Originally posted by: flexy
i do NOT mind PvP, actually i love itHowever we have a problem if (on my server) scens pop only all 4-5 hours
Destruction? On Brettonia my destruction player usually has to wait 5-10 mins to get in. My order player on Sylvania gets in instantly.
Scenarios do pose a problem right now. Hopefully they can address the issues.
VashHT
Diamond Member
- Feb 1, 2007
- 3,318
- 1,379
- 136
Flexy- A ton of people complain about WoW too, more people than any other game I've played actually, but it's still massively successful. Just because a few people are whining on forums doesn't mean the game is going to tank. I would recommend getting out of tier 1 at least before you discard the game completely... seriously that's like getting to level 10-15 in WoW and saying there's nothing to do besides quest. You haven't gotten high enough to do bigger scens or RvR.
I will just say one thing... Read in detail, the 2 main threads here regarding war...
Let me say first... Playing it, loving it.. Having a BLAST. I dont consider myself a fanboy...
Most, most of the negatives posted here (and there) are well thought out, and posted with a style that indicates knowledge of a MMPORG... I applaud you all for your posts..
That being said (here comes other edge of the sword) with your understanding and knowledge of MMPORGs, why would you even bother purchasing during its first 6 months of life? Cripes people.... It is a living viable thing... and it is a month old!!!!
This is like saying ZOMG... My 4 week old baby crapped his diaper again... WTF????... His class must be boinked... What I waste I rolled him... UGH.. Wait wait I know the POOP, the poop must be nerfed... It is just too powerful...
People... an undertaking such as this is HUGE.. HUGE.... Perfection out the box?
Never gonna happen.... Yes, yes... I know we all post with the hope that we can influence the game to be better more like what we want.... GUESS WHAT.. Your wishes hopes desires will piss off a whole new market segment of people... SO Mythic is really in a no win situation... IF knock backs and a few of the issues griped about get implemented, those people who use them... Now it is their turn.. (Wash rinse repeat)
Leveling is a grind? Ummmm Folks, that is MMPORG 101 Subscribe.. Play, PAY, level get stuff... I dont think there will EVER be a day where a game comes out, we pay 15 a month for and the premise is... Start at level 79, get to max level (80) in 4 hours... Play against all the other elites that night... Not seeing it... Sorry..
Racolvin, not picking on you... But I have only played 3 MMPORGs with sides...
What games allow you to "In other games I could make almost any race/class combination. Heck I can even take a race from the "evil" side and play them on the "good" side. " I never saw that before... So I am curious...
And, again.... the basis for this Game is Warhammer lore... the purists would be filling these forums up if what you want, were to happen... So you should have had plenty of understanding of this "rigid" requirement.. Mythic made Warhammer MMPORG... Not Good guys vs bad guys with side interchangeability MMPORG...
I know return you all to your regular programming... Please flame responsibly...
Let me say first... Playing it, loving it.. Having a BLAST. I dont consider myself a fanboy...
Most, most of the negatives posted here (and there) are well thought out, and posted with a style that indicates knowledge of a MMPORG... I applaud you all for your posts..
That being said (here comes other edge of the sword) with your understanding and knowledge of MMPORGs, why would you even bother purchasing during its first 6 months of life? Cripes people.... It is a living viable thing... and it is a month old!!!!
This is like saying ZOMG... My 4 week old baby crapped his diaper again... WTF????... His class must be boinked... What I waste I rolled him... UGH.. Wait wait I know the POOP, the poop must be nerfed... It is just too powerful...
People... an undertaking such as this is HUGE.. HUGE.... Perfection out the box?
Never gonna happen.... Yes, yes... I know we all post with the hope that we can influence the game to be better more like what we want.... GUESS WHAT.. Your wishes hopes desires will piss off a whole new market segment of people... SO Mythic is really in a no win situation... IF knock backs and a few of the issues griped about get implemented, those people who use them... Now it is their turn.. (Wash rinse repeat)
Leveling is a grind? Ummmm Folks, that is MMPORG 101 Subscribe.. Play, PAY, level get stuff... I dont think there will EVER be a day where a game comes out, we pay 15 a month for and the premise is... Start at level 79, get to max level (80) in 4 hours... Play against all the other elites that night... Not seeing it... Sorry..
Racolvin, not picking on you... But I have only played 3 MMPORGs with sides...
What games allow you to "In other games I could make almost any race/class combination. Heck I can even take a race from the "evil" side and play them on the "good" side. " I never saw that before... So I am curious...
And, again.... the basis for this Game is Warhammer lore... the purists would be filling these forums up if what you want, were to happen... So you should have had plenty of understanding of this "rigid" requirement.. Mythic made Warhammer MMPORG... Not Good guys vs bad guys with side interchangeability MMPORG...
I know return you all to your regular programming... Please flame responsibly...
Fingolfin269
Lifer
- Feb 28, 2003
- 17,948
- 34
- 91
I've been playing WAR since a couple of days after launch and finally just stopped late last week. I found myself asking the question... what is so much different between WAR PvP and WoW PvP? Other than the obvious collision (which I LOVE) I just don't see a difference at this point. WoW could easily incorporate zone battles, which I believe they have in the xpac, and it would basically be the same game with far superior PvE. The class balance between factions is also much easier to maintain because the classes are exactly the same on both sides if you exclude racials.
I'm not giving up on WAR completely, hell I'm only R12, but if I'm already getting bored at R12 I don't feel like it's going to get much better once the xp curve starts to kick in. I want to like this game because i'm ready for something new but in all honesty this game doesn't feel like anything new to me, at least not right now.
I'm not giving up on WAR completely, hell I'm only R12, but if I'm already getting bored at R12 I don't feel like it's going to get much better once the xp curve starts to kick in. I want to like this game because i'm ready for something new but in all honesty this game doesn't feel like anything new to me, at least not right now.
No problem, I don't feel picked on
Perfectly legit question actually Both EQ and EQ2 have good and evil sides. "Good" races are Kill On Sight to "Evil" races NPC's (guards in town, etc), so there are "sides" in the same sense as in Warhammer.
In EQ2 particularly you could start out a race on the Evil side, do a particular quest line called a Betrayal quest that would let you switch over to the Good side - and you would no longer be KOS to the good guys NPCs, etc. In that way you could make a Dark Elf, Orc, Ogre, race but they could play on the good guys team
Don't get me wrong, some races were still limited in their classes, but not nearly as rigid as the setup in Warhammer. I mean there is obviously nothing technical that limits a Dark Elf race from using the skills, etc of a Greenskin tank - its just in keeping with the Warhammer lore. But why couldn't I have a high elf version of a bright wizard for example? it's just different spells and skills,so why limit the races like that? From an MMO player perspective, and this is purely IMHO, allowing more diversity in race/class lets people feel more "unique" and involved, rather than feeling like a cookie-cutter piece on a chessboard.
Some will argue that certain races are "meant" to be certain classes and from a game design that's true - the stats of certain races lend themselves to certain classes more than others. But many MMO players will choose to create seemingly inefficient combinations just for the variety and challenge of making a good character out of that combination - playing the role as it were.
Hopefully that made sense
The whole rigidity with the racial pairing and classes probably goes back to the days of DAoC but back then you had 3 realms so more diversity. They probably shouldn't have taken out the missing careers though as i think those fill in some needed gaps but some where down the line the decision was made for whatever reason.
You guys need to get out of Tier 1 at least because it does get more interesting as you gain more abilities in the higher tiers. If you're bored of the game already, it's probably because you're bored of MMOs in general. Questing is going to be the same for every game, I don't know how much more "fun" you can really make it. Even PQs will get boring... questing in WAR is really easy as it is... you don't need a group to do those, you don't even need to go to any sites to look up shit. Does exploring even interest you in one bit? I think the different zones are pretty cool and the tome (as in get tome unlocks) is a good way to pass the time if you are bored.
If not then really what would make you not bored of the game?
You guys need to get out of Tier 1 at least because it does get more interesting as you gain more abilities in the higher tiers. If you're bored of the game already, it's probably because you're bored of MMOs in general. Questing is going to be the same for every game, I don't know how much more "fun" you can really make it. Even PQs will get boring... questing in WAR is really easy as it is... you don't need a group to do those, you don't even need to go to any sites to look up shit. Does exploring even interest you in one bit? I think the different zones are pretty cool and the tome (as in get tome unlocks) is a good way to pass the time if you are bored.
If not then really what would make you not bored of the game?
If the game is this boring in T1 it doesn't retain subscribers. The "interest" curve is supposed to be early so as to get people to stick around. If the interest curve doesn't kick in until T3 that, IMHO, is a design issue.
My personal issues and some of the others I've read in this thread revolve around the game itself being more MMOPvP than MMORPG. In fact it feels to me a great deal like Guild Wars, which is a graphically beautiful game but with the focus on PvP the RPG side of things gets totally lost. Wandering around in WAR there seems to be no impetus for players to chat with one another and build a functioning team. With no social interaction, the game just feels ... barren.
With the lack of race/class diversity if you see a dark elf you know know almost instantly what class they are. By knowing that just by looking at them, there's no point in getting to know them because you already know what their role in a group would be. Since there is no area chat function you can't even build casual conversation relationships with names that you see regularly.
As for exploring ... well, I for one love to roam around and see the world but I dislike respawning alot
That and the run speed is just killer - exploring just takes WAY too long on foot. I understand there is a mount that you can get somehow but I have yet to figure that part out.So I'm not bored with MMO's, I'm bored with MMO's that are seemingly one-dimensional
HeroOfPellinor
Lifer
- Dec 27, 2001
- 11,272
- 1
- 0
Flexy, WoW is perfect for you and I fully support your cancellation of your WAR account. It's full of idle chat to keep you "entertained" and there's lots of people standing around in the capital cities in their uber armor dancing and flexing and shit. Although, really, I think you could save yourself $15 a month by joining a chat room and watching a Pokemon DVD over and over. As for me, the short time I tried WoW, I'd have just as soon /ignored every damn idiot on the server for all the good zone chat did me, ugh.
WAR scenarios have kinda replaced my TF2 time. On Red Eye Mountain, as Order on Nordwatch, last night they were popping literally 1 minute after they'd complete so I was doing 4-5 an hour. Because of the random elements of different group makeups, and classes, and levels, and individual tactics not to mention the tons of XP and RP and insane loot, it's still entertaining and in a few more levels I get to move to a different set of maps. I got some BW armor last night in a T1 that has +132AR and +51 to both elemental and corporeal and only requires lvl 9. Gonna give it to the next random wiz I see and wish him a happy birthday.
Overall, I think you're just arriving to the point many of us have been for 6-7 years. The pointlessness of lvl-based MMORPGs is just dawning on you. Except you're displacing the realization and placing the blame on the specific idiosyncrasies of the game you happened to be playing when it struck you.
The reason I give WAR a tiny bit of credit is that they're brought the endgame to everybody. Aside from scenarios there are contested zones in every area where a small group can go stir up some stuff. Once more people are T-3 those contested zones should be pretty lively.
WAR scenarios have kinda replaced my TF2 time. On Red Eye Mountain, as Order on Nordwatch, last night they were popping literally 1 minute after they'd complete so I was doing 4-5 an hour. Because of the random elements of different group makeups, and classes, and levels, and individual tactics not to mention the tons of XP and RP and insane loot, it's still entertaining and in a few more levels I get to move to a different set of maps. I got some BW armor last night in a T1 that has +132AR and +51 to both elemental and corporeal and only requires lvl 9. Gonna give it to the next random wiz I see and wish him a happy birthday.
Overall, I think you're just arriving to the point many of us have been for 6-7 years. The pointlessness of lvl-based MMORPGs is just dawning on you. Except you're displacing the realization and placing the blame on the specific idiosyncrasies of the game you happened to be playing when it struck you.
The reason I give WAR a tiny bit of credit is that they're brought the endgame to everybody. Aside from scenarios there are contested zones in every area where a small group can go stir up some stuff. Once more people are T-3 those contested zones should be pretty lively.
There are things I don't like about the game. It's overwhelmingly linear, a feeling reinforced by the organization of the game content into "chapters" in each zone. The zones feed you from the starter area through to the higher level content in straight-line fashion, with the only possible deviation being to jump the track and rerail on another race's storyline.
The zones themselves look good, as far as I am concerned, but some of them feel quite constricted. Those used to the vast, open world of WoW, or even the less obtrusive zone boundaries of DAoC, might be disappointed. War is definitely a series of distinct, separate spaces connected by plumbing.
Zone content could use some rearranging in a few places. In some of them it seems like they just scattered mobs everywhere, and it can be pretty hard to find a place where it's safe to catch a breath.
I find the scenarios fun for a few runs, but I never got into BGs, and much prefer DAoC model of open-field and siege-oriented realm warfare. Fortunately, while a large number of people just jump on and queue scens over and over, we've found some good running battles in Troll Country, and other places. I am slightly apprehensive about how this goes post-40, since people still have the scenario option, but I hope open RvR will develop along the lines of DAoC.
On that point, though, I have come to the conclusion that their RvR world design isn't helping. In Dark Ages the other races were wholly alien, and their lands were far off. You became aware of them when they entered your lands and caused trouble, or you did the same in theirs. Getting from your lands to theirs felt like travelling, and it felt dangerous, especially if you did it as a low level.
In War the division between their lands and our lands is almost invisible. The races are mixed up in areas of each zone. Every night the "war" continues and messages flash across the screen. Order has Ostland! Ostland is contested! Destruction has Ostland! I can't tell whether any of it means anything. Certainly the game play doesn't change when the zones change sides. Nothing like reading about your keeps dropping one after another and Hibs on your relic. To be fair, once they took the relic DAoC gameplay didn't change a huge amount, either. But it sure felt like something dire was afoot.
In the end, War feels to me less like a virtual world in which a war is on, and more like a virtual themepark for RvR. And that might be fun for awhile, as it is now, but I don't think it will draw the kind of member base and loyalty that DAoC did unless they can design the world so that it is in need of, and worth, defending.
The game as a whole is fun now, after two weeks. Crafting is interesting but feels incomplete, and Apothecary at least is certainly buggy. I give Mythic credit, because you can make useful things at even a low level, and that was one of Jacobs' design goals. I'm selling full stacks of potions at the AH at 100 apothecary, so that was a pleasant surprise.
There's lots of money, lots of loot, no death penalty to speak of, fairly easy mobs, small areas that you can cover quickly on foot, no sharp edges, no indigestion, and so on those counts Mythic swallowed the WoW marketing strategy whole, and who wouldn't? That's the way it's going to be from now on, I guess. I do wish someone would make a hardcore RPG like EQ built around RvR and a huge world, and be happy with a couple hundred K subs, but there's so much big money in this genre now that I'm afraid we'll get nothing but quarter pounders with cheese from here on out.
The zones themselves look good, as far as I am concerned, but some of them feel quite constricted. Those used to the vast, open world of WoW, or even the less obtrusive zone boundaries of DAoC, might be disappointed. War is definitely a series of distinct, separate spaces connected by plumbing.
Zone content could use some rearranging in a few places. In some of them it seems like they just scattered mobs everywhere, and it can be pretty hard to find a place where it's safe to catch a breath.
I find the scenarios fun for a few runs, but I never got into BGs, and much prefer DAoC model of open-field and siege-oriented realm warfare. Fortunately, while a large number of people just jump on and queue scens over and over, we've found some good running battles in Troll Country, and other places. I am slightly apprehensive about how this goes post-40, since people still have the scenario option, but I hope open RvR will develop along the lines of DAoC.
On that point, though, I have come to the conclusion that their RvR world design isn't helping. In Dark Ages the other races were wholly alien, and their lands were far off. You became aware of them when they entered your lands and caused trouble, or you did the same in theirs. Getting from your lands to theirs felt like travelling, and it felt dangerous, especially if you did it as a low level.
In War the division between their lands and our lands is almost invisible. The races are mixed up in areas of each zone. Every night the "war" continues and messages flash across the screen. Order has Ostland! Ostland is contested! Destruction has Ostland! I can't tell whether any of it means anything. Certainly the game play doesn't change when the zones change sides. Nothing like reading about your keeps dropping one after another and Hibs on your relic. To be fair, once they took the relic DAoC gameplay didn't change a huge amount, either. But it sure felt like something dire was afoot.
In the end, War feels to me less like a virtual world in which a war is on, and more like a virtual themepark for RvR. And that might be fun for awhile, as it is now, but I don't think it will draw the kind of member base and loyalty that DAoC did unless they can design the world so that it is in need of, and worth, defending.
The game as a whole is fun now, after two weeks. Crafting is interesting but feels incomplete, and Apothecary at least is certainly buggy. I give Mythic credit, because you can make useful things at even a low level, and that was one of Jacobs' design goals. I'm selling full stacks of potions at the AH at 100 apothecary, so that was a pleasant surprise.
There's lots of money, lots of loot, no death penalty to speak of, fairly easy mobs, small areas that you can cover quickly on foot, no sharp edges, no indigestion, and so on those counts Mythic swallowed the WoW marketing strategy whole, and who wouldn't? That's the way it's going to be from now on, I guess. I do wish someone would make a hardcore RPG like EQ built around RvR and a huge world, and be happy with a couple hundred K subs, but there's so much big money in this genre now that I'm afraid we'll get nothing but quarter pounders with cheese from here on out.
Originally posted by: flexy
i do NOT mind PvP, actually i love it
Maybe everyone on the server is only doing World RvR. Or they're doing a different scenario than you are.
Have you checked the three World RvR areas for T1 on your server?
HeroOfPellinor
Lifer
- Dec 27, 2001
- 11,272
- 1
- 0
Originally posted by: drebo
Originally posted by: flexy
i do NOT mind PvP, actually i love it
Maybe everyone on the server is only doing World RvR. Or they're doing a different scenario than you are.
Have you checked the three World RvR areas for T1 on your server?
Yeah, in T1 everyone is in Nordwatch. OP = Gates of Ekrund = Fail.
As a Hib, I can say that New Frontiers really upped the usefulness of most Hib classes over Old Frontiers. After NF, Hibs were on par with everyone else, and the fight as a whole was a lot more fun.
As to what Markbnj said, I agree. RvR was not done well in WAR, unfortunately. And scenarios just complicate that. The RvR areas are very small and the siege warfare is much less flexible than it was in DAoC. It's fun, don't get me wrong, and collision is WONDERFUL, but that alone isn't enough to get over all of the other downfalls. I understand why they made it the way they did, but I think that more focus should have been put on the open-world RvR. Hopefully T4 with all the different keeps will make world RvR more popular.
Order tried to take one of the T2 greenskin keeps a couple days ago...awesome 2 hour defense fight. Everyone got lots of RPs and Exp and had lots of fun...much more than would have been had in scenarios in that time. Scenarios provide instant gratification, which is why they're so popular, but the rewards ARE better in open world RvR for time invested.
Originally posted by: flexy
So i am playing WAR for a while, i got my impressions, did some RvR and PvE.
I signed up on the warh forums, and i see that my complaints are actually the same as have MANY of WAR players out there.
Basically, the WAR forums are an only QQ place with people complaining about MANY aspects of the game.
For me, the more and more i play, the more and more i see inconsistencies...the more disappointed i get with this supposed to be "best MMORPG since WoW"
1) The game is empty, servers are empty, scenarios HARDLY ever pop. If it werent for my wife questing with me (ON WOW MAINTENANCE TUESDAY
Due to the fact that the game is empty, RvR scnearios HARDLY (if ever!) pop. I have been in 4 hr queues...and no scneario is popping in hours. I dont see people running around and socialising, AT ALL
However, you get gold spammers (thats the only "entertainment")..and for some bizarre reason the /IGNORE command doesn't work...you cannot ignore them.
2) No zone chat
3) Another big common impression i share with other people is the fact that the game lacks heart, charm, atmosphere.
Starting with missing music score...to the fact that my caster's spells dont make any sounds. I always enjoyed the music score in WoW..and still do
4) People complain about the grinding, they say it gets even worse at T4. This applies to PVE as well as RvR.
5) I personally think that the "scenario" or BG concept is total nonsense, i dont see any new things compared to WoW BGs. "Scenarios" are distruptive and dont make any sense since they dont go together with whatever PVE questiong you're doing.
You just get "transported" from your questing right into a scenario..and then afterwards back to your PVE location ---> lame
6) I expected WAR far superior when it comes to PvP...and i actually dont think it is. The scens i played were not that much different from your average EOTS or whatever BG, i am missing innovative and new elements...but they're not there.
OVERALL....i think there are so many aspects of WAR which really, really disappoint and make this rather a halfa$$ attempt to compete with WoW, a game without soul and charm..and i see many people coming to the same conclusion.
Move to a populated server.... there are a few ghost town servers out there.
we moved off of one and now we get insta pop scens and plenty or people to do PQs with.
that made it alot more fun.
Most of your problems come from you being behind the curve for leveling atm on your server. I am speaking first hand, I'm on Kragg(r20 Chosen) and I have fallen slightly behind myself. Still not bad where I am at, but most of the server pop is in Tier3 atm and people aren't rolling a lot of alts yet. A lot of the points you bring up just go away when you get to higher levels(particularly the differences in PVP compared to WoW- it isn't remotely close).
Maybe one of the higher pop servers would make you happier, Kragg is mid pop with the majority of people playing atm in Tier3, a decent amount in Tier2 and very few in Tier4/Tier1.
Maybe one of the higher pop servers would make you happier, Kragg is mid pop with the majority of people playing atm in Tier3, a decent amount in Tier2 and very few in Tier4/Tier1.
- Sep 28, 2001
- 8,464
- 155
- 106
Originally posted by: HeroOfPellinor
Originally posted by: drebo
Originally posted by: flexy
i do NOT mind PvP, actually i love it
Maybe everyone on the server is only doing World RvR. Or they're doing a different scenario than you are.
Have you checked the three World RvR areas for T1 on your server?
Yeah, in T1 everyone is in Nordwatch. OP = Gates of Ekrund = Fail.
I queue up in all of them, but IF one pops its only NW. I have never seen another one popping than NW.
Modelworks
Lifer
- Feb 22, 2007
- 16,240
- 7
- 76
They did some interesting things in the patch today.
Que all button for scenarios
20% exp bonus for joining low pop servers.
Should help even out the populations
Que all button for scenarios
20% exp bonus for joining low pop servers.
Should help even out the populations
Mem
Lifer
- Apr 23, 2000
- 21,476
- 13
- 81
Way to early to say IMHO and really unfair at this point for a new game that has only been live weeks.
MMORPGs change with updates/patches which is always ongoing,WAR is far from the worst MMORPG outhere and has many postive and original ideas.
I hope it succeeds.
TRENDING THREADS
-
Discussion Zen 5 Speculation (EPYC Turin and Strix Point/Granite Ridge - Ryzen 9000)- Started by DisEnchantment
- Replies: 25K
-
Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes Discussion Threads
- Started by Tigerick
- Replies: 21K
-
Discussion Intel current and future Lakes & Rapids thread- Started by TheF34RChannel
- Replies: 23K
-
-
Facebook
Twitter