USC Professor: We're seeing a second civil war

[umbrella39]

Someone cut this guy off, would Ya ?

I think he's had too much.

What do you expect from a conservaterrorist apologist...

 

[Jhhnn]

A typical liberal would ask me a rational question. What real advantages are there? Why would real advantages be on the radar of any conservatives? Their gig is denial of reality.

I get that. I just try to put it on their radar in a way where they're motivated to think it through on their own, to reconcile contradictory beliefs rather than compartmentalizing them.

 

[glenn1]

So, after you flip the rest of us us off in a big way, then what happens? What's the real advantage?

Self determination. For better or worse, people don't want to live under laws or submit to a culture they hate. Even if the overlap with the other country is 98% that last 2 percent is a big deal, see Irish republicans or the Quebec separatists for example.

 

[Victorian Gray]

"Hater"? You're the one getting excited over the thought of people being killed at a political convention. Get some perspective, jihadi.

You really should stick to the 'ethics in gaming journalism' stuff.

 

[Jhhnn]

Self determination. For better or worse, people don't want to live under laws or submit to a culture they hate. Even if the overlap with the other country is 98% that last 2 percent is a big deal, see Irish republicans or the Quebec separatists for example.

Exquisitely vague. Self determination to correct what deficiencies, exactly? What sort of oppression does the larger culture exercise over you? Or is it that we're too free?

 

[glenn1]

Exquisitely vague. Self determination to correct what deficiencies, exactly? What sort of oppression does the larger culture exercise over you? Or is it that we're too free?

That depends on who you talk to. For some I guess it's lack of a wall along the border. For others it's the fact that "the rich" are allowed to keep an intolerable amount of their money from the tax man. Go ask someone in a Tea Party rally and another in a "We are the 99% rally" what their wants and needs are and I'm sure you'll find your answer to what those "deficiencies" are. The one would never agree to submit to the ideas of the other and vice versa.

 

[stormkroe]

moderation in all things

except P&N

Mod callout. Bandable offense.

:awe:

 

[Jhhnn]

That depends on who you talk to. For some I guess it's lack of a wall along the border. For others it's the fact that "the rich" are allowed to keep an intolerable amount of their money from the tax man. Go ask someone in a Tea Party rally and another in a "We are the 99% rally" what their wants and needs are and I'm sure you'll find your answer to what those "deficiencies" are. The one would never agree to submit to the ideas of the other and vice versa.

Nice dance. You haven't answered the question at all. None of that explains the desire for state level secession. The Tea Party only holds ~50 widely spread HOR districts out of 438, for example. It's not like secession fits the map.

A border wall won't stop illegals unless it's like the monstrous Israeli wall through Jerusalem. It would also have to run through a lot of private property & at least 1 Indian reservation. It'll be tied up in court for a decade. It's the xenophobe's version of a security blankie.

Potential secessionist states would likely shift the tax burdens further down the scale than they already are. Texas has no income tax & other conservative legislatures want to follow their lead.

 

[woolfe9998]

A border wall won't stop illegals unless it's like the monstrous Israeli wall through Jerusalem. It would also have to run through a lot of private property & at least 1 Indian reservation. It'll be tied up in court for a decade. It's the xenophobe's version of a security blankie.

Yeah, it would also require extensive use of eminent domain to acquire all this private property, which has already happened with the fencing they've been putting up and has been complained about by property owners in Texas. It's kind of ironic since conservatives have never been fond of the government taking people's private property from them. But I guess they'll make an exception if it will help keep Mexicans out. Though Trump is apparently in favor of eminent domain so he at least doesn't have a hypocrisy problem on this issue.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/09/trump-eminent-domain-attacks-right

As for the conservatives supporting him, they likely haven't even considered it.

 

[IronWing]

Yeah, it would also require extensive use of eminent domain to acquire all this private property, which has already happened with the fencing they've been putting up and has been complained about by property owners in Texas. It's kind of ironic since conservatives have never been fond of the government taking people's private property from them. But I guess they'll make an exception if it will help keep Mexicans out. Though Trump is apparently in favor of eminent domain so he at least doesn't have a hypocrisy problem on this issue.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/09/trump-eminent-domain-attacks-right

As for the conservatives supporting him, they likely haven't even considered it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roosevelt_Reservation

It takes care of most of NM, AZ, and CA. Since TX didn't have much original public domain land, it probably doesn't have much impact there.

 

[MagickMan]

You really should stick to the 'ethics in gaming journalism' stuff.

Poor #Triggered Jihadi.

 

[Victorian Gray]

Poor #Triggered Jihadi.

That's it. Continue to clutch those pearls. Fucking hilarious.

 

[Ventanni]

There's no second civil war about to happen. My goodness would that be a terrible thing for the world; the US ignites into civil war, and you bet every country and their mother would begin to make territorial moves knowing that Uncle Sam isn't around to stop them.

I don't have an exact science on this, but I know and have watched people enough that I think I'm on the right track here. People who talk about terrible things like the US economy crashing, the igniting of a second civil war, and ISIS being the beginning of the apocalypse blah blah blah are really talking about these kinds of things because they've chosen to live in a world of fear, and in order to live in fear, you have to have something to justify you living in that. It's like people actually *want* there to be a second civil war or a massive worldwide economy collapse, because that would actually justify them living that way. It's all fear based, and it's sick.

But more importantly, it's also extremely cowardly. For the sake of discussion, I'll keep it to local and national issues, but allow me to explain. I find that people who worry about things like a second US civil war erupting because Trump might get elected would rather lay back and let these type of events happen rather than address the real issue, and I'm going to be blunt when I say this; America, as a whole, cares more about what goes on with America's Got Talent and the Kardashians than they do what happens on city council. I don't know how many times I hear or read people blame Obama for something that I'm thinking to myself, "Wait a minute, isn't that a city council decision?"

People want freedom, but real freedom can only happen when people properly govern themselves.

 

[glenn1]

Nice dance. You haven't answered the question at all. None of that explains the desire for state level secession. The Tea Party only holds ~50 widely spread HOR districts out of 438, for example. It's not like secession fits the map.

A border wall won't stop illegals unless it's like the monstrous Israeli wall through Jerusalem. It would also have to run through a lot of private property & at least 1 Indian reservation. It'll be tied up in court for a decade. It's the xenophobe's version of a security blankie.

Potential secessionist states would likely shift the tax burdens further down the scale than they already are. Texas has no income tax & other conservative legislatures want to follow their lead.

I don't think what you're seeking is possible; you want me to explain to YOUR satisfaction what a "proper" justification for secession would be. What you think about it doesn't matter, either they have the votes for it or not and if they do your opinion over how "correct" their cause or rationale is means jack squat. That would be the entire point, that they DON'T give a fuck about what you think or what laws or policy they'd proceed to implement as they'd be their own independent country. The desire quite frankly would be to get away from people like you.

 

[Jhhnn]

I don't think what you're seeking is possible; you want me to explain to YOUR satisfaction what a "proper" justification for secession would be. What you think about it doesn't matter, either they have the votes for it or not and if they do your opinion over how "correct" their cause or rationale is means jack squat. That would be the entire point, that they DON'T give a fuck about what you think or what laws or policy they'd proceed to implement as they'd be their own independent country. The desire quite frankly would be to get away from people like you.

In other words, the reason really is just to give the finger to the rest of America, like I said.

Have you considered that might be a little short sighted?

 

[Jhhnn]

There's no second civil war about to happen. My goodness would that be a terrible thing for the world; the US ignites into civil war, and you bet every country and their mother would begin to make territorial moves knowing that Uncle Sam isn't around to stop them.

I don't have an exact science on this, but I know and have watched people enough that I think I'm on the right track here. People who talk about terrible things like the US economy crashing, the igniting of a second civil war, and ISIS being the beginning of the apocalypse blah blah blah are really talking about these kinds of things because they've chosen to live in a world of fear, and in order to live in fear, you have to have something to justify you living in that. It's like people actually *want* there to be a second civil war or a massive worldwide economy collapse, because that would actually justify them living that way. It's all fear based, and it's sick.

But more importantly, it's also extremely cowardly. For the sake of discussion, I'll keep it to local and national issues, but allow me to explain. I find that people who worry about things like a second US civil war erupting because Trump might get elected would rather lay back and let these type of events happen rather than address the real issue, and I'm going to be blunt when I say this; America, as a whole, cares more about what goes on with America's Got Talent and the Kardashians than they do what happens on city council. I don't know how many times I hear or read people blame Obama for something that I'm thinking to myself, "Wait a minute, isn't that a city council decision?"

People want freedom, but real freedom can only happen when people properly govern themselves.

I think you're right, for the most part. The whole thing about Trump is a veiled threat as to what will happen if he's *not* elected, not what might happen if he is. The latter looks more like brown shirts against brown people than civil war to me.

 

[sm625]

Trump represents a threat to at least $300 billion in annual corporate profits. Perhaps much more. That's all this is. The hate stems from that. He is a threat to the backroom dealing that has wrecked this country for decades if not longer. From weapons contractors to drug companies/cartels to the welfare state... he is a wildcard that threatens these people in a way that none of the other candidates do, so they attack him. They want someone who wont touch any of it. But how do you really fix anything without touching these sacred cows? Well, obviously you dont. And that is good for a lot of people. If you look at the things he's said over the years, only a dumbed down fool would claim that all he will do is try to build a wall.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqA2Hs5dTFM

 

[MongGrel]

Mod callout. Bandable offense.

:awe:

I had to grin a little.

()

 

[MongGrel]

I spent ages describing the CBD and the LBD to both sides with equal results. But the descriptions I gave are the result of scientific studies that are based on fact. I don't vacillate, you simply do not know the science. Look for a video of Bill Moyers interviewing Johnathan Height. It will teach you things you never imagined.

:hmm:

 

[MongGrel]

Trump represents a threat to at least $300 billion in annual corporate profits. Perhaps much more. That's all this is. The hate stems from that. He is a threat to the backroom dealing that has wrecked this country for decades if not longer. From weapons contractors to drug companies/cartels to the welfare state... he is a wildcard that threatens these people in a way that none of the other candidates do, so they attack him. They want someone who wont touch any of it. But how do you really fix anything without touching these sacred cows? Well, obviously you dont. And that is good for a lot of people. If you look at the things he's said over the years, only a dumbed down fool would claim that all he will do is try to build a wall.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqA2Hs5dTFM

Drumpf is a con man who has always been one, and is feeding off of anything he knows he can get away with.

Many people seem to be slurping that up.

 

[OutHouse]

Do you agree with this?

no, but I will agree that you are a idiot.

 

[Jhhnn]

Trump represents a threat to at least $300 billion in annual corporate profits. Perhaps much more. That's all this is. The hate stems from that. He is a threat to the backroom dealing that has wrecked this country for decades if not longer. From weapons contractors to drug companies/cartels to the welfare state... he is a wildcard that threatens these people in a way that none of the other candidates do, so they attack him. They want someone who wont touch any of it. But how do you really fix anything without touching these sacred cows? Well, obviously you dont. And that is good for a lot of people. If you look at the things he's said over the years, only a dumbed down fool would claim that all he will do is try to build a wall.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqA2Hs5dTFM

One thing I'm sure of is that he'll cut taxes at the tippy-top with a Repub Congress. He's all trickledown all the time.

Shee-it, Sherlock- Repubs want EITC for billionaires. We can just call it the investment income tax credit, sell off public lands to pay for it.

 

[glenn1]

In other words, the reason really is just to give the finger to the rest of America, like I said.

Have you considered that might be a little short sighted?

Yeah, that's the thing about voting; people can use it for things that you dislike such as "giving the finger to the rest of America" and you still need to honor the results. There would not be another civil war if another seccession vote happened and whether you consider it short sighted or not doesn't matter.

 

[rudder]

https://soundcloud.com/so-that-happened-1/is-donald-trump-a-fascist (listen starting at 24 mins in)



Do you agree with this?

I hope it doesn't get as crazy like civil war crazy.. I'd much rather let them go and form their own country than have a second war.

Yes it is all due to Trump. Nothing at all to do with years of hateful rhetoric from the obama administration and the main stream media.

 

[Jhhnn]

Yes it is all due to Trump. Nothing at all to do with years of hateful rhetoric from the obama administration and the main stream media.

Oh, God! The unbearable persecution of being a straight white American male! The Horror!

Lepers got nuthin' on that!