Watched a few religious channels and now I think I understand

[seemingly random]

Originally posted by: Nik

Originally posted by: seemingly random
If the christian god is all-powerful, works in mysterious ways, has infinite wisdom, etc, trying to eliminate a cancer or any illness, which this god has given to a person, is going against the wishes of this god.

That's a stupid argument. You could also argue, in the same breath, that since god provided the capacity for knowledge and understanding in humans to solve problems using modern medicine, many people who've been cured of cancer or are in remission would also be the will of god.

Exactly my point. I have heard these precise words out of people's mouths.

So they attribute the cure to this god but not the initial disease. The person probably got it initially because they were a sinner or didn't go to church enough ... which would have been given to them by this god ... head asplodes...

 

[Regs]

Religion should be outlawed on TV sadly or at least shunned by the pope. Most of the guys on TV don't even come from creditable backgrounds.

I don't even believe in organized religion because it's manipulative and humanity as a whole are unable to think for themselves. Hopefully we will reach a point one day when humanity meets the presipist, but for now people should just think for themselves.

I'm spiritual for instance. I don't need a guy in a large hat to make me believe there is a god or supreme being. I also don't need a billboard to tell me Jesus or Mohammed are the only ones I have to talk with to get my message to god.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Originally posted by: Nik

Originally posted by: seemingly random
If the christian god is all-powerful, works in mysterious ways, has infinite wisdom, etc, trying to eliminate a cancer or any illness, which this god has given to a person, is going against the wishes of this god.

That's a stupid argument. You could also argue, in the same breath, that since god provided the capacity for knowledge and understanding in humans to solve problems using modern medicine, many people who've been cured of cancer or are in remission would also be the will of god.

No, it's a solid argument and that is a stupid attempt at dismissing it. You either believe in an omnipotent god or you don't. You either believe in god having a plan or you don't.

If you believe in an omnipotent god that has a plan then you also believe, perforce, that god decides who lives and who dies. A doctor can't lose a patient that god wants alive and medicine can't save one that god wants dead. That concept is quite simple and should be understandable even to morons who believe in omnipotent gods. So what's the point of going to a doctor? If a patient beats cancer they'll claim it was the grace of god that saved them and if they croak the family will console themselves by murmuring "it was god's will". So it was gods will either way, what was the doctor for? Why the hospital? Why the medicine? If god wanted that person alive they would be alive even if they refused treatment entirely because mankind can't circumvent his plan.

 

[Jeff7]

Originally posted by: seemingly random

Originally posted by: Nik

Originally posted by: seemingly random
If the christian god is all-powerful, works in mysterious ways, has infinite wisdom, etc, trying to eliminate a cancer or any illness, which this god has given to a person, is going against the wishes of this god.

That's a stupid argument. You could also argue, in the same breath, that since god provided the capacity for knowledge and understanding in humans to solve problems using modern medicine, many people who've been cured of cancer or are in remission would also be the will of god.

Exactly my point. I have heard these precise words out of people's mouths.

So they attribute the cure to this god but not the initial disease. The person probably got it initially because they were a sinner or didn't go to church enough ... which would have been given to them by this god ... head asplodes...

And that's the great thing - God can never lose. If he gave the illness, then it was for a good reason. The suffering the person endures is therefore a beautiful thing, because it was God's will. But maybe the doctor finding a cure was also God's will. Or else it was God's will that no cure be found, and the person dies in agony. So no matter what happens, someone can always say that that's exactly how God wanted it to happen.
It's no different than saying "I meant to do that!" every time you screw up something.


Or, pretty much what GagHalfrunt beat me to saying.

 

[seemingly random]

Originally posted by: loki8481
religion may not be for you, but you're as much of a moron as those you're condemning if you're going to damn all religion across the board based on a couple televangelists.

Nice attempt at minimization.

I don't think he's damning all religion.

I understand why people are turning away from religion. I haven't been to church in probably 7 years, but I remain somewhat religious. So last night I was really bored with what was on tv and flipped through some channels till I came to the block of channels on directv that are religion based.
...

Just the quack tv ministries.

Now, if you want to rag on someone who damns all religion, you can rag on me or any of the other numerous people here who do.

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: Jeff7

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Nitemare
Televangelists and lotteries are a tax on the stupid.

I agree.

But I don't feel that the minister, pastor, priest, who takes up a collection in his/her church is in the same category. The electric bill needs to be paid no matter what organization you belong too.

Fine, then have them stop saying that "God" needs money, and just call it what it is: A membership fee.

I have never been in any church where anyone said, "God needs money".
At the church I go to there is a collection at every mass. It is voluntary. It is not a "membership fee" that you have to pay to remain a member. The minister/priest/pastor rarely mentions the collection except when they are collecting for something extra like for right to life, missionary work, etc. I have never been pressured to give.

Those of you who actually don't know what goes on beyond the chapel doors because you don't attend a church are really just shooting from your hip. I don't give you crap because you don't attend, but the non-believers are quite loud and feel the need to be heard whenever the topic of religion comes up. I wonder why that is....

Originally posted by: loki8481
religion may not be for you, but you're as much of a moron as those you're condemning if you're going to damn all religion across the board based on a couple televangelists.

thank you for being a voice of reason, and i take it you aren't just speaking of the OP, but of the others who did just at you've said.

 

[waggy]

I have said it before and i feel its still true. Religion is great. THE CHURCH (no religion speciefied at all) is evil. when you get someone in power such as you get in large churches and higher up it tends to currupt them.

and nearly EVERY TV ministry is a frickne quack.

 

[SilentZero]

Nice post...so true!

 

[Jeff7]

Originally posted by: moshquerade
I have never been in any church where anyone said, "God needs money".
At the church I go to there is a collection at every mass. It is voluntary. It is not a "membership fee" that you have to pay to remain a member. The minister/priest/pastor rarely mentions the collection except when they are collecting for something extra like for right to life, missionary work, etc. I have never been pressured to give.

Those of you who actually don't know what goes on beyond the chapel doors because you don't attend a church are really just shooting from your hip. I don't give you crap because you don't attend, but the non-believers are quite loud and feel the need to be heard whenever the topic of religion comes up. I wonder why that is....

Why go to church? Why not just go right to the source? The bible itself says that God wants tithes, though usually not in currency as we're accustomed to, but it was always some relevant portion of each person's income.
And just historically, there have been far too many churches (>0 would be too many for those who are "doing God's work) where tithing was talked up as the way to get into God's good graces. If you can't trust those who say that they're God's good people, then what are you left with? God needs better QC standards.

Why the wish to be heard? Part of it was summed up in Godless' sig awhile ago, that there is no term for people who don't believe Elvis lives on Mars, or no term for people who don't believe in Santa (something along those lines), yet there are still an astonishing number of people still believe in these thousands of years-old dogmas of fanciful, silly children's stories, and it is somehow viewed as being "normal." There's a big man in the sky who has things he wants people to do, but no one can agree on what they are, and he doesn't seem to care one way or another. But people still supposedly know how they can please him, with no reinforcement or denial as evidence - the only "evidence" is purely circumstantial, like saying that an astrology forecast is correct. It's all just absurd, and rather unsettling.

And of course there's the discrimination that's present. An atheist running for public office in this country? He might as well announce that he enjoys having sex with decapitated kittens. But if his opponent announces in the a speech that he himself is a good Christian who has sex with decapitated kittens, he'd probably get more votes than the normal atheist.

 

[seemingly random]

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Jeff7

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Nitemare
Televangelists and lotteries are a tax on the stupid.

I agree.

But I don't feel that the minister, pastor, priest, who takes up a collection in his/her church is in the same category. The electric bill needs to be paid no matter what organization you belong too.

Fine, then have them stop saying that "God" needs money, and just call it what it is: A membership fee.

I have never been in any church where anyone said, "God needs money".
At the church I go to there is a collection at every mass. It is voluntary. It is not a "membership fee" that you have to pay to remain a member. The minister/priest/pastor rarely mentions the collection except when they are collecting for something extra like for right to life, missionary work, etc. I have never been pressured to give.

Those of you who actually don't know what goes on beyond the chapel doors because you don't attend a church are really just shooting from your hip. I don't give you crap because you don't attend, but the non-believers are quite loud and feel the need to be heard whenever the topic of religion comes up. I wonder why that is....

Originally posted by: loki8481
religion may not be for you, but you're as much of a moron as those you're condemning if you're going to damn all religion across the board based on a couple televangelists.

thank you for being a voice of reason, and i take it you aren't just speaking of the OP, but of the others who did just at you've said.

Bullshit. If you were raised catholic, you've been pressured your whole life. The church likes to get their hooks into the kiddies as early as possible. This is one of the reason people who have been religious their entire lives find utterly impossible to imagine that they've been wrong or misled.

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: Jeff7

Originally posted by: moshquerade
I have never been in any church where anyone said, "God needs money".
At the church I go to there is a collection at every mass. It is voluntary. It is not a "membership fee" that you have to pay to remain a member. The minister/priest/pastor rarely mentions the collection except when they are collecting for something extra like for right to life, missionary work, etc. I have never been pressured to give.

Those of you who actually don't know what goes on beyond the chapel doors because you don't attend a church are really just shooting from your hip. I don't give you crap because you don't attend, but the non-believers are quite loud and feel the need to be heard whenever the topic of religion comes up. I wonder why that is....

Why go to church? Why not just go right to the source? The bible itself says that God wants tithes, though usually not in currency as we're accustomed to, but it was always some relevant portion of each person's income.
And just historically, there have been far too many churches (>0 would be too many for those who are "doing God's work) where tithing was talked up as the way to get into God's good graces. If you can't trust those who say that they're God's good people, then what are you left with? God needs better QC standards.

Why the wish to be heard? Part of it was summed up in Godless' sig awhile ago, that there is no term for people who don't believe Elvis lives on Mars, or no term for people who don't believe in Santa (something along those lines), yet there are still an astonishing number of people still believe in these thousands of years-old dogmas of fanciful, silly children's stories, and it is somehow viewed as being "normal." There's a big man in the sky who has things he wants people to do, but no one can agree on what they are, and he doesn't seem to care one way or another. But people still supposedly know how they can please him, with no reinforcement or denial as evidence - the only "evidence" is purely circumstantial, like saying that an astrology forecast is correct. It's all just absurd, and rather unsettling.

And of course there's the discrimination that's present. An atheist running for public office in this country? He might as well announce that he enjoys having sex with decapitated kittens. But if his opponent announces in the a speech that he himself is a good Christian who has sex with decapitated kittens, he'd probably get more votes than the normal atheist.

And I have to ask, why do religious people, people who believe in God, bother you so much? How do they negatively affect your life? Frankly, I don't think it's any of your concern.

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: seemingly random

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Jeff7

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Nitemare
Televangelists and lotteries are a tax on the stupid.

I agree.

But I don't feel that the minister, pastor, priest, who takes up a collection in his/her church is in the same category. The electric bill needs to be paid no matter what organization you belong too.

Fine, then have them stop saying that "God" needs money, and just call it what it is: A membership fee.

I have never been in any church where anyone said, "God needs money".
At the church I go to there is a collection at every mass. It is voluntary. It is not a "membership fee" that you have to pay to remain a member. The minister/priest/pastor rarely mentions the collection except when they are collecting for something extra like for right to life, missionary work, etc. I have never been pressured to give.

Those of you who actually don't know what goes on beyond the chapel doors because you don't attend a church are really just shooting from your hip. I don't give you crap because you don't attend, but the non-believers are quite loud and feel the need to be heard whenever the topic of religion comes up. I wonder why that is....

Originally posted by: loki8481
religion may not be for you, but you're as much of a moron as those you're condemning if you're going to damn all religion across the board based on a couple televangelists.

thank you for being a voice of reason, and i take it you aren't just speaking of the OP, but of the others who did just at you've said.

Bullshit. If you were raised catholic, you've been pressured your whole life. The church likes to get their hooks into the kiddies as early as possible. This is one of the reason people who have been religious their entire lives find utterly impossible to imagine that they've been wrong or misled.

I have said that I've never been pressured to give money. I know you don't want to believe it, because it doesn't fit into your little house of criticism, but it's the truth.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: seemingly random

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Jeff7

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Nitemare
Televangelists and lotteries are a tax on the stupid.

I agree.

But I don't feel that the minister, pastor, priest, who takes up a collection in his/her church is in the same category. The electric bill needs to be paid no matter what organization you belong too.

Fine, then have them stop saying that "God" needs money, and just call it what it is: A membership fee.

I have never been in any church where anyone said, "God needs money".
At the church I go to there is a collection at every mass. It is voluntary. It is not a "membership fee" that you have to pay to remain a member. The minister/priest/pastor rarely mentions the collection except when they are collecting for something extra like for right to life, missionary work, etc. I have never been pressured to give.

Those of you who actually don't know what goes on beyond the chapel doors because you don't attend a church are really just shooting from your hip. I don't give you crap because you don't attend, but the non-believers are quite loud and feel the need to be heard whenever the topic of religion comes up. I wonder why that is....

Originally posted by: loki8481
religion may not be for you, but you're as much of a moron as those you're condemning if you're going to damn all religion across the board based on a couple televangelists.

thank you for being a voice of reason, and i take it you aren't just speaking of the OP, but of the others who did just at you've said.

Bullshit. If you were raised catholic, you've been pressured your whole life. The church likes to get their hooks into the kiddies as early as possible. This is one of the reason people who have been religious their entire lives find utterly impossible to imagine that they've been wrong or misled.

i have gone to church since i was a child. I Have NEVER been pressured to give.

Even was a teen when i wondered where all the money went. i mean i could guess how much they were bringing in. i sat down and talked with one of the heads of the local church and he told me. the church ran a food pantry. he asked how much i thought that cost? then electricity? etc.
the land was donated and they relied on donations to keep the church going (it was a small church).

only time i ever felt much pressure to give was when i went to a really large church in toward chicago. while he never said god needs the money he did say the church needs it to continue to spread his word. i did have trouble with that..

 

[seemingly random]

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: seemingly random

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Jeff7

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Nitemare
Televangelists and lotteries are a tax on the stupid.

I agree.

But I don't feel that the minister, pastor, priest, who takes up a collection in his/her church is in the same category. The electric bill needs to be paid no matter what organization you belong too.

Fine, then have them stop saying that "God" needs money, and just call it what it is: A membership fee.

I have never been in any church where anyone said, "God needs money".
At the church I go to there is a collection at every mass. It is voluntary. It is not a "membership fee" that you have to pay to remain a member. The minister/priest/pastor rarely mentions the collection except when they are collecting for something extra like for right to life, missionary work, etc. I have never been pressured to give.

Those of you who actually don't know what goes on beyond the chapel doors because you don't attend a church are really just shooting from your hip. I don't give you crap because you don't attend, but the non-believers are quite loud and feel the need to be heard whenever the topic of religion comes up. I wonder why that is....

Originally posted by: loki8481
religion may not be for you, but you're as much of a moron as those you're condemning if you're going to damn all religion across the board based on a couple televangelists.

thank you for being a voice of reason, and i take it you aren't just speaking of the OP, but of the others who did just at you've said.

Bullshit. If you were raised catholic, you've been pressured your whole life. The church likes to get their hooks into the kiddies as early as possible. This is one of the reason people who have been religious their entire lives find utterly impossible to imagine that they've been wrong or misled.

I have said that I've never been pressured to give money. I know you don't want to believe it, because it doesn't fit into your little house of criticism, but it's the truth.

I'm not really trying to pick on you personally. Having had several catholic friends, I do believe that you've been pressured - maybe in a way that you are not conscious of. If you want to continue to believe in your fantasy, then have at it. Just don't be stunned when someone who is not as close to it as you are, sees a different picture.

And btw, I've had some of the best times in those catholic church fund raisers in the church basements where they play poker and other games - drinking beer and cussing and smoking. Some of the people are quite gregarious. There hasn't been one hint of prosetylizing or I would have been out the door.

 

[Jeff7]

Originally posted by: moshquerade
And I have to ask, why do religious people, people who believe in God, bother you so much? How do they negatively affect your life? Frankly, I don't think it's any of your concern.

In daily life, they're not much of a concern. And really, here on the forums, this kind of ranty debate is just amusing, which is honestly why I think most of us are here in ATOT - entertainment, amusement, and lulz.

On the larger scale, it's just, I don't know, weird that this kind of thing isn't viewed as a mental illness or cult. (As they say, the difference between a religion and a cult is the number of followers.) It's perfectly ok to be a Ra or Zeus nonbeliever, but cross the next step and say "none of the above" and suddenly you've gone off the deep end. And the arguments used to justify or rationalize the existence of any deity make logicians cry. Example.
Yes, people do use that kind of reasoning, while at the same time failing to understand how it is circular. Or nearly verbatim, people will say that the Bible is the word of God because the Bible says so, while seeing no problem with that. The only appropriate response to that kind of thinking is simply: .

 

[Regs]

"As Christians we are supposed to give more than 10% with a loving heart. Holy Spirit will guide us."

I believe it says this in a book somewhere. Jesus came down from the heavens with his calculator and told everybody to give 10% to the church. You're also not suppose to have a angry face when you're giving it either.

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: seemingly random

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: seemingly random

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Jeff7

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Nitemare
Televangelists and lotteries are a tax on the stupid.

I agree.

But I don't feel that the minister, pastor, priest, who takes up a collection in his/her church is in the same category. The electric bill needs to be paid no matter what organization you belong too.

Fine, then have them stop saying that "God" needs money, and just call it what it is: A membership fee.

I have never been in any church where anyone said, "God needs money".
At the church I go to there is a collection at every mass. It is voluntary. It is not a "membership fee" that you have to pay to remain a member. The minister/priest/pastor rarely mentions the collection except when they are collecting for something extra like for right to life, missionary work, etc. I have never been pressured to give.

Those of you who actually don't know what goes on beyond the chapel doors because you don't attend a church are really just shooting from your hip. I don't give you crap because you don't attend, but the non-believers are quite loud and feel the need to be heard whenever the topic of religion comes up. I wonder why that is....

Originally posted by: loki8481
religion may not be for you, but you're as much of a moron as those you're condemning if you're going to damn all religion across the board based on a couple televangelists.

thank you for being a voice of reason, and i take it you aren't just speaking of the OP, but of the others who did just at you've said.

Bullshit. If you were raised catholic, you've been pressured your whole life. The church likes to get their hooks into the kiddies as early as possible. This is one of the reason people who have been religious their entire lives find utterly impossible to imagine that they've been wrong or misled.

I have said that I've never been pressured to give money. I know you don't want to believe it, because it doesn't fit into your little house of criticism, but it's the truth.

I'm not really trying to pick on you personally. Having had several catholic friends, I do believe that you've been pressured - maybe in a way that you are not conscious of. If you want to continue to believe in your fantasy, then have at it. Just don't be stunned when someone who is not as close to it as you are, sees a different picture.

And btw, I've had some of the best times in those catholic church fund raisers in the church basements where they play poker and other games - drinking beer and cussing and smoking. Some of the people are quite gregarious. There hasn't been one hint of prosetylizing or I would have been out the door.

You should listen to your own words (I've modified them slightly): "Just don't be stunned when someone who is closer to it than you are, sees a different picture."

It's funny, and I'm not really trying to pick on your personally either, but your type feels they know more than the type that is actually attending mass every week. That really lacks logic.

Not sure what "catholic" church you went to, but I would say it wasn't a model one if they had poker, beer, smoking, cussing parties in the basement. At my church the basement is utilized for small receptions, funeral dinners, and religious ed classes.

 

[HumblePie]

Originally posted by: moshquerade
And I have to ask, why do religious people, people who believe in God, bother you so much? How do they negatively affect your life? Frankly, I don't think it's any of your concern.

I can field this. Because more people have been killed in the name of religion by another man than any other reason. Because our world of hate, crime, and violence has been shape for thousands of years by religion. Because religion to this day still deludes many. Because it still infects our politics, schools, and social atmosphere where ever you go. Because bar fights are still brought out by it.

I could literally go on and on, but suffice it to say, despite whatever is "preached" religion has been the reason for more violence in the history of man kind than ANYTHING else. I'll simplify the reason but it is basically this. Televangislist ONE has an army of loyal followers but wants more. He finds televangislist TWO who also has an army but calls the other one a pagan, a heretic and forces a holy war to gain control of the resources and people in the other televangislists army. It's all about greed.

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: waggy
and nearly EVERY TV ministry is a frickne quack.

Anyone who believes in religion is a quack. The TV ministers have simply found a way to monetize it.

 

[seemingly random]

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: seemingly random

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: seemingly random

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Jeff7

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: Nitemare
Televangelists and lotteries are a tax on the stupid.

I agree.

But I don't feel that the minister, pastor, priest, who takes up a collection in his/her church is in the same category. The electric bill needs to be paid no matter what organization you belong too.

Fine, then have them stop saying that "God" needs money, and just call it what it is: A membership fee.

I have never been in any church where anyone said, "God needs money".
At the church I go to there is a collection at every mass. It is voluntary. It is not a "membership fee" that you have to pay to remain a member. The minister/priest/pastor rarely mentions the collection except when they are collecting for something extra like for right to life, missionary work, etc. I have never been pressured to give.

Those of you who actually don't know what goes on beyond the chapel doors because you don't attend a church are really just shooting from your hip. I don't give you crap because you don't attend, but the non-believers are quite loud and feel the need to be heard whenever the topic of religion comes up. I wonder why that is....

Originally posted by: loki8481
religion may not be for you, but you're as much of a moron as those you're condemning if you're going to damn all religion across the board based on a couple televangelists.

thank you for being a voice of reason, and i take it you aren't just speaking of the OP, but of the others who did just at you've said.

Bullshit. If you were raised catholic, you've been pressured your whole life. The church likes to get their hooks into the kiddies as early as possible. This is one of the reason people who have been religious their entire lives find utterly impossible to imagine that they've been wrong or misled.

I have said that I've never been pressured to give money. I know you don't want to believe it, because it doesn't fit into your little house of criticism, but it's the truth.

I'm not really trying to pick on you personally. Having had several catholic friends, I do believe that you've been pressured - maybe in a way that you are not conscious of. If you want to continue to believe in your fantasy, then have at it. Just don't be stunned when someone who is not as close to it as you are, sees a different picture.

And btw, I've had some of the best times in those catholic church fund raisers in the church basements where they play poker and other games - drinking beer and cussing and smoking. Some of the people are quite gregarious. There hasn't been one hint of prosetylizing or I would have been out the door.

You should listen to your own words (I've modified them slightly): "Just don't be stunned when someone who is closer to it than you are, sees a different picture."

It's funny, and I'm not really trying to pick on your personally either, but your type feels they know more than the type that is actually attending mass every week. That really lacks logic.

Not sure what "catholic" church you went to, but I would say it wasn't a model one if they had poker, beer, smoking, cussing parties in the basement. At my church the basement is utilized for small receptions, funeral dinners, and religious ed classes.

The catholic church is on the grounds of a jesuit high school in a large city in ohio. Maybe it's those damn jesuits taking liberties...

I'm not stunned anymore by the lengths the religious go towards defending their rituals. Maybe dissappointed, but not stunned. Now if I heard that they had gone back to blood sacrifices of ancient civilizations, I would be stunned.

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: waggy
and nearly EVERY TV ministry is a frickne quack.

Anyone who believes in religion is a quack. The TV ministers have simply found a way to monetize it.

I'm not a quack.

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: seemingly random

The catholic church is on the grounds of a jesuit high school in a large city in ohio. Maybe it's those damn jesuits taking liberties...

I'm not stunned anymore by the lengths the religious go towards defending their rituals. Maybe dissappointed, but not stunned. Now if I heard that they had gone back to blood sacrifices of ancient civilizations, I would be stunned.

We aren't going to come to common ground on this one. I do appreciate you being civil.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: waggy
and nearly EVERY TV ministry is a frickne quack.

Anyone who believes in religion is a quack. The TV ministers have simply found a way to monetize it.

says you.

i belive if religion. but granted not what they push in church. and as i said i personally belive one of the biggest evils in the world is the orginized "church".

but to say anyone who believes in religion is a quack is nieve as the people you want to bash.

 

[HannibalX]

Originally posted by: Modelworks
Watched a few religious channels and now I think I understand

You mean infomercials.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Originally posted by: moshquerade

I have never been in any church where anyone said, "God needs money".
At the church I go to there is a collection at every mass. It is voluntary. It is not a "membership fee" that you have to pay to remain a member. The minister/priest/pastor rarely mentions the collection except when they are collecting for something extra like for right to life, missionary work, etc. I have never been pressured to give.

Then you go to odd churches. I spent 12 years in Catholic schools and we were all most assuredly pressured to give. Every single day there was a strong request for more money or more time. You were expected to donate at mass, you were expected to sell raffle tickets, you had a quota of candy to sell, you were expected to volunteer for various tasks around the school and church, every family was pressured in hundreds of ways to pony up more cash and more free time so that the church could make more profit.

I still find it funny that churches need money at all. You believe that the invisible man in the sky has ultimate power of life and death over every person and utterly controls what happens on earth, but it doesn't bother you that the guy can't handle a checkbook. He CAN feed the poor and hungry with manna from heaven, but he wants you to pay for it instead. Truly and utterly astounding. Yep, the almighty created light with 4 simple words, but if you want the lights on in the church where you worship him you have to pay for it. He can't say "Let there be light in my churches", eh? Would that be too hard for him? He can surely take 1/10th of a second to say the words to make that happen for all eternity, but it's better if the church collects money every day instead. ROFL!