Vaccine mercury not linked to autism

[Schadenfroh]

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE68C1CZ20100913

A new government study adds to the evidence that thimerosal, a mercury-based preservative until recently found in many vaccines, does not increase children's risk of autism

This is good news, but I think the damage has already been done. The debate even has a scary element's name in it, so it only adds to the irrational fear. Hopefully, the anti-science lobby will not succeed in having more and more children not receive their vaccinations and thus pose a risk to themselves and others.

The consequences of fear mongering cannot be overemphasized.

Concerns about a link between vaccines and autism were first raised more than a decade ago by British physician Andrew Wakefield.

His report, based on 12 children, has since been discredited and was retracted earlier this year by the journal that published it. In the meantime, it sparked a fierce worldwide debate among scientists and a health scare that caused many parents to shy away from recommended vaccines like the one against measles, mumps and rubella.

Outbreaks of all three diseases followed.

I cannot help but see a similarity between this and the current anti-science interests attacking GMOs. If the anti-science crowd succeeds in having unnecessary GMO warning labels attached to foods that are proven safe, farmers will be forced to switch back to less hardy strains rather than moving towards superior GMOs due to irrational consumer fear and one day there will be another blight that genetic engineering could have prevented.

 

[Fear No Evil]

This must be the same anti-science lobby that is against nuclear energy as well.

 

[surfsatwerk]

But I'm worried! We need to bring march of progress to a screeching halt until I feel more comfortable with all this stuff.

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

This study compared a lot of exposure to a little bit of exposure. It only really shows that degree of exposure doesn't affect autism rates, not whether any exposure at all can lead to it. Not that I'm insisting there is a link (or dismissing the benefits of vaccines), but this doesn't necessarily disprove it.

And there are still a lot of unknowns with GMO's, with the real issue being no way to contain them once they're in the wild if a problem does come up down the road.

We are really quick to label things as a "certainty" when we really not all that certain at all. We just found out that the laws of physics may vary depending on where and when you are in the universe.

We need to be very careful with science stuff, unintended consequences and all that.
http://www.cracked.com/article_18503_how-biotech-company-almost-killed-world-with-booze.html

 

[cubby1223]

the anti-science lobby
...
anti-science interests
...
the anti-science crowd

No bias at all in this recap

But such is the idiots of ATP&N, if one does not attack every ounce of "the enemy's" existence, that means such person is in full 100% support of "the enemy" against you. So I suppose I should chant "Science rules! Those other idiots must be purged from the Earth lest they infect others with their harmful thought!!!"

 

[Craig234]

nm for now.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

The autism link has been debunked long ago but I have concerns about GMOs, not because I'm anti-science by any means. Kudzu? Starlings? Zebra mussels? Asian carp? Purple loosestrife?

Every one of these harmful organisms exist mucking up things in North America because they do not naturally exist here so there is no effective check on their populations.
When (not if) modified genetic material makes it into unintended organisms, what will be the result? What recall mechanism does anyone have in that scenario? There isn't one.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

But there are dp's.

 

[cubby1223]

This must be the same anti-science lobby that is against nuclear energy as well.

And deep-sea oil drilling. Boy do they all have egg on their face now! Science capped that BP well so fast barely had any impact on the environment.

 

[Moonbeam]

I just don't see the problem with human genes in my pork to improve the taste. And why shouldn't cat meat taste like pussy.

 

[Throckmorton]

The medical community is partially to blame for allowing the fearmongering to happen, because instead of stopping the use of the mercury compound, they argued that it doesn't cause autism, ignoring the fact that mercury is a neurotoxin.

 

[Brainonska511]

The medical community is partially to blame for allowing the fearmongering to happen, because instead of stopping the use of the mercury compound, they argued that it doesn't cause autism, ignoring the fact that mercury is a neurotoxin.

Except thiomersal is not mercury. It's a mercury compound that metabolizes to ethylmercury and quickly leaves the body (does not bioaccumulate). Methylmercury is the compound found in fish that leads to mental deficiency if ingested in high amounts and it will linger in your body.

 

[dainthomas]

Except thiomersal is not mercury. It's a mercury compound that metabolizes to ethylmercury and quickly leaves the body (does not bioaccumulate). Methylmercury is the compound found in fish that leads to mental deficiency if ingested in high amounts and it will linger in your body.

I'm not sure what all those big words mean, but it sounds like sciency mumbo-jumbo to me! If Jesus didn't want people to get Polio, he wouldn't have created it!

And in other news, a study has confirmed that the Earth isn't supported on the back of a giant tortoise!

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Except thiomersal is not mercury. It's a mercury compound that metabolizes to ethylmercury and quickly leaves the body (does not bioaccumulate). Methylmercury is the compound found in fish that leads to mental deficiency if ingested in high amounts and it will linger in your body.

Perhaps the medical community knows more than AT experts? Shocking I tell you!

 

[Double Trouble]

GMO is a completely different issue than vaccinations, for many reasons, including what hayabusa stated.

 

[SunnyD]

I cannot help but see a similarity between this and the current anti-science interests attacking GMOs. If the anti-science crowd succeeds in having unnecessary GMO warning labels attached to foods that are proven safe, farmers will be forced to switch back to less hardy strains rather than moving towards superior GMOs due to irrational consumer fear and one day there will be another blight that genetic engineering could have prevented.

Prove it. You have a pace of hundreds of thousands of years of evolution versus a handful of years of GMO to compare to. Prove to me without a shadow of a doubt that human evolution will not be negatively impacted from the development and consumption of GMO's.

You can't.

So, why the hell fuck with what nature spent millions of years developing if it's not broken?

(I see the tangible short-term benefits of both vaccines and GMO, however yes, I can provide an argument against vaccines radically different from "fear mongering" that would be wildly unpopular with both sides of the fence, but I'll keep that one to myself.)

 

[Moonbeam]

The medical community is partially to blame for allowing the fearmongering to happen, because instead of stopping the use of the mercury compound, they argued that it doesn't cause autism, ignoring the fact that mercury is a neurotoxin.

Too much water will kill you. Too much Iodine too. Your argument isn't sound in my opinion because tiny amounts of stuff come in below the damage threshold and there were sound reasons for its use.

 

[Throckmorton]

Except thiomersal is not mercury. It's a mercury compound that metabolizes to ethylmercury and quickly leaves the body (does not bioaccumulate). Methylmercury is the compound found in fish that leads to mental deficiency if ingested in high amounts and it will linger in your body.

It may not bioaccumulate but it takes 14 days to clear from the brain according to wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thiomersal

Toxicology

Thiomersal is very toxic by inhalation, ingestion, and in contact with skin (EC hazard symbol T+), with a danger of cumulative effects. It is also very toxic to aquatic organisms and may cause long-term adverse effects in aquatic environments (EC hazard symbol N).[9] In the body, it is metabolized or degraded to ethylmercury (C2H5Hg+) and thiosalicylate.[3]

Few studies of the toxicity of thiomersal in humans have been performed. Cases have been reported of severe poisoning by accidental exposure or attempted suicide, with some fatalities.[10] Animal experiments suggest that thiomersal rapidly dissociates to release ethylmercury after injection; that the disposition patterns of mercury are similar to those after exposure to equivalent doses of ethylmercury chloride; and that the central nervous system and the kidneys are targets, with lack of motor coordination being a common sign. Similar signs and symptoms have been observed in accidental human poisonings. The mechanisms of toxic action are unknown. Fecal excretion accounts for most of the elimination from the body. Ethylmercury clears from blood with a half-life of about 18 days in adults. Ethylmercury clears from the brain in about 14 days in infant monkeys. Inorganic mercury metabolized from ethylmercury has a much longer clearance, at least 120 days; it appears to be much less toxic than the inorganic mercury produced from mercury vapor, for reasons not yet understood.[11]

Risk assessment for effects on the nervous system have been made by extrapolating from dose-response relationships for methylmercury.[11] Methylmercury and ethylmercury distributes to all body tissues, crossing the blood-brain barrier and the placental barrier, and ethylmercury also moves freely throughout the body.[12] Concerns based on extrapolations from methylmercury caused thiomersal to be removed from U.S. childhood vaccines, starting in 1999. Since then, it has been found that ethylmercury is cleared from the body and the brain significantly faster than methylmercury, so the late-1990s risk assessments turned out to be overly conservative.[11]

 

[Acanthus]

14 days is actually quite low, look at Pb. Which is 40 days or more.

 

[bfdd]

I honestly don't even care if there was a small risk to some children in these vaccinations. It would still be worth vaccinating the population and killing off the virus/bacteria/disease.

 

[daishi5]

14 days is actually quite low, look at Pb. Which is 40 days or more.

I am not certain if he is arguing that it is or is not dangerous. He seems to be saying it is dangerous, but his link discusses how it leaves the body naturally. Almost any substance is poisonous in high enough doses, and this is no exception, but if it leaves the body naturally and is given in small enough doses to not cause harm, I don't see a problem.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

It may not bioaccumulate but it takes 14 days to clear from the brain according to wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thiomersal

Would you explain the clinical significance of that? How much Thimersol would there be in an injection?

MSDS:
http://www.conncoll.edu/offices/envhealth/MSDS/neuroscience/thimerosal.pdf

You'll see that it's listed as toxic to skin, but it was used before 1930's topically as Merthiolate without problems.

Everything has a context and you have to know what it is.

 

[Moonbeam]

Would you explain the clinical significance of that? How much Thimersol would there be in an injection?

MSDS:
http://www.conncoll.edu/offices/envhealth/MSDS/neuroscience/thimerosal.pdf

You'll see that it's listed as toxic to skin, but it was used before 1930's topically as Merthiolate without problems.

Everything has a context and you have to know what it is.

I wish bad ideas left after 14 days.

 

[BoberFett]

I wish bad ideas left after 14 days.

It's a nice thought Moonie, but we'd all miss your crazy, drugged up diatribes.

 

[shira]

This must be the same anti-science lobby that is against nuclear energy as well.

No. It's the same anti-science, head-in-the-sand crowd that denies man-made climate change.