Maybe I am, maybe I'm not. The main point of this thread is what "right" do I have? I should have every right in the world to refuse service to ANYONE I want, even if it's not morally right.
Maybe I am, maybe I'm not. The main point of this thread is what "right" do I have? I should have every right in the world to refuse service to ANYONE I want, even if it's not morally right.
I'll argue both points.
Your point: As a business, you should have the right to do business with whom you choose as long as it doesn't impose on ones Civil Rights. You cannot discriminate on X characteristict but other than that, a business should be totally independent with their decisions and should be allowed to serve whomever or restrict their services to who they choose.
Counter Point: If I, as an autonomous human being, demand services from a business who sells that service, I should be able to purchase said service regardless of their excuses. It's my self-control that should determine whether or not I request said service and if I do that, said request shouldn't be obstructed by any party.
If someone wants to do something against your beliefs, you should have a right not to be a part of it. Let her go to the liquor store.
moshquerade
No Lifer
- Nov 1, 2001
- 61,504
- 12
- 56
did he site any actual court references? i'd be interested to read them, and then also, if there were a way, follow up and see if the baby was born with fetal alcohol symdrome.
THEN... some crafty lawyer could come back on a bartender and say he/she contributed to the fetal alcohol syndrome. :roll:
Rock Hydra
Diamond Member
- Dec 13, 2004
- 6,466
- 1
- 0
That's what I was thinking. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. OP, maybe you should make everyone sign a disclaimer before you serve them alcohol.
Toasthead
Diamond Member
- Aug 27, 2001
- 6,621
- 0
- 0
but I GUARANTEE you if the child is born with birth defects, the mom would sue saying 'YOU SHOULD HAVE NEVER GAVE A PREGNANT WOMAN ALCOHOL!!!' and probably win.
In fact thats probably what they are hoping for.
Its a no win situation
People are stupid.
HomeBrewerDude
Lifer
- Jan 18, 2001
- 14,465
- 1
- 0
kranky
Elite Member
- Oct 9, 1999
- 21,020
- 156
- 106
It's one of those unusual situations where lawyers can win either way. You're told you must serve them because of discrimination. Now the lawyers can sue you for the fetal alcohol syndrome problems, AND sue the mother on behalf of the child for knowingly contributing to it.
Everyone's a loser!
Everyone's a loser!
Can this entire thing be avoided by putting up a sign saying "This establishment will not serve alcohol to obviously pregnant or nursing women"
I've refused to serve pregnant women many times over. Never sued. I no longer work in the restaurant industry, and who knows how long the statute of limitations is for that. All of them except one didn't give me any trouble. The one that gave me trouble was drunk already, so I had another reason not to serve her. 80% of the time, I ended up getting a huge tip and many thanks from her friends who were with her. Note: these were all bar settings; when I was serving tables, I've served wine with a meal to pregnant women.
I would never let my wife drink alcohol while she is pregnant. Asian people like me, for one reason or another, even if i am the same weight as a white guy, i always get drunk easier. Not only that, i know people that drank only beer and their kids still come out with problems. Perhaps that throughout the generations of drinking, some of us have adapted a higher tolerance to alcohol. Just remember though, it wasnt until the 20th century that we developed the technology to monitor brain activity precisely. It has been shown that drinking causes brain activity to decrease in your babies! Meaning families that drink generations after generations will continue to lower their brain activity and it doesnt come back. I did not say you become more stupid but you do the math, does less brain activity = being more stupid?
Studies have shown that even the slightest bit of alcohol during pregnancy can have an effect on an unborn child.
Drinking while pregnant is irresponsible, even if it's just on principle alone.
No, I'm not linking to the studies
. I just remember reading it.I have turned down jobs before where I quoted out the work and the customer says "Don't you think that's a bit high? I'll let you do the work if you drop it by $XXX.XX.". I just tell them no thanks. Or if they say "Well so and so will do it for such and such less.". I just tell them "Okay, have a nice day.". they looked shocked and either leave it and I bill what I bill or they leave and save me the headache of dealing with a cheapskate.
Maybe his lack of trust in his fellow man stems from pregnant women drinking and smoking "just a little" while pregnant.
I believe most laws MAKE it the bartender's responsibility. As KarenMarie stated, they've been sued in the past for not using discretion.
It truly is a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" scenario.
It's not your call. Same BS as pharmacists refusing to dispense birth control or morning after pills.
There's a difference between discriminating against a protected class and choosing not to serve an intoxicated/pregnant/disorderly/etc individual. The former is illegal. The latter is required by law in many states.
mugs
Lifer
- Apr 29, 2003
- 48,920
- 46
- 91
I think it'd be an open and shut case... you can't refuse to serve someone because they're a member of a protected class. Pregnant women are a protected class. The bartender would have an easy defense if he was sued for serving her - he's legally required to do it.
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