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US Airways Plane Crash in Hudson River

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Originally posted by: TangoJuliet
Crab - the departures of 31 turn right 340 or 359 degrees - away from the west side of NYC. BIGGY/ELIOT/PARKE are off to the West but that's almost an immediate left turn after departure

You're exactly right...I was thinking 4. They were landing 31. Looks they were assigned a heading of about 340-360 or so as you say. I'm curious to know where exactly they hit the birds.

Check out http://www4.passur.com/lga.html

Set it to 1525, and try and click on the green aircraft departing 4. Should be AWE1549.
 
Originally posted by: crab
Originally posted by: TangoJuliet
Crab - the departures of 31 turn right 340 or 359 degrees - away from the west side of NYC. BIGGY/ELIOT/PARKE are off to the West but that's almost an immediate left turn after departure

You're exactly right...I was thinking 4. They were landing 31. Looks they were assigned a heading of about 340-360 or so as you say. I'm curious to know where exactly they hit the birds.

Check out http://www4.passur.com/lga.html

Set it to 1525, and try and click on the green aircraft departing 4. Should be AWE1549.

That is an awesome website. I am bookmarking it.
 
Originally posted by: Ballatician
Originally posted by: jpeyton
Originally posted by: Ballatician
So there isn't any way to protect the engines from a bird strike like a screen?
A screen would only slice and dice the bird before it got fed to the engine.

Seems like that would help if it is a larger bird like a goose though right? Seems like smaller pieces wouldn't harm as much...

Actually whatever the object is would probably be sucked right through one of the holes anyway..

A video of when birds hit jet engines!

Bird strike

Bird strike is an aviation term for a collision between a bird and an aircraft. It is a common threat to aircraft safety and has caused a number of fatal accidents. In 1988 an Ethiopian Airlines Boeing 737 sucked pigeons into both engines during take-off and then crashed in an attempt to return to the Bahir Dar airport; of the 104 people aboard, 35 died and 21 were injured. In another incident in 1995, a Dassault Falcon 20 crashed at a Paris airport during an emergency landing attempt after sucking lapwings into an engine, which caused an engine failure and a fire in the airplane fuselage; all 10 people on board were killed.[35]

Modern jet engines have the capability of surviving an ingestion of a bird
. Small fast planes, such as military jet fighters, are at higher risk than big heavy multi-engine ones. This is due to the fact that the fan of a high-bypass turbofan engine, typical on transport aircraft, acts as a centrifugal separator to force ingested materials (birds, ice, etc.) to the outside of the fan's disc. As a result, such materials go through the relatively unobstructed bypass duct, rather than through the core of the engine, which contains the smaller and more delicate compressor blades. Military aircraft designed for high-speed flight typically have pure turbojet, or low-bypass turbofan engines, increasing the risk that ingested materials will get into the core of the engine to cause damage.

The highest risk of the bird strike is during the takeoff and landing, in low altitudes, which is in the vicinity of the airports.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jet_engine#Bird_strike
 
Originally posted by: crab
Originally posted by: TangoJuliet
Crab - the departures of 31 turn right 340 or 359 degrees - away from the west side of NYC. BIGGY/ELIOT/PARKE are off to the West but that's almost an immediate left turn after departure

You're exactly right...I was thinking 4. They were landing 31. Looks they were assigned a heading of about 340-360 or so as you say. I'm curious to know where exactly they hit the birds.

Check out http://www4.passur.com/lga.html

Set it to 1525, and try and click on the green aircraft departing 4. Should be AWE1549.

If they were departing 4 then its either runway heading or left turn 360 after departure. I'm pretty sure they were headed to ELIOT or PARKE which would be a left turn to 360 which would make complete sense as to where they ended up.

Departing 31 they would have had to make a right turn initially and then when the problem started decided on how to head back to the airport so if that was the case kudos to the pilot because the right turn would have taken them straight to the TNB.

When I looked at the METAR when the accident happened the wind was something like 31008 which would favor a depart 4 and land 31 config. However that all depends on the cloud cover/vis. Also the TAF favored a depart 31 land 22 config later on in the evening so I was guessing it was being setup in that way for the night shift.
 
Originally posted by: rh71
Originally posted by: GagHalfrunt
The pilot deserves a medal for his landing. That plane doesn't appear to be broken-up at all and has remained afloat for a VERY long time.

great job by him but you'd have to think many many pilots would have done the same. The difficulty of such a landing though - I can't say anything about that.

It's a one shot deal, and we have no idea how much power he was able to get out of either engine. Engines produce varying mounts of power after an event like that, depending on the damage. If it was truly a no power approach and landing, that was quite the job.:thumbsup:
With a wing loading of over 120 pounds per square foot, it will come down like the proverbial "toolbox with a broken handle". It would be a steep approach with a hell of a manuever at the end for any kind of flare.
 
I bet the airlines would have wished they died. I am sure they can't wait for the immense lawsuits coming from each and every passenger on that plane. Those passengers hit the lotto, just like the families of the people who died in the World Trade.
 
Originally posted by: skyking

It's a one shot deal, and we have no idea how much power he was able to get out of either engine. Engines produce varying mounts of power after an event like that, depending on the damage. If it was truly a no power approach and landing, that was quite the job.:thumbsup:
With a wing loading of over 120 pounds per square foot, it will come down like the proverbial "toolbox with a broken handle". It would be a steep approach with a hell of a manuever at the end for any kind of flare.

I was wondering when you'd chime in. Eye witness reports are a pretty high nose but those witnesses aren't pilots. My guess is the pilot looked for a place to dump and did it perfectly.

i.e. - he flared it and landed softly.

-edit-
When I say "looked for a place to dump" he had his outs already planned before takeoff.
 
Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: skyking

It's a one shot deal, and we have no idea how much power he was able to get out of either engine. Engines produce varying mounts of power after an event like that, depending on the damage. If it was truly a no power approach and landing, that was quite the job.:thumbsup:
With a wing loading of over 120 pounds per square foot, it will come down like the proverbial "toolbox with a broken handle". It would be a steep approach with a hell of a manuever at the end for any kind of flare.

I was wondering when you'd chime in. Eye witness reports are a pretty high nose but those witnesses aren't pilots. My guess is the pilot looked for a place to dump and did it perfectly.

i.e. - he flared it and landed softly.

I used to practice landings like this but we had tall trees on the ends of the runways so it was actually necessary. In that sense, I feel safer doing steep nose down approaches.
 
Originally posted by: amdhunter
I bet the airlines would have wished they died. I am sure they can't wait for the immense lawsuits coming from each and every passenger on that plane. Those passengers hit the lotto, just like the families of the people who died in the World Trade.
Good luck. Have you read the fine print accompanied with every airline ticket? The airline, pilot, and plane manufacturer is faultless when a bird flies into the engine.
 
Originally posted by: akshatp
Originally posted by: rh71
Originally posted by: GagHalfrunt
The pilot deserves a medal for his landing. That plane doesn't appear to be broken-up at all and has remained afloat for a VERY long time.

great job by him but you'd have to think many many pilots would have done the same. The difficulty of such a landing though - I can't say anything about that.

A medal? For doing his job? They are trained in what to do in emergency situations. He deserves an atta boy for a job well done, but at the end of the day he is just doing his job.

If I saved a server from crashing at work last week by detecting a HD that was going bad.. i wouldnt get so much as a thank you let alone a medal!

Youre a freakin moron.
He does deserve a medal.
The guy just saved 155 lives.
Survivors was talking about how they thought they were going to die.

Doing his job ??
Hmmmm...how many times have you seen anyone doing their job by gliding a plane with no engine into a river and everyone survived.
Doing his job is flying a plane not trying to figure out where to land a plane without a working engine.
There are thousands of pilots out there and 99.9% of them will never ever have to figure on how to land a plane without a working engine.
Just STFU !!

 
Originally posted by: GagHalfrunt
Originally posted by: akshatp
Originally posted by: rh71
Originally posted by: GagHalfrunt
The pilot deserves a medal for his landing. That plane doesn't appear to be broken-up at all and has remained afloat for a VERY long time.

great job by him but you'd have to think many many pilots would have done the same. The difficulty of such a landing though - I can't say anything about that.

A medal? For doing his job? They are trained in what to do in emergency situations. He deserves an atta boy for a job well done, but at the end of the day he is just doing his job.

If I saved a server from crashing at work last week by detecting a HD that was going bad.. i wouldnt get so much as a thank you let alone a medal!

ROFLMAO!!! Oh wow, save a server crash? Do you get 72 virgins and a parade down Main Street for that?? I'm sitting here with 1000 examples of why you might be the biggest moron in ATOT history for comparing a life or death plane crash with a server, but I don't have confidence in you possessing the one functioning brain cell necessary to understand.'

A server crash? ROFL!!!!! Oh my god, that's too good. :laugh:

Might be ??
NO, he is biggest moron in ATOT history !!
 
Originally posted by: FoBoT
the boat is right there , they should be able to get most of them out of the water


reminds me of that crash in DC back in 1982 , air florida flight 90

Thankfully, this was a good rescue.
But, will Howard Stern find a way to lose his job again?
 
Originally posted by: CTrain

Doing his job ??
Hmmmm...how many times have you seen anyone doing their job by gliding a plane with no engine into a river and everyone survived.
Doing his job is flying a plane not trying to figure out where to land a plane without a working engine.
There are thousands of pilots out there and 99.9% of them will never ever have to figure on how to land a plane without a working engine.
Just STFU !!

Grow up. Seriously. You sound like an overly emotional 15 year old.

Pilots train for these kind of things, and they follow procedures to take the least risk. They are professionals. This pilot did a good job, but you're out of your mind with your claims about "99.9%" of them not knowing what to do.
 
Originally posted by: jpeyton
Originally posted by: amdhunter
I bet the airlines would have wished they died. I am sure they can't wait for the immense lawsuits coming from each and every passenger on that plane. Those passengers hit the lotto, just like the families of the people who died in the World Trade.
Good luck. Have you read the fine print accompanied with every airline ticket? The airline, pilot, and plane manufacturer is faultless when a bird flies into the engine.

No kidding and like the families wouldn't have sued for more if people had died.
 
Originally posted by: amdhunter
I bet the airlines would have wished they died. I am sure they can't wait for the immense lawsuits coming from each and every passenger on that plane. Those passengers hit the lotto, just like the families of the people who died in the World Trade.

You got to be kidding, right?
 
Originally posted by: 91TTZ
Originally posted by: CTrain

Doing his job ??
Hmmmm...how many times have you seen anyone doing their job by gliding a plane with no engine into a river and everyone survived.
Doing his job is flying a plane not trying to figure out where to land a plane without a working engine.
There are thousands of pilots out there and 99.9% of them will never ever have to figure on how to land a plane without a working engine.
Just STFU !!

Grow up. Seriously. You sound like an overly emotional 15 year old.

Pilots train for these kind of things, and they follow procedures to take the least risk. They are professionals. This pilot did a good job, but you're out of your mind with your claims about "99.9%" of them not knowing what to do.

No, you sound like another idiot.
Don't put words in my mouth, read what I said.
I said, "99.9% of them will never ever have to figure on how to land a plane without a working engine"
So many times have pilots had a real life experience to land a plane without working engines ??
Sure, they all had training but to actually do it in real life, how many have ever had a chance to do it ?
Exactly...slim to none.
And so when was the last time a commercial plane crash land on water and everyone survived ??
Exactly, so STFU !!

 
Originally posted by: CTrain

And so when was the last time a commercial plane crash land on water and everyone survived ??
Exactly, so STFU !!

I heard on CNN tonight that this was the first time of a water ditching in the US where everyone survived. Add that to the fact that he put the plane down in the busiest metro area in the world and nobody died is one helluva job by everyone (ATC, crew, rescuers, etc etc)
 
Originally posted by: TangoJuliet
Originally posted by: CTrain

And so when was the last time a commercial plane crash land on water and everyone survived ??
Exactly, so STFU !!

I heard on CNN tonight that this was the first time of a water ditching in the US where everyone survived. Add that to the fact that he put the plane down in the busiest metro area in the world and nobody died is one helluva job by everyone (ATC, crew, rescuers, etc etc)
I also read that they came darn close to hitting the GW Bridge.

Pilot did an excellent job. Anyone who puts it in the terms that he was "just doing his job" is one of the biggest condescending douchebags in history.
 
Originally posted by: Number1
Do they normally carry pets in the cargo bay on these flights?

Sometimes. I walk through the AAL hangars twice a day and pass by the baggage ramps and have seen the occasional animal there.
 
Originally posted by: jpeyton

Good luck. Have you read the fine print accompanied with every airline ticket? The airline, pilot, and plane manufacturer is faultless when a bird flies into the engine.

i guarantee you every passenger involved in any us-based airline incident has gotten compensated WELL.

look at recent continental 1408 as example
 
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