Volt gets official EPA mileage rating(s)

[Throckmorton]

There is no battery problem.

 

[Throckmorton]

The Prius averages 55mpg not because of the hybrid system, but because it has a really small gasoline motor.

The main reason the Prius gets good gas mileage even on the highway where the hybrid system isn't that much use is the aerodynamics. If the entire auto industry can get away from the stupid "sedan" 3 box shape, highway gas mileage will go way up.

 

[desy]

Right, the batteries work
however
They are expensive, offer poor range because they have 1/10th the energy density compared to gasoline and have what most people consider to be an inordinate amount of time to charge.
Most people consider these to be problems

 

[Arkaign]

No, they aren't viable everywhere, however Solar/Wind are perfectly predictable in the right places. Solar in the desert southwest and Wind in the Texas panhandle for example are two great places to make cheap energy.

I also think nuclear is good too, but it's not completely renewable. Better than coal/gas though 🙂

Hey, on the nuclear front, check out the Thorium cycle reactor technologies. It's been pretty successful and it's unbelievably efficient (~98% of the fuel used in a cycle can be re-used for the next cycle). Thorium is incredibly abundant on earth, and concievably most of the world's electric power could easily be supplied by Thorium-cycle reactors for the forseeable future, or hundreds of years with even moderate supplies. I think the only problem that I saw was how easily weapons-grade materials can be gathered from running the Thorium cycle, which I guess makes it a bit sensitive in terms of who gets to run the things.

 

[Throckmorton]

Right, the batteries work
however
They are expensive, offer poor range because they have 1/10th the energy density compared to gasoline and have what most people consider to be an inordinate amount of time to charge.
Most people consider these to be problems

But most people commute 20 miles or less. That means the Volt is perfect since it allows commuting on battery only, with the generator available for longer trips. Even if you have batteries with 10x the capacity, that's only 400 miles, and then what do you do? I don't think we'll be able to charge any type of battery in 2 minutes at a filling station for decades.

 

[Bignate603]

Purely opinion. I don't need a hybrid drive system in a daily driver, nor do I need NAV or plush accommodations for a BASIC fuel efficient car. I appreciate the discussion, but you are spouting opinion and not FACT.

It's not purely opinion. Those cars got lousy ratings when they were new and compare even worse now. As was stated, with their tiny little engines they couldn't keep freeway speeds with the slightest incline. With the crash, safety, and emissions standards you're never going to see anything as cheap or as fuel efficient (at least with a traditional drivetrain).

Beyond that, its hard for car companies to make money off those cars. Those tin cans are competing with far nicer used cars so they have to be ridiculously cheap to make people consider them. Ridiculously cheap cars have ridiculously small margins. Ridiculously small margins means that car companies would prefer to focus on things that can actually make them profitable.

 

[Gillbot]

It's not purely opinion. Those cars got lousy ratings when they were new and compare even worse now. As was stated, with their tiny little engines they couldn't keep freeway speeds with the slightest incline. With the crash, safety, and emissions standards you're never going to see anything as cheap or as fuel efficient (at least with a traditional drivetrain).

Beyond that, its hard for car companies to make money off those cars. Those tin cans are competing with far nicer used cars so they have to be ridiculously cheap to make people consider them. Ridiculously cheap cars have ridiculously small margins. Ridiculously small margins means that car companies would prefer to focus on things that can actually make them profitable.

Like building SUV's that cause them to nearly go bankrupt and forcing a government bailout?

 

[LTC8K6]

Like building SUV's that cause them to nearly go bankrupt and forcing a government bailout?

I didn't know it was the SUV's that ruined GM and Chrysler. Are you sure it wasn't the way the companies were run?

 

[Ktulu]

I didn't know it was the SUV's that ruined GM and Chrysler. Are you sure it wasn't the way the companies were run?

Yeah me either, SUV's were their highest profit vehicles. Pretty sure it was shitty management + shitty unions + shitty banks not wanting to loan money.

 

[Gillbot]

I didn't know it was the SUV's that ruined GM and Chrysler. Are you sure it wasn't the way the companies were run?

Yeah me either, SUV's were their highest profit vehicles. Pretty sure it was shitty management + shitty unions + shitty banks not wanting to loan money.

It added to the mess. When they were pumping out SUV's for the "masses" without an eye to the future, they were "blindsided" by the economic downturn. Plus, if you were a bank and saw these companies and the way they were run, would you risk loaning them money too?

 

[iversonyin]

A 4 pages thread discussing about a pointless vehicle that cost $41,000? MPG is so overrated.

"my car does 90 mpg" oh wow!

 

[ShawnD1]

A 4 pages thread discussing about a pointless vehicle that cost $41,000? MPG is so overrated.

"my car does 90 mpg" oh wow!

Pretty much this. After maybe $30,000 (in the US), you're not allowed to bitch about gas mileage. If gas money was that tight for simple commuting, you wouldn't be buying a $30,000 car.

Trucks get the exception. People who need a $30,000 truck for work can still complain about fuel costs 🙂

 

[LTC8K6]

Well, the Volt is not really for saving fuel. It's for looking trendy and green, and that's priceless.

 

[Ktulu]

It added to the mess. When they were pumping out SUV's for the "masses" without an eye to the future, they were "blindsided" by the economic downturn. Plus, if you were a bank and saw these companies and the way they were run, would you risk loaning them money too?

They risked loaning Ford money and at the time they loaned Ford money they were in a shittier situation that GM. The banks weren't loaning ANYONE money when GM and Chrysler went to ask. GM had already set out a plan to restructure that didnt involve the government. The banks fucked them.

 

[ShawnD1]

Well, the Volt is not really for saving fuel. It's for looking trendy and green, and that's priceless.

Unfortunately Americans are not all about looking cool. Top google result for best selling cars in america says the top selling vehicles are:
1. Ford F150
2. Chevy Silverado
3. Toyota Camry
4. Honda Civic
5. Honda Accord
6. Toyota Corolla

And the list goes on like that. Americans don't want expensive ass trendy cars. They want a car that goes from A to B without breaking down and without costing a fortune (40k???). Everything else after that doesn't matter.

 

[Gillbot]

They risked loaning Ford money and at the time they loaned Ford money they were in a shittier situation that GM. The banks weren't loaning ANYONE money when GM and Chrysler went to ask. GM had already set out a plan to restructure that didnt involve the government. The banks fucked them.

They screwed themselves by over extending, over producing and overpaying. You can't fail in business and blame someone else, period.

 

[LTC8K6]

Unfortunately Americans are not all about looking cool. Top google result for best selling cars in america says the top selling vehicles are:
1. Ford F150
2. Chevy Silverado
3. Toyota Camry
4. Honda Civic
5. Honda Accord
6. Toyota Corolla

And the list goes on like that. Americans don't want expensive ass trendy cars. They want a car that goes from A to B without breaking down and without costing a fortune (40k???). Everything else after that doesn't matter.

I wasn't praising the Volt with that comment... :biggrin:

 

[Throckmorton]

It added to the mess. When they were pumping out SUV's for the "masses" without an eye to the future, they were "blindsided" by the economic downturn. Plus, if you were a bank and saw these companies and the way they were run, would you risk loaning them money too?

That's political spin. They built what customers wanted which is their job. Then those customers panicked when gas prices went up, even though they were already driving vehicles they couldn't really afford.

 

[Squisher]

They screwed themselves by over extending, over producing and overpaying. You can't fail in business and blame someone else, period.

I agree, but the only thing separating GM and Chrysler from Ford was money management.

If I was your financial planer and I told you Mr. Gillbot sir I want you to max out every credit card you have with cash advances, get a second mortgage, get loans using every tangible asset you have as collateral and take that money and bury it in a mason jar in your backyard. You would probably ignore my advise. GM and Chrysler did the same.

 

[Gillbot]

That's political spin. They built what customers wanted which is their job. Then those customers panicked when gas prices went up, even though they were already driving vehicles they couldn't really afford.

It's not political spin at all. I used to work for Chrysler so I was in the middle of the mess. It was typical tunnel vision with an eye on the bottom line of the moment.

 

[steppinthrax]

My old Ford Aspire got 50 actual on the highway, no idea what it was rated. I just can't see paying the premium price for a car that is crippled to short trips or weighed down for long ones with useless extra electric stuff.

The Geo Metro XFI can get 80+ mpg when modified. I believe stock it's around 53 mpg. There is a whole enthusiast forum to people who modify the hell out of the care to get 80+ mpg and keep in road safe. The problem is that Americans want to drive in style.

 

[SandEagle]

saw a Volt on the road the other day. looked nice. but for the price i'd want more mpg dammit

 

[Rifter]

Other than the fact that they are ugly thats not great MPG average. I had the chance to look at two a few days ago and according to the computers in them they were averaging 53MPG and 55MPG average. I work at a tow company and we hauled in a car carrier that was on fire with 2 volts onboard and a hybrid escalade. The escalade looked nice, volts not so much. Cant post pics had to sign agreement with chevy when we put them into our secure bay, they left last night going to michigan.

 

[lupi]

I don't think I have that demanding of a commute, but unless that thing deploys a solar tower when parked it wouldn't have enough juice just to make it to work and back.

 

[Gillbot]

The Geo Metro XFI can get 80+ mpg when modified. I believe stock it's around 53 mpg. There is a whole enthusiast forum to people who modify the hell out of the care to get 80+ mpg and keep in road safe. The problem is that Americans want to drive in style.

Exactly! Plus corporations want to charge a premium for anything and everything. Want power windows? Sure, add the xyz package for $10k that adds a moon roof, sat nav, luggage rack, power seats, heated seats, blah blah blah blah to an 8k base price car.