Viruses... what's the point?

[SunSamurai]

Originally posted by: dorion

Originally posted by: CycloWizard

Originally posted by: KIAman
I see humans on an evolutionary path towards understanding and mastering their environment.

I see animals as transitionary or failed attempts at human-like self-awareness and progression.

Viruses... do they have an evolutionary path? I think not. Once again, what's the point?

Why does evolution have a point? I think you're convoluting the philosophy of the "why" with the science of the "how."

Exactly! Evolution has no point, it can't. It's just a name for a process. Evolution has no pentultimate goal.

The goal is efficient survival.

 

[irishScott]

To get you to make this thread.

 

[Foxery]

Originally posted by: BrownTown
Viruses have the same point as every single other living thing.

Viruses are not alive. They're just DNA fragments in a protective coating... they have no metabolic processes. My impression has always been that they are accidents. Mistakes. Thus, there is no why, and no purpose.

Originally posted by: superunknown98
Just recently I was reading that viruses can actually have thier own viruses. I might put forward a theory that if viruses destroyed all complex life they would attack themselves.

Nope - see above. A virus is purely parasitic, and cannot function on its own.

Several people here are confusing viruses with bacteria/micro organisms, and they are not related concepts in the slightest. Viruses can infect bacteria, because they are orders of magnitude smaller. Both of these can infect humans, because we are orders of magnitude larger than both.

 

[TheDoc9]

If you look at things from a different viewpoint, viruses tend to have more reason than not. For example Herpes could literally be viewed as a warning to others, and it goes right in line with teachings from certain religious books. As does HIV, this virus is actually horrible and ingenious, it literally tricks your immune system and like a spy infiltrating an enemy base the virus hijacks it and proceeds to create enemy combatants with your own materials, eventually killing you.

What reason would a virus have to do this? Replication and 'just to survive' don't necessarily answer it, why not form a more symbiotic/beneficial relationship with the host?

 

[Gibsons]

Originally posted by: TheDoc9
If you look at things from a different viewpoint, viruses tend to have more reason than not. For example Herpes could literally be viewed as a warning to others, and it goes right in line with teachings from certain religious books. As does HIV, this virus is actually horrible and ingenious, it literally tricks your immune system and like a spy infiltrating an enemy base the virus hijacks it and proceeds to create enemy combatants with your own materials, eventually killing you.

What reason would a virus have to do this? Replication and 'just to survive' don't necessarily answer it, why not form a more symbiotic/beneficial relationship with the host?

Herpes simplex really isn't that horrible and it rarely kills its hosts. The immune system is usually able to control it quite well, unlike HIV. It's really only deadly when it causes encephalitis (rare) or in the immune compromised.

As stated in a previous post in this thread, the relationship of at least one herpes virus (Epstein-Barr) can be viewed as symbiotic/beneficial to the host in some cases.

 

[Dragon Thee]

The purpose of a Virus varies from virus to virus. Some are created to create strengthen in the human race. Without them, the human immune system would become lax and then be wiped out. Like the common cold, it has found homeostasis with its host organism.

Some viruses are like scientists poking around in the dark. They insert random genes and see what happens. Most of the time, they die. but sometimes....SOMETIMES, something amazing and new happens. And that becomes a new "feature" of that now dominant species of the Earth.

Other viruses just want to have fun...at your expense. And they survive and adapt to that end very well.

Of course, the host organism doesn't want to change because at some point, a virus infected that host's ancestor, become the immune system and stated "You have to get through ME to be part of this system."

Of course, this is all bullshit. Unless you believe it, write a grant and get paid from the government and back it up with SCIENCE.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

The purpose of a Virus varies from virus to virus. Some are created to create strengthen in the human race. Without them, the human immune system would become lax and then be wiped out. Like the common cold, it has found homeostasis with its host organism.

Some viruses are like scientists poking around in the dark. They insert random genes and see what happens. Most of the time, they die. but sometimes....SOMETIMES, something amazing and new happens. And that becomes a new "feature" of that now dominant species of the Earth.

Other viruses just want to have fun...at your expense. And they survive and adapt to that end very well.

Of course, the host organism doesn't want to change because at some point, a virus infected that host's ancestor, become the immune system and stated "You have to get through ME to be part of this system."

Of course, this is all bullshit. Unless you believe it, write a grant and get paid from the government and back it up with SCIENCE.

Sep 15, 2008.
Sep 15, 2008.
Sep 15, 2008.

 

[William Gaatjes]

Nature quickly puts overacheivers in place, incredibly effective killing viruses burn out because their target host becomes to sparse/extinct. Animals that are too effective have a population crash once they've consumed all their resources. Wolves can't eat all the deer, deer can't eat all the grass, grass can't drain the soil of all it's nutrients.

It does not have to be that black and white.
A virus for example can be a killer for host a, but can be a mild inconvenience for host b and can even end up being assimilated in the dna of host c. Some hosts are just carriers without getting any illness. When these hosts get attacked by parasites like for example mosquitoes, the parasites can transfer the virus into another host that does get sick.

There is even a theory (I do not know if it is proven yet) that some animals (hosts) carry the complete dna for a given virus in their own dna). When the right genetic trigger (Certain toxins or epigentic changes) in the host (carrying the virus dna into their own dna) is present, the particular dna sequence read and transcribed into a fully functional virus. For the host it may do nothing (Or perhaps be a cause of cancer decreasing the life expectancy) . But when bitten by mosquitoes, this virus could be transmitted to other hosts where the virus may create havoc.


edit:

I finally remembered the expression, if you look at it from a certain point of view : Hiding in plain sight.

 

[William Gaatjes]

Viruses are not alive. They're just DNA fragments in a protective coating... they have no metabolic processes. My impression has always been that they are accidents. Mistakes. Thus, there is no why, and no purpose.



Nope - see above. A virus is purely parasitic, and cannot function on its own.

Several people here are confusing viruses with bacteria/micro organisms, and they are not related concepts in the slightest. Viruses can infect bacteria, because they are orders of magnitude smaller. Both of these can infect humans, because we are orders of magnitude larger than both.

Nature is not just independent cells. Nature is everything combined. We would survive without viruses and bacteria fine in a sterile world. But we would no longer be able to adapt on the "short" timescale we can do now. Viruses are very efficient means to get mutations happening. Phages for bacteria are a good example next to of course to plasmids.