Van Jones: Obama's Marxist "Green Jobs" Advisor

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sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,855
6,393
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It's impossible to know if Marx would have supported Lenin/Stalin. I suspect he didn't think things would work out in that fashion, but most Idealists usually only have an Idea and don't really know how they'll work in the Real World. They usually only see the Pros of what they have imagined and not the Cons. Love him or hate him, there's little doubt that Marx has had a strong influence on the World we live in. Some of it Good, some of it Bad.
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
Originally posted by: Vic

There was a logical progression here that lead from Marx to Stalin, particularly with Lenin.

Lenin knew all too well of the dangers of Stalin and warned the infant Revoloution about him.


It is called Lenin's Testament and Stalin had it basically hidden and censured Lenin's warning in his grab for power.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lenin%27s_Testament

"Comrade Stalin, having become Secretary-General, has unlimited authority concentrated in his hands, and I am not sure whether he will always be capable of using that authority with sufficient caution. Comrade Trotsky, on the other hand, as his struggle against the C.C. on the question of the People's Commissariat of Communications has already proved, is distinguished not only by outstanding ability. He is personally perhaps the most capable man in the present C.C., but he has displayed excessive self-assurance and shown excessive preoccupation with the purely administrative side of the work."



Lenin wanted Trotsky to carry on his idea of a internationally cooperative Democratic Socialist state (more like modern Europe), and warned of Stalins tyranny.

(Lenin of all people knew how brutal Stalin was as when they were all in exile together Stalin was literally a thug, bankrobber and extortionist.)


Please learn your revolutionary history.

And Marx does not own Socialism, there are 2 opposing aspects of Socialism since before Marx wrote his books on Communism. Marxism as it became to be known was always criticized for giving the "state" (Which to Stalin meant a monolithic vanguard Communist party) total control which would inevitably lead to tyranny.

Lenin was no saint in the Revolution but always maintained that after it was over freedoms and Democracy must be restored in Russia after they were not being invaded by 11 capitalist armies who turned on the Revolution once WW1 was over since the Capitalists were scared shitless of having workers run things instead of the wealthy elites.

Anyhow, the 1917 Revolution was a failure from the start after Rosa Luxembourg was assassinated in Germany thus the German Revolution never happened pulling them out of WW1 and allying with Russia and guiding them through the Revolution together.

Marx and Lenin both said Socialism could not happen in Russia without a advanced capitalist sister state such as Germany. (USA and UK were big on their list also)

Instead Germany and 10 other countries (including USA) invaded Bolshevik Russia creating the chaos of post WW1 that led to a prick like Stalin getting control.

Marx mostly wrote of economics, which still to this day are very relevant when it comes ot things like anti-trust laws (although the details are very outdated he writes about in 1850s the general ideas still ring true) I do agree that his politics were flawed on running this new system he came up with, but he was no leader of countries.

Saying Marx is responsible for Stalin is as lame as saying Jesus is responsible for the inquisition.
 

bl4ckfl4g

Diamond Member
Feb 13, 2007
3,669
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This guy has changed his philosophy though for whatever it is worth. For a few years now he has been on the opposite side he was before. See quote. Not saying he's a good guy, how would I know? I just know he claims to not hold those views anymore.

"We are entering an era during which our very survival will demand invention and innovation on a scale never before seen in the history of human civilization. Only the business community has the requisite skills, experience, and capital to meet that need. On that score, neither government nor the nonprofit and voluntary sectors can compete, not even remotely." -Van Jones
 

marincounty

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2005
3,227
5
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Originally posted by: BarrySotero
Originally posted by: Vic
LOL! now even the Sun Tzu's The Art of War is supposed communist doctrine... what a fscking moron! :p :roll:

Indeed, one of us is a moron and according to a KGB defector it's you. For the non morons here I'll link a video of Yuri Brezmenov - a KGB defector who gave lectures in the early 80's.

Brezmenov explained that all students trained by KGB and in military academies were given copies of Sun Tzu because it was considered a masterpiece of subversion principles. At 5:40 into video he says (paraphrasing) that:

"To implement state policy in a war like manner is inefficient. The highest art of warfare is not to fight at all but to subvert anything of value in your enemies country until his perception of reality is so screwed up that he does not perceive you as an enemy and that your system looks to your enemy as a feasible alternative (better red than dead). The ultimate goal is to take enemy without a single shot being fired...

We rarely need to use guns to kill people and take their country. The cleanest way is to blackmail, pervert, bribe, lie and intimidate the politicians and the media and they will destabilize and disunify their own country for us. Then all we have left to do is to arm the procommunist or simply criminal factions and we have a coup and another "liberated" country. As neat as that."

He is describing the foundation of the culture war and political correctness - as exerted by media and schools that were targeted by subversion

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cj0Id3BLFco

What's ironic about your post is: We won the cold war, without firing a shot. We bankrupted the Soviet Union, something the Marxists hadn't counted on.
 

heyheybooboo

Diamond Member
Jun 29, 2007
6,278
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Any one else notice the new preponderance of 'cut-n-paste' topics without proper attribution or linkage?

The OP is strung together from 2 blogs: http://therealbarackobama.wordpress.com who then attributes their musings to http://newzeal.blogspot.com "a libertarian activist and political researcher from Christchurch New Zealand."

And what is with then attaching videos that have little if any relevance to the hack spam job ?

And what's also interesting is that these 'cut-n-paste' topics without proper attribution are generally months old without any relevance.

That is, the only relevance, really, is to pound the President with negativity (using those 'special' code words).



 

EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
Staff member
Oct 30, 2000
42,589
5
0
Originally posted by: marincounty

...

What's ironic about your post is: We won the cold war, without firing a shot. We bankrupted the Soviet Union, something the Marxists hadn't counted on.

Many shots were fired and people died.

It just was not a public war between the US and the USSR.

Civilian s & military personal were killed from both sides of the coin as well as from allies
Countries were destroyed in the use of proxies. via conflict, revolutions and economic policies.
 

WHAMPOM

Diamond Member
Feb 28, 2006
7,628
183
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Originally posted by: Vic
LOL! now even the Sun Tzu's The Art of War is supposed communist doctrine... what a fscking moron! :p :roll:

And they read the adventures of Sherlock Holmes to sharpen their analytical skills too.
 

BarrySotero

Banned
Apr 30, 2009
509
0
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Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
Any one else notice the new preponderance of 'cut-n-paste' topics without proper attribution or linkage?

The OP is strung together from 2 blogs: http://therealbarackobama.wordpress.com who then attributes their musings to http://newzeal.blogspot.com "a libertarian activist and political researcher from Christchurch New Zealand."

And what is with then attaching videos that have little if any relevance to the hack spam job ?

And what's also interesting is that these 'cut-n-paste' topics without proper attribution are generally months old without any relevance.

That is, the only relevance, really, is to pound the President with negativity (using those 'special' code words).


The videos are great because you can hear Van Jones radicalism in his own words. People can't contest that he is a radical Marxist because he says he is. He has no business working in a gov post when he could not pass a FBI check.


Van Jones and the Apollo Alliance uniting of SEIU, ACORN, enviro and political groups under SOROS and Obama is full of other radicals like Jones and corrupting influences.

The New York chapter of the Apollo Alliance is run by another former Weatherman Jeff Jones.

"Jeff Jones' bio on the Apollo website boasts the activist campaigned to remove PCBs from the Hudson River, clean up toxic pollution in inner-city and rural neighborhoods, and reverse global warming .

The bio states that from 1995-2005, Jeff Jones served as the communications director of Environmental Advocates of New York. Previously, he was a reporter covering state politics and policy for a variety of news organizations.

Not mentioned is that Jeff Jones was a leading anti-war activist and terrorist group founder who spent time on the run from law enforcement agencies while his group carried out a series of bombings of U.S. government buildings.

Jeff Jones joined the Students for a Democratic Society, or SDS, from which the Weathermen splintered in the fall of 1965. Two years later, he became the SDS's New York City regional director, a position in which he participated in nearly all of the group's major protests until 1969, including the 1968 Columbia University protests and the violent riots that same year at the Democratic National Convention.

In 1969, Jeff Jones founded the Weathermen with terrorists Bill Ayers and Mark Rudd when the three signed an infamous statement calling for a revolution against the American government inside and outside the country to fight and defeat what the group called U.S. imperialism. President Obama came under fire for his longtime, extensive association with Ayers.

Jeff Jones was a main leader and orchestrator of what became known as the Days of Rage, a series of violent riots in Chicago organized by the Weathermen. The culmination of the riots came when he gave a signal for rowdy protestors to target a hotel that was the home of a local judge presiding over a trial of anti-war activists.

Jeff Jones went underground after he failed to appear for a March 1970 court date to face charges of "crossing state lines to foment a riot and conspiring to do so." He moved to San Francisco with Ayers' wife, Bernardine Dorhn. That year, at least one bombing claimed by the Weathermen went off in Jones' locale at the Presidio Army base."

There is a serious rise of radical left elements that are tied directly to Soros, foreign influences, Obama and a Who's Who of radical agitiators. Beck is the only one calling out about this issue and Jones and other have gone after him for reporting what is true.


http://ednews.org/articles/oba...th-terror-founder.html

 

JKing106

Platinum Member
Mar 19, 2009
2,193
0
0
Originally posted by: GeezerMan
It's either fascism or socialism we are heading to, or a bit of both.

"He sees urban youth "putting down the handgun and picking up the caulk gun". They will become new green entrepreneurs - fighting pollution and poverty at the same time. Jones even speaks of making solar boom boxes."


This should be a Saturday Night Live skit. Too funny...

We're already fascists. The corporations run the country. Where have you been?
 

ZeGermans

Banned
Dec 14, 2004
907
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A bunch of people in here that have never met a single person that ever lived under marxism in their lives talking like experts. As anyone in former bloc countries that have now been sufficiently raped by capitalist ventures if they'd rather go back to communism. They put the ability to eat over the ability to criticize the government.
 

PJABBER

Diamond Member
Feb 8, 2001
4,822
0
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Originally posted by: ZeGermans
A bunch of people in here that have never met a single person that ever lived under marxism in their lives talking like experts. As anyone in former bloc countries that have now been sufficiently raped by capitalist ventures if they'd rather go back to communism. They put the ability to eat over the ability to criticize the government.

I have met many and I can tell you that you have no idea what you are talking about.

No country has been governed under the principles of Marxism. That is a clear impossibility for totalitarianism does not adhere to the idealistic but ultimately ineffective economic and political principles of Marxism, even in states in transition from one economic/political form to another. And a viable political economics theory is what Marx and Engels were shooting in their joint work, broadly misunderstood by both adherents and detractors in their time and even more so in the present.

Marxism-Leninism is more accurately the term used to describe what has actually been attempted, unsuccessfully and at the cost of millions of lives around the world.

Many have suffered under Hitlerism, Leninism, Stalinism, Maoism, Castroism, Bolivarianism and a whole host of other totalitarian variants spawned by egoistic dictatorships, usually as a result of a weakened populace suffering from war, poverty and disintegration of societal mores seeking a respite from self determination.

There were people in the gulags that defended Stalin even as they were killed in his name. Victims often identify with those that have power over them. Don't mistake Stockholm syndrome or gulag syndrome with rational thought. You should read authors such as Aleksandr Isayevich Solzhenitsyn and works such as his The Gulag Archipelago and One Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovich to get a glimpse of reality, instead of the comic books you seem to base your opinions on.

The more we accept defenses of totalitarianism, such as you and your friends offer, the closer we come to allowing ourselves to be subject.

You are intellectually vapid, sitting in front of your computer spewing nonsense with no life experience worth noting. You are joined by fellow travelers who would be the first to be imprisoned if the government becomes what you wish it to be, as your utility will be done with, but your annoyance will remain.

BTW, the closest I have seen to an actual recounting of what happened in Russia before and after their revolution is coming from TheRedUnderURBed, who, unfortunately, seems to buy into the failed ideology. Notwithstanding this flaw, he is offering a fairly clear idea of what went on to get to the point of the statism of Stalin. Perhaps he can extend the offer of his knowledge beyond the theories of communism into a comment on what transpired after Stalin's death to the present and if there is any practical expectation that the theories of communism will be tested again. Possibly here, under current circumstances.