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WAR - what is your impression?
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Just spent this weekend doing lots of T3 scenarios and on my server Order is dominant at T3 and up I think. What annoys me though is that a lot of times I see sides just not bothering with the actual objective and just turtling up on the flag or certain area and letting time run out.
If roots are annoying to Order players, knockbacks are the same or worse to Destruction players. Order seems to have more aoe knockbacks at the T3 low end range and about the same number of roots. Thankfully as a chosen I can at least break free of those roots once a minute.
On a positive note, I received my first purple piece last night. It dropped from an order player in a scenario and thankfully no one ninja'd it and I actually won fairly. So far I've only seen a couple incidents where people roll need for pieces they can't wear.
I'm hitting that T3 wall now though so it's going to be a slow climb to T4.
If roots are annoying to Order players, knockbacks are the same or worse to Destruction players. Order seems to have more aoe knockbacks at the T3 low end range and about the same number of roots. Thankfully as a chosen I can at least break free of those roots once a minute.
On a positive note, I received my first purple piece last night. It dropped from an order player in a scenario and thankfully no one ninja'd it and I actually won fairly. So far I've only seen a couple incidents where people roll need for pieces they can't wear.
I'm hitting that T3 wall now though so it's going to be a slow climb to T4.
Malladine
Diamond Member
Yeah, when outnumbered it can feel quite imbalanced. I don't know how the scenarios reflect that though, since those are balanced at the start, number wise at least. What server are you on again Mem? I'm Ulthuan Order, don't know if they allow transfers yet but it seems good over here.
Also i hear what you're saying about the lag, I need an upgrade. The game seems to respond very well to faster CPUs, or maybe Vista runs it better. My friend's system is a 6000+ Am2, 1950gt card and 6gb RAM (doesn't use more than 2.5). It runs WAR much better than mine with a 5200+ and a 8800gts.
But yeah, the number difference hurts in RvR but we still manage to take Keeps. I'm 21/15 and haven't been involved in a Keep siege yet, and not really defense either. I arrived without oil to put in the damn thing, only had ballista bolts or whatever, and they'd already destroyed that 🙁
I'm in T3 now, 6 scenarios is nice. There are a few flag cap ones, a hold the Thing, flag holds, also a location hold, Temple of Isha. As in T2 the hold the Thing map is the most popular.
Starting to want to level a new character. I'm trying shadow warrior right now, but I'm thinking about Destro too, those Chosen/Black Orcs look so cool
Black Orcs are fun and have amazing staying power, but our DPS is piss poor. I can't even do enough damage to kill a squishy archmage, let alone a healer in full armor (warrior priest). But I can sure take a beating. Just be ware...roots will be the bane of your existence.
In T2, I think 3 very popular Order classes have roots. They're Instant, PBAOE roots, and they don't break on damage and they don't have an immunity timer. Even with Juggernaught, it's virtually impossible to excape them. Roots need an immunity timer that lasts as long as the root itself. In DAoC, the 1 minute immunity was too long. Here, though, it's possible to be chain rooted the entire duration of a fight. I swear, I was stuck in place for a full minute last night after using Juggernaught.
The throws aren't nearly that bad. Except that people use them when they shouldn't...like when you're wailing on someone and someone on your team throws him back into his own group when he's got 15% health left. Infuriates me.
Roots need to be toned down though.
Malladine
Diamond Member
I'd say WoW's are actually far more involved, objectively speaking. World PVP in WAR would be the real deal though, especially end game. We'll see right?
The reasons I enjoy scenarios more than BGs are:
1. I gain XP
2. PvP in WAR is just better, more challenging.
3. Admittedly, it's new 🙂
4. they're over in 15 mins or less guaranteed making for more excitement imo
5. succeeding means your side receives actual benefits
The reasons I enjoy scenarios more than BGs are:
1. I gain XP
2. PvP in WAR is just better, more challenging.
3. Admittedly, it's new 🙂
4. they're over in 15 mins or less guaranteed making for more excitement imo
5. succeeding means your side receives actual benefits
I agree I love the scenarios as well.
I hated the way WoW did it.
now the very first thing I do is create char.. hit level 2.. then queue and level RVR in all 3 scenarios.
and I adore the fact that as level 2 or whatever that you instantly gain the hit points and attack power for the median level in that area.. that was a fantastic idea.
I dont like the leveling curve much on the PVE side..
wow these levels take ages past 10.
I know there are only 40 levels so it evens out but man some of these levels are LONG.
my highest toons so far are only 12. (Val is up to 20 on her main) we started day one on Kislev and it's just too underpopulated and hasn't grown at all so we left and started over on another server with med/high pops.
overall fun game.. Healers (especially DoKs and WP) are extremely overpowered takes 2-5 peeps to out damage thier healing.
and the atmosphere especially the greenskins area is great.
Yeah, I just rerolled from a Swordmaster to an Archmage and grinded scenarios like mad with a friend this weekend. I'm playing Order on Azazel (the Goon server) and overall it seems very balanced. Lots of close games with about an even number of stompings for both side.
WAR PvP really is very different from WoW, though. A lot of it has to do with the pacing of the game because no one dies nearly as quickly in WAR as WoW; fights last much longer and no one can one-shot anyone else.
It should get a lot more interesting once people learn to gear up better, too. I'm doing almost nothing but PvP (both scenarios and RvR) and Toughness is my highest stat by a fair margin so despite being in cloth I can take a beating fairly well between self-heals and Shield of Saphery. I even tanked a black orc down in Mourkain last night for the five minutes it takes to kill one. (I'm Mertel, if you're on Azazel). But clothies who try to stack Int or Willpower and don't pay attention to Toughness will get dropped like a sack of potatoes.
The scenarios so far have been a blast, with Mourkain Temple in T2 and High Pass Cemetery in T3 probably my favorites. For those who don't know, Mourkain Temple is basically just a scenario focused on pure beatdown. Here's the Gamespy strategy guide (I hope; I googled it and the link is blocked at work), and it's pretty much it. An artifact spawns in the middle of the temple, someone picks up. Everyone on the other team tries to kill the person carrying the artifact while their team tries to keep them alive. You get points for how long you hold the artifact and points for killing the other team. To prevent stalemates and turtling (most, if not all, scenarios have an anti-stall mechanic), the artifact hits you with a DOT every few seconds that scales up over time. At first, you barely notice it, but after you're holding it for a while it eventually ticks for ridiculous amounts until you're dead, then someone else has to grab it. That's it: kill the dude with the thing.
Anyway, for those who like MMOs, WAR is way exceeding my expectations, which were extremely low to begin with. Keep in mind, though, it's very much a PvP/RvR focused game, and while the PvE content is there, most people have little interest in pursuing it to any great degree. Definitely a niche game. If you want to run around, quest, and explore PvE content you're much better off in LOTRO. If you want to do lots of PvP, run a bunch of scenarios, and get in a bunch of semi-random RvR brawls, it can be a ton of fun.
Malladine
Diamond Member
yeah i played one to lvl 4 and even then realized the lack of damage. Kinda sucks to hear it's the same at higher levels. It's annoying enough on my WP to be unable to kill players, not sure I could handle less dps, if that's the case.
Maybe i just don't get targetted with root as much or maybe order just has far more roots, but it's not an issue for me really. When i'm rooted it's so they can escape us, which is less frustrating than if I'm rooted while trying to escape.
The knockbacks are fun, i love seeing people get smacked into lava, etc. It even amuses me when i'm the victim, i think it's a great addition to pvp. And LOL, I agree, people need to think before they spam that, so many times i've seen it help the enemy instead of hurting them. I'd like to see a shadow warrior or whatever smack a gobbo into our main group. That'd be hilarious, and satisfying 😀
Perfectly said for me.... Less than a week playing........ Buuuuut
LOVING it...
Dont get me wrong... 2 level 70's in WOW and 2 50's... So I have spent my time there..
This is fresh and exciting... I love getting XP while PVPing... Public quests... ROCK....
SO far (sorry, I forget the server I am on) Destructo cooperation is FABULOUS in T1..
Being a squishy.. I hide in the back.. Nuking as often as I can... we start going down.. They break through.. I run back to our rally point.. I GET HEALED 75% of the time.. And then any tank at that point intercepts the guy chasing me.... SO I, in turn, drop my pet.. NUKE.... Help my hero!!!!!!
I RARELY GET HEALED IN WOW... And I have had more intercepts (Saving my squishy butt) in 2 nights of playing WAR than 2 years of WOW... And I always play a squishy...
Well I bought a copy and have been playing for over a week. I've got 6 characters, 3 order and 3 destruction. And frankly I'm bored with it.
That said, I'm not a PvP/RvR person. I simply don't care for it. So that leaves the PvE content and getting ad-hoc groups together is just not happening. The mechanisms they built in are good, just the server population in the areas I'm in during the times I'm on makes it seem like the server is empty. I doubt I'll be staying with it past the free 30 days.
That said, I'm not a PvP/RvR person. I simply don't care for it. So that leaves the PvE content and getting ad-hoc groups together is just not happening. The mechanisms they built in are good, just the server population in the areas I'm in during the times I'm on makes it seem like the server is empty. I doubt I'll be staying with it past the free 30 days.
Thing is, healing is actually really fun in WAR PvP. I tend to play healers in most games but WoW really burned me out on it. I played a Swordmaster to 26, saw that we needed more healers, then decided to reroll an archmage (and to be honest, I'm a much better healer anyway). Having played a raiding/higher-rank PvP druid in WoW (up to rank 11 under the old system, couldn't stand to go any higher than that because of the time commitment), it's a playstyle I've always enjoyed but got a little tired of.
After marathoning scenarios this weekend, I can honestly say I've never had so much fun healing. In WoW, some classes just went down so easy (rogues and mages, for example) that you basically had to keep an eye on them at all times and there was no guarantee they weren't going to get dropped in one second flat even if you were properly baby-sitting them. So what do you do? You keep the Arms warrior alive because he hits like a truck and he can take a beating. A few people get heals, everyone else is pretty much left for themselves. Obviously, this is a generalization but some classes just weren't worth the time and effort investment of keeping them alive. (I'm mostly talking old school PvP here, I sold my account in the middle of Season 1 Arena).
In WAR, although some classes really need some help (Squig herder, engineer, magus, and white lion, I'm looking at you), everyone can make useful contributionis and no one is going to die instantly unless they manage to get themselves completely surrounded. So everyone gets support; healers can focus on keeping other people alive and other people focus on doing their jobs and keeping their healers alive because they know they're being supported. And you end up with this crazy thing called "teamwork in PUGs". Really something pretty amazing about hopping into a PUG and two minutes into a match you've got the bright wizard next to you rooting anything that comes close while the Ironbreaker who's got you on Guard (he takes 50% of your damage) is punting away anything that slips past root.
Obviously, not every PUG will end up like that, but the amount of excellent teamwork I saw on both sides in a bunch of scenarios was really fairly shocking. The individual brawls themselves could sometimes last five minutes or more. I'm sure a lot of it has to do with the fact that it's a PvP-focused game so it attracts more serious PvP'ers
I gotta say the level of cooperation has increased since T1 but there are still those times when it seems everyone just runs around like chickens with their heads chopped off.
I just wish more of the other scenarios would pop instead of just Tor Arnoc.
It might just be a flaw in the map layout. I know what you mean though since I'm on destruction, I can pretty much time it right and guarantee getting to the thing first. However, i'm usually just a split second ahead of order and there have been times that they've killed me before I get out of range.
You can try to join a guild to see if that helps. I usually run into people doing quests and sometimes maybe a group doing a PQ. It might be nice to see more people around but then again I'd rather not have places too crowded.
I just wish more of the other scenarios would pop instead of just Tor Arnoc.
It might just be a flaw in the map layout. I know what you mean though since I'm on destruction, I can pretty much time it right and guarantee getting to the thing first. However, i'm usually just a split second ahead of order and there have been times that they've killed me before I get out of range.
You can try to join a guild to see if that helps. I usually run into people doing quests and sometimes maybe a group doing a PQ. It might be nice to see more people around but then again I'd rather not have places too crowded.
Seriously,I never thought of that... Perhaps only being 2 nights deep and one level 7 is why I didnt think of it.....
You are right... I dont die quickly... So dare I say... There is time for Strategy? :Q
In Arena... Being a squishy with little resilience... one short session of Stun Lock and I am DEAD..... In epic (Heroic) dungeons... I would get one shotted by some boss and my healer is screaming WTF...
WELL DAMIT I LOST EVERY FRIGGIN ROLL SINCE WE STARTED THIS DAMN CAMPAIGN AND MY ARMOR SUKS...................................
The rolls I did win I won an item I end up sharding anyway... GRRRRRRRR.
But we are not here to put down WOW... NO... We are here to reveal in greatness..
WAR
Perfect? NO.... But it is not even a month old yet... I see great things on the horizon...
You spoke of everyone making a contribution... You are SPOT ON... as a level 4... I out damaged some level 5's who were tanking the Public Quest... Now I am sure there were times they had to switch styles...DO defensive thingy or something (I know nothing of tanker boys :roll🙂 But I felt a PART of the group... It was fantastic...
HumblePie
Lifer
I said it above.
Level 11 Witches and hunters OWN!!!
level 12+ witches and hunters, hide under the bed from everyone else.
Reason being, at level 11, most classes are still not at their defensive and offensive prime. Witches and hunters just don't scale as fast offensively as other classes scale defensively. Add to the fact that witches and hunters defense doesn't really scale well at all compared to the offensive abilities of most other classes and the problem with these two classes becomes glaring.
My witch elf at level 11 had just over a hair of 2K health. I was focused only on str, but tried to make sure I had enough of wounds, weapon skill, toughness, and resists where I could as well.
At level 11, only tanks had more than 2K hps, around 3K if memory serves me. Most probably had less. Add in the fact I was doing around 150 a whack up to 500 with specials on my witch at level 11 on most classes (take about 30% off that against tanks) and it's easy to see why witches and hunters with similar stats would own at level 11 in the tier 1 RVR and scenarios. Other classes typically did 50ish damage to me at most. It was gross how fast I could kill most classes, even tanks, at tier 1.
Now, tier 2 was a whole different ball game. I'll jump right up to where I was level 21. I had just a hair shy of 4K hps. 3950 I think. I had almost 500 strength, 395 wounds, 340 toughness, and 400+ weapon skill as my primary stats I was upping. Forgot my resists but they were decent if not maxed.
So, you'd think I'd be ripping again right? Naw. I was basically doing 180 per whack, with 700 on my specials. At most I got a 15% offensive boost. Add in the fact that defensively, I got nearly a 100% increase, as most classes, that 15% offensive boost in relation to the defensive scale doesn't cut it.
Thinking, things may swing back, I've grinded it out to 32 and so far, I feel like a complete joke for going this far. If 21 was bad, 31 was worse. Basically the same problems, just compounded. Everyone gets better defensive skills, more crowd control, and better scaling offense compared to ours. Still no real CC, except in a level or so, have to check my mastery, when I get a 2 second aoe knockdown. Basically, it's a nice addition, but nothing that will change the current balance. Also, I've noticed fewer and fewer witches and hunters the higher level I go. At tier 1 there was a ton of them. Now, not so much.
Basically, tanks, casters, and healers are where it's at in this game. Anything else and you are easy meat.
As for order vs destruction, T4 sucks!!! At least on volkmarr. My guild has a bunch of healers, but not all of them are T4 yet. Every scenario or RVR is a pain watching order roll over us due to them have 10 times as many healers. We are lucky if there is a lower level DoK running around on our side actually healing. The few shamans I see typically spam nukes not heals. The last time I saw a T4 zealot was the last time I saw a flying purple hippo. No point to being a witch elf to take down the healers, because they all stand right next to each other in the back. I try to stealth up to one I think is a little bit alone and take down, I only draw the attention of every other healer who then heals each other. Making it impossible to kill anything. Funny thing is, we can have triple the amount of people in an RVR area and still get rolled at every flag or keep point. No healers = no win. At least at higher levels. Lower levels it's not so bad, but at higher it's stupid how powerful the healer classes are and how much they can add to RVR. Oh well, time to get my DoK alt up.
Malladine
Diamond Member
Caveats: i haven't done world rvr much nor have I played as a witch elf/hunter
That said I have over 2 days /played now, 1450 player kills and I dunno man, no offence but I think you're exaggerating. Firstly the bold part. Those were your 21 stats? I'm 21 with my WP and my stats are something close to 230str, 290wounds, 180 toughness, 220 weapon skill, 280 willpower, and i've not been slouching. Unless you're all purples I don't believe this for a second...
Second my experiences with Witch Elves and Witch hunters so far. I've regularly seen them at the top of damage and/or kills in scenarios, T1 through T3 and am usually impressed when I see them, slaughtering anyone if given a chance. In fact I make it a priority to heal witch hunters asap.
They aren't the rogues of WoW clearly, since they are visible more often than not, but i've always viewed their damage as signifcant to say the least! Maybe you're just not used to playing this kind of melee damage dealer, or the strength of healers in WAR?
Mem
Lifer
I'm finally getting bit bored with WAR, team players are useless in RvR scenerios on Order side on my server,lost the temple one again(too laggy to really play it anyway see below),troll Crossing was hmm 48- 500 to Destruction again,Phoenix was hmm 80 -300 something like that to Destruction again on my server.
Infact I was in Troll crosssing and I saw an IB run away with full health when I went to help him was 2 on 1 until I came along, he was going wrong way to chase the chaos guy with the pacifier too, anyway he legged it and left me on my own to take both of them on and die,nobody hardly talks in Scenerio chat so you can't get any real Group tattics going.
Healers on my server I feel sorry for,they get so much stick when things go wrong,the tanks/melee guys wonder why not many people want to be healers on Order side,well I told them because of the stick they get from rude players and thankless job,they actually thought about it and said you know you are right.
I was in PQ one time and they all started speaking finnish,I thought WTF?...I said hmm this is European English server and you are supposed to speak English in PQs,he tried to argue that the PQ was for thier guild(even though half the players were from different guilds etc) I said well PQ is Public Quests for anybody.
Almost at 20 level as WP and its starting to feel like a grind ,quests giving little exp now so left with RvR scenerio's or normal RvR which do not have a lot going on in tier 2 on my server.
Scenerio wise I have played about 100-130 easy and we have won like maybe 15 out of all that.
I'm hoping things will change later but so far never do RvR wise,we tried to take a keep the other day lost that too(can't win them all as they say but on my server its trying not to lose again).Balance issues are killing the game for me on my server,if you have to go Destruction side to win 95% of everything then something is very wrong.
Another serious issue I have is lagg/choppyness,read this thread here its on both XP and Vista,I have tried all the tweaks and nothing is really working,I don't get it in other MMORPGs just WAR,when your FPS goes down to 5 FPS in some towns with no AA/AF or shadows with a 4870 card at 1680x1050 res something is wrong,I might try a clean install of WAR later but don't think thats going to fix it.
Good points for healers,well I had no trouble getting loads of Guild invites as WP,so far I have declined all Guild offers, bad points as healers well remember healers are normally first targets in RvR etc.. so expect aggro from the enemy and fellow team m8s(they love to bitch about healing).
Infact I was in Troll crosssing and I saw an IB run away with full health when I went to help him was 2 on 1 until I came along, he was going wrong way to chase the chaos guy with the pacifier too, anyway he legged it and left me on my own to take both of them on and die,nobody hardly talks in Scenerio chat so you can't get any real Group tattics going.
Healers on my server I feel sorry for,they get so much stick when things go wrong,the tanks/melee guys wonder why not many people want to be healers on Order side,well I told them because of the stick they get from rude players and thankless job,they actually thought about it and said you know you are right.
I was in PQ one time and they all started speaking finnish,I thought WTF?...I said hmm this is European English server and you are supposed to speak English in PQs,he tried to argue that the PQ was for thier guild(even though half the players were from different guilds etc) I said well PQ is Public Quests for anybody.
Almost at 20 level as WP and its starting to feel like a grind ,quests giving little exp now so left with RvR scenerio's or normal RvR which do not have a lot going on in tier 2 on my server.
Scenerio wise I have played about 100-130 easy and we have won like maybe 15 out of all that.
I'm hoping things will change later but so far never do RvR wise,we tried to take a keep the other day lost that too(can't win them all as they say but on my server its trying not to lose again).Balance issues are killing the game for me on my server,if you have to go Destruction side to win 95% of everything then something is very wrong.
Another serious issue I have is lagg/choppyness,read this thread here its on both XP and Vista,I have tried all the tweaks and nothing is really working,I don't get it in other MMORPGs just WAR,when your FPS goes down to 5 FPS in some towns with no AA/AF or shadows with a 4870 card at 1680x1050 res something is wrong,I might try a clean install of WAR later but don't think thats going to fix it.
Good points for healers,well I had no trouble getting loads of Guild invites as WP,so far I have declined all Guild offers, bad points as healers well remember healers are normally first targets in RvR etc.. so expect aggro from the enemy and fellow team m8s(they love to bitch about healing).
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