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Was Bynum's foul last night dirty?

B

Ballatician

Golden Member
What do you think?

Unsurprisingly, a lot of people are calling the foul dirty and for Bynum to be suspended indefinitely. [Insert dramatic "sigh" SFX here.] For the umpteenth time, it's called professional basketball, folks ? freak, unfortunate injuries can happen. (At least, until we start wrapping players in bubble wrap.)

As Ziller notes, it looks like Bynum missed his rotation and tried to make up ground fast to save face with Coach Jackson. He reached out with his arm to wrap up him, Wallace hit the key much faster than anticipated, chest meets elbow, ouch. Was it lazy defense by Bynum? Yes, no doubt. But malicious? Please ...

Injury Update: "Wallace was diagnosed with having 30-40 percent of his left lung collapsed and a non-displaced fracture of the fifth rib following a CT-Scan at Centinela Hospital in Los Angeles. Wallace had a chest tube inserted into the lung to help restore it to functional capacity, but will remain in the hospital over the next 48 hours for observation." Get well soon, Crash.
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I've been impressed with Bynum's play this year. He is certainly going to be one of the best big men in the game for the next few years. However, what the hell was he thinking with this foul? I understand freak injuries happen but what can you really expect when you decided to stick your elbow into the ribs of a guy who is running/jumping in your direction?

That yahoo blogger, JE Skeets tries to explain that he missed his rotation. Rotation? Watch the video, he has time to make it all the way to Wallace and turn his back. He could have tried to go for the ball or block but perhaps he was worried about ending up posterized? Anyone who has played bball knows that some people make way too big of a deal about being dunked on. He could have fouled with his hands/arms straight up but instead he elected to stick his elbow out. I think if he had time to make it over there and turn his back, he could have moved his feet and met him straight on. Granted it was a long game and he was probably tired. Anyway this got longer than I intended.

So dirty or not?

It was ruled flagrant btw and the Bobcats ended up winning the game.
 
It looks like he went to contest but got there to late and dropped his right arm. It looks like a regular hard foul but not flagrant but I'm sure it would be called a flagrant because of how hard he hit.
 
Here's the same clip in HQ. Text

It looked flagrant, but not dirty to me. He obviously wasn't going for the ball (w/ the right elbow), but it didn't look like he was trying to put Wallace down.
 
Originally posted by: Zaitsev
Here's the same clip in HQ. Text

It looked flagrant, but not dirty to me. He obviously wasn't going for the ball (w/ the right elbow), but it didn't look like he was trying to put Wallace down.
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i agree. it looked as if he was going for a hard foul. BUT it does nto look as if he was trying to hurt him.
 
I dont know. It almost looks like he shoved his elbow into him on purpose. Its a tough call because it may have just looked like that or he may have done it intentionally. Im fine with a flagrant foul call for that.
 
I'd say it's flagrant and should carry a suspension - Bynum had to push pretty damn hard with his elbow in order to crack the rib and puncture the lung. Maybe a 3 or 4 game suspension to basically say, hey you're a big dude, be a little more careful.
 
Originally posted by: dougp
I'd say it's flagrant and should carry a suspension - Bynum had to push pretty damn hard with his elbow in order to crack the rib and puncture the lung. Maybe a 3 or 4 game suspension to basically say, hey you're a big dude, be a little more careful.
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hmm I though he hurt it when he fell lol, I dont think it broke when he was elbowed or what not.
 
That takes a lot of force to do that much damage, he didn't have to put that much force behind his arm if he knew he had missed a position. :/
 
Originally posted by: thescreensavers
Originally posted by: dougp
I'd say it's flagrant and should carry a suspension - Bynum had to push pretty damn hard with his elbow in order to crack the rib and puncture the lung. Maybe a 3 or 4 game suspension to basically say, hey you're a big dude, be a little more careful.
Click to expand...

hmm I though he hurt it when he fell lol, I dont think it broke when he was elbowed or what not.
Click to expand...

Falling on a flat surface like that would not have broken his rib - it was clearly the elbow that did it. If he went down with enough force to break it, that also says a lot about how hard he was hit.
 
Originally posted by: thescreensavers
Originally posted by: dougp
I'd say it's flagrant and should carry a suspension - Bynum had to push pretty damn hard with his elbow in order to crack the rib and puncture the lung. Maybe a 3 or 4 game suspension to basically say, hey you're a big dude, be a little more careful.
Click to expand...

hmm I though he hurt it when he fell lol, I dont think it broke when he was elbowed or what not.
Click to expand...

I'm under the impression that it was the elbow that did the damage.
 
Bynum hasn't shown himself to be a dirty player so he gets the benefit of the doubt. It didn't look like he was intentionally trying to put a hurting on Wallace either.

Besides, the Lakers lost in double OT so Bynum got a little bit of payback for that foul. 😉
 
Stupid play and an obvious flagrant foul. But he didn't intend to hurt the guy.

Still, intention is only so important. I think a suspension is warranted given the result. He didn't elbow the guy, but he stuck his elbow in the guys path and caused him to be injured by it.
 
people forget how things look much different in slo-mow

ie. a hit on a quarterback doesnt look "heavy" in slow-mo...but they hurt like shit
 
Originally posted by: LS21
people forget how things look much different in slo-mow

ie. a hit on a quarterback doesnt look "heavy" in slow-mo...but they hurt like shit
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You're right about that. A lot of times I wish they would show replays in real time because it gives me better perspective.

Edit: Things look a lot worse in slow-mo sometimes.
 
There is no way Bynum was thinking "Hey, I'm gonna hit this guy so hard I'm gonna collapse his lung".
He was protecting the paint, pure and simple.
However, he went a little to far with it and deservingly got tagged with a flagrant.
If he gets an extra fine I wouldn't be stunned, but I'm not saying he deserves it either.
I promise you he has already called Gerald Wallace and apologized or at the very least had his agent do so.
These things happen in sports and while its a shame to see someone get hurt, it is just a by product of 7 foot men flying around at full speed bubbling full of adrenaline.
 
Originally posted by: zerocool84
It looks like he went to contest but got there to late and dropped his right arm. It looks like a regular hard foul but not flagrant but I'm sure it would be called a flagrant because of how hard he hit.
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no, it was called flagrant because he didn't attempt to make a play on the ball.
 
Originally posted by: Ballatician
I've been impressed with Bynum's play this year. He is certainly going to be one of the best big men in the game for the next few years. However, what the hell was he thinking with this foul? I understand freak injuries happen but what can you really expect when you decided to stick your elbow into the ribs of a guy who is running/jumping in your direction?

That yahoo blogger, JE Skeets tries to explain that he missed his rotation. Rotation? Watch the video, he has time to make it all the way to Wallace and turn his back. He could have tried to go for the ball or block but perhaps he was worried about ending up posterized? Anyone who has played bball knows that some people make way too big of a deal about being dunked on. He could have fouled with his hands/arms straight up but instead he elected to stick his elbow out. I think if he had time to make it over there and turn his back, he could have moved his feet and met him straight on. Granted it was a long game and he was probably tired. Anyway this got longer than I intended.

So dirty or not?

It was ruled flagrant btw and the Bobcats ended up winning the game.
Click to expand...

i dunno he will become a jermaine o'neal type player at best imo.
 
How would one define "dirty?"

If it means to intentionally perform an action that you know could lead to serious injury, such as sticking your elbow into a player's rib while he's going up for a dunk, then, yes, that's dirty.

If it means to intentionally harm another player, then, no, it was not a dirty play.
 
Slow rotation and a bad play on the ball, but not dirty.

When you have a guy that's giving up 50+ pounds to another guy and they crash into each other, the little guy is going to take the beating.

Think civic vs suburban in a collision.
 
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