West Virginia teachers vote themselves a nice state pension

[lupi]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Throckmorton
Didn't all jobs used to be like this? Only in America in 2008 is a pension plan called "stealing from taxpayers" by ATOT

yea and private industry realized it is nearly impossible to sustain such programs and still turn a profit. Thus the move to 401k's where the funding and responsibility is on the employee. Unsurprising govt is 30 years behind the times and still cant properly fund most of these pension plans without sapping the tax payer. Private industry has no tool to suck every american dry to fund their pension plans.

It has nothing to do with them making a profit.

It has everything to do with them making a higher profit so their stock price goes up so the board members and CEO gets more money when they sell their yearly stock bonuses.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: lupi

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Throckmorton
Didn't all jobs used to be like this? Only in America in 2008 is a pension plan called "stealing from taxpayers" by ATOT

yea and private industry realized it is nearly impossible to sustain such programs and still turn a profit. Thus the move to 401k's where the funding and responsibility is on the employee. Unsurprising govt is 30 years behind the times and still cant properly fund most of these pension plans without sapping the tax payer. Private industry has no tool to suck every american dry to fund their pension plans.

It has nothing to do with them making a profit.

It has everything to do with them making a higher profit so their stock price goes up so the board members and CEO gets more money when they sell their yearly stock bonuses.

That sounds contradictory at best. Especially when you look at the few mega corps in this country who still have pension plans. They are struggling big time with the costs of their plans, most of which are underfunded because they needed the cash to keep running.

Big Auto and Airlines being two examples. Unsurprising Unions are still running the show over there as well. Though some of these companies are getting out from underneath them and having the unions run and fund the plans.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: fleshconsumed
I don't live in Virginia, but I really feel for Virginia residents. Most people would dream of having a 7.5% 401K match from their employer. And now not only they have to struggle scraping for retirement, they also have to pick up pension plans for the people who couldn't manage their finances.

Why do you feel for us Virginia residents? These teachers are in West Virginia, which is a different state. Are they teaching geography to kids anymore? lol

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: lupi

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Throckmorton
Didn't all jobs used to be like this? Only in America in 2008 is a pension plan called "stealing from taxpayers" by ATOT

yea and private industry realized it is nearly impossible to sustain such programs and still turn a profit. Thus the move to 401k's where the funding and responsibility is on the employee. Unsurprising govt is 30 years behind the times and still cant properly fund most of these pension plans without sapping the tax payer. Private industry has no tool to suck every american dry to fund their pension plans.

It has nothing to do with them making a profit.

It has everything to do with them making a higher profit so their stock price goes up so the board members and CEO gets more money when they sell their yearly stock bonuses.

If company A stops throwing money at ex employees, company B has to to be competitive. Don't you wonder why it's primarily government employees that now get such great pensions? it's because market forces are not relevant to them. They just count on a larger population and habitually increased taxes to cover budget shortfalls.

 

[lupi]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: lupi

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Throckmorton
Didn't all jobs used to be like this? Only in America in 2008 is a pension plan called "stealing from taxpayers" by ATOT

yea and private industry realized it is nearly impossible to sustain such programs and still turn a profit. Thus the move to 401k's where the funding and responsibility is on the employee. Unsurprising govt is 30 years behind the times and still cant properly fund most of these pension plans without sapping the tax payer. Private industry has no tool to suck every american dry to fund their pension plans.

It has nothing to do with them making a profit.

It has everything to do with them making a higher profit so their stock price goes up so the board members and CEO gets more money when they sell their yearly stock bonuses.

That sounds contradictory at best. Especially when you look at the few mega corps in this country who still have pension plans. They are struggling big time with the costs of their plans, most of which are underfunded because they needed the cash to keep running.

Big Auto and Airlines being two examples. Unsurprising Unions are still running the show over there as well. Though some of these companies are getting out from underneath them and having the unions run and fund the plans.

It was health care plans dragging them under, not pension.

 

[lupi]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: lupi

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Throckmorton
Didn't all jobs used to be like this? Only in America in 2008 is a pension plan called "stealing from taxpayers" by ATOT

yea and private industry realized it is nearly impossible to sustain such programs and still turn a profit. Thus the move to 401k's where the funding and responsibility is on the employee. Unsurprising govt is 30 years behind the times and still cant properly fund most of these pension plans without sapping the tax payer. Private industry has no tool to suck every american dry to fund their pension plans.

It has nothing to do with them making a profit.

It has everything to do with them making a higher profit so their stock price goes up so the board members and CEO gets more money when they sell their yearly stock bonuses.

If company A stops throwing money at ex employees, company B has to to be competitive. Don't you wonder why it's primarily government employees that now get such great pensions? it's because market forces are not relevant to them. They just count on a larger population and habitually increased taxes to cover budget shortfalls.

I remember a part of capitalism being to treat your employees well. Seems over the last couple of decades that has fallen well aside as those in charge of many of the larger companies have an extremely narrow me first view. A negative impact of the revolution of the 60/70's perhaps? I wouldn't be surprised to see a continued decline of the american worker, vacation time, pensions, educational benefits, actual wage all going down.

 

[OutHouse]

Originally posted by: marincounty
Here's a link with some of the wages of police and fire in Vallejo, CA.
Text

Citywide rank Employee name Department Total wages
5 James L. Higgins Fire Department $251,094
6 Lamonte K. Morris Fire Department $247,902
7 Russell S. Sherman Fire Department $238,725
8 Richard E. Mackenzie Fire Department $236,701
9 John A. Barbuzano Fire Department $236,467
10 Gordon C. Moncibais Fire Department $233,338
11 Michael Kirchner Fire Department $229,317
12 Gregory R. Falkenthal Fire Department $226,235
13 Alphonzo L. Love Fire Department $223,933
14 Michael Deroque Fire Department $222,755
15 Douglas T. Robertson Fire Department $221,458
16 Kurt P. Henke Fire Department $218,830
17 Raymand R. Dandridge Fire Department $217,920
18 David A. Urrutia Fire Department $215,060
19 Sean Fields Fire Department $214,219
21 Mansfield S. Simmons Fire Department $212,395
24 John J. Ha Fire Department $209,547
27 Michael Brooks Fire Department $205,793
28 Michael H. Humphrey Fire Department $205,335
30 Jason S. Goodner Fire Department $202,127

holy shit!!

 

[Mardeth]

Originally posted by: Citrix

Originally posted by: marincounty
Here's a link with some of the wages of police and fire in Vallejo, CA.
Text

Citywide rank Employee name Department Total wages
5 James L. Higgins Fire Department $251,094
6 Lamonte K. Morris Fire Department $247,902
7 Russell S. Sherman Fire Department $238,725
8 Richard E. Mackenzie Fire Department $236,701
9 John A. Barbuzano Fire Department $236,467
10 Gordon C. Moncibais Fire Department $233,338
11 Michael Kirchner Fire Department $229,317
12 Gregory R. Falkenthal Fire Department $226,235
13 Alphonzo L. Love Fire Department $223,933
14 Michael Deroque Fire Department $222,755
15 Douglas T. Robertson Fire Department $221,458
16 Kurt P. Henke Fire Department $218,830
17 Raymand R. Dandridge Fire Department $217,920
18 David A. Urrutia Fire Department $215,060
19 Sean Fields Fire Department $214,219
21 Mansfield S. Simmons Fire Department $212,395
24 John J. Ha Fire Department $209,547
27 Michael Brooks Fire Department $205,793
28 Michael H. Humphrey Fire Department $205,335
30 Jason S. Goodner Fire Department $202,127

holy shit!!

Yea and 261 people earn >100k.

 

[PingSpike]

Don't worry, I'm sure they'll continue to whine about being underpaid while ignoring their unheard-of-in-the-private-sector benefits package, safe working environment and above average job security when it comes time to get their above average annual wage increase.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: lupi

I remember a part of capitalism being to treat your employees well. Seems over the last couple of decades that has fallen well aside as those in charge of many of the larger companies have an extremely narrow me first view. A negative impact of the revolution of the 60/70's perhaps? I wouldn't be surprised to see a continued decline of the american worker, vacation time, pensions, educational benefits, actual wage all going down.

Capitalism has never had anything to do with treating workers well. The golden era of the 50s where people worked for 40 years for the same company, got a gold watch and a comfy retirement were nothing more than an amusing footnote in history. It never was that way before and never will be again.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: marincounty
Here's a link with some of the wages of police and fire in Vallejo, CA.
Text

Citywide rank Employee name Department Total wages
5 James L. Higgins Fire Department $251,094
6 Lamonte K. Morris Fire Department $247,902
7 Russell S. Sherman Fire Department $238,725
8 Richard E. Mackenzie Fire Department $236,701
9 John A. Barbuzano Fire Department $236,467
10 Gordon C. Moncibais Fire Department $233,338
11 Michael Kirchner Fire Department $229,317
12 Gregory R. Falkenthal Fire Department $226,235
13 Alphonzo L. Love Fire Department $223,933
14 Michael Deroque Fire Department $222,755
15 Douglas T. Robertson Fire Department $221,458
16 Kurt P. Henke Fire Department $218,830
17 Raymand R. Dandridge Fire Department $217,920
18 David A. Urrutia Fire Department $215,060
19 Sean Fields Fire Department $214,219
21 Mansfield S. Simmons Fire Department $212,395
24 John J. Ha Fire Department $209,547
27 Michael Brooks Fire Department $205,793
28 Michael H. Humphrey Fire Department $205,335
30 Jason S. Goodner Fire Department $202,127

WHOA! I have the utmost respect for all first responders, but damn! I'm seriously in the wrong line of work...

 

[BlueWeasel]

Originally posted by: PingSpike
Don't worry, I'm sure they'll continue to whine about being underpaid while ignoring their unheard-of-in-the-private-sector benefits package, safe working environment and above average job security when it comes time to get their above average annual wage increase.

Not to mention that including holidays, spring break, and summer vacation, they probably only work for 8 months out of the year.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: BlueWeasel

Originally posted by: PingSpike
Don't worry, I'm sure they'll continue to whine about being underpaid while ignoring their unheard-of-in-the-private-sector benefits package, safe working environment and above average job security when it comes time to get their above average annual wage increase.

Not to mention that including holidays, spring break, and summer vacation, they probably only work for 8 months out of the year.

They get off work early, too :0

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: JS80
Democracy - where Joe can vote to steal from Jack, LEGALLY!

Democracy is nothing more than betting that 51% of the nation know whats best for 100% of the nation 100% of the time.

 

[dmcowen674]

Why does the OP hate Teachers

 

[trenchfoot]

we all carve our own niches in this society.

it seems rather unfair to say on the one hand that we should all be experts at investing our monies, yet otoh it's not fair to be experts at acquiring wealth in other ways, such as positioning yourself to be in the right place at the right time while cultivating the right connections for career advancement, etc. we all deserve the stations we have in our lives because we chose our own paths that fit with our own unique inherent gifts and abilities.

to criticize those that decide to heed their passion for being teachers or whatever else that fulfills and pleases a person's career aspirations, including those jobs that offer generous pension/benefits packages to compensate for undesireable working conditions etc. smells of sour grapes.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: tweaker2
to criticize those that decide to heed their passion for being teachers or whatever else that fulfills and pleases a person's career aspirations, including those jobs that offer generous pension/benefits packages to compensate for undesireable working conditions etc. smells of sour grapes.

I think you're missing the point. This isn't so much about teachers' benefits but that this group of teachers put in no effort for 17 years with their retirement and now are whining to the tax payers to cover the rift. Their fault.

 

[Kappo]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: tweaker2
to criticize those that decide to heed their passion for being teachers or whatever else that fulfills and pleases a person's career aspirations, including those jobs that offer generous pension/benefits packages to compensate for undesireable working conditions etc. smells of sour grapes.

I think you're missing the point. This isn't so much about teachers' benefits but that this group of teachers put in no effort for 17 years with their retirement and now are whining to the tax payers to cover the rift. Their fault.

Exactly. Why is it a taxpayer's responsibility to pick up the tab for a group of people being stupid? Is google down or something in WV?

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: tweaker2
we all carve our own niches in this society.

it seems rather unfair to say on the one hand that we should all be experts at investing our monies, yet otoh it's not fair to be experts at acquiring wealth in other ways, such as positioning yourself to be in the right place at the right time while cultivating the right connections for career advancement, etc. we all deserve the stations we have in our lives because we chose our own paths that fit with our own unique inherent gifts and abilities.

to criticize those that decide to heed their passion for being teachers or whatever else that fulfills and pleases a person's career aspirations, including those jobs that offer generous pension/benefits packages to compensate for undesireable working conditions etc. smells of sour grapes.

Other than congress, and now apparently teachers, what other group gets to vote themselves a raise? That's what this is. A raise. A big fat one.

 

[trenchfoot]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: tweaker2
to criticize those that decide to heed their passion for being teachers or whatever else that fulfills and pleases a person's career aspirations, including those jobs that offer generous pension/benefits packages to compensate for undesireable working conditions etc. smells of sour grapes.

I think you're missing the point. This isn't so much about teachers' benefits but that this group of teachers put in no effort for 17 years with their retirement and now are whining to the tax payers to cover the rift. Their fault.

well slap me with a pissed off toad. i see what you mean. thanks for getting me back on the tracks. :thumbsup:

edit - my speedreading just ain't what it used to be.