we've lost over 30% of our workforce in the past 6 months...

[Engineer]

Its just when you start getting extended unemployment benefits (After then normal X amount of weeks) you are really leaching off the government.

Not according to "some people".

 

[mcmilljb]

The problem that I've seen (at least in IT) is that companies will post ridiculous requirements for a job and offer peanuts for compensation. People with the qualifications "required" for many of the positions I've seen are gainfully employed making much more money, so there is no way they're going to leave and take a hit on pay and total compensation.

I think you hit the nail on the head with the qualifications. I think some companies have a hard time realizing what it actually takes to get someone in that position. You're going to have to pay some more than what they're currently being paid to leave a job to go some where else. You're actually better off getting someone that can molded into the position or has the experience but might lack the education side. I know companies want more experience, but that costs money and time. You can't always buy experience from the labor market, sometimes it has to be built. We might see some growing pains because companies did cut training budgets plus some fields have had less interest. If you lose a senior programmer, you need to have trained the lower level programmers so one can fill the role otherwise you'll be forced to bare what the market wants. Plus you need to have training to bring in new guys or once again you're at the mercy of the market.

 

[josh0099]

Not according to "some people".

Well its collecting a benefit that really hasn't been paid for already...

 

[Engineer]

Well its collecting a benefit that really hasn't been paid for already...

I'm talking about "any" unemployment, severance...earned and paid for even. Of course, "some people" only say that to anyone not in their circle and are very quiet if anyone in the circle even blatantly promote the systems abuse.

 

[rudeguy]

I'm talking about "any" unemployment, severance...earned and paid for even. Of course, "some people" only say that to anyone not in their circle and are very quiet if anyone in the circle even blatantly promote the systems abuse.

once again man...screw them

Some people get their jollies by kicking people while they are down. Especially on here. Its like their lives are so terrible that the only hope they have of feeling better is to try to bring someone else down to their level.

Unless you are talking about spidey. He just likes to mess with people.

 

[kranky]

If they are short-staffed in sales, aren't sales dropping? And wouldn't it be logical in that case to beef up the sales team, not cut them back even more?

 

[Engineer]

If they are short-staffed in sales, aren't sales dropping? And wouldn't it be logical in that case to beef up the sales team, not cut them back even more?

LOL...company's logic is to cut more people and the remaining ones to work that much harder to make up the difference and more.

 

[BoomerD]

Doesn't the first X amount of weeks come from the state unemployment fund which while he has been an employee his company pays into, so technically if he finds a new job within that time period he isn't leeching off of it as he getting a benefit that has been paid for....Not saying he shouldn't be proactive, but its a risk/reward situation if he believes the situation may turn for the better it might be better to just prepare for the loss and collect the benefit while looking for a job rather then take a perhaps lower job at a new company. Its just when you start getting extended unemployment benefits (After then normal X amount of weeks) you are really leaching off the government.

Not technically...or at least, not in something like 47 states. IIRC, only 3 states require an employee contribution to unemployment.
BUT, I figure those "employment taxes" are part of the total compensation package since employers generally use those costs when figuring out how much it costs to fill the job. (wages, benefits, state and federal taxes)

I've never seen anything wrong when collecting unemployment following a RIF/ROF. That's why the system is in place.
When we lived in Wyoming, I called it, "Fishing for Dollars," because I spent most of my days on a river or stream with a fishing pole in my hand...
Of course, I was "looking for work" all the time...🙄 or at least, looking as hard for work as I was required to look...(union hiring hall agreements, lay-off subject to recall agreements, etc.)

 

[Lanyap]

So... you think that he should sponge off the government for a year and leave a big employment gap on his resume that hiring managers (like myself) will notice for the next 5 years?

That's odd advice coming from you, Spidey.

Severance and the first 26 weeks of unemployment come from the employer. He didn't say to stay out for a year (unless I missed it.) A huge number of good people have been laid off over the past several years. It will be common for hiring managers to see people have large gaps in their resume. It will not have the usual stigma attached.

 

[Svnla]

OP, if I was you, I would definitely dust up my resume and look around. Don't wait until the ship hits the iceberg.

BTW, even your nick is rudeguy, you were a few nice posters with helpful information in my thread about newbie buying stuffs in eBay.:thumbsup:.

The problem that I've seen (at least in IT) is that companies will post ridiculous requirements for a job and offer peanuts for compensation. People with the qualifications "required" for many of the positions I've seen are gainfully employed making much more money, so there is no way they're going to leave and take a hit on pay and total compensation.

Not just in IT, it is happening in other fields too. Companies (not all of course) are paying peanuts for all the requirements that are demanding.

 

[Lanyap]

Not technically...or at least, not in something like 47 states. IIRC, only 3 states require an employee contribution to unemployment.
BUT, I figure those "employment taxes" are part of the total compensation package since employers generally use those costs when figuring out how much it costs to fill the job. (wages, benefits, state and federal taxes)

Companies don't generally figure in unemployment taxes in their wage compensation since it's a relatively small amount. It's only 26 weeks. Depending on your state it could be anywhere from $6,000 to $10,000 for a long term employee.

 

[3chordcharlie]

Exactly. I have a 80-90k position that I'm trying to fill and can't find anyone qualified. Hard to believe that there are not enough people to fill these types of jobs. I know I personally have 3-5 recruiters calling me each day with jobs they are trying to fill. I guess kids gave up on Computer Science in college sometime in the last 10 years.

A lot of kids never got jobs in their field in the last 5 years especially.

So they aren't 'qualified', and probably don't bother applying.

It's cheaper for me to cut my training budget and simply siphon experience from other employers. Of course, it's cheaper for them to do the same; all of a sudden no one is training.

It's the same math that makes off-shore manufacturing so fool-proof.

 

[BoomerD]

Companies don't generally figure in unemployment taxes in their wage compensation since it's a relatively small amount. It's only 26 weeks. Depending on your state it could be anywhere from $6,000 to $10,000 for a long term employee.

Here in California, the rate paid by an employer varies, and can be as high as 6.2% on the first $7000 per employee. ($434 per employee MAX.) AFAIK, that's always figured in total cost to the company...not compensation amounts, but it IS part of how much an employee costs the company...same with the FICA taxes and any other state/federal tax.
Hell, I've had companies list every dime of taxes they "paid on my behalf" when explaining our total compensation package...and included unemployment taxes, FICA, work comp, etc.

 

[rudeguy]

If they are short-staffed in sales, aren't sales dropping? And wouldn't it be logical in that case to beef up the sales team, not cut them back even more?

Especially since us sales folks have the lowest base pay out of anyone. We also never get raises. Our labor cost is the lowest out of anyone in the building.

 

[nublikescake]

Sounds like a sinking ship, time to fire up whatever document editor you use and spiffy up that resume.

I second this strongly.

 

[DJK Frank 16]

Sounds like they are looking for a way to shut the doors to me....

 

[EMPshockwave82]

Sounds like they are looking for a way to shut the doors to me....

And make as much money as possible off of the last few people that will put up with their BS for as long as they can hold out.

 

[Anubis]

The problem that I've seen (at least in IT) is that companies will post ridiculous requirements for a job and offer peanuts for compensation. People with the qualifications "required" for many of the positions I've seen are gainfully employed making much more money, so there is no way they're going to leave and take a hit on pay and total compensation.

its not just IT where this happens. we have openings for certain positions where the reqs are 15+ years in the industry, phd, .... those people generally aren't looking to move

 

[IndyColtsFan]

its not just IT where this happens. we have openings for certain positions where the reqs are 15+ years in the industry, phd, .... those people generally aren't looking to move

Yeah, I'm not surprised. I am only familiar with the IT market, so I didn't want to speak for other fields. I've seen some ridiculous examples in the last few months, such as IT manager jobs requiring x,y,z certifications, 10 years of experience, a PMP, and an MBA and the job only paying $50K to $60K. Seriously?

 

[gophins72]

it sort of sounds like these jobs are being opened with the qualification requirements that fit the resumes of the previous job holders

 

[IndyColtsFan]

it sort of sounds like these jobs are being opened with the qualification requirements that fit the resumes of the previous job holders

Well, in fairness, many of these postings might be due to the hiring rules of the company. Some companies require that job postings be made externally even if there are qualified internal candidates. This might be a situation where the company intentionally makes the external posting somewhat unattractive so that they can hire their preferred internal candidate without too much difficulty. Or, at least, I hope that's the excuse.

 

[3chordcharlie]

its not just IT where this happens. we have openings for certain positions where the reqs are 15+ years in the industry, phd, .... those people generally aren't looking to move

Some of those 'require phd' jobs are pretty silly.

As if a phd (extremely focused area of study) would make you a better manager, or better understand an entire industry. Some places have a phd-glass-ceiling that can prevent the best managers from rising to their potential.

Of course now you'll tell me you are looking for senior research professors and I will feel silly😉

 

[mmntech]

That's a normal month for my company. We lost most of our veteran employees in the last year. They quit because they're underpaid and find something better.

 

[dmcowen674]

and my company still isn't hiring.

They've given us sales folks metrics that are impossible to hit. This means that our commissions are nearly nonexistent. So we have all taken roughly a 25% paycut and doing 30% more work. Then since we aren't able to hit our numbers, they keep firing more and more of us.

I'm worried.

Get out as soon as you can, that company is toast.

 

[Macamus Prime]

and my company still isn't hiring.

They've given us sales folks metrics that are impossible to hit. This means that our commissions are nearly nonexistent. So we have all taken roughly a 25% paycut and doing 30% more work. Then since we aren't able to hit our numbers, they keep firing more and more of us.

I'm worried.

Sorry, but you are getting the white glove treatment. Many companies are doing this.

They are making the work environment unfriendly, so you can up and leave, without them having to give you a package.

My former employer made all of 2010 sound like performance counts and is rewarded. I was the top performer in my group and I got a 25% cut in bonus.

They do not want you or anyone else there.