Utah demands land surrendered from Fedgov by Dec 31

[IronWing]

I think that's a fair solution too.

Maybe have some perks for residents of Utah to get a pre-sale before it opens up to the nation.

It's certainly better than the federal government maintaining all that land.

So since you choose not to avail yourself of opportunities to enjoy your public lands you wish to deprive other all Americans of these opportunities. How selfish of you.

 

[lozina]

So since you choose not to avail yourself of opportunities to enjoy your public lands you wish to deprive other all Americans of these opportunities. How selfish of you.

Bravo, spoken like a true socialist.

Have the collective pay for things they dont need or want for your benefit :thumbsup:

 

[Bowfinger]

Bravo, spoken like a true socialist.

Have the collective pay for things they dont need or want for your benefit :thumbsup:

/facepalm

God grief, you kids need to get over screeching "socialism" about everything you don't like. It just makes you look ignorant. Nothing government does benefits everyone. That is not the point. The whole purpose of government is to collectively do those things society as a whole needs or wants, even though individual needs and wants vary.

The lands in question belong to the public -- ALL Americans. That the State of Utah craves a golden goose is their problem, not ours.

 

[lozina]

/facepalm

God grief, you kids need to get over screeching "socialism" about everything you don't like. It just makes you look ignorant. Nothing government does benefits everyone. That is not the point. The whole purpose of government is to collectively do those things society as a whole needs or wants, even though individual needs and wants vary.

The lands in question belong to the public -- ALL Americans. That the State of Utah craves a golden goose is their problem, not ours.

so·cial·ism
ˈsōSHəˌlizəm/Submit
noun
a political and economic theory of social organization that advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole. Socialism is a social and economic system characterised by social ownership

Most of the country = private land the way our nation was designed. Capitalism.

It's funny how you are ashamed by what you believe in.

 

[IronWing]

Bravo, spoken like a true socialist.

Have the collective pay for things they dont need or want for your benefit :thumbsup:

Why do you hate freedom?

Collectivism built the west. Railroads, canals, mines, highways, dams, the power grid all the result of collective action. Despite the movie images, very little in the west got built through individualism. Government, corporations, and collectives (irrigation districts, Mormon communities, power cooperatives, etc.) got shit done.

 

[lozina]

Why do you hate freedom?

http://www.summitpost.org/public-and-private-land-percentages-by-us-states/186111

Why do you hate the top 37 states in our nation with >70% private land ownership ?

 

[IronWing]

http://www.summitpost.org/public-and-private-land-percentages-by-us-states/186111

Why do you hate the top 37 states in our nation with >70% private land ownership ?

And each person in every one of those states has ownership in the public lands and you, because you hate freedom, want to deprive those people of their birthright to enjoy their public lands. You should be ashamed of your own selfishness.

 

[Bowfinger]

Most of the country = private land the way our nation was designed. Capitalism.

Given that these lands being public dates back to the earliest days of our nation, this is pure nonsense.

It's funny how you are ashamed by what you believe in.

It's funny how you can't read your own definition: "a political and economic theory of social organization that advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole." Socialism is a system where the government owns the means of production, like factories, farms, etc. It has absolutely zero to do with the government owning land. You are simply wrong.

Let's also note that you completely ignored my key point: nothing government does benefits everyone. That's because you don't have the foggiest clue what you're talking about, and are just parroting random wing-nut talking points.

 

[lozina]

Given that these lands being public dates back to the earliest days of our nation, this is pure nonsense.



It's funny how you can't read your own definition: "a political and economic theory of social organization that advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole." Socialism is a system where the government owns the means of production, like factories, farms, etc. It has absolutely zero to do with the government owning land. You are simply wrong.

Let's also note that you completely ignored my key point: nothing government does benefits everyone. That's because you don't have the foggiest clue what you're talking about, and are just parroting random wing-nut talking points.

So, are you a closet socialist in denial or do you just not realize that what you believe in is socialism?

Notice how it goes from private ownership in capitalism, to collective ownership [by the people] in socialism then to complete state ownership in communism?


If you'd like, I can rent you a backhoe for you to dig yourself into a hole faster

 

[bshole]

So, are you a closet socialist in denial or do you just not realize that what you believe in is socialism?

The entire western world is socialist and has been for a century now. The closest thing to capitalism in the world currently is China. There the profiteering capitalists are allowed to rape the environment and their labor force. Socialism is a FANTASTIC thing and I embrace it enthusiastically. Unfettered capitalism is an evil on society and must be controlled by a strong central SOCIALIST government like America has.

 

[trenchfoot]

So, are you a closet socialist in denial or do you just not realize that what you believe in is socialism?

Notice how it goes from private ownership in capitalism, to collective ownership [by the people] in socialism then to complete state ownership in communism?


If you'd like, I can rent you a backhoe for you to dig yourself into a hole faster

Irony.

Check please!

 

[Bowfinger]

So, are you a closet socialist in denial or do you just not realize that what you believe in is socialism?

[ self-serving propaganda clipped ]

Notice how it goes from private ownership in capitalism, to collective ownership [by the people] in socialism then to complete state ownership in communism?


If you'd like, I can rent you a backhoe for you to dig yourself into a hole faster

Yawn. The fact that you think some blowhard's partisan blog qualifies as educational material explains why you are so stubbornly ignorant. We've seen that throughout this thread, where one person after another has cited facts refuting your talking points, but you ignore them. Get well soon.

 

[lozina]

The entire western world is socialist and has been for a century now. The closest thing to capitalism in the world currently is China. There the profiteering capitalists are allowed to rape the environment and their labor force. Socialism is a FANTASTIC thing and I embrace it enthusiastically. Unfettered capitalism is an evil on society and must be controlled by a strong central SOCIALIST government like America has.

Yes, I concede that pure capitalism has some nasty consequences. But I certainly lean more towards a system where hard work and determination is rewarded instead of laziness and crooks reaping the benefits of the people.

 

[lozina]

Yawn. The fact that you think some blowhard's partisan blog qualifies as educational material explains why you are so stubbornly ignorant. We've seen that throughout this thread, where one person after another has cited facts refuting your talking points, but you ignore them. Get well soon.

Yes, that must be it. All the literature explaining ownership in the socialist system are lies. Wikipedia, text books, quotes from socialist advocates. All lies.

 

[IronWing]

Yes, I concede that pure capitalism has some nasty consequences. But I certainly lean more towards a system where hard work and determination is rewarded instead of laziness and crooks reaping the benefits of the people.

Yet in this very thread you advocate turning over the public lands to crooks at the expense of the people.

 

[lozina]

Yet in this very thread you advocate turning over the public lands to crooks at the expense of the people.

So are you saying that in the 37 states with private land ownership > 70%, most of that land is owned by crooks?

 

[CitizenKain]

Yes, I concede that pure capitalism has some nasty consequences. But I certainly lean more towards a system where hard work and determination is rewarded instead of laziness and crooks reaping the benefits of the people.

Hahahaahhahaahahahah.

 

[lozina]

Hahahaahhahaahahahah.

reaping the benefits of the [industrious] people

my hands don't write as fast as I think. sue me.

 

[IronWing]

So are you saying that in the 37 states with private land ownership > 70%, most of that land is owned by crooks?

No silly. I'm saying that Utah politicians want to give away the public lands to their cronies. And here you are, a New Yorker who knows jack shit about your public lands, advocating for the grand looting. When folks here tried to correct your erroneous assumptions you scream "Socialism" like you're a 50s throwback aspie stuck on stupid.

 

[lozina]

No silly. I'm saying that Utah politicians want to give away the public lands to their cronies.

Because some Green Peace equivalent leftist organization claims that they would?

 

[IronWing]

Because some Green Peace equivalent leftist organization claims that they would?

No, because Utah politicians claim they would.

 

[lozina]

No, because Utah politicians claim they would.

It seems you either misunderstood something or are deliberately sensationalizing.

No one is planning on "giving away the land to cronies".

 

[Bowfinger]

Yes, that must be it. All the literature

All the literature? Lulz. You didn't cite all the literature. You cited one random blowhard's blog that told you what you wanted to hear. It was empty propaganda. Do you have anything on-topic and credible to offer?

explaining ownership in the socialist system are lies.

Repeating your same tired lies doesn't make them more true. The basic principle of socialism is government ownership of the means of production, distribution, and payment ... which I already said. In other words, in socialism government owns the economy, or at least its primary components. It still has nothing to do with government owning land. You. Are. Wrong. Period.

Wikipedia, text books, quotes from socialist advocates. All lies.

Yawn. If only you had cited them instead of your nutter blog. For that matter, if only you actually read some of them instead of guzzling wing-nut propaganda. Get well soon.

 

[lozina]

All the literature? Lulz. You didn't cite all the literature. You cited one random blowhard's blog that told you what you wanted to hear. It was empty propaganda. Do you have anything on-topic and credible to offer?


Repeating your same tired lies doesn't make them more true. The basic principle of socialism is government ownership of the means of production, distribution, and payment ... which I already said. In other words, in socialism government owns the economy, or at least its primary components. It still has nothing to do with government owning land. You. Are. Wrong. Period.


Yawn. If only you had cited them instead of your nutter blog. For that matter, if only you actually read some of them instead of guzzling wing-nut propaganda. Get well soon.

OMG I cannot believe you are being serious, there is no way.

http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/551569/socialism

Socialism, social and economic doctrine that calls for public rather than private ownership or control of property and natural resources

Honestly, did you not know this or are you being a huge troll?

 

[Bowfinger]

OMG I cannot believe you are being serious, there is no way.

http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/551569/socialism

Honestly, did you not know this or are you being a huge troll?

I know reading is hard, but if you could then work your way down the article, all the way down to the second paragraph:

"This conviction puts socialism in opposition to capitalism, which is based on private ownership of the means of production and allows individual choices in a free market to determine how goods and services are distributed. ..."
​

Honestly, are you a deliberate liar or just a half-witted clown?

Will there be anything else? Any other credible sources you can't bother to comprehend?