[Various]Radeon Fury X and Radeon Fury coming

[utahraptor]

I cant help but feel this too.

Hardwareluxx said this and I`m not sure what it means. Are they hitting the power roof with current clocks for Fury? Is that what they mean?

I think a lot of us are having PTSD flashbacks to the bulldozer release.

 

[SimianR]

We've known since April that AMD and PC Gamer were doing a presentation/show together at E3. I don't think they would randomly change their plans and release the card early. I also don't think they are making any major changes at this point to try and "counter" the 980 Ti - they were probably always aiming for the Titan X level of performance and the 980 Ti isn't any faster though it is cheaper. I can see them rethinking whatever their initial price point was, though. I don't think they'll want their new fury water cooled card viewed as a "value" or budget alternative, so I don't think it will be priced too low.

 

[RussianSensation]

I don't think that is a choice with Fiji. 2x8 pin on a new single GPU sounds like water is pretty much a necessity unless they want to go with a 2 fan open air cooler which isn't practical on a 17cm card.

Of course WC is required on a 17 cm board, but not because of 300W power usage in and of itself but because you can't fit a large enough air cooler onto such a small PCB. You can't expect a near miniITX 300W flagship card without some compromises. We could just as well rip 980Ti apart for being too large for smaller cases but that wouldn't be fair either since not everyone has a small case.

People keep confusing why the requirement exists. Gigabyte Windforce G1 has a 600W cooler they are strapping on a 980Ti. Can it really handle all 600W? Probably not but 350W is a cake walk for that cooler.

Also, you are penalizing the Fiji card for requiring a water cooling kit because it is smaller but are ignoring how much of a turd the reference blower 980Ti/Titan X blowers are once the cards are overclocked. I don't want a 20% overclocked 980Ti reference running 55-56 dBA in my system. At that point you gotta be objective and we are then really comparing a 300W-400W card exhausting 95% of the heat out of the case vs. a 275-300W card that dumps 95% of it into the case. So it's not quite a simple to paint AIO CLC as some "requirement" failure. It has its benefits you know.

Now let's take this up 1 notch: 980Ti SLI vs. Fiji XT CF. I now have 500W being dumped into my case OR have to put up with awful jet engine R9 290X reference noise levels on those overclocked 980Tis OR I gotta pay $100 more per each NV card going EVGA Hybrid. Fiji XT gives $749 EVGA Hybrid setup. You aren't assigning any premium to that....

Your other points I agree with. 980Ti shows amazing perf/watt scaling when overclocked on 1.23V. 6GB of HBM is also a nice free bonus. These factors mean 980Ti has the potential to be a clear winner, esp. cards like G1 Gaming, MSI Lightning, etc.

The other side of the coin is GW. In GW titles, AMD can easily end up 25-50% behind. At that point no Fiji XT card can compete against black boxed game code!!!

There is a counter point to that as well. NV's Business Practices and how they treated Kepler and 970 owners leaves a lot to be desired. For a lot of gamers who hate GW because they view is it creating segregation in the PC industry (ala consoles) for no reason, and NV's business attitude as of late, they might choose to sacrifice some performance to not support a company that bribes its way with developers to win benchmarks and plays marketing tricks with specs, then feels 0 remorse even when it is caught red-handed.

Also, what if Fiji XT has full hardware HVEC decoder for 4K? 980Ti doesn't. Could be a small factor to some -- certainly this was the Key point being made why 960 > 280/280X/290 by certain NV supporters.

If we take all of these factors aside, then sure 980Ti OC 6GB is starting to look like a winner. But some people don't want a monopoly or support "dirty" practices of "exclusive game code locks" in games.

*** BTW, Congrats on your 2nd kid! ***

 

[5150Joker]

Just in case someone missed it and the previous thread was closed, I`m reposting it here along with new information (OP also updated)

Hardwareluxx:

• Fury X:
• Slower than GTX 980Ti
• Water cooler made by CoolIT
• Confirmed to have 4GB HBM
• PSU of 700W is recommended

Sweclockers:

• Radeon Fury post poned because of bad yields (did not specify what had bad yields but will guess HBM).
• Radeon Fury X is 17cm in length

• Radeon Fury X will be launched as an alternative to GTX 980Ti whatever that means
• GTX 980Ti was launched to make it difficult for AMD to succeed with Fury cards
• Radeon Fury X was originally planned to launch at a high price (but lower than Titan X) but GTX 980Ti have made them changed plans and AMD is now preparing to launch the card at around $600 with low profit/margin to have a chance against GTX 980Ti

Lol if this is true there will be a lot of tears from some that thought it was going to be a titan x killer.

 

[tential]

You took that out of context. I said "Combine the release date, the performance, and the price"

Very few expected that combination, imo.

I thought Ti would be close, but not almost identical in performance.

I doubt anyone predicted the near tie between the Ti and the Tx.



http://www.anandtech.com/show/9306/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-980-ti-review/18

Release date and perf were a given already. We'd already knew it was coming before fury I mean it's a cut down Titan x part it's been available for awhile now. The perf was a given as well. Price we all expected higher prices. Which is saying something. We all expected to be milked far more than we are being milked for this card lol...

 

[tential]

AMD could easily play the sandbag game as well, don't release the water cooled versions until the GTX980Ti Uber Blaster HyBoost Warp Bubble cards are released.

What possible reason would there be for AMD to wait?

They Already set aa release date. How can you guys not understand this? Companies don't make knee-jerk reactions. If they said they have aa reveal in place with pcgamer at e3 there is definitely a contract and obviously revealing the card now would hurt whatever deal they have with pcgamer at e3. Major companies aren't 1 person chilling by themselves. Any of you guys working at a big company try and get a major changes done in 2 weeks to a new product release..... Lol....

 

[thilanliyan]

Lol if this is true there will be a lot of tears from some that thought it was going to be a titan x killer.

If that is all true then these new cards would be a failure. But thats the thing...none of this has actually been confirmed, yet Cloudfire is posting it like it is fact.

 

[AnandThenMan]

Why would a card with Titan X class performance be a failure? By association that makes T-X a fail.

 

[chimaxi83]

Why would a card with Titan X class performance be a failure? By association that makes T-X a fail.

Because fanboys gonna fan the flame(bait). It's all some of these posters are capable of.


2 days off for personal attack and the Fanboy comment.

-Rvenger

 

[5150Joker]

Why would a card with Titan X class performance be a failure? By association that makes T-X a fail.

Because many across the enthusiast fold fully expected it to be faster than Titan X and priced $850 thus making it some kind of "value". If it can't even reach 980 Ti levels, that is a major fail. Especially given the fact that AMD will likely be relegated to razor thin margins, it can't be good for their financial health. Coupled with the rumor of poor yields, this could be all around bad news for AMD.

So many people thought the 980 Ti was a "panicked" release and I questioned that assertion and noted it was NVIDIA's plan to finish off AMD and if this pans out, we'll see AMD in big trouble for another few quarters.

If that is all true then these new cards would be a failure. But thats the thing...none of this has actually been confirmed, yet Cloudfire is posting it like it is fact.

I don't see where he posted it as fact, he did cite a source. It's up to you whether you put credence in the source or not.

 

[exar333]

Because many across the enthusiast fold fully expected it to be faster than Titan X and priced $850 thus making it some kind of "value". If it can't even reach 980 Ti levels, that is a major fail. Especially given the fact that AMD will likely be relegated to razor thin margins, it can't be good for their financial health. Coupled with the rumor of poor yields, this could be all around bad news for AMD.

So many people thought the 980 Ti was a "panicked" release and I questioned that assertion and noted it was NVIDIA's plan to finish off AMD and if this pans out, we'll see AMD in big trouble for another few quarters.




I don't see where he posted it as fact, he did cite a source. It's up to you whether you put credence in the source or not.

The massive memory bandwidth (HBM) tech was also very exciting...

 

[Enigmoid]

I already posted that...

What is the point of using a lot of power in a card that's supposed to use a lot less power?

Yeah, I took some time to post and you bet me.

I think the price of the 980Ti was a surprise to most people.

It's not hard to believe it surprised AMD.

Combine the release date, the performance, and the price, and I can see AMD being a bit stunned.

Is it true?

I don't know, but it's certainly believable.

AMD must have known. For sure they have people in the channel whom they can get general ideas from. Nvidia played that trick with the 970, surely it would have to be taken into consideration with the 980 ti.

 

[AnandThenMan]

Because many across the enthusiast fold fully expected it to be faster than Titan X and priced $850...

Really? I'd like to see you even remotely back that up. If you had said you fully expect it to have the above criteria then fine...

If it can't even reach 980 Ti levels, that is a major fail.

According to you, which is fine.

Especially given the fact that AMD will likely be relegated to razor thin margins,

On a $650 graphics card? What is this based on?

Coupled with the rumor of poor yields, this could be all around bad news for AMD.

I have not heard this, got a source? Unless you mean HBM which is possible at first.

So many people thought the 980 Ti was a "panicked" release

I don't see many people saying this to be honest.

and I questioned that assertion and noted it was NVIDIA's plan to finish off AMD and if this pans out, we'll see AMD in big trouble for another few quarters.

Isn't Nvidia always planning to finish off AMD? Don't see why this particular case is special or different.

 

[DDH]

If that is all true then these new cards would be a failure. But thats the thing...none of this has actually been confirmed, yet Cloudfire is posting it like it is fact.

Didnt he also post that his "sources" said it would be 20nm fab process?




AMD's extremely tight guarding of information regarding this product is responsible for the vacuum we now find ourselves in, which has contributed to the extreme variation of speculation. Clearly no one knows anything at this stage. Yet everyone knows everything.

Its all AMDs fault. How dare they not leak performance benches ahead of time.

 

[rainy]

I don't see where he posted it as fact, he did cite a source. It's up to you whether you put credence in the source or not.

Really?
This is title of his locked thread: "[Hardwareluxxx]Breaking news: AMD Fury X will be slower than GX 980Ti".

Btw, I'm not surprised that one fanboy defending another one.


Infraction issued for inflammatory language.

-Rvenger

 

[RussianSensation]

Lol if this is true there will be a lot of tears from some that thought it was going to be a titan x killer.

Highly unlikely. If Fiji Fury is slower than 980Ti, AMD will probably price is lower. That gives even more affordable options for PC gamers, a far cry from that overpriced mid-range 980 that we endured for 8 months (yawn). It means competition will drive superior price/performance points on the technology curve at various pricing segments, likely pushing 980 $499 even lower as well. Either way, anyone who waited this long will be able to buy a Titan X killer no matter what - because 980Ti after-market cards exist. A lot of people at this point are either getting 980Ti or Fiji or waiting to Pascal gen. If anything, the only people shedding tears should be TX owners who spent $350 per each card for e-peen/bragging rights and then another on AIO CLCs/waterblock to keep Titan Xs from not sounding like a jet engine. The hilarious part is even after all that the cream of the crop KINGPIN 980Ti after-market card should beat the Titan X. :thumbsup:

$1300 GTX980Ti SLI = 97% of Titan X SLI performance for $700 less. Titan X has already been killed off. Oops.

So many people thought the 980 Ti was a "panicked" release and I questioned that assertion and noted it was NVIDIA's plan to finish off AMD and if this pans out, we'll see AMD in big trouble for another few quarters.

Sounds like some fantasy right there. AMD has the entire console business, should announce their design win with Nintendo's NX console and they are bound to get new design wins with MediaTek. They are probably already working on R9 400 series and Fiji HBM1 card lays a nice foundation for their next gen series. With $900 million in the bank, AMD will easily make it to the launch of Zen and R9 400 series. They might not regain much market share this gen due to what appears to be lack of competitive mobile dGPUs, but they aren't getting finished off any time soon.

So many people thought the 980 Ti was a "panicked" release and I questioned that assertion and noted it was NVIDIA's plan to finish off AMD and if this pans out, we'll see AMD in big trouble for another few quarters.

Thankfully the GPU market isn't just made up of $650-1000 cards. We still don't know where the rest of R9 300 series will fall. There is potential that a fully unlocked Tonga will easily beat a 960, that an after-market 390 will beat a 970 and have 8GB of VRAM to boot, while a $400 390X could come in at 95% of the 980's performance for $100 less. Then there is Fiji PRO that should obsolete the $500 980 as well if AMD prices it at $550.

Even if NV takes the performance crown with 980Ti/Titan X, doesn't mean the rest of AMD's $100-550 cards will be a fail.

Btw, I'm not surprised that one fanboy defending another one.

It's hard to imagine how anyone can hate AMD so much considering he bought HD5800M, 6900M and supposedly 7900M series and suffered through broken CF setups for 3 generations in a row. I am sorry but who the buys 3 consecutive generations of supposedly broken CF flagship mobile cards when any normal PC gamer would have switched after 1 unhappy generation?

Besides, one has to wonder why he even cares about Fiji XT at all considering his monitor is:

LG 27EA83-D (10 bit IPS), ASUS ROG Swift PG278Q 144 Hz + G-Sync

That means even if Fiji XT cost $499 and was by pure magic 2X faster than Titan X, he wouldn't buy it anyway.

If I were the most hardcore NV fan in the world, I would still want AMD to bring out cards that are as fast as possible simply because I would want AMD to push NV that much more (for example to push NV to release a fully unlocked 980Ti Black Edition with 3072 shaders and 1200-1300mhz clocks), not to mention stronger competition from AMD will ensure more pricing pressure on NV. I guess this is too much logic for certain fans of a particular brand who desire nothing more but 100% monopoly in the marketplace.

 

[Glo.]

Yeah, PR games are working great job. GTX980Ti got all the attention.

Now Fiji, based on rumor on one site is being burned to the ground, and again, all the attention goes for Nvidia, and poor situation of AMD.

What I believe is what happened: Fiji is such a great performer, that Nvidia had to make 90% of Titan X performance at 65% of his price to counter it. In real world, it would not be logical to make this move. And yet, they did it.

I would not ignore benchmarks from ChipHell, from last few months, which shown that new AMD GPU is faster than Titan X.

 

[tviceman]

the reality amd faces with regards to nvidia's market share and more importantly, mindshare, is that this fury card needs to be either:

1) same performance/OC ability as 980ti for 20% cheaper ($549), or
2) same price as 980ti but 20% more performance across the board (making it the undisputed fastest single card, full stop, and accounting for any GW bias that can be cherry picked to compare)

I don't agree with that at all. 20% is a HUGE gap and being both significantly faster AND significantly cheaper with a brand new card is not required.

Of course WC is required on a 17 cm board, but not because of 300W power usage in and of itself but because you can't fit a large enough air cooler onto such a small PCB.

Good point, for whatever weird reason this never occured to me. I still think this card will draw significantly more power than 980 TI / Titan which, as you point out, makes blower-style coolers borderline unusable.[/QUOTE]

*** BTW, Congrats on your 2nd kid! ***

ANY. MOMENT. NOW. Hahahahahaha oh god please help.

 

[StinkyPinky]

"Slower" can mean anything. 2% slower? Without a price that means nothing.

 

[IEC]

Silly season is in full effect. Let this sink in nice and slow: No single GPU will beat Titan X by 60% this year. No single GPU will beat Titan x by 25% this year. The heavy, and most likely, indications is that Fury won't be able to "beat" Titan X at all. I think best case scenario is win some lose some. But Titan X is irrelevant for now for any "gamers." 980 TI is going to rock it out and likely have better OC abilities with custom AIB cards.

And here's the real kicker: with the 2x8 pin connector, it's obvious Fiji is going to be a power hog. It looks more and more like water cooling isn't just a great new feature, it was REQUIRED. And that does not bode well for overclocking. If Hawaii is any indication, Fiji is going to have less OC headroom and a massively ballooning TDP vs. Titan X overclocking. An given than massively overclocked 980 TI's are inbound, Fiji is going to have a hard time against 980 TI's once all the lines are drawn.

Veiled personal attack aside, I didn't say that any single GPU will beat Titan X by 60%.

I said it would be good for gamers if performance was closer to that figure stated by sung (than not). Obviously due to 28nm limitations it can't be 60%, but with the space savings of HBM it would be very nice if the card had flagship+ level performance at a competitive price.

RS already responded to the hybrid cooling piece and I have nothing to add there. He's correct.

 

[2is]

The Titan X is designed more for people who really need the 12GB of RAM for GPU computing-related purposes, and probably don't mind playing a game or two with it.

You could have made this argument with the Titan Z but Titan X has gimped DP performance which is what a compute card excels in. Titan X is a gaming card with 12GB VRAM, it is not a compute card any more so than the 980Ti is really.

 

[2is]

Lol if this is true there will be a lot of tears from some that thought it was going to be a titan x killer.

Or even a 980Ti killer for that matter.

If I were the most hardcore NV fan in the world, I would still want AMD to bring out cards that are as fast as possible simply because I would want AMD to push NV that much more (for example to push NV to release a fully unlocked 980Ti Black Edition with 3072 shaders and 1200-1300mhz clocks), not to mention stronger competition from AMD will ensure more pricing pressure on NV. I guess this is too much logic for certain fans of a particular brand who desire nothing more but 100% monopoly in the marketplace.

AMD isn't doing much pushing though if we are to believe these reports. NVidia is fully in control. 980Ti was something they quickly and easily put together and NVidia is the one dictating AMD pricing. Kind of sad actually. Seeing this play out, can't help but feel like this is a boa constrictor very slowly squeezing the life out of it's prey.

 

[JDG1980]

I think a lot of us are having PTSD flashbacks to the bulldozer release.

Yeah, I hope I'm wrong, but I am starting to get a very bad feeling about this. I remember that before Bulldozer dropped, there were some benchmark leaks by Coolaler and a couple other leakers. I and many other forum-goers thought these were fake; there was no way AMD was going to do something that stupid, and release a product that uncompetitive (which didn't even beat the previous generation). But they did.

If the pessimistic rumors are all true (Fiji falling short of 980 Ti performance, and the rest of the lineup consisting of straight rebrands), then this GPU "generation" is AMD's biggest fail since Bulldozer. I guess we'll find out in a few hours.

 

[2is]

Yeah, I hope I'm wrong, but I am starting to get a very bad feeling about this. I remember that before Bulldozer dropped, there were some benchmark leaks by Coolaler and a couple other leakers. I and many other forum-goers thought these were fake; there was no way AMD was going to do something that stupid, and release a product that uncompetitive (which didn't even beat the previous generation). But they did.

If the pessimistic rumors are all true (Fiji falling short of 980 Ti performance, and the rest of the lineup consisting of straight rebrands), then this GPU "generation" is AMD's biggest fail since Bulldozer. I guess we'll find out in a few hours.

There's literally no positive news coming from AMD, and it's very worrisome. Everything from the Fiji rumors, to 7 month old drivers, to the Project Cars and TW3 debacle, to the news regarding their developer relations, to their market share numbers... it's ALL bad.

If indeed it's slower than a 980Ti for "around" $600 I see no reason to even buy one.

-Not saving much, if any money
-Slower
-Less VRAM
-Far worse driver support for many new game releases.

I'm not seeing any positives here.

 

[SolMiester]

Really? I'd like to see you even remotely back that up. If you had said you fully expect it to have the above criteria then fine...

According to you, which is fine.

On a $650 graphics card? What is this based on?

I have not heard this, got a source? Unless you mean HBM which is possible at first.

I don't see many people saying this to be honest.

Isn't Nvidia always planning to finish off AMD? Don't see why this particular case is special or different.

I have read countless posts on this forum from AMD supporters expecting the latest card from AMD to be a titan killer. I find it hard to believe you havent seen the same!