US Gun Production Sets Another New Record

[BUnit1701]

Gotta find your news outside the right wing bubble sometimes, brotha.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...giffords-says-americans-overwhelmingly-suppo/

LMAO you can cite polls until your blue in the face, it doesn't change the FACT that millions of Americans wrote Congress to tell them no.

 

[Daverino]

LMAO, riiight, that's why the House got millions of letters, calls, and e-mails telling them to reject the legislation. Try again.

A million Americans is still .3% of the population. . . you do know that right?

 

[rudeguy]

You know that statistics doesn't require too much more than about a thousand people to be polled in order to accurately describe what those 240 million people think as a whole, right?

He said 80-90% of America was polled. I am questioning those numbers.

Also, we all know that polls suck. The questions can be made to fit the agenda of the person asking the question. Which is what usually happens.

 

[BUnit1701]

Would expanded background checks prevented Sandy Hook? No. Are they a good idea? Yeah. Is that a piece of common sense gun control that the country has been lacking and doesn't interfere with a citizen's legitimate right to bear arms? Yes.

Now, please explain how the invasion of Iraq could have prevented the destruction of the Twin Towers.

It wouldn't have. Good job, we have found two cases of the government exploiting the people. If you open your eyes, I'll bet we can find a whole bunch more.

 

[Newell Steamer]

Twist: Obama is the 49% stakeholder in every gun making company. And, said stakes are held under an entity,.. registered in KENYA.

O.O

 

[fskimospy]

He said 80-90% of America was polled. I am questioning those numbers.

Also, we all know that polls suck. The questions can be made to fit the agenda of the person asking the question. Which is what usually happens.

Actually he said '80-90% of the nation polled' which in that context pretty clearly meant 80-90% of those in the nation that were polled. It's a valid grammatical construction.

Also, polls don't suck. Polls made by partisan organizations frequently suck due to question bias and other reasons, but polls from numerous, independent, reputable pollsters all showed overwhelming support for expanded background checks. Overwhelming.

 

[BUnit1701]

A million Americans is still .3% of the population. . . you do know that right?

Which coincidentally is more than the number polled. But that small groups opinion gets to be considered EVERYONES opinion. Isn't that handy.

 

[thraashman]

Actually he said '80-90% of the nation polled' which in that context pretty clearly meant 80-90% of those in the nation that were polled. It's a valid grammatical construction.

Also, polls don't suck. Polls made by partisan organizations frequently suck due to question bias and other reasons, but polls from numerous, independent, reputable pollsters all showed overwhelming support for expanded background checks. Overwhelming.

Thank you to eskimospy for having reading comprehension skills. I am simply not patient enough to deal with him, so I leave it to you. You're doing a good job so far.

 

[Daverino]

so you can't defend your position so you go for the personal attack. Its like a bad version of Groundhog's Day with you people.

Please don't.

If you honestly think that we need to poll 240 million Americans to have a statistically valid poll, you're just showing yourself woefully bad at math. That has nothing to do with gun control and everything to do with taking a college level statistics course.

Pauline Kael was a New York City socialite who famously said after Nixon's election, "I live in a rather special world. I only know one person who voted for Nixon." Please don't presume that the whole of America agrees with you on anything, solely based on what you know from your own community. This is why I feel that Fox and MSNBC provide a disservice to Americans. Their business models are based around reinforcing their viewer's already held beliefs to hold viewers and get advertising dollars. In the process, they convince people that their views are held universally throughout our society, regardless of whether its true.

 

[fskimospy]

LMAO you can cite polls until your blue in the face, it doesn't change the FACT that millions of Americans wrote Congress to tell them no.

lol. "I don't care what the facts are, I know what I know". This is what you get from living in the right wing bubble. Inconvenient information is discarded if it threatens your beliefs.

 

[unokitty]

Twist: Obama is the 49% stakeholder in every gun making company. And, said stakes are held under an entity,.. registered in KENYA. O.O

Can't speak about anyone else's investments.

But its clear that alot of people have made alot of money by investing in the weapons industry prior to Obama's inauguration.

Irregardless of your political beliefs, its clear that Obama has had a very positive effect on the value of companies involved weapons manufacturing.

Uno

 

[Daverino]

Which coincidentally is more than the number polled. But that small groups opinion gets to be considered EVERYONES opinion. Isn't that handy.

The laws of probability are a harsh mistress to those who dislike the outcomes.

 

[fskimospy]

Which coincidentally is more than the number polled. But that small groups opinion gets to be considered EVERYONES opinion. Isn't that handy.

You know how scientific polling works, right? 1,000 people scientifically polled is exponentially more valid and accurate than a million people writing in. Of course the opinion of 1,000 or so people is considered the opinion of the nation as a whole. That's how math works. If you have a problem with this, go take it up with the central limit theorem.

This chart may help:

 

[thraashman]

Can't speak about anyone else's investments.

But its clear that alot of people have made alot of money by investing in the weapons industry prior to Obama's inauguration.

Irregardless of your political beliefs, its clear that Obama has had a very positive effect on the value of companies involved weapons manufacturing.

Uno

No one ever went poor overestimating the craziness of the far right.

 

[Genx87]

Expanded background checks are supported by a majority. Too bad the democrats muddied the water with wanting to restrict weapons that represent a small % of gun violence. And wanted to ban cosmetic features that have no bearing on the lethalness of the gun.

 

[BUnit1701]

You know how scientific polling works, right? 1,000 people scientifically polled is exponentially more valid and accurate than a million people writing in. Of course the opinion of 1,000 or so people is considered the opinion of the nation as a whole. That's how math works. If you have a problem with this, go take it up with the central limit theorem.

This chart may help:

I understand how polling works, and while it is useful and valid information, it is folly to conclude that it must be 100% true and accurate representation of everyone's opinions. I dont care how carefully those 1000 who are polled are picked, it is simply not possible for them to accurately represent everyone.

 

[fskimospy]

I understand how polling works, and while it is useful and valid information, it is folly to conclude that it must be 100% true and accurate representation of everyone's opinions. I dont care how carefully those 1000 who are polled are picked, it is simply not possible for them to accurately represent everyone.

I don't think you understand how polling works then. Not only is polling explicitly not about being 100% true, but there is no claim that any poll represents everyone. The polling sample is supposed to accurately represent the preferences of the population it was drawn from. This has been tested a lot. They do.

To be clearer, polling is most often reported at the 95% confidence interval, which means that the odds of the population's true preferences are 95% likely to fall within its margin of error. Considering the overwhelming results of those polls, even if you expand your confidence interval to 98% and above you still have massive majorities of Americans in favor of expanded background checks.

If you're simply talking about what the majority of Americans support however, a result that far from 50% means that the odds a majority of Americans support those expanded background checks is going to be somewhere around 99.999%.

Long story short, the polls are right. The support for those checks is absolutely overwhelming.

 

[thraashman]

Expanded background checks are supported by a majority. Too bad the democrats muddied the water with wanting to restrict weapons that represent a small % of gun violence. And wanted to ban cosmetic features that have no bearing on the lethalness of the gun.

This is quite true. The democrats very much shot too high for shit that was never going to get passed, would have had very limited to no effect, and helped sow the seeds of anger against the entire concept. If they had kept it simple, then they probably could have gotten increased background checks passed.

 

[Moonbeam]

I don't think you understand how polling works then. Not only is polling explicitly not about being 100% true, but there is no claim that any poll represents everyone. The polling sample is supposed to accurately represent the preferences of the population it was drawn from. This has been tested a lot. They do.

To be clearer, polling is most often reported at the 95% confidence interval, which means that the odds of the population's true preferences are 95% likely to fall within its margin of error. Considering the overwhelming results of those polls, even if you expand your confidence interval to 98% and above you still have massive majorities of Americans in favor of expanded background checks.

If you're simply talking about what the majority of Americans support however, a result that far from 50% means that the odds a majority of Americans support those expanded background checks is going to be somewhere around 99.999%.

Long story short, the polls are right. The support for those checks is absolutely overwhelming.

There is only one poll for the conservative and that is truthiness. He or she needs no poll. They are gifted with knowing the truth instinctively and science be damned. They rationalize away any data that contradicts their initial condition as we could see rudeguy do in this thread. The important thing for BUnit1701 is that millions of fine upstanding right thinking American people wrote their congressperson, that group think among imbeciles is intact and his ego is safely protected by an altered reality bubble mass denial.

If you manage to convince him that polls properly done accurately represent the population measured he will convince himself there is something wrong with that particular poll and when that is shown to be wrong he will realize that it's people themselves and their opinions that is mistaken, that background checks represent the thinking of crazy people. These delusional dimwits have been programmed and they are too filled with egotistical self flattery to admit it. They don't want to face the fact that Americans die because of the policies they believe in, that they are tools of an industry whose purpose is to make money by manipulating the opinions of those very millions who write to congress at their bidding.

 

[Doppel]

Gun manufacturers may pretend to hate liberals but they must privately love them. Gun sales have gone very high indeed in the last couple of years.

 

[highland145]

No one ever went poor overestimating the craziness of the far right.

The same can't be said for the opposite.


Solar panel, anyone?

 

[theeedude]

Can't speak about anyone else's investments.

But its clear that alot of people have made alot of money by investing in the weapons industry prior to Obama's inauguration.

Irregardless of your political beliefs, its clear that Obama has had a very positive effect on the value of companies involved weapons manufacturing.

Uno

Thanks for a short idea :thumbsup:

 

[K1052]

Gun manufacturers may pretend to hate liberals but they must privately love them. Gun sales have gone very high indeed in the last couple of years.

Obama (or more accurately the caricature presented by the GOP) has been fantastic for the firearms industry. It's like owning a cash printing press. Just say that the evil black muslim communist hippie is coming for your guns and the morons clear the shelves at their local gun stores. The hysteria whipped up by the NRA is cynical marketing on a grand scale.

 

[Genx87]

Obama (or more accurately the caricature presented by the GOP) has been fantastic for the firearms industry. It's like owning a cash printing press. Just say that the evil black muslim communist hippie is coming for your guns and the morons clear the shelves at their local gun stores. The hysteria whipped up by the NRA is cynical marketing on a grand scale.

Also it doesnt help when democrat politicians are lining up to ban scary black rifles, cosmetic features, and limit magazine sizes.

 

[boomerang]

Expanded background checks are supported by a majority. Too bad the democrats muddied the water with wanting to restrict weapons that represent a small % of gun violence. And wanted to ban cosmetic features that have no bearing on the lethalness of the gun.

They're never satisfied with just a piece of the pie, they want it all.