US Air Force Obsolete?

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Fenixgoon

Lifer
Jun 30, 2003
33,405
13,010
136
Who can explain to this noob why the Navy has fighter jets? Because they are stuck on a ship in an ocean? Then why don't they collaborate with the Air Force with joint operations? The military is just so complex to me.

navy fighter jets are not air-to-air superiority fighters but multi-role strike fighters. they can perform a variety of missions from ground support, to anti-radar, to EW and more.

and by having aircraft carriers vs operating out of a fixed airbase, the navy can project force far more easily than the air force can.
 

lupi

Lifer
Apr 8, 2001
32,539
260
126
Who can explain to this noob why the Navy has fighter jets? Because they are stuck on a ship in an ocean? Then why don't they collaborate with the Air Force with joint operations? The military is just so complex to me.

Because landing on a bobbing couple hundred feet of steel is considerably different than a couple miles of superslab.
 

JTsyo

Lifer
Nov 18, 2007
12,038
1,135
126
Who can explain to this noob why the Navy has fighter jets? Because they are stuck on a ship in an ocean? Then why don't they collaborate with the Air Force with joint operations? The military is just so complex to me.

Because then you might run into issues like you see with the A-10. The Army loves it and wants it available for CAS but the AF see it as obsolete and an drain on its budget.

With the Navy in charge of its fighter force they have control over the planes and pilots and can prioritize as then deem necessary.
 

Blitzvogel

Platinum Member
Oct 17, 2010
2,012
23
81
Who can explain to this noob why the Navy has fighter jets? Because they are stuck on a ship in an ocean? Then why don't they collaborate with the Air Force with joint operations? The military is just so complex to me.

Because the Navy doesn't want a bunch of Air Force big-base boys using their carriers.......JK

Realistically, the naval environment, operating from carriers and in cohesion with naval movements and tactics pretty much means the Navy needs it's own pilots and own combat aircraft adapted to the conditions. A USAF pilot trying to land on a rocking carrier in sea swells at night would choke.

Aircraft carriers = power projection. For the USAF to do the same thing, we need allies who allow us to operate from air bases in their territories. The Soviet Union never had this capability in any real shape. Currently China is developing theirs, while some other countries like India are seeking to improve their stakes. "Helicopter" and assault carriers are pretty common amongst first-world nations, but require VSTOL aircraft like the Harrier and F-35 in order to have a fixed wing element.

Interestingly enough, the French are the only ones with a remotely comparable-to-US supercarrier of the CATOBAR variety and even nuclear powered (Charles De Gaulle). Brazil's Sao Paulo is an extremely old French Clemenceau-class carrier that only operates heavily modernized A-4 Skyhawks and S-2 Trackers. Here's to hoping they get the navalized Gripen NG. Russian and India currently only have ski-jump equipped carriers with arrested recovery, which puts a huge dent on how much weight their planes can realistically take off with.

The USAF-USN rivalry has hit some very hot points in the past, especially when it came to deployment of America's nuclear arms. Before Submarine-launched ballistic missiles became a thing, the USN was pushing for medium-ish nuke-armed bombers, on a new generation of carriers designed to handle them in the 1950s. The USAF claimed that America's nuclear arms were their dominion, and a bunch of disputes took place that designated the USAF as majority holders of aircraft-based and ICBM nuclear weapons. But the Navy was made proprietor of submarine launched ICBMs, arguably the most important and reliable part of the US's MAD policy.
 

Artdeco

Platinum Member
Mar 14, 2015
2,682
1
0
Calling the Air Force the "Air Force" is a bit in narrate, it's become the Air and Space Force.
 

MagnusTheBrewer

IN MEMORIAM
Jun 19, 2004
24,122
1,594
126
Just take the basic idea of the A-10 build a new airframe which incorporates the MFBFC, titanium tub, redundant control actuators, easily replaceable engines.

Added capability should be onboard state of the art avionics, a larger payload capability and perhaps make it a bit faster.


_________________

One of the strong points of the A-10 is it DOESN'T have state of the art avionics. Thus, keeping the cost down and, not requiring the support of those systems to keep flying.
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,688
126
Who can explain to this noob why the Navy has fighter jets? Because they are stuck on a ship in an ocean? Then why don't they collaborate with the Air Force with joint operations? The military is just so complex to me.

Turns out airplanes launched from ships are way more effective than shells launched from ships. We figured that out about 80 years ago and it was proven beyond all doubt 70 years ago.
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Mar 5, 2001
49,601
167
111
www.slatebrookfarm.com
Drones with sophisticated weapons, spying, etc., systems are expensive. But, compared to the cost of a fighter jet, why not send in a couple hundred unarmed drones made to look like armed drones, complete with using radar, etc., so that any enemy wouldn't know which drone was a dummy, and which drone was well equipped? I mean, how many anti-aircraft missiles does one location have? Deplete the enemy's resources.
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,688
126
Drones with sophisticated weapons, spying, etc., systems are expensive. But, compared to the cost of a fighter jet, why not send in a couple hundred unarmed drones made to look like armed drones, complete with using radar, etc., so that any enemy wouldn't know which drone was a dummy, and which drone was well equipped? I mean, how many anti-aircraft missiles does one location have? Deplete the enemy's resources.

A drone that has the capability to fly long range, and is large enough to mimic armed drones with payloads will always be way more expensive than the missile needed to shoot it down.
 

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
70,745
13,855
126
www.anyf.ca
Don't worry Canada is buying some state of the art F35's, we can always send them if you need anything. They're not very busy. They recently dispatched two existing jets somewhere because some kids were playing with a drone near an airport. You know your military is bored when...
 

Gunbuster

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
6,852
23
81
A drone that has the capability to fly long range, and is large enough to mimic armed drones with payloads will always be way more expensive than the missile needed to shoot it down.

But you outlay that cash to have an enemy that just popped off all their AA missiles. At that point the really expensive assets like the JSF can derp on in with it's non functional gun trigger software and drop bombs with impunity. ;p