia, China, have all been attacked or have found homegrown terrorists that were planning to attack. With all the money that has been spent in Iraq, imagined what that could have done to securing the US and finding Bin Laden.
This WAS a worldwide effort to stamp out terrorism. Do you realize how many nations participated in Afghanistan? Instead of focusing on that, this administration has fvcked everything up beyond belief. Now the terrorists and even nations aren't afraid of the US. If they had focused on Afghanistan, not only would you have been able to contained it, but no other nation on earth would dare touch the US again, or even dare harbor terrorists in their own country... because if they did, and another attacked happened, that government would have been toppled just like Afghanistan did.
You guys have been so blind, and still so blind, as to the purpose of this war. It's been shown again and again that this administration selectively chosen what intelligence it wanted to present to the public to make their case for war, and it has all been lies. So if it wasn't for WMD, which none has been found, and not for nation building, like what they said initially, then what was the Iraq war for? It was for oil.
How about building a real united allegiance against terrorism? The UK, Spain, US, Canada, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Russia, China, have all been attacked or have found homegrown terrorists that were planning to attack. With all the money that has been spent in Iraq, imagined what that could have done to securing the US and finding Bin Laden.
Well, you cant exactly do something wrong if you havent done anything at all. Interesting strategy. So far, all they've accomplished is passing useless legislation to throw some red meat at their base, which seems to be all politicians do these days when their not naming post offices after themselves.
michaels- I already asked this of the resident "Bush&Co" bashers on here and pretty much got no where.
Most had no plan, they just attacked me and/or "Bush&Co", go figure... :roll:
Granted, 2 or 3 had at least some kind of plausible path forward (didn't necessairly agree with them, but at least they had something).
As we are all seeing with the Dem.'s being in control of Congress, it takes more than a "Bush&Co. are evil!" mindset to actually do something with the country.
So far they made the rapid progress of advancing the countries interests by looking into 8 people who were fired who serve at the presidents pleasure, and of course, sending the president a bill with so much pork it should be veto'd alone based on only that, nevermind setting the precedent of putting timetables on major military actions...and of course it was veto'd, as they knew at least a month in advance (therefore completely wasting their time, which means our tax dollars).
Don't look to the left for actual ideas that may work, unless you want to hear either a.) Do nothing (this is popular), or b.) Talk to them (whatever context that means, since negotiating with someone who takes satisfaction in blowing up civilians is probably not going to amount to much for us).
Chuck
EDITS: Wow, that must have been my record for typos... 🙁
Most had no plan, they just attacked me and/or "Bush&Co", go figure... :roll:
Granted, 2 or 3 had at least some kind of plausible path forward (didn't necessairly agree with them, but at least they had something).
As we are all seeing with the Dem.'s being in control of Congress, it takes more than a "Bush&Co. are evil!" mindset to actually do something with the country.
So far they made the rapid progress of advancing the countries interests by looking into 8 people who were fired who serve at the presidents pleasure, and of course, sending the president a bill with so much pork it should be veto'd alone based on only that, nevermind setting the precedent of putting timetables on major military actions...and of course it was veto'd, as they knew at least a month in advance (therefore completely wasting their time, which means our tax dollars).
Don't look to the left for actual ideas that may work, unless you want to hear either a.) Do nothing (this is popular), or b.) Talk to them (whatever context that means, since negotiating with someone who takes satisfaction in blowing up civilians is probably not going to amount to much for us).
Chuck
EDITS: Wow, that must have been my record for typos... 🙁
blackangst1
Lifer
Not voting or voting in a prez election doesnt really matter. Im sure youre aware of this though.
palehorse
Lifer
lol.. you're lost! WE (the US) had nothing to do with the radicalization of Islam - it has been getting worse every day for nearly one thousand years! The US is simply the convenient and modern focal point of their propaganda campaign - which appears to work well against some Americans too! DOH!
I suggest that you pick up a book and actually study the history of radical Islam before spouting off any more of your bullsh*t.
Start by looking up the name Ibn Tamiya. hint: he lived and died before Christopher Columbus landed on American shores. Zawahiri and UBL were very much inspired by Tamiya's Wahhabi fatwas written during the 14th century. In fact, they love to quote Tamiya whenever they come out of hiding long enough to make a propaganda video condemning the west...
thanks ahead of time.
PS: Collectively, the current Dem leadership have no clue what they will do to fight radical Islam. They're too busy screaming "Down with teh evul Bush!" to pay attention to the real war being fought around the entire globe.... so who the hell knows what a Dem president would do!?
Arkaign
Lifer
Real war? Please. Terrorism is a relatively minor security issue. If you ranked ALL terrorist-caused casualties together for the past 1,000 years, it would still PALE next to any of these wars BY THEMSELVES :
The Vietnam War
The Korean War
WW2 (any theatre by itself, even)
WW1
The US Civil War
etc
The reaction to the minor threat of terrorism has been greeted with a level of extreme overkill and waste of resources. As a point of fact, the majority of proactive 'anti-terrorism' activity has been downright counterproductive, coming from our own National Security Estimates. Our disastrous showing in Iraq is radicalizing hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions of people against us, of which a certain number will become active terrorists. Even so, the threat remains petty compared to dozens of other much more serious issues facing the world each day, like :
Hunger
Disease
Poverty
Education
Vehicle Safety
Drunk Driving
and so on
Go check out 'Why We Fight' by Eugene Jarecki, although you're probably too programmed to accept that the arms industry and associated special interests actively DRIVE our foreign policy in this regard.
The GWOT is a facade for compounding great power, and accumulating even more wealth for a certain group of people and companies. It has NOTHING to do with the patriotic, jingoistic BS they love to shove down everyone's throats.
EDIT : Trailer Link FTW 🙂
http://www.apple.com/trailers/sony/whywefight/trailer/
Not to put too fine a point on it, but what exactly is the plan Republicans and other conservatives have for radical Islam? Because, while the Dem plan might chiefly be composed of bitching about the Republicans, the Republican plan seems to mostly consist of bitching about the Democrats. Virtually every thread, OP-ED, asshole on TV, etc, etc, from the right, on the topic of radical Islam, consists of complaining how liberals/Democrats/whoever aren't "willing to stand up", with the obvious implication that Republicans ARE "standing up to radical Islam". But wouldn't you know it, just what exactly that means is sort of glossed over. I mean, you yahoos sure have a lot of hot air and rhetoric, but somehow I don't think that impresses the terrorists too much.
You want to know the dirty little secret? You're all a bunch of frightened children. Yes, terrorism is a threat that needs to be dealt with. But it is nowhere near the level that popular culture would suggest, you're way more likely to be killed by the lack of proper health care than by a terrorist. Hell, you're more likely to be killed tomorrow on your way to work by someone who isn't paying enough attention to the road because he's talking on his cell phone. It is absolutely pathetic that terrorism still dominates our culture and our country. The way we'll deal with terrorism is the only way to deal with it, properly fund out intelligence and police organizations and let them do their job. They won't be 100%, of course, but we'll be safe enough so that our government can focus on things that actually threaten our nation. Health care, education, national debt, and many, MANY other national priorities far outweigh the threat posed by "radical Islam", which mostly consists of pissed off idiots living in caves halfway around the globe. "Radical Islam" is a threat dreamed up by a bored news media and politicians who need something to keep the morons voting for them...and it seems to have worked! You want to know how to fight terrorism? Stop being so God damned terrorized!
I know a lot of you people vote for politicians based on their plan to deal with radical Islamic terrorism, and I'd like to get in on the game too. So here's my plan, any politician (of either party) who panders to the security pansies is guaranteed not to get my vote. Any politician who takes the rare rational view on the issue, and concentrates more on real threats to our way of life, gets a big step up in my book...if there is more than one of those, that is.
You want to know the dirty little secret? You're all a bunch of frightened children. Yes, terrorism is a threat that needs to be dealt with. But it is nowhere near the level that popular culture would suggest, you're way more likely to be killed by the lack of proper health care than by a terrorist. Hell, you're more likely to be killed tomorrow on your way to work by someone who isn't paying enough attention to the road because he's talking on his cell phone. It is absolutely pathetic that terrorism still dominates our culture and our country. The way we'll deal with terrorism is the only way to deal with it, properly fund out intelligence and police organizations and let them do their job. They won't be 100%, of course, but we'll be safe enough so that our government can focus on things that actually threaten our nation. Health care, education, national debt, and many, MANY other national priorities far outweigh the threat posed by "radical Islam", which mostly consists of pissed off idiots living in caves halfway around the globe. "Radical Islam" is a threat dreamed up by a bored news media and politicians who need something to keep the morons voting for them...and it seems to have worked! You want to know how to fight terrorism? Stop being so God damned terrorized!
I know a lot of you people vote for politicians based on their plan to deal with radical Islamic terrorism, and I'd like to get in on the game too. So here's my plan, any politician (of either party) who panders to the security pansies is guaranteed not to get my vote. Any politician who takes the rare rational view on the issue, and concentrates more on real threats to our way of life, gets a big step up in my book...if there is more than one of those, that is.
blackllotus
Golden Member
Its quite clear that senseamp was talking about the radicalization of islamists against the United States and western culture. You're right that Wahhabism has existed for centuries however its primary goal has always been to reform Islam, not the rest of the world. They hate muslims who don't practice proper Islam much more than they hate an American who has never been exposed to the religion. We have become a target because our interference in the middle east conflicts with their interests and because, contrary to popular belief, their popularity has been falling (or atleast was, I don't know about after 9/11). They use hatred against America as a recruiting point.
flavio
Diamond Member
Well said! :thumbsup:
See my list of real threats to US citizens:
Biggest threats?
Diseases of Heart 28.5%
Malignant Neoplasms (cancer) 22.8%
Cerebrovascular Diseases (stroke) 6.7%
Chronic Lower Respiratory Diseases 5.1%
Accidents 4.4%
Diabetes Mellitus 3.0%
Influenza and Pneumonia 2.7%
Alzheimer's Disease 2.4%
Nephritis, Nephrotic Syndrome and Nephrosis (kidney diseases) 1.7%
Septicemia (blood poisoning) 1.4%
Radical Islam doesn't even rank.
blackllotus
Golden Member
Maybe you should have read the rest of his post.
LegendKiller
Lifer
You have a 1 in 18,585 chance of getting killed by a car today according to widely accepted statistics. Freakonomics puts forward evidence that you are 4,300,000 less times likely to get killed by a terrorist than you are to get killed by a car.
Thus, you have a .000000000012% chance of getting killed by a terrorist.
Good luck hiding under your bed.
LegendKiller
Lifer
Funny, I live in Manhattan. Work right next to the Chrysler building. Walk by the WTC site all of the time. I am not scared, nor will I ever be. I'd rather take my .0000000000012% chance of getting killed by a terrorist than worry about it. Go ahead and march around without questioning why, how likely it's needed, or what we should do to really prevent it. I'd rather also take that risk than certainly give up something by either living differently or giving up any rights. You are guarding against overblown threats.
100% of losing a right through insecurity vs a .0000000000012% chance of getting killed by a terrorist seems like a losing proposition.
UberNeuman
Lifer
Great. Guard us from your mania as well.....
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